[The Scare Crow RisesParticipant]

1st off I’d like to say that I am a huge believer in all three of these players and I don’t really feel as though any of them has to be moved…

But I have seen multiple threads involving the Cavs early season struggles and their need for defense and shot blocking, at the same I hear the talk around the league and internet that the 76ers are or were shopping MCW, so I asked myself …

What would the Cavs and 76ers have to gain\lose by trading Irving for MCW/Noel???

The 76ers get an immediate All Star and a player that people have compared to Philly favorite Allen Iverson, the Cavs get a big guard in MCW to defend and pass to Lebron and Love while also adding a young shot blocker in Noel…

The 76ers could than target any of the Bigs in the draft to compliment Embiid and Saric (Okefor-Towns-Alexander) without worrying how Noel fits in…I believe Embiid and Saric could play C and Pf while another Pf/C like Okafor/Towns/Kaminski plays around them(Okafor and Towns could be stars in the League, Saric a 6th man)

The Cavs would save some money by trading Irving, using it to resign Love and finding some depth to add to their bench…

Cavs long term assets

MCW-Waiters-Lebron-Love-Noel-Thompson + Free Agents…

76ers long term assets

Irving-Wroten-McDaniels-Saric-Embiid-Okafor or Towns + Free Agents…

[JCliff24Participant]

No matter how much they struggle this year Kyrie,Love, and Lebron won’t be moved. 

With that being said, its clear the Cavs have to do something to add a defense. So to stay along the Cavs/Sixers theme…

Waiters for Noel? 

[JCliff24Participant]

No matter how much they struggle this year Kyrie,Love, and Lebron won’t be moved. 

With that being said, its clear the Cavs have to do something to add a defense. So to stay along the Cavs/Sixers theme…

Waiters for Noel? 

[MopgrassParticipant]

 Side note: Noel… I thought he’d be blocking a boatload of shots immediately. That’s one of the few stats that usually translates from college to pros right away. 

[MopgrassParticipant]

 Side note: Noel… I thought he’d be blocking a boatload of shots immediately. That’s one of the few stats that usually translates from college to pros right away. 

[The Scare Crow RisesParticipant]

The Cavs would be saving 10 to 13 million in cap space after making a trade like this, and could add a few shooters/defenders in free agency even after resigning Kevin Love…MCW and Noel would look a lot better around Lebron and Love…They also have a few draft picks coming to them in the next few years and I think they could take the Miami approach and build Lebron/Love/Waiters and have MCW and Noel be the key role playing Pg and C…Lebron and Waiters could mimic he and Wade, Love and Bosh play similar roles in the Heat/Cavs offense and I feel Love would have a bigger role in the offense because of Waiters’ age…

The Heat struggled early on but they eventually got it together, I feel like the Cavs could remain patient and click towards the end of the year, gain some playoff experience for Love/Irving/Waiters and be ready to contend next year…

They will still need a shot blocker, a defensive guard and some depth, they’ll just have to do it with far less cap space…

I didn’t mean for the Original Post to be so 76ers focus, they are but 1 of 2 Teams involved in the hypothetical trade I suggest

[The Scare Crow RisesParticipant]

The Cavs would be saving 10 to 13 million in cap space after making a trade like this, and could add a few shooters/defenders in free agency even after resigning Kevin Love…MCW and Noel would look a lot better around Lebron and Love…They also have a few draft picks coming to them in the next few years and I think they could take the Miami approach and build Lebron/Love/Waiters and have MCW and Noel be the key role playing Pg and C…Lebron and Waiters could mimic he and Wade, Love and Bosh play similar roles in the Heat/Cavs offense and I feel Love would have a bigger role in the offense because of Waiters’ age…

The Heat struggled early on but they eventually got it together, I feel like the Cavs could remain patient and click towards the end of the year, gain some playoff experience for Love/Irving/Waiters and be ready to contend next year…

They will still need a shot blocker, a defensive guard and some depth, they’ll just have to do it with far less cap space…

I didn’t mean for the Original Post to be so 76ers focus, they are but 1 of 2 Teams involved in the hypothetical trade I suggest

[PhillytheKid]

was saying KJ McDaniels and MCW were offered to Milwaukee for Jabari Parker and their first round pick.

