[ChicagoCaseyParticipant]

 This isn’t a post that is dismissing LeBron accomplishment or discrediting him as a player, but asking a question about his team accomplishments. I read a tweet about Tom Haberstroh talking about Michael Jordan missed the finals 7 out his 13 years in the league vs. LeBron made the finals 7-12 years. He used that to dismiss the LeBron haters "2-4" argument. I believe that’s a horrible take and I don’t know why people dismiss LeBron 2-4 record, but praise him going to the finals 7 times. 

You can’t praise LeBron went to the finals 6 straight years, but dismiss his 2-4 record in those finals because he carried his team to the finals and he went against superior teams in the finals. You can say the same thing in reverse, everybody knows the eastern conference been trash for the past 16 or so years and that’s why he got to those finals. That’s one major argument in the Tom Haberstoh tweet, another one is that MJ faced far more 50+ win teams than LeBron, that’s probably why LeBron made more finals and Jordan lost in previous rounds.

That’s not discrediting LeBron legacy, it’s just a simple fact. I don’t know why the media always sugercoat it and always praise the fact how many times LeBron went to the finals, but not the competition that he faced to get there. LeBron is an top 5 all time player, but it’s valid to talk about the eastern conference have been god awful for 16 or so years and that’s a key reason for LeBron playoff team success. By saying that, that does not saying that LeBron is overrated or is underserving of his accomplishments. But, just stating facts and putting to bed that he went to 7 finals, but not mentioning the record in the finals. My personal opinion is that the national media baby LeBron about his legacy. 

P.S. I made a post that suggest the NBA need to end all conferences because the competition is flat out bad and the ratings are getting worst because of it in the east.

 

 

 

 

[akhan786Participant]

 Conversely if he was in the West, I’d say he would still get to 3-4 Finals at this point in his career. And then he would most likely have an undefeated record in the Finals to boot.

It can go both ways however you want to twist the narrative. Getting to 6 Finals in a row period is damn impressive let alone doing it from two different teams.

 

 

[akhan786Participant]

 Conversely if he was in the West, I’d say he would still get to 3-4 Finals at this point in his career. And then he would most likely have an undefeated record in the Finals to boot.

It can go both ways however you want to twist the narrative. Getting to 6 Finals in a row period is damn impressive let alone doing it from two different teams.

 

 

[ChicagoCaseyParticipant]

 Never said it wasn’t impressive at all. Just stating the facts that if you want to dismiss the fact that he’s 2-4 in the finals, you could do the same thing about how he got to the finals. Those are all facts. The facts is that he didn’t face many 50+ win teams to get to the finals. That’s a fact.

What you saying is all opinion about if he was in the western conference he would’ve still made the finals, that is can not proven and that’s a opinion. You and I don’t know how he would fare in the western conference. That’s why I stuck with all the facts/ I could’ve made an opinion and stated that LeBron wouldn’t have made the finals in the western conference. But, that’s an opinion.

It’s pretty impressive if you look at it that way, but if you put in into context then it would be less impressive. He had 2 other top 10-15 players in the conference for all those years and they had the top 2 records in the conference in those 6 seasons. It would’ve been a major disappointment if he didn’t make the finals each year. He was suppose to make it.

 

 

[ChicagoCaseyParticipant]

 Never said it wasn’t impressive at all. Just stating the facts that if you want to dismiss the fact that he’s 2-4 in the finals, you could do the same thing about how he got to the finals. Those are all facts. The facts is that he didn’t face many 50+ win teams to get to the finals. That’s a fact.

What you saying is all opinion about if he was in the western conference he would’ve still made the finals, that is can not proven and that’s a opinion. You and I don’t know how he would fare in the western conference. That’s why I stuck with all the facts/ I could’ve made an opinion and stated that LeBron wouldn’t have made the finals in the western conference. But, that’s an opinion.

