[valentine]

 Bill Russell comes to mind, anybody else?

I’m looking at Kelly Olynyk, +/- superstar, and trying to come up with an historical comparison, of a super-valuable role player who didn’t dominate the box score.

Lamar Odom comes to mind.

Who else, especially bigger guys. Old Bill Walton?

 

 

[T Rex]

 Scottie Pippen I guess, though he put up flashy steals stats.

Boris Diaw.

Draymond Green

 

 

[evangelion79Participant]

 Bill Russell averaged 15.1 ppg, 22.5 rpg, and 4.3 assists per game. Scottie Pippen had career stats of 16.2 ppg, 6.4 rpg, 5.2 apg, and 2.0 spg. Both were allstars and hall of famers. 

They are 2 of the worst examples you couldve picked. When I think of winners with average stats I think of guys like Bruce Bowen, Robert Horry, or Derek Fisher.

 

[Rip255]

 How many blocks do you think Russell and Wilt averaged? 

 

Gotta be somewhere between 5 and 8 right?

[evangelion79Participant]

 I was wondering that myself when I was posting those stats. Im sure it was an insane amount. Too bad they didnt record them back then..

[evangelion79Participant]

 I was wondering that myself when I was posting those stats. Im sure it was an insane amount. Too bad they didnt record them back then..

[Rip255]

 How many blocks do you think Russell and Wilt averaged? 

 

Gotta be somewhere between 5 and 8 right?

[T Rex]

 Oh yeah, Pippen’s stat line is just dominant. Almost impossible to think of a better career statline than that, buddy.

And who could confuse Bill Russell’s 15 ppg career average with anything other than complete dominance.

Remember that time Wilt scored 30, and then wrote 30 on a piece of paper? Classic photo.

 

 

[ItsVictorOladipoParticipant]

 You seem confused about the meanings of the words "statistics" and "mediocre"

NBA Statistics refer to more than just scoring, they also refer to things like rebounds, assists, blocks, steals and other measurements.

Mediocre means middling and refers to things being average or near the middle of the pack.

Russell was one of the greatest rebounders in NBA history, if blocks had been counted then he’d probably be among the greatests shot blockers in history as well. He was also a terrific passing center.

Pippen is one of the greatest passing forwards of all time he was also a very good rebounder for a wing in addition to racking up some of the best steals totals ever (which at least you did acknowledge). In his prime he routinely averaged about 20 PPG…that is not middle of the pack.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[ItsVictorOladipoParticipant]

 You seem confused about the meanings of the words "statistics" and "mediocre"

NBA Statistics refer to more than just scoring, they also refer to things like rebounds, assists, blocks, steals and other measurements.

Mediocre means middling and refers to things being average or near the middle of the pack.

Russell was one of the greatest rebounders in NBA history, if blocks had been counted then he’d probably be among the greatests shot blockers in history as well. He was also a terrific passing center.

Pippen is one of the greatest passing forwards of all time he was also a very good rebounder for a wing in addition to racking up some of the best steals totals ever (which at least you did acknowledge). In his prime he routinely averaged about 20 PPG…that is not middle of the pack.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[T Rex]

 You seem confused by the spirit of this thread. Russell and Pippen are famous for contributing towards winning far beyond their stats. They’re the two most recognizable examples, and as such, I mentioned them to clarify the spirit of this thread, by citing two easily recognizable examples of overperforming stats.

By citing two famous names, I was hoping to trigger more citations of less famous names, guys with truly mediocre stats. It worked, and a lot of names were cited.

Welcome to my thread.

 

 

 

[T Rex]

 You seem confused by the spirit of this thread. Russell and Pippen are famous for contributing towards winning far beyond their stats. They’re the two most recognizable examples, and as such, I mentioned them to clarify the spirit of this thread, by citing two easily recognizable examples of overperforming stats.

