[nateoak10Participant]

The guy just scored 46 points on 17-22 shooting and 4-6 on 3’s and made an over the backboard shot. Ok how is Billups better than him. He led the Golden State D leaguers from down 25 to eventually down to 4 (even though the finish was slightly higher). He also chipped in 4 boards and 2 assists which wont seem high but if you watched how much everyone else missed off his creation or dropped the pick and roll it seemed like 5-6. the 7 to’s is a little to much but most were off charges that were BS CALLS THAT I WAS SCREAMING ABOUT (woosah…) He also blocked a dirk jumper and got a steal. I mean someone explain what he has too do to be an all star? Magically heal Azebuike, Randolph, Morrow, Wright, Bell, and fire Nellie? Theres nothing he can do more, Kobe and Lebron would look bad here. He would have gotten 50 if he didnt have to sit out cause of foul trouble on those charges.

Side note : Biedrins in 20 minutes grabbed 9 boards and got a block and 6 points, yet Nellie decides he can do better with those minutes with Devean George. WHAT.THE.HELL. Worst coach in the league easily.

Final note : Warriors are 1 guy of equal level of Monta and there a playoff contender easy, plus with the emergence of Randolph once Nellie frees him, Curry will be a borderline all star in 2-3 years add in Whiteside/Turner/Wes and there not as bad as they look…. Oh yeah reboot the whole front office

And that is all.

[knicksfan7Participant]

Billups has played more years and has been an anchor on teams that have won and been to NBA Finals. So I am not arguing that. With Ellis he needs to improve his free throw shooting 8 of 13 for a guard isn’t acceptable, if he misses any it shouldn’t be more than 3. He needs to improve his 3 point abilities still. While I agree he does need a team around him, but I see him a lot like Stephon Marbury just playing for a lot of losing team’s and not helping as a player with character.

[nateoak10Participant]

If you chose the all stars for the last 4 years Billups should be there but this season Monta is better than Billups, his 3’s are starting to become very good, and the ft’s im not sure whats ups. slump maybe ? the guy went 17-22, itll get back up it was just a bad night

[rickyD510Participant]

billups has a great pedigree(and being on the second best team in the west doesnt hurt) and monte is too turnover prone(7turnovers to 2assists) and has a horrible shot selection (he often has as many points as fga)

[nateoak10Participant]

What evidence do you have on the FGa statement? HE had 1 game with 39 shots? Cmon, he’s at 47% from the field which is much better than billups. he takes around 23 shots a game and averages a little under 27.

[M-DYMESParticipant]

Since All-stars are based on fan voting he needs to move out of GS, stop being a cocky asshole who bitches about who he can and cannot play with (Curry) and throws his teammates under the bus (complaining about their effort), and maybe get his assist count up as a PG. He also needs a better coach and needs to play in that coach’s system rather than trying to play 1 v 5 basketball.

[M-DYMESParticipant]

And if you wanna look purely at his scoring numbers v. Billups, I think one way you can relate the 2 (as far as affect on the team), consider an assist worth 2 points (sometimes its even worth 3).

Say Billups is getting 3 or 4 more assists than Ellis, but Ellis scored 8 more points. Add 6 or 8 more points to Billups night (the assists) and then compare the 2. Assists are very underrated in the game and ultimately they are worth just as much if not more considering they get the entire team involved which maximizes the amount of weapons and effort displayed on the floor. One of the many reasons why the Nuggets > Warriors.