It’s pretty impressive if you look at it that way, but if you put in into context then it would be less impressive. He had 2 other top 10-15 players in the conference for all those years and they had the top 2 records in the conference in those 6 seasons. It would’ve been a major disappointment if he didn’t make the finals each year. He was suppose to make it.

 

 

[J-rueMykelParticipant]

MJ played 15 years in the league.  Those Washington Wizard years still count.  Lebron entered the league as an 18 year old kid, MJ was 21 when he came in if I remember correctly. At 22, Lebron was willing an awful Cleveland supporting cast to the finals. At 22 MJ lost in the first round via sweep after qualifying for the playoffs with a 30-52 record.  Yes you read that right, 30-52 got you in the playoffs. MJ won his first title in his age 27 season, same as Lebron. Yes MJ went a remarkable 6-0 in NBA finals, but he also lost in the ECSF to a pre-peak Shaq and Penny Magic team that couldn’t even win a Finals game.  MJ also had the luxury of being coached by the greatest coach of all time, maybe POP has ascertained that distinction now IDK, and a team carefully constructed around his talents.  MJ was the ultimate competitor, LJ is the most well rounded player ever.  MJ wanted to rip your heart out and then let you watch him eat it with the last moment of your life.  Lebron want’s to penetrate the defense and make the right basketball play by kicking it out to an open shooter.  They are different players, in different eras, and the foolish comparisons need to stop.  Greatness is greatness, appreciate it, don’t try and discredit it with foolish keystrokes that spread your negative energy.  And please don’t forget, Big Shot Bob (Robert Horry) won 7 championships, not even MJ can say that, so why don’t we talk about his legacy which if you’re counting rings obviously supercedes MJ’s legacy. 

[J-rueMykelParticipant]

MJ played 15 years in the league.  Those Washington Wizard years still count.  Lebron entered the league as an 18 year old kid, MJ was 21 when he came in if I remember correctly. At 22, Lebron was willing an awful Cleveland supporting cast to the finals. At 22 MJ lost in the first round via sweep after qualifying for the playoffs with a 30-52 record.  Yes you read that right, 30-52 got you in the playoffs. MJ won his first title in his age 27 season, same as Lebron. Yes MJ went a remarkable 6-0 in NBA finals, but he also lost in the ECSF to a pre-peak Shaq and Penny Magic team that couldn’t even win a Finals game.  MJ also had the luxury of being coached by the greatest coach of all time, maybe POP has ascertained that distinction now IDK, and a team carefully constructed around his talents.  MJ was the ultimate competitor, LJ is the most well rounded player ever.  MJ wanted to rip your heart out and then let you watch him eat it with the last moment of your life.  Lebron want’s to penetrate the defense and make the right basketball play by kicking it out to an open shooter.  They are different players, in different eras, and the foolish comparisons need to stop.  Greatness is greatness, appreciate it, don’t try and discredit it with foolish keystrokes that spread your negative energy.  And please don’t forget, Big Shot Bob (Robert Horry) won 7 championships, not even MJ can say that, so why don’t we talk about his legacy which if you’re counting rings obviously supercedes MJ’s legacy. 

[SeattleSuperChronicsParticipant]

 If lebron can get 3-4 more championships how can you not call him the greatest of all time..Assuming he stays healthy..I can see it being possible. 

[SeattleSuperChronicsParticipant]

 If lebron can get 3-4 more championships how can you not call him the greatest of all time..Assuming he stays healthy..I can see it being possible. 

[J-rueMykelParticipant]

Is the best username I’ve seen you get a plus 1 from me everytime I see you. 

[J-rueMykelParticipant]

Is the best username I’ve seen you get a plus 1 from me everytime I see you. 

[J-rueMykelParticipant]

Can we start the conversation about how amazing Lebron played in the finals last year, and how he got robbed of a Finals MVP award. The award doesn’t say the Most Valuable Player on the winning team, it says the Most Valuable Player, I’d argue that GSW still wins that series with out Iggy, who is from my hometown by the way, but CLE loses every game by as many points as GSW wants to win by without Lebron.  Last year might have been the best we’ve ever seen Bron play, let’s not forget that. 

