[valentine]

Will Ben Simmons be a Franchise Changing player?

I mean he’s doing very well at LSU almost averaging a triple double

Highlights
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUATD3cOyhY&list=PLrYefdLi6tllV2bBUdry60Y5fTNd2SjYF

but his jump shot looks very shaky, even at the hoop summit practice video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PigAy1_slJU

[BleedGreen808Participant]

 It’s hard to nitpick when he’s averaging 18.1/14.4/5.7 but I want to see him look for his own offense more often.  LSU is struggling to win games against weaker competiton and too often he’s not even looking to score but instead trying to set up his teammates.  More aggressiveness and imprving his jumpshot would make him a franchise changing player for sure.  

[BleedGreen808Participant]

 It’s hard to nitpick when he’s averaging 18.1/14.4/5.7 but I want to see him look for his own offense more often.  LSU is struggling to win games against weaker competiton and too often he’s not even looking to score but instead trying to set up his teammates.  More aggressiveness and imprving his jumpshot would make him a franchise changing player for sure.  

[Hype Machine]

Put up an easy 24,9,7 line today againat Oral Roberts.

Nice game. Only really looked assertive for 10 mins in the 2nd half.

Nice game. I want to see him against SEC conpetition.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Hype Machine]

Put up an easy 24,9,7 line today againat Oral Roberts.

Nice game. Only really looked assertive for 10 mins in the 2nd half.

Nice game. I want to see him against SEC conpetition.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Memphis MadnessParticipant]

 You need to clarify this question.

Sam Bowie, Greg Oden, and Hasheem Thabeet were franchise changing players, although not in a good way.

Yes.  Ben Simmons WILL BE a franchise changing players.  By definition there are 30 franchises.  I would think there are 25 to 30 guys out there who can move the needle for a franchise.  Maybe not 25, but something more than 15-20.

I think he turns a BAD team into a GOOD team.  Or, he takes a GOOD team and turns them into a contender.  He would put a contender over the top.

So, if he goes to the Celtics I think he turns them into a contender.

I DO NOT THINK he is a LEAGUE CHANGING PLAYER.  Players like that have been (nearly) limited to Mikan, Bob Cousy, Bill Russell, Wilt, Kareem, Dr. J, Bird, Magic, Jordan, Shaq, Kobe, LeBron, and probably somewhat younger guys like Durant, Steph, and Westbrook.  

Besides the outside shot, I think he might lack the ALPHA mentality.  He can be the next Magic without the outside shot, BUT Magic had an ALPHA competitiveness.  Same with Bird.  The ALPHA mentality AND clutch gene.

Is he a point guard, or a point forward who can GENUINELY run a team, or more of a standard 6’10 athletic 3 who can also play the 4, can score, slash, and really rebound it well, as well as handle and pass… but more of a Big 3, and a good small ball 4.

I would think that that a good baseline for Ben Simmons would be Danny Manning.  An uber talented 6’10 forward who could score, rebound, pass, and handle the ball.  He can play either forward spot but primarily a small forward.  Not an ALPHA DOG scorer and seemed a bit laid back.  Had a FANTASTIC freshman season and actually led his team to a championship.  First pick, All Star, had a bad knee injury that changed the trajectory of his career, but not a guy you would confuse with Magic Johnson or LeBron James.  However, unlike Lamar Odom, he (thankfully) lacked the Loser Gene.  LO is (more recently) emotionally unstable.  Not an issue with Danny Manning.

If Ben Simmons is the next Danny Manning, and I think that is a solid baseline then I would project averages of anywhere from 17 to 20 points a game, about 7-9 rebounds, and 5-7 assists.  Somewhere between really, really good, to MVP favorite.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Memphis MadnessParticipant]

 You need to clarify this question.

Sam Bowie, Greg Oden, and Hasheem Thabeet were franchise changing players, although not in a good way.

Yes.  Ben Simmons WILL BE a franchise changing players.  By definition there are 30 franchises.  I would think there are 25 to 30 guys out there who can move the needle for a franchise.  Maybe not 25, but something more than 15-20.

I think he turns a BAD team into a GOOD team.  Or, he takes a GOOD team and turns them into a contender.  He would put a contender over the top.

So, if he goes to the Celtics I think he turns them into a contender.