[nateoak10Participant]

Im sorry but your very ignorant. Where are you getting these rumors? Some ESPN guy on the east coast? cocky?hardly. The rumor with Curry was BS and never was an issue and play well together, also he’s not a point guard so get that out of your head. the 1v5 is on nellie, nellie calls iso’s for him constantly whats he supposed to do say no to the coach? Also if you watch this guy regularly and then watch billups it’s obvious ellis as an individual has played better. also a player has the right to complain about effort of a team as the captain, do you want him to sit there and not say anything? captains need to tell there teammates whats up sometimes, unfortunately there guys like Coby Karl

[M-DYMESParticipant]

I said he needs a better coach. And when he gets that coach he needs to stop the 5 v 1 ball. I put that on Nellie so dont act a fool and say I didn’t. And basketball is a team game which is precisely why he shouldn’t be an allstar. Allstar status is for those who are great basketball players. Ellis is probably a hell of a 1 on 1 player but he needs to get the rest of the team involved more and that means toning down the 30+ shot games working that ball around. He has the ball in his hands the whole time on offense and then when he does get it to teammate once he gets in trouble, they are so cold since they are playing without the ball in their hands roughly the whole game. Billups is a great leader and team player, something I just can’t see Ellis ever being. He’s trying to be like Kobe was before he realized he needs his team to get to that next level. Once Kobe started to share the rock more you see the results. I think if Ellis does develop into a team player he will be much more successful and the fans will take notice.

[rickyD510Participant]

vs Cha 10-23 22points
vs Nor 8-17 19points
vs NJN 2-9 4 points
vs Miami 6-15 17points
vs Cle 9-25 30 points
vs Lal 10-23 22 points
vs Phi 3-14 8 points
vs Chi 10-26 27 points
vs Lal 9-17 18 points
vs Bos 8-21 18 points
vs Cle 9-23 23 points
vs Ind 7-19 16 points
vs Min 8-16 18 points
vs Sac 4-11 9 points
vs Mem 10-23 24 points
vs Pho 7-19 19 points
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/gamelog?playerId=2751 (there were a few more games but i didnt bother to put them up)

[nateoak10Participant]

game by game

– given
– injured ankle (sprained ) and jammed wrist
– ^
– sat out 3/4 of the game with the sprained ankle
– look @ the rest of the team, what was he supposed to do?
– who does good against LAL? but if you want, given
– dont remember this one too well but when i look back he was rested rather early cause it wasnt even close
– defense on Rose made up for it
– look at other LAL
– and im too lazy to keep going by bullet points, so ill summarize : most of these games were blowouts where no one helped him and had no choice an usually no center

Also something you should have mentioned that skews that post ALOT is that those games are spread out and randomly picked out over the season. not consecutively but as seperate sets of games so its like going back and looking at Kobe an saying he shoots as much as he scores and i can pull out a game from october, this month and the 1st week of the year and say he was 13-28 with 28 points… is that reasonable? when making an argument make sure you think through placement of stats and the situations and variables. also if you dont watch someone a lot its not fair to make a judgment. i can say jennings is awful but i dont watch him a whole lot so i cant say he is only a shooter. fans wont take notice till we win. also his assists numbers are pretty decent for a shooting guard, tonight was a night where no one can hit and can you expect george to come in and stroke it?

[festar35Participant]

If Ellis is that good why isn’t his team winning?

[rickyD510Participant]

All in all Chauncey’s replacing a pg in Chris Paul. Chauncey has came up big for his team in the clutch (monta has not). Also is more of a pg then Monta is (5 to 4 assist to t.o. vs Chauncey 6 to 3). Most importantly Chauncey is on the SECOND best team in the west.

[M-DYMESParticipant]

Don’t get me wrong, Monta is a hell of a player. But, to be an allstar in the fans eyes, you either need to come from a winning franchise or you need more pub. AI gets in the all-star game cuz he will always be a fan favorite due to his pub and days back when the sixers we decent. Once Monta gets on a team that consistently wins games, he may become an allstar. Billups is having a great year though and he is one a winning team where he is a leader. Hes also a local boy whose back home in Denver now so you know everyone and their mother in Den is voting for him. The Warriors franchise has not been dominant for quite some time and therefore they are kind of viewed as a JV squad and do not get consideration for allstar games and same with Monta and the MVP. He needs to build an image and that comes with winning which is exactly what Billups does. He does what the team needs and the fans love that as they should.