[J-rueMykelParticipant]

Can we start the conversation about how amazing Lebron played in the finals last year, and how he got robbed of a Finals MVP award. The award doesn’t say the Most Valuable Player on the winning team, it says the Most Valuable Player, I’d argue that GSW still wins that series with out Iggy, who is from my hometown by the way, but CLE loses every game by as many points as GSW wants to win by without Lebron.  Last year might have been the best we’ve ever seen Bron play, let’s not forget that. 

[ChicagoCaseyParticipant]

 People are taking my post way out of context, talking to you "J-rueMykel". Not comparing MJv/LBJ. Just talking about the facts about the tweet Tom Haborstoh. I said in the tweet. I’m. just dismissing and discrediting that tweet about Tom had tweeted out. You can’t just say LeBron made 6 straight NBA finals, but say "don’t count the finals record because he didn’t have the team to have a better record". You can say the same thing about how he made to the finals. You can say that the only reason he made it to the finals because he had better teams throughout these past six seasons, not including the first one when he went against the Spurs. 

To "J-rueMykel" again, I wasn’t making this out to be a MJv/LBJ debate. Never compared them to each other, And I said that LBJ was a top 5 player of all time. I only used the comparison because of that tweet. LeBron is an all time player, but what I said was all FACT. THE EAST IS A WEAK CONFERENCE, BEEN THAT WAY SINCE LEBRON CAME INTO THE LEAGUE. THE EAST WAS BETTER DURING THE MJ ERA, BETTER TEAMS, HARDER TO GET TO THE FINALS, MORE STARS IN THE EAST.

All I am saying is fact.

 

 

 

 

[ChicagoCaseyParticipant]

 People are taking my post way out of context, talking to you "J-rueMykel". Not comparing MJv/LBJ. Just talking about the facts about the tweet Tom Haborstoh. I said in the tweet. I’m. just dismissing and discrediting that tweet about Tom had tweeted out. You can’t just say LeBron made 6 straight NBA finals, but say "don’t count the finals record because he didn’t have the team to have a better record". You can say the same thing about how he made to the finals. You can say that the only reason he made it to the finals because he had better teams throughout these past six seasons, not including the first one when he went against the Spurs. 

To "J-rueMykel" again, I wasn’t making this out to be a MJv/LBJ debate. Never compared them to each other, And I said that LBJ was a top 5 player of all time. I only used the comparison because of that tweet. LeBron is an all time player, but what I said was all FACT. THE EAST IS A WEAK CONFERENCE, BEEN THAT WAY SINCE LEBRON CAME INTO THE LEAGUE. THE EAST WAS BETTER DURING THE MJ ERA, BETTER TEAMS, HARDER TO GET TO THE FINALS, MORE STARS IN THE EAST.

All I am saying is fact.

 

 

 

 

[J-rueMykelParticipant]

 The entire league is better now than the MJ era, a chicago homer like yourself will never see that.  Evolution, the european invasion dynamic, and better understanding of basketball analytics and metrics has created a much stronger competition. Lebron has never played on a well constructed "team", he had a couple super friends in Miami but those teams were by no means juggernauts, and we saw that when Lebron left last year and Miami fell out of the playoffs.  This man, does things MJ never could, This man still has 6-7 years of elite basketball left in him, can we just appreciate his greatness, his durability, his comitmment to winning and the city of Cleveland without having to try and take something away from him and use Michael Jordan as the only arguement for doing so.  The 90’s were great, but please start living in the moment.

[J-rueMykelParticipant]

 The entire league is better now than the MJ era, a chicago homer like yourself will never see that.  Evolution, the european invasion dynamic, and better understanding of basketball analytics and metrics has created a much stronger competition. Lebron has never played on a well constructed "team", he had a couple super friends in Miami but those teams were by no means juggernauts, and we saw that when Lebron left last year and Miami fell out of the playoffs.  This man, does things MJ never could, This man still has 6-7 years of elite basketball left in him, can we just appreciate his greatness, his durability, his comitmment to winning and the city of Cleveland without having to try and take something away from him and use Michael Jordan as the only arguement for doing so.  The 90’s were great, but please start living in the moment.