By citing two famous names, I was hoping to trigger more citations of less famous names, guys with truly mediocre stats. It worked, and a lot of names were cited.

Welcome to my thread.

 

 

 

[T Rex]

 Oh yeah, Pippen’s stat line is just dominant. Almost impossible to think of a better career statline than that, buddy.

And who could confuse Bill Russell’s 15 ppg career average with anything other than complete dominance.

Remember that time Wilt scored 30, and then wrote 30 on a piece of paper? Classic photo.

 

 

[evangelion79Participant]

 Bill Russell averaged 15.1 ppg, 22.5 rpg, and 4.3 assists per game. Scottie Pippen had career stats of 16.2 ppg, 6.4 rpg, 5.2 apg, and 2.0 spg. Both were allstars and hall of famers. 

They are 2 of the worst examples you couldve picked. When I think of winners with average stats I think of guys like Bruce Bowen, Robert Horry, or Derek Fisher.

 

[T Rex]

 Scottie Pippen I guess, though he put up flashy steals stats.

Boris Diaw.

Draymond Green

 

 

[T Rex]

 My theory is that the big man hockey assist is underrated.

Edit: Olynyk is Canadian. Canadians like hockey eh? Steve Nash anybudy?

Marc Gasol probably wanted to be a soccer player as a kid.

I suspect Brad Miller might have been a +/- stud, but will have to check.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[T Rex]

 My theory is that the big man hockey assist is underrated.

Edit: Olynyk is Canadian. Canadians like hockey eh? Steve Nash anybudy?

Marc Gasol probably wanted to be a soccer player as a kid.

I suspect Brad Miller might have been a +/- stud, but will have to check.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[CameronCrazy11Participant]

In terms of the common per game stats, Bruce Bowen is the first one who comes to mind. He never averaged double-digits, averaged less than 2 assists per game every season of his career, his highest steals per game in his career was 1.1, and yet he’s considered one of the most critical pieces to the Spurs championship teams and one of the best perimeter defenders ever.

It is worth noting though that he was a career 39.3% (peaking at 44.1%-led the league that year) three point shooter in his career and pretty much started the 3-and-D trend that we see in today’s NBA.

[CameronCrazy11Participant]

In terms of the common per game stats, Bruce Bowen is the first one who comes to mind. He never averaged double-digits, averaged less than 2 assists per game every season of his career, his highest steals per game in his career was 1.1, and yet he’s considered one of the most critical pieces to the Spurs championship teams and one of the best perimeter defenders ever.

It is worth noting though that he was a career 39.3% (peaking at 44.1%-led the league that year) three point shooter in his career and pretty much started the 3-and-D trend that we see in today’s NBA.

[BleedGreen808Participant]

 I clicked this expecting it to be another thread on Marcus Smart’s impact on winning despite him not putting up big stats.  I actually is one of those guys based on last year’s stats and his impact for Boston.  I’m really hoping to see improvement on his FG% and FT% this year along with him attacking the basket more often.  I’d rather have him become a solid two way player impacting the game.  

Olynyk is interesting to me.  As you said the advanced statistics seem to say he has a big impact on the game.  However, the eye test leaves a lot to be desired.  He has the ability to be a knockdown stretch big that can attack closeouts and make plays passing the ball.  Except too often he pump fakes instead of taking shots he can make.  If he can become more agressive he would be a much better player statistically.  

[BleedGreen808Participant]

 I clicked this expecting it to be another thread on Marcus Smart’s impact on winning despite him not putting up big stats.  I actually is one of those guys based on last year’s stats and his impact for Boston.  I’m really hoping to see improvement on his FG% and FT% this year along with him attacking the basket more often.  I’d rather have him become a solid two way player impacting the game.  

Olynyk is interesting to me.  As you said the advanced statistics seem to say he has a big impact on the game.  However, the eye test leaves a lot to be desired.  He has the ability to be a knockdown stretch big that can attack closeouts and make plays passing the ball.  Except too often he pump fakes instead of taking shots he can make.  If he can become more agressive he would be a much better player statistically.  