No chance I’d do that if I was Milwaukee.

Noel and MCW for Parker and 1st round pick is interesting, but I still woudln’t do it if I was Milwaukee.

 

IF that rumor is true, which I don’t think it is, its telling for a few reasons.

 

1)  Sixers realize MCW is limited as a PG.  They also realize KJ McD is probably a sell while he’s hot guy, meaning right now, his internet hype is worth more than he is to the Sixers.  I don’t think this means the Sixers don’t plan on keeping KJ, I think they will, but they think they can get what they asked for, then why not sell while he is high.

 

I like that you are offering up MCW, Bain.  It means you also are becoming frustrated by him.  Sometimes you just have to point out flaws for them to be noticeable to you, and now you see MCW busy complaining to refs but Failing to get back on defense.  You see him lowering his head and missing shots that he doesn’t have a chance to finish, which sets back the entire team on transition D and leads to an easy bucket (a 4 point play) for the other team.  

Apparently he’s coachable.  He’s said he realizes he needs to distribute the ball to get good shots, but I have only seen him get worse with it.  Good teammates or not, what he is doing, does not work.  So try something else, like hit Henry Sims at the elbow and make a better pass to Noel, instead of throwing your hands up in despair once poor Noel mishandles another ball.

But then again, he’s got things you can’t teach like rebounding.  He is not a good defender, and he needs to get better by dedicating himself to studying his opponents better (and not complaining so much).  

I like the rebounding and am curious to see him develop with the better talent (this year is a wash, Embiid, Towns, and Saric will change everything).  

I am not opposed to the trade you’ve put up.  I don’t think Kyrie is a typical PG, and I think he plays like an idiot at times (he is not Steph Curry, Steph Curry makes everyone on his team better).  I like the idea of trading Noel (limited and moot with the other bigs coming in next year) and MCW for an upgrade at PG.  We need a Rondo type of PG for the future.  MCW has the size and rebounding and potential defense of Rondo, but he definitely hasn’t been playing PG like Rondo.  He could learn a lot from him.  If he doesn’t get better, I defeinitely want an upgrade over him.

 

I do not buy the whole "eh’s the best player on that team" crap.  His absolute value is not great.  Let’s compare him to Rajon Rondo or Russel Westbrook or CP3 or Steph Curry, before we compare him to Jakarr Sampson.  We need an upgrade at the PG position, we might as well sell high.

I know its not realistic but if we could get Emmanuel Mudiay, I’m all for it.  That kid can ball more than people think.  They’ve forgotten his game since he went to China.  

Let’s get Muday, Hezonja, Towns, to run with Embiid and Saric.  Would be sick.  

[PhillytheKid]

was saying KJ McDaniels and MCW were offered to Milwaukee for Jabari Parker and their first round pick.

No chance I’d do that if I was Milwaukee.

Noel and MCW for Parker and 1st round pick is interesting, but I still woudln’t do it if I was Milwaukee.

 

IF that rumor is true, which I don’t think it is, its telling for a few reasons.

 

1)  Sixers realize MCW is limited as a PG.  They also realize KJ McD is probably a sell while he’s hot guy, meaning right now, his internet hype is worth more than he is to the Sixers.  I don’t think this means the Sixers don’t plan on keeping KJ, I think they will, but they think they can get what they asked for, then why not sell while he is high.

 

I like that you are offering up MCW, Bain.  It means you also are becoming frustrated by him.  Sometimes you just have to point out flaws for them to be noticeable to you, and now you see MCW busy complaining to refs but Failing to get back on defense.  You see him lowering his head and missing shots that he doesn’t have a chance to finish, which sets back the entire team on transition D and leads to an easy bucket (a 4 point play) for the other team.  

Apparently he’s coachable.  He’s said he realizes he needs to distribute the ball to get good shots, but I have only seen him get worse with it.  Good teammates or not, what he is doing, does not work.  So try something else, like hit Henry Sims at the elbow and make a better pass to Noel, instead of throwing your hands up in despair once poor Noel mishandles another ball.

But then again, he’s got things you can’t teach like rebounding.  He is not a good defender, and he needs to get better by dedicating himself to studying his opponents better (and not complaining so much).  