[ChicagoCaseyParticipant]

 Here’s where you are wrong, I was born in 1997, 17 years old, and I never really watched Jordan. So, I don’t have no blind Jordan stan that believe he can’t do nothing wrong, like you LBJ stan.

So, you are saying that the that todays eastern conference is better than Jordan eastern conference? It’s a pretty common fact that todays eastern conference is worst than yesterdays eastern conference. There were better teams in the east back then that Jordan have to go through to get to the final. He had to go through the Knicks, Pacers, Pistons, and much more. They had all time greats on those teams, Todays Hawks, Raptors, and Celtics does not.

And yes, the athletes of this age is much better than in 20 or so years, but that does not prove that the todays Raptors could beat Isiah Thomas Piston team, Reggie Miller Pacer team, Patrick Ewing Knicks team.

 

 

[ChicagoCaseyParticipant]

 Here’s where you are wrong, I was born in 1997, 17 years old, and I never really watched Jordan. So, I don’t have no blind Jordan stan that believe he can’t do nothing wrong, like you LBJ stan.

So, you are saying that the that todays eastern conference is better than Jordan eastern conference? It’s a pretty common fact that todays eastern conference is worst than yesterdays eastern conference. There were better teams in the east back then that Jordan have to go through to get to the final. He had to go through the Knicks, Pacers, Pistons, and much more. They had all time greats on those teams, Todays Hawks, Raptors, and Celtics does not.

And yes, the athletes of this age is much better than in 20 or so years, but that does not prove that the todays Raptors could beat Isiah Thomas Piston team, Reggie Miller Pacer team, Patrick Ewing Knicks team.

 

 

[J-rueMykelParticipant]

 It’s a pretty common fact in what circle, manipulated brain-washed children who never watched those teams, or people who have an inflated sense of what those teams were capable of becasue they were the reason the fans fell in love with the game.  Those Knicks and Pacers teams, combined for zero championships.  The Pistons, were not the same after their two championship teams and really only conteneded in the 91 season. 

Lebron had to face Pistons and Celtic cores that were able to win championships, so to pretend he has been playing in a much weaker eastern conference than MJ did is quite laughable.  This years Raptors team wasn’t a joke, they won 1 less game than the Cavs and 1 more than the Thunder, they didn’t have much playoff expierience but they made a series against this Cleveland team which appears to be the most dynamic squad LBJ has ever had.  To call Reggie Miller and Patrick Ewing all time greats and then pretend that Kevin Garnett, Ray Allen, Paul Pierce, and Dwight Howard are not is pretty laughable.  Reggie Miller/Rik Smits/ Mark Jackson & Ewing/John Starks/Alan Houston do not keep you up at night. Jason Kidd got into the Finals twice and AI once with no-one in the East after MJ retired.  The east has been cakewalk since the Pistons fell apart, lets get real, the mid to late 2000’s East were no joke and Lebron’s greatness dismantled that. 

 

[J-rueMykelParticipant]

 It’s a pretty common fact in what circle, manipulated brain-washed children who never watched those teams, or people who have an inflated sense of what those teams were capable of becasue they were the reason the fans fell in love with the game.  Those Knicks and Pacers teams, combined for zero championships.  The Pistons, were not the same after their two championship teams and really only conteneded in the 91 season. 