I DO NOT THINK he is a LEAGUE CHANGING PLAYER.  Players like that have been (nearly) limited to Mikan, Bob Cousy, Bill Russell, Wilt, Kareem, Dr. J, Bird, Magic, Jordan, Shaq, Kobe, LeBron, and probably somewhat younger guys like Durant, Steph, and Westbrook.  

Besides the outside shot, I think he might lack the ALPHA mentality.  He can be the next Magic without the outside shot, BUT Magic had an ALPHA competitiveness.  Same with Bird.  The ALPHA mentality AND clutch gene.

Is he a point guard, or a point forward who can GENUINELY run a team, or more of a standard 6’10 athletic 3 who can also play the 4, can score, slash, and really rebound it well, as well as handle and pass… but more of a Big 3, and a good small ball 4.

I would think that that a good baseline for Ben Simmons would be Danny Manning.  An uber talented 6’10 forward who could score, rebound, pass, and handle the ball.  He can play either forward spot but primarily a small forward.  Not an ALPHA DOG scorer and seemed a bit laid back.  Had a FANTASTIC freshman season and actually led his team to a championship.  First pick, All Star, had a bad knee injury that changed the trajectory of his career, but not a guy you would confuse with Magic Johnson or LeBron James.  However, unlike Lamar Odom, he (thankfully) lacked the Loser Gene.  LO is (more recently) emotionally unstable.  Not an issue with Danny Manning.

If Ben Simmons is the next Danny Manning, and I think that is a solid baseline then I would project averages of anywhere from 17 to 20 points a game, about 7-9 rebounds, and 5-7 assists.  Somewhere between really, really good, to MVP favorite.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[WinterSoldierParticipant]

 He is a player with extreme strengths and extreme weaknesses which makes me very unsure what he will be.

Strengths: ball handling, passing, running the floor, rebounding, creating offense and quickness. He happens to be star quality good at all those things.

Weaknesses: defense other than passing lanes(he doesn’t put in any effort on defense so its hard to tell how bad he actually is), shooting both mid range and 3pt(again, he rarely shoots so it’s very hard to tell how bad he actually is), unselfishness leading to turnovers and missed opportunities.

Nuetral: posting up sometimes he looks really good posting up, other times he looks not so good, pick and roll this might be the quality of his teammates so i’ll leave it in nuetral.

I think his NBA role will be much different than what he is playing at LSU and he will have to be revaluated again as an NBA player. Better coaching could do wonders for someone like Simmons. He has the natural talent to be a franchise changing player but his weakness at this point are concerning and could hold him back from being a top 10 player in the league. 

 

 

 

 

[Hype Machine]

 Defense is NOT a weakness. Anyone can write an article and post 2 vines of defensive lapses.

Hes way above average. He can defend all 5 positions. Hes a ball shark and fantastic on ball defender

Excuse the freshman for being a bit tired…hardly ever rests and carries the team. Opposition teams attack him to draw fouls cos anyone knows if hes in foul trouble…LSUs cooked.

 

 

 

 

[WinterSoldierParticipant]

 I have watched all his games and defense is weakness for him. I have watched him stand there so many times while his guy or his help defense guy goes in for a easy lay up. I have never seen him be a ball shark or play good on ball defense, It must happen every time I turn my head for a second. I get that you like the kid, so do I, but really watch him next game and see how little he even tries on defense. 

[Hype Machine]

I’m glad you’ve seen the games and formed your own opinion, because recently I’ve read some garbage on SI and ESPN trying to find flaws in his game and they do what is trendy these days by lazy journalists…

Isolate a couple mistakes, embed a vine in an article and then claim its a continual problem in his game. Don’t fall for it. I saw Kawhi Leanord commit a dumb reaching foul yesterday that gave Chris Paul 2 fts…everyone makes mistakes. If you want to see ‘weak’ defense, just watch any of his cherry-picking team mates. 

I could easily show vines of him doing unbelievably good defense. Recovering, doubling, blocking shots, steals leading to transition, not to mention his nation-leading defensive rebounding. 

I also disagree with your opinion on post-ups. Dude scored 43 points almost exclusively on post-ups recently, yet you’ve listed it as "nuetral". He also leads all freshman in FG% because he creates high % shots close to the hoop. His ability to create a mismatch is a strength., as is his finishing ability with either hand, using good footwork and fakes.