[festar35Participant]

Andre Iguodala through the regular season didn’t put up great numbers, but was clearly influential.

We could lump the Atlanta a hawks as a whole in here as well.

[festar35Participant]

Andre Iguodala through the regular season didn’t put up great numbers, but was clearly influential.

We could lump the Atlanta a hawks as a whole in here as well.

[JR RyderParticipant]

Ron Artest, especially during his prime. He had terrible shot selection and would jack up wild 3 point shots. Also shot at low percentage, but he impacted the game so much defensively.

[JR RyderParticipant]

Ron Artest, especially during his prime. He had terrible shot selection and would jack up wild 3 point shots. Also shot at low percentage, but he impacted the game so much defensively.

[JordanC20Participant]

 Big Shot Rob!

[JordanC20Participant]

 Big Shot Rob!

[MJBrownParticipant]

 Anthony Mason?!?

[MJBrownParticipant]

 Anthony Mason?!?

[ChewyParticipant]

 Tyson Chandler

[ChewyParticipant]

 Tyson Chandler

[Dazzling Dunks and Basketball BloopersParticipant]

Guys like Robert horry, Derek Fisher, Shane Battier, Bruce Bowen, Michael Cooper, Dennis rodman (especially on the pistons) all come to mind. 

[Dazzling Dunks and Basketball BloopersParticipant]

Guys like Robert horry, Derek Fisher, Shane Battier, Bruce Bowen, Michael Cooper, Dennis rodman (especially on the pistons) all come to mind. 

[jaycee24Participant]

 Tayshaun Prince never had huge stats in Detroit but he played hard on defense rebounded decently got a block or two and was almost a lockdown type of defender in his prime. He could score some too.

[jaycee24Participant]

 Tayshaun Prince never had huge stats in Detroit but he played hard on defense rebounded decently got a block or two and was almost a lockdown type of defender in his prime. He could score some too.

[Stop_basketball_nonsenseParticipant]

 Look I usually explain my comment in depth but I’m sleepy, cooking dinner at this time of night before I watching the rest of pineapple express, then sleep, so I’m going with the best answer that comes to mind in my opinion for my generation.

Tony Allen! Goodnight

 

[T Rex]

 Good choice. Tony Allen was way up there with Kelly Olynyk in +/- per 36 minutes. Paul Milsap and Kevin Love are also in that Olynyk territory.

 

 

[T Rex]

 Good choice. Tony Allen was way up there with Kelly Olynyk in +/- per 36 minutes. Paul Milsap and Kevin Love are also in that Olynyk territory.

 

 

[Stop_basketball_nonsenseParticipant]

 Look I usually explain my comment in depth but I’m sleepy, cooking dinner at this time of night before I watching the rest of pineapple express, then sleep, so I’m going with the best answer that comes to mind in my opinion for my generation.

Tony Allen! Goodnight

 

[Rip255]

 Shane Battier

[ZouldiersParticipant]

Good Choice. Can’t believe I wasn’t able to mention him though.

[ZouldiersParticipant]

Good Choice. Can’t believe I wasn’t able to mention him though.

[Rip255]

 Shane Battier

[ZouldiersParticipant]

 Matthew Dellavedova

[ZouldiersParticipant]

 Matthew Dellavedova

[ncballer]

 No love for the White Mamba huh?  Haha

[ncballer]

 No love for the White Mamba huh?  Haha

[ExumInfernoParticipant]

 The first player I thought of was Battier, so well done to those who already listed him.

A similar player, James Posey.  Two championships, with different teams.  Guarded three positions for a lot of his career, could also hit some outside shots.

Ron Harper, started but had low stats and won 5 titles.

Mario Elie, he made some big plays, didn’t have huge stats but helped his teams win.

