[valentine]

Need to vent.  

First off congrats to Arizona fans, I think you all are getting a stud who is a potential one and done.  This guy is a more athletic Ryan Kelly.

That being said, all my guys were really confident that he was going to UNC, and his father playing for Roy was the trump card.  Pekka even personally contacted Roy and asked him to recruit his son.  

That being said,

I think this recruitment embodies a very important rule to follow when trying to guess if a prospect is going to commit to somewhere.  Pay attention to the school that is not like the others!  

Markennon’s coach in Finland played at Utah.
His Dad personally played for Roy Williams.

Where was his inside connection to Arizona?  There was none.  His interest in that school came personally and not from a connection.  

That being said, I am shocked and sad, but congrats to Arizona fans!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  

[TarHeelRavenParticipant]

Didn’t Roy just fly over to Finland to do an in-home with this guy?  I think Carolina’s recruiting problems might extend far beyond the academic scandal.  This is purely a guess because I have absolutely zero inside information about the program like ncballer.  Has Roy perhaps lost touch with young kids these days and is unable to relate to them?  The Carolina brand that used to sell itself has lost it’s luster.  Brandon Robinson and Tony Bradley are solid guys, but they are not Jabari Parker, Justice Winslow or Jahlil Okafor or Andrew Wiggins by any stretch of the imagination.  Is having Brandan Wright as your only one and done during your tenure Carolina absolutely killed Roy’s credibility with guys who are obvious one and dones?  I am 100 percent honest guys like Cal, K, Sean Miller, and Bill Self have abslutely lit up Carolina in a negative sense when they are talking to recruits.  Carolina will contend for a title this year, but after this year bringing in just Brandon Robinson and Tony Bradley with the mass exodus I am expecting, Carolina could be 2010 bad, or much worse.  I’m hearing Seventh Wooods is leaning toward South Carolina.  As a die-hard Carolina fan I am looking for ANY answers here.  Roy is a hall of fame coach with 2 national titles, but hasn’t sniffed a final four since 2009.  Giles is not coming to Carolina.  In my opinion, Roy has lost his way.  It pains me to say this, but I think he should maybe step down and perhaps Carolina needs some young new blood to reenergize a program that has been floundering recently. 

[TarHeelRavenParticipant]

Didn’t Roy just fly over to Finland to do an in-home with this guy?  I think Carolina’s recruiting problems might extend far beyond the academic scandal.  This is purely a guess because I have absolutely zero inside information about the program like ncballer.  Has Roy perhaps lost touch with young kids these days and is unable to relate to them?  The Carolina brand that used to sell itself has lost it’s luster.  Brandon Robinson and Tony Bradley are solid guys, but they are not Jabari Parker, Justice Winslow or Jahlil Okafor or Andrew Wiggins by any stretch of the imagination.  Is having Brandan Wright as your only one and done during your tenure Carolina absolutely killed Roy’s credibility with guys who are obvious one and dones?  I am 100 percent honest guys like Cal, K, Sean Miller, and Bill Self have abslutely lit up Carolina in a negative sense when they are talking to recruits.  Carolina will contend for a title this year, but after this year bringing in just Brandon Robinson and Tony Bradley with the mass exodus I am expecting, Carolina could be 2010 bad, or much worse.  I’m hearing Seventh Wooods is leaning toward South Carolina.  As a die-hard Carolina fan I am looking for ANY answers here.  Roy is a hall of fame coach with 2 national titles, but hasn’t sniffed a final four since 2009.  Giles is not coming to Carolina.  In my opinion, Roy has lost his way.  It pains me to say this, but I think he should maybe step down and perhaps Carolina needs some young new blood to reenergize a program that has been floundering recently. 

[airenn34Participant]

 Die hard UNC fan from Chicago. I have to agree with youTarHeel raven. I love what Roy has done for UNC  but I really think the game is passing him by. I really believe all the OAD, the elite guys who wanna set themselves up with a sure pipeline to the NBA are seeing that Roy doesnt really develop  or improve players and get them ready for the pros. I may be wrong but maybe its his style or how he runs his system in Carolina. I dont think its a prostyle offense. Roy has churned out his fair shair of pros: Heinrich, Collison, Pirece. Most recently guys like Henson, Bullock, Davis. You got a guy like Barnes who we dont even know what his ceiling is but. We thought Kobe esque but its looking more like very good complimentary. Roy in fairness likes to bring in guys who will stay 3 years  and gets the squad ready to contend within that time frame.