On what scale are we judging freshmen these days? 

Are you comparing his defense to Anthony Davis as a Freshman….or everyone else in his class?

Are you comparing his post-moves to Jahlil Okafor…or everyone else in his class?

Cos he’s miles ahead of anyone in both categories in my opinion. 

The answer to the question "is he a franchise changing talent"….please. He’s going to be All-NBA First team before his rookie contract expires. 

I know my username is Hype Machine, but sometimes the hype is justified. 

(For what its worth, I also think Brandon Ingram is a worthy #1 in almost any other draft). 

Thanks for the debate lol. 

 

 

 

[OhCanada-Participant]

 The comparison is made as per the adjustment from the college game to the NBA game. In the college game against 6’7 Centers as the teams biggest player his post game is dominant he will score 43. In the NBA not so much it needs work.

His most translate able skill is anticipation which leaves him one step ahead of the opposition at all times.

 

 

 

 

 

[Hype Machine]

If it was that easy to score 43 against 6’7" post players….

 

 

 

[Jr. ROXASParticipant]

Miles ahead of Jahlil in post-ups??? Nahhhhhhhhh. He has good instincts posting up, but c’mon, MILES AHEAD of Jahlil? Strictly post moves, Jahlil has the best in the NBA right now, much less over college athletes.

[Jr. ROXASParticipant]

Miles ahead of Jahlil in post-ups??? Nahhhhhhhhh. He has good instincts posting up, but c’mon, MILES AHEAD of Jahlil? Strictly post moves, Jahlil has the best in the NBA right now, much less over college athletes.

[Hype Machine]

If it was that easy to score 43 against 6’7" post players….

 

 

 

[OhCanada-Participant]

 The comparison is made as per the adjustment from the college game to the NBA game. In the college game against 6’7 Centers as the teams biggest player his post game is dominant he will score 43. In the NBA not so much it needs work.

His most translate able skill is anticipation which leaves him one step ahead of the opposition at all times.

 

 

 

 

 

[Hype Machine]

I’m glad you’ve seen the games and formed your own opinion, because recently I’ve read some garbage on SI and ESPN trying to find flaws in his game and they do what is trendy these days by lazy journalists…

Isolate a couple mistakes, embed a vine in an article and then claim its a continual problem in his game. Don’t fall for it. I saw Kawhi Leanord commit a dumb reaching foul yesterday that gave Chris Paul 2 fts…everyone makes mistakes. If you want to see ‘weak’ defense, just watch any of his cherry-picking team mates. 

I could easily show vines of him doing unbelievably good defense. Recovering, doubling, blocking shots, steals leading to transition, not to mention his nation-leading defensive rebounding. 

I also disagree with your opinion on post-ups. Dude scored 43 points almost exclusively on post-ups recently, yet you’ve listed it as "nuetral". He also leads all freshman in FG% because he creates high % shots close to the hoop. His ability to create a mismatch is a strength., as is his finishing ability with either hand, using good footwork and fakes.

On what scale are we judging freshmen these days? 

Are you comparing his defense to Anthony Davis as a Freshman….or everyone else in his class?

Are you comparing his post-moves to Jahlil Okafor…or everyone else in his class?

Cos he’s miles ahead of anyone in both categories in my opinion. 

The answer to the question "is he a franchise changing talent"….please. He’s going to be All-NBA First team before his rookie contract expires. 

I know my username is Hype Machine, but sometimes the hype is justified. 

(For what its worth, I also think Brandon Ingram is a worthy #1 in almost any other draft). 

Thanks for the debate lol. 

 

 

 

[WinterSoldierParticipant]

 I have watched all his games and defense is weakness for him. I have watched him stand there so many times while his guy or his help defense guy goes in for a easy lay up. I have never seen him be a ball shark or play good on ball defense, It must happen every time I turn my head for a second. I get that you like the kid, so do I, but really watch him next game and see how little he even tries on defense. 

[Hype Machine]

 Defense is NOT a weakness. Anyone can write an article and post 2 vines of defensive lapses.

Hes way above average. He can defend all 5 positions. Hes a ball shark and fantastic on ball defender

Excuse the freshman for being a bit tired…hardly ever rests and carries the team. Opposition teams attack him to draw fouls cos anyone knows if hes in foul trouble…LSUs cooked.