You want bigger players, backup centers on winning teams, there are probably a bunch.  Scott Williams of the Bulls had a lot of hustling plays when they won 3 times, Lakers used B McAdoo and M Thompson behind Kareem so they provided great backup minutes for winning teams, and some other champion teams had smaller centers off the bench that seemed to work hard and get their team a win like Leon Powe, Carl Herrera, Malik Rose, and don’t forget the backup players who could play center or forward and had some range some Ferry and Bonner, Doleac, Wennington, and obviously Horry was mentioned and he hit so many important shots in the finals.

 

 

 

[ExumInfernoParticipant]

 The first player I thought of was Battier, so well done to those who already listed him.

A similar player, James Posey.  Two championships, with different teams.  Guarded three positions for a lot of his career, could also hit some outside shots.

Ron Harper, started but had low stats and won 5 titles.

Mario Elie, he made some big plays, didn’t have huge stats but helped his teams win.

You want bigger players, backup centers on winning teams, there are probably a bunch.  Scott Williams of the Bulls had a lot of hustling plays when they won 3 times, Lakers used B McAdoo and M Thompson behind Kareem so they provided great backup minutes for winning teams, and some other champion teams had smaller centers off the bench that seemed to work hard and get their team a win like Leon Powe, Carl Herrera, Malik Rose, and don’t forget the backup players who could play center or forward and had some range some Ferry and Bonner, Doleac, Wennington, and obviously Horry was mentioned and he hit so many important shots in the finals.

 

 

 

[ChewyParticipant]

 He was a lottery pick that averaged 23 pts, 5 ast and 2.5 steals as a ROOKIE! In 8 of his first 9 years in the league he averaged over 18 points a game. The lone season he didn’t, he was still at 15 ppg.

Ron Harper is another example of how stacked those Bulls teams were. He went from 20 pts, 5 ast, and 2 stls for the Clippers in 1994. Then in 1995 Harper averaged just 7 pts, 2 ast and 1 stl for the Bulls.  He could of stuck to bad teams and continued to put up numbers, but choose a supporting role to win rings.

But still, even including those Jordan Bulls years and his past prime Bulls years, he averaged over 18 points over half of his career. Harper’s stats look really good.

 

 

[ChewyParticipant]

 He was a lottery pick that averaged 23 pts, 5 ast and 2.5 steals as a ROOKIE! In 8 of his first 9 years in the league he averaged over 18 points a game. The lone season he didn’t, he was still at 15 ppg.

Ron Harper is another example of how stacked those Bulls teams were. He went from 20 pts, 5 ast, and 2 stls for the Clippers in 1994. Then in 1995 Harper averaged just 7 pts, 2 ast and 1 stl for the Bulls.  He could of stuck to bad teams and continued to put up numbers, but choose a supporting role to win rings.

But still, even including those Jordan Bulls years and his past prime Bulls years, he averaged over 18 points over half of his career. Harper’s stats look really good.

 

 

[RUDEBOY_Participant]

im go old school and say caldwell jones & kurt rambis…

 

[RUDEBOY_Participant]

im go old school and say caldwell jones & kurt rambis…

 

[Captain LParticipant]

 Old Philly, Bobby Jones!!!!

[Captain LParticipant]

 Old Philly, Bobby Jones!!!!

[RUDEBOY_Participant]

does tim donaghy count?

[RUDEBOY_Participant]

does tim donaghy count?

[rich.homie.mitchParticipant]

Kendrick Perkins? Helped with those celtic teams and Thunder

[rich.homie.mitchParticipant]

Kendrick Perkins? Helped with those celtic teams and Thunder

[RecoveringVegetarianParticipant]

 Hey now!! Yeah Perkins helped If u consider Patting guys on the back after a timeout and towel waving contributing

[RecoveringVegetarianParticipant]

 Hey now!! Yeah Perkins helped If u consider Patting guys on the back after a timeout and towel waving contributing

[Author]

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