[airenn34Participant]

 Die hard UNC fan from Chicago. I have to agree with youTarHeel raven. I love what Roy has done for UNC  but I really think the game is passing him by. I really believe all the OAD, the elite guys who wanna set themselves up with a sure pipeline to the NBA are seeing that Roy doesnt really develop  or improve players and get them ready for the pros. I may be wrong but maybe its his style or how he runs his system in Carolina. I dont think its a prostyle offense. Roy has churned out his fair shair of pros: Heinrich, Collison, Pirece. Most recently guys like Henson, Bullock, Davis. You got a guy like Barnes who we dont even know what his ceiling is but. We thought Kobe esque but its looking more like very good complimentary. Roy in fairness likes to bring in guys who will stay 3 years  and gets the squad ready to contend within that time frame.

[ncballer]

 Utah’s coach, and Sean Miller both flew out there as well for in-homes.

As it pertains to Markennon, I believe the immediate PT was a bigger trump card than Dad was.  There is a gaping hole at the PF spot ever since TJ Leaf decommited.  With Isaiah Hicks, likely returning, I assume that Roy’s pitch to him was to be a super 6th man being a guy who completely changes the dynamic off the bench to spell Hicks and play them at the same time.  I would imagine that Miller’s speach was, "come in here and get 35 minutes a game and start right away."  I am still shocked to say the least though.  My guys were the most confident about getting him than any other remaining prospect on board and I am pretty sure Roy is just as shocked.  They were under the impression that his OV to UNC could not have gone any better.  

I think you will be pleasently surprised with Tony Bradley.  He is in no way a one and done, but don’t let the clips of him fool you.  Although certainly not overwhelming or flashy, he is going to be a hell of a college player.  The guy put up some serious numbers against serious competition on the circuit this summer.  Although he is a lot closer to his ceiling than other players, I would expect an immediate impact from him.  

The only real way to find out if Roy has lost his touch is let the NCAA thing play out, and they need Jalek Felton to be a one and done, top 5 draft pick, (and he certainly has the ability to be one), then see if recruiting changes.  As it stands now though, Roy is determined to get this program back to the standard it should be.  I am hoping that starts with a final four/championship run this year!

FYI, not even Seventh’s coach knows which school he is leaning toward.  It will be a nail biter to the end.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

[ncballer]

 Utah’s coach, and Sean Miller both flew out there as well for in-homes.

As it pertains to Markennon, I believe the immediate PT was a bigger trump card than Dad was.  There is a gaping hole at the PF spot ever since TJ Leaf decommited.  With Isaiah Hicks, likely returning, I assume that Roy’s pitch to him was to be a super 6th man being a guy who completely changes the dynamic off the bench to spell Hicks and play them at the same time.  I would imagine that Miller’s speach was, "come in here and get 35 minutes a game and start right away."  I am still shocked to say the least though.  My guys were the most confident about getting him than any other remaining prospect on board and I am pretty sure Roy is just as shocked.  They were under the impression that his OV to UNC could not have gone any better.  

I think you will be pleasently surprised with Tony Bradley.  He is in no way a one and done, but don’t let the clips of him fool you.  Although certainly not overwhelming or flashy, he is going to be a hell of a college player.  The guy put up some serious numbers against serious competition on the circuit this summer.  Although he is a lot closer to his ceiling than other players, I would expect an immediate impact from him.  

The only real way to find out if Roy has lost his touch is let the NCAA thing play out, and they need Jalek Felton to be a one and done, top 5 draft pick, (and he certainly has the ability to be one), then see if recruiting changes.  As it stands now though, Roy is determined to get this program back to the standard it should be.  I am hoping that starts with a final four/championship run this year!

FYI, not even Seventh’s coach knows which school he is leaning toward.  It will be a nail biter to the end.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

[airenn34Participant]

 ncballer it seems like Jalek is as hard commit to UNC as there is no? I really think he’ll honor his verbal seeing as how Felton family s UNC family. Really hoping Seventh comes. Isnt it true that this kid is the hardest Roy has ever recruited. Thats gotta reciprocate to Seventh. Now In hearing Giles cancelled his official to Chapel Hill. Lets just enjoy the incoming season as we are prime for a deep run in March.

[ncballer]

 There were some rumors flying around that Jalek was flirting with Kentucky and Kansas even after his verbal to UNC.  He cleared that up really fast and has let the media know he is 100% committed to UNC.  The academic scandal stuff has been a HUGE part of negative recruiting.  Anyone who takes the time to really understand the investigations knows and can jump to a logical conclusion that it is highly unlikely Men’s Basketball will get any type of sanction or probation, but the flip side to that is that we are dealing with the NCAA, who is by nature a huge wildcard.  

I don’t know if he has recruited Seventh the hardest.  He put in a TON of time and effort into Harrison Barnes, while many naysayers thought he was a lock to Duke.  I would say that he put in a ton of effort into Harry Giles who has frankly drank the kool-aid of negative recruiting in regards to the NCAA stuff.  Many UNC fans scratched their heads as to why Ingram got an offer so early as a low end 4 star top 80 player, and now we see why.  I think Ingram hurt Roy the most, from what I hear.  Ingram visited UNC by far the most out of any other school, his worst visit that he experienced was to the school he committed to, it was so bad that he stopped by UNC on his way home and Roy kind of put his head out there for the kid when he wasn’t the commodity that he is now.  