[nateoak10Participant]

Thats not there for him yet….. to adress the winning does a lineup of Curry,Ellis,Maggette,ANthony Tolliver, Biedrins (20 minutes?), Turiaf, Coby Karl/Cartier Martin , Cj ,Chris Hunter with Nellie coaching sound good to you? Dont tell me Billups,Roy,DWill etc could lead that team. W/O Ellis were worse than the nets…. and thats the truth when you talk about wins. now were on a similar page, but Stern made the last pick. Otherwise this brings up a whole other argument on fan voting. I think fans should only get a 30-50 % say in the starters give the rest to the players. Kobe AND Shaq have both said he is a top 7 guard in the NBA and is underrated and are quoted in saying it.. look it up 😉

[rickyD510Participant]

Biedrins deserves more pt hes better then those d-league scrubs

[M-DYMESParticipant]

Im not saying Billups, Roy, or DWill could lead that team to victories. Im just saying thats kinda just tough shit dude. I mean there are only X amount of spots for All-stars and the winners tend to get those spots. Once Ellis and whoever he team is at the time starts to win, Im sure hell get more consideration. Until then though, he is going to be viewed as a great player who is playing for a Division 3 team. Same concept applies to the NBA draft. You can be a great player on a horrible team but your stock will probably not be as high as a very very good player on a winning D1 team. If the gap in ability is not that extensive, the player on the losing team is going to get the short end of the stick. Thats just the way it is. We like Winners.

[M-DYMESParticipant]

Ok lets say he is top seven. It don’t matter. The West is filled with great guards and you need to be above top 7 to make the allstar game. If he’s in the East then no question..he is an all-star. But in the West you need to be on a winning squad because the amount of great guards in that conference is paramount. Guards are gonna get snubbed in the West every single year.

Being on a team that plays as poorly as the Warriors, you need to considerably outplay the likes of…

Chris Paul
Deron Williams
Chauncey Billups
Tony Parker
Nash
and then eventually… Evans and Westbrook

Its tough company out west.

[nateoak10Participant]

The D3 argument is pretty accurate. But I’d put Ellis > Parker. Parker benefits from Timmy, Manu, a system etc. And oce Westbrook and Evans get into that category Nash will probably have gotten too old and fallen out

[M-DYMESParticipant]

Yea I wasn’t just talkin about this year though. Im talking about the future as well. Im just saying the West is so deep with guard talent that expectations are raised not only for the player, but for the team he is associated with as well. Believe me, I feel your pain man. Im a T-Wolves fan and even if K-Love or J Flynn develop into very very good players they are still gonna have a very very hard time becoming All-stars even if they have an exceptional year such as Ellis.

You put Ellis on a Winning team in the East this year, he’s in
You put Ellis on the nets this year (East), he’s in.
You put Ellis on a winning team in the west, he’s probably in.
You put Ellis on a losing team in the West, he’s out.

[nateoak10Participant]

+1

[OldSkoolBasketballParticipant]

Ellis best game this season with good shooting percentage and still lost. Mavs defense is questionable after giving 52 points to Andre Miller and Ellis 46.

[the microwaveParticipant]

your argument is ridiculous.. Is monta a good player? of course he is, but good players on BUTT CHEEK tms do not make the all star team.. Take Andre Igoudala for example? David Lee? Chris Kaman? All different positions, but all the guys warrant being in the all star gm as well…. Why are they not in??? Look at their records. Unless you are a legitimate superstar in the class of Wade, etc… you will not make the all star gm on a crap tm.. Case closed!

[arman]

i just hate this shitty fans i mean when nellie got them in playofs he was god to them(al that we believe shit ) but now when the team is losing nellie is the worst coach…. and i must also say that Ellis is the player that you want to see in ASG i like billups but even if he misses game that wouldnt hurt him very much…

[Author]

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