Lebron had to face Pistons and Celtic cores that were able to win championships, so to pretend he has been playing in a much weaker eastern conference than MJ did is quite laughable.  This years Raptors team wasn’t a joke, they won 1 less game than the Cavs and 1 more than the Thunder, they didn’t have much playoff expierience but they made a series against this Cleveland team which appears to be the most dynamic squad LBJ has ever had.  To call Reggie Miller and Patrick Ewing all time greats and then pretend that Kevin Garnett, Ray Allen, Paul Pierce, and Dwight Howard are not is pretty laughable.  Reggie Miller/Rik Smits/ Mark Jackson & Ewing/John Starks/Alan Houston do not keep you up at night. Jason Kidd got into the Finals twice and AI once with no-one in the East after MJ retired.  The east has been cakewalk since the Pistons fell apart, lets get real, the mid to late 2000’s East were no joke and Lebron’s greatness dismantled that. 

 

[BiggysmallsParticipant]

 LeBron’s domination of the East is something never seen before in the NBA and hopefully when it’s over, never is seen again. It makes for an incredibly boring playoffs. 

A couple things go into it

1. LeBron is one of the best players of all time and still probably the most impactful player in the game today by a wide margin. 

2. LeBron is smart enough to continually surround himself with terrific supporting players. He played with 2 elite players for 4 years in Miami, in his physical prime and they tore through a weak East as Boston’s run was ending and nobody else was really ready to contend with them. Then he joined Cleveland with 2 more very good players and a nice roster structured perfectly around him. 

3. The Eastern Conference has become a slop fest of mediocrity. I think LeBron got to the finals unexpectedly one time – his first time – and in the 6 since, it wouldve been a major shock had he not gotten there. Those Heat teams steamrolled people and shouldve steamrolled people. These Cavs teams are so far superior to the competition that it would be a major disappointment if they were to NOT get to the finals. 

Now LeBron can’t really control who he plays and who he beats on his way to the Finals but that has to be at least part of the equation when talking about his legacy. These teams the Cavs are beating are okay teams but it doesn’t really feel like they are playoff series where there is any sort of pressure at all. It doesn’t feel like they are being challenged by these teams at all. 

That doesn’t take away from LeBron as a player because he’s an incredible player. But in terms of how you evaluate the "6 straight finals appearances"…it has to matter because the East has been watered down for years. The best team his team has beaten was probably when they beat Boston in 7 games with an old Pierce, Allen and Garnett. That was like the final stand of the Boston Big 3 though. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[BiggysmallsParticipant]

 LeBron’s domination of the East is something never seen before in the NBA and hopefully when it’s over, never is seen again. It makes for an incredibly boring playoffs. 

A couple things go into it

1. LeBron is one of the best players of all time and still probably the most impactful player in the game today by a wide margin. 

2. LeBron is smart enough to continually surround himself with terrific supporting players. He played with 2 elite players for 4 years in Miami, in his physical prime and they tore through a weak East as Boston’s run was ending and nobody else was really ready to contend with them. Then he joined Cleveland with 2 more very good players and a nice roster structured perfectly around him. 

3. The Eastern Conference has become a slop fest of mediocrity. I think LeBron got to the finals unexpectedly one time – his first time – and in the 6 since, it wouldve been a major shock had he not gotten there. Those Heat teams steamrolled people and shouldve steamrolled people. These Cavs teams are so far superior to the competition that it would be a major disappointment if they were to NOT get to the finals. 

Now LeBron can’t really control who he plays and who he beats on his way to the Finals but that has to be at least part of the equation when talking about his legacy. These teams the Cavs are beating are okay teams but it doesn’t really feel like they are playoff series where there is any sort of pressure at all. It doesn’t feel like they are being challenged by these teams at all. 

That doesn’t take away from LeBron as a player because he’s an incredible player. But in terms of how you evaluate the "6 straight finals appearances"…it has to matter because the East has been watered down for years. The best team his team has beaten was probably when they beat Boston in 7 games with an old Pierce, Allen and Garnett. That was like the final stand of the Boston Big 3 though. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[ChicagoCaseyParticipant]

 That’s exactly my point. But, you will get negged hard for stating facts or disrespecting the "GOAT". These people don’t want to have an honest convo about LeBron team legacy. Everyone knows that LeBron is this generation GOAT and is a top 5 player of all time. But, you can’t question LBJ legacy like you can question someone like Kobe legacy. You can’t say a bad word about him.