I like the rebounding and am curious to see him develop with the better talent (this year is a wash, Embiid, Towns, and Saric will change everything).  

I am not opposed to the trade you’ve put up.  I don’t think Kyrie is a typical PG, and I think he plays like an idiot at times (he is not Steph Curry, Steph Curry makes everyone on his team better).  I like the idea of trading Noel (limited and moot with the other bigs coming in next year) and MCW for an upgrade at PG.  We need a Rondo type of PG for the future.  MCW has the size and rebounding and potential defense of Rondo, but he definitely hasn’t been playing PG like Rondo.  He could learn a lot from him.  If he doesn’t get better, I defeinitely want an upgrade over him.

 

I do not buy the whole "eh’s the best player on that team" crap.  His absolute value is not great.  Let’s compare him to Rajon Rondo or Russel Westbrook or CP3 or Steph Curry, before we compare him to Jakarr Sampson.  We need an upgrade at the PG position, we might as well sell high.

I know its not realistic but if we could get Emmanuel Mudiay, I’m all for it.  That kid can ball more than people think.  They’ve forgotten his game since he went to China.  

Let’s get Muday, Hezonja, Towns, to run with Embiid and Saric.  Would be sick.  

[ibe12Participant]

You made some good points here. I think MCW picked up some of Evan Turners bad qualities. Arguing with teammates and coaches and that annoying ‘hey ref I got fouled’ on every play syndrome. Although we have Embiid and Noel if Okafor is there you have to take him. I think he will be better than Noel and Embiid combined. You can never have enough quality big men and if one of them don’t fit your scheme or develop package him in a trade for another need.

[ibe12Participant]

You made some good points here. I think MCW picked up some of Evan Turners bad qualities. Arguing with teammates and coaches and that annoying ‘hey ref I got fouled’ on every play syndrome. Although we have Embiid and Noel if Okafor is there you have to take him. I think he will be better than Noel and Embiid combined. You can never have enough quality big men and if one of them don’t fit your scheme or develop package him in a trade for another need.

[ZachAttackParticipant]

 Even if that trade did go down, it’d just be cap space for the Sixers. Do you really think Kyrie would play a single game for them. Danny Granger refused to play for them and Andrei Kirilenko won’t play for them. Kyrie’s an All-Star so if this did happen. He probably just wouldn’t show up for practice or games.

[PabloFiascoParticipant]

You say Kyrie’s an All-Star as if he’s done anything in his career like LEAD his team to the playoffs. The Cavs never even sniffed the playoffs. Two #1 picks and a fixture at the bottom of the conference shows you just how much of an impact Kyrie has on a team

Of course Kirilenko doesn’t want to play on the 76ers! He wants to compete for a championship not race up and down the court with young players.

[Andrew1984Participant]

So anyone who has never led a team to the playoffs has never “done anything in their career,” according to your logic?

Ok, I guess DeMarcus Cousins, Kevin Love, and Andre Drummond haven’t “done anything.”

Then there’s Anthony Davis. He’s only a year younger than Kyrie and has never been to the playoffs (and if they started today, still wouldn’t be), so I guess he’s never “done anything” either.

Oh, but Paul Millsap did lead his team to the playoffs, so he has actually achieved something while the above players have accomplished nothing.

I will listen to the argument that postseason success would take them to the next level in their careers, but saying that they’ve never done anything is silly and uninformed.

It’s a lot like the NFL argument that unless you have a Super Bowl win, you’re not a great QB. So Trent Dilfer and Brad Johnson were great QBs, but Dan Marino, Jim Kelly, and Warren Moon weren’t.

This is the fallacy of refusing to look at the big picture and assessing everything based on one requirement.

[PabloFiascoParticipant]

As it occured to me reading your statement I will say that you failed to comprehend the arguement that was being made. He said Kyrie Would NOT play for the 76ers because he was an All-Star as if he was a well accomplished veteran, been put through the wire and warranted such a luxury to choose who he plays for. There’s no denying he’s talented (I won’t call him "GREAT" just yet) …..but he doesn’t have the impact on the game as much as say John Wall, Chris Paul, and Russell Westbrook.