 

 

 

 

[WinterSoldierParticipant]

 He is a player with extreme strengths and extreme weaknesses which makes me very unsure what he will be.

Strengths: ball handling, passing, running the floor, rebounding, creating offense and quickness. He happens to be star quality good at all those things.

Weaknesses: defense other than passing lanes(he doesn’t put in any effort on defense so its hard to tell how bad he actually is), shooting both mid range and 3pt(again, he rarely shoots so it’s very hard to tell how bad he actually is), unselfishness leading to turnovers and missed opportunities.

Nuetral: posting up sometimes he looks really good posting up, other times he looks not so good, pick and roll this might be the quality of his teammates so i’ll leave it in nuetral.

I think his NBA role will be much different than what he is playing at LSU and he will have to be revaluated again as an NBA player. Better coaching could do wonders for someone like Simmons. He has the natural talent to be a franchise changing player but his weakness at this point are concerning and could hold him back from being a top 10 player in the league. 

 

 

 

 

[Bob BallParticipant]

 http://www.bobbawblog.com/ben-simmons/ I wrote this a few weeks ago.

[Bob BallParticipant]

 http://www.bobbawblog.com/ben-simmons/ I wrote this a few weeks ago.

[Hype Machine]

Why everyone saying hes not a scorer.

Leads freshman in points, fg% and assists.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Hype Machine]

Why everyone saying hes not a scorer.

Leads freshman in points, fg% and assists.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[CU.LIONSParticipant]

Simmons is a extremely talented “kid” with a ton of potential to grow as a player. His skill level will only get better as he matures both physically and mentally. He will definitely be a franchise player in the NBA, but it may take a few years to develop before he gets there. I think expectations for instance production is part of the problem. I think Lebron and KD spoiled us with their early success. For the most part he will need some time to get there, But I do really believe he will.

And it certainly helps depending on what team drafts him.

[CU.LIONSParticipant]

Simmons is a extremely talented “kid” with a ton of potential to grow as a player. His skill level will only get better as he matures both physically and mentally. He will definitely be a franchise player in the NBA, but it may take a few years to develop before he gets there. I think expectations for instance production is part of the problem. I think Lebron and KD spoiled us with their early success. For the most part he will need some time to get there, But I do really believe he will.

And it certainly helps depending on what team drafts him.

[HitsterParticipant]

 A franchise changing player is someone who can really make a team become better IMO but how long you expect this to take is an issue. The T-Wolves have both KAT and Wiggins but are still well below .500 but if they improve next year this could be more to those two getting better than what anyone else contributes.

Jabari was considered to be at that level but due to an injury he is still finding his way in the NBA and we cannot judge him yet.

If the 76ers say win 10 games this year and draft Simmons and maybe then win 30 plus games next year, it could well be a combination of Simmons and the contributions of others.

I think Simmons can be a franchise changer but it might take a few years.

 

 

 

[TripleDoubleScoutParticipant]

 I totally agree. I’m probably the biggest Simmons fan on this site, but I am serious when it comes to assessing talent. Simmons is definitely an impact star, but the jury is out on whether he is a franchise player. We will have to wait until we see how he does in SEC play to make that judgement call.

[TripleDoubleScoutParticipant]

 I totally agree. I’m probably the biggest Simmons fan on this site, but I am serious when it comes to assessing talent. Simmons is definitely an impact star, but the jury is out on whether he is a franchise player. We will have to wait until we see how he does in SEC play to make that judgement call.

[HitsterParticipant]

 A franchise changing player is someone who can really make a team become better IMO but how long you expect this to take is an issue. The T-Wolves have both KAT and Wiggins but are still well below .500 but if they improve next year this could be more to those two getting better than what anyone else contributes.

Jabari was considered to be at that level but due to an injury he is still finding his way in the NBA and we cannot judge him yet.

If the 76ers say win 10 games this year and draft Simmons and maybe then win 30 plus games next year, it could well be a combination of Simmons and the contributions of others.

I think Simmons can be a franchise changer but it might take a few years.

 

 

 

[DrivingDownTheStreetinmy64]

He is a Scottie  Pippen Clone!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Not a Lebron clone!!! 

[DrivingDownTheStreetinmy64]

He is a Scottie  Pippen Clone!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Not a Lebron clone!!! 

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