I think one thing different we are going to start to see is Roy recruiting a lot of players that in the past he would have deemed unrecruitable due to handlers.  Historically, Roy has really only wanted to work with a HS basketball coach and parents of recruits.  John Wall and Rashad Vaughan are two prominent prospects that would have been Tar Heels had Roy been more willing to work with the people that were handling their recruitments.  I think we Tar Heels are going to see that change we so desperately need to keep up with the times. 

 

 

[ncballer]

 There were some rumors flying around that Jalek was flirting with Kentucky and Kansas even after his verbal to UNC.  He cleared that up really fast and has let the media know he is 100% committed to UNC.  The academic scandal stuff has been a HUGE part of negative recruiting.  Anyone who takes the time to really understand the investigations knows and can jump to a logical conclusion that it is highly unlikely Men’s Basketball will get any type of sanction or probation, but the flip side to that is that we are dealing with the NCAA, who is by nature a huge wildcard.  

I don’t know if he has recruited Seventh the hardest.  He put in a TON of time and effort into Harrison Barnes, while many naysayers thought he was a lock to Duke.  I would say that he put in a ton of effort into Harry Giles who has frankly drank the kool-aid of negative recruiting in regards to the NCAA stuff.  Many UNC fans scratched their heads as to why Ingram got an offer so early as a low end 4 star top 80 player, and now we see why.  I think Ingram hurt Roy the most, from what I hear.  Ingram visited UNC by far the most out of any other school, his worst visit that he experienced was to the school he committed to, it was so bad that he stopped by UNC on his way home and Roy kind of put his head out there for the kid when he wasn’t the commodity that he is now.  

I think one thing different we are going to start to see is Roy recruiting a lot of players that in the past he would have deemed unrecruitable due to handlers.  Historically, Roy has really only wanted to work with a HS basketball coach and parents of recruits.  John Wall and Rashad Vaughan are two prominent prospects that would have been Tar Heels had Roy been more willing to work with the people that were handling their recruitments.  I think we Tar Heels are going to see that change we so desperately need to keep up with the times. 

 

 

[airenn34Participant]

 ncballer it seems like Jalek is as hard commit to UNC as there is no? I really think he’ll honor his verbal seeing as how Felton family s UNC family. Really hoping Seventh comes. Isnt it true that this kid is the hardest Roy has ever recruited. Thats gotta reciprocate to Seventh. Now In hearing Giles cancelled his official to Chapel Hill. Lets just enjoy the incoming season as we are prime for a deep run in March.

[Bill Walton’s KneesParticipant]

 With a lot of the highly ranked guys waiting until the Spring Signing Period to declare, UNC still has a shot to score come big time recruits, especially if they live up to expecations this season.

[Bill Walton’s KneesParticipant]

 With a lot of the highly ranked guys waiting until the Spring Signing Period to declare, UNC still has a shot to score come big time recruits, especially if they live up to expecations this season.

[TarHeelRavenParticipant]

I don’t doubt anything of what you say ncballer, but how did K get Ingram if his visit was so bad?  What exactly happened there?

[ncballer]

 Winslow (he and Ingram have mutual disdain for each other and got into a verbal altercation on the visit) who was previously was not expected to go pro, announced he was going pro, and K got Thornton to reclassify and commit.  It’s funny, to add insult to injury, K was telling Brandon things like "don’t expect to play much your freshman season if you were to come here", etc, and that pitch really shifted once Winslow exploded onto draft boards.  

The NCAA mess was scaring the Ingrams as well.  Which I could understand back then, but now, it is a longshot IMO that we have anything happen to men’s basketball.  They were not named in the NOA, not that is not stopping negative recruiting anyways.  

[ncballer]

 Winslow (he and Ingram have mutual disdain for each other and got into a verbal altercation on the visit) who was previously was not expected to go pro, announced he was going pro, and K got Thornton to reclassify and commit.  It’s funny, to add insult to injury, K was telling Brandon things like "don’t expect to play much your freshman season if you were to come here", etc, and that pitch really shifted once Winslow exploded onto draft boards.  

The NCAA mess was scaring the Ingrams as well.  Which I could understand back then, but now, it is a longshot IMO that we have anything happen to men’s basketball.  They were not named in the NOA, not that is not stopping negative recruiting anyways.  

[TarHeelRavenParticipant]

I don’t doubt anything of what you say ncballer, but how did K get Ingram if his visit was so bad?  What exactly happened there?

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