[PabloFiascoParticipant]

As it occured to me reading your statement I will say that you failed to comprehend the arguement that was being made. He said Kyrie Would NOT play for the 76ers because he was an All-Star as if he was a well accomplished veteran, been put through the wire and warranted such a luxury to choose who he plays for. There’s no denying he’s talented (I won’t call him "GREAT" just yet) …..but he doesn’t have the impact on the game as much as say John Wall, Chris Paul, and Russell Westbrook.

[Andrew1984Participant]

So anyone who has never led a team to the playoffs has never “done anything in their career,” according to your logic?

Ok, I guess DeMarcus Cousins, Kevin Love, and Andre Drummond haven’t “done anything.”

Then there’s Anthony Davis. He’s only a year younger than Kyrie and has never been to the playoffs (and if they started today, still wouldn’t be), so I guess he’s never “done anything” either.

Oh, but Paul Millsap did lead his team to the playoffs, so he has actually achieved something while the above players have accomplished nothing.

I will listen to the argument that postseason success would take them to the next level in their careers, but saying that they’ve never done anything is silly and uninformed.

It’s a lot like the NFL argument that unless you have a Super Bowl win, you’re not a great QB. So Trent Dilfer and Brad Johnson were great QBs, but Dan Marino, Jim Kelly, and Warren Moon weren’t.

This is the fallacy of refusing to look at the big picture and assessing everything based on one requirement.

[ZachAttackParticipant]

 Don’t you think Kyrie wants to compete for a championship. Everyone does! So your finally argument doesn’t make sense.

[ZachAttackParticipant]

 Don’t you think Kyrie wants to compete for a championship. Everyone does! So your finally argument doesn’t make sense.

[PabloFiascoParticipant]

You say Kyrie’s an All-Star as if he’s done anything in his career like LEAD his team to the playoffs. The Cavs never even sniffed the playoffs. Two #1 picks and a fixture at the bottom of the conference shows you just how much of an impact Kyrie has on a team

Of course Kirilenko doesn’t want to play on the 76ers! He wants to compete for a championship not race up and down the court with young players.

[ZachAttackParticipant]

 Even if that trade did go down, it’d just be cap space for the Sixers. Do you really think Kyrie would play a single game for them. Danny Granger refused to play for them and Andrei Kirilenko won’t play for them. Kyrie’s an All-Star so if this did happen. He probably just wouldn’t show up for practice or games.

[Hector_Reyes_8Participant]

I don’t see Cleveland doin this seeing as MCW has yet to prove he can be a good defensive player and can’t stretch the floor.

[Hector_Reyes_8Participant]

I don’t see Cleveland doin this seeing as MCW has yet to prove he can be a good defensive player and can’t stretch the floor.

[DolanCareParticipant]

 I actually thought of the same trade idea but was too much of a puss to post it here, hahaha. I like it to be honest- Kyrie would be going to a horrible situation but maybe he’ll like having the consistent green light. MCW would be someone who could focus on defense and getting the ball to Love and Lebron, a role that was MCW’s destiny since draft day. 

[DolanCareParticipant]

 I actually thought of the same trade idea but was too much of a puss to post it here, hahaha. I like it to be honest- Kyrie would be going to a horrible situation but maybe he’ll like having the consistent green light. MCW would be someone who could focus on defense and getting the ball to Love and Lebron, a role that was MCW’s destiny since draft day. 

[mixtape2003Participant]

If this trade happened then the Cavs would have to have faith that Waiter could pick up the scoring that is getting traded away with Kyrie. I don’t see that happening but the Waiters for Noel makes sense but I can see the Sixers wanting more since they will have more leverage. Either way something has to be done soon, cause Love could still walk in FA this summer and Lebron recently has came out and said he would leave the Cavs again if it was a good business move (not 100% on the context of that convo).

[mixtape2003Participant]

If this trade happened then the Cavs would have to have faith that Waiter could pick up the scoring that is getting traded away with Kyrie. I don’t see that happening but the Waiters for Noel makes sense but I can see the Sixers wanting more since they will have more leverage. Either way something has to be done soon, cause Love could still walk in FA this summer and Lebron recently has came out and said he would leave the Cavs again if it was a good business move (not 100% on the context of that convo).

[Author]

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