You can’t say the eastern conference have been a slop fest of mediocrity because they believe it’s not and it’s a whole bunch of elite teams in the east. But, truth be told the only teams that gave LeBron some go in the playoffs was an aging Boston team and a young Indiana team. No other teams have came close to LeBron teams.

LeBron can’t control it, but it’s a fact that he or his teams didn’t face great teams in the east/

 

 

[ChicagoCaseyParticipant]

 That’s exactly my point. But, you will get negged hard for stating facts or disrespecting the "GOAT". These people don’t want to have an honest convo about LeBron team legacy. Everyone knows that LeBron is this generation GOAT and is a top 5 player of all time. But, you can’t question LBJ legacy like you can question someone like Kobe legacy. You can’t say a bad word about him.

You can’t say the eastern conference have been a slop fest of mediocrity because they believe it’s not and it’s a whole bunch of elite teams in the east. But, truth be told the only teams that gave LeBron some go in the playoffs was an aging Boston team and a young Indiana team. No other teams have came close to LeBron teams.

LeBron can’t control it, but it’s a fact that he or his teams didn’t face great teams in the east/

 

 

[J-rueMykelParticipant]

has anyone coming out of the east had to face????
The only eastern conference team to win a championship other than Jordan’s Bulls and Lebron’s Cheat was that Pistons team that put it together down the stretch and shocked LAL, a Miami team that had a near prime shaq and an out of his mind DWade, and that ALL TIME GREAT BOSTON THREE PARTY SQUAD that went 7 games in the first two rounds.  

Usually there is 1, maybe 2 great teams a year.  And those great teams don’t always win the NBA championship.  Those soft Knicks and Pacers team’s MJ had to beat were real challenges? Is that what you’re trying to argue???  Please. Get real.  The NBA is great because upsets are rare and mind-blowing when they do happen.  It’s usually predictable and the fun starts in the finals. Also, Doc Rivers is looking smarter and smarter when he said last year that GSW got really lucky in the draw last year.  This is the first time they have played a playoff-tested, supremely talented team that can matchup with them and they have to win 3 straight elimination games to get out alive.  Tonight should be fun.

[J-rueMykelParticipant]

has anyone coming out of the east had to face????
The only eastern conference team to win a championship other than Jordan’s Bulls and Lebron’s Cheat was that Pistons team that put it together down the stretch and shocked LAL, a Miami team that had a near prime shaq and an out of his mind DWade, and that ALL TIME GREAT BOSTON THREE PARTY SQUAD that went 7 games in the first two rounds.  

Usually there is 1, maybe 2 great teams a year.  And those great teams don’t always win the NBA championship.  Those soft Knicks and Pacers team’s MJ had to beat were real challenges? Is that what you’re trying to argue???  Please. Get real.  The NBA is great because upsets are rare and mind-blowing when they do happen.  It’s usually predictable and the fun starts in the finals. Also, Doc Rivers is looking smarter and smarter when he said last year that GSW got really lucky in the draw last year.  This is the first time they have played a playoff-tested, supremely talented team that can matchup with them and they have to win 3 straight elimination games to get out alive.  Tonight should be fun.

[SubZeroParticipant]

Those “soft” Knicks and Pacers teams were easily better than any other team in the East this year

[SubZeroParticipant]

Those “soft” Knicks and Pacers teams were easily better than any other team in the East this year

[J-rueMykelParticipant]

Opinion does not a fact make.  The best argument for a strong Eastern Confernce team in the Jordan era is the Orlando Magic and you all fail to make it, perhpas I should make it for you.  The only team to beat a Jordan Bulls squad in the playoffs after 1990 was the Magic.  

But lets dive into more facts.  The first year Jordan retired, the Bulls w/o Jordan made it to the eastern conference semis where they were 1 game away from beating those same Knicks you’re worshipping, without MJ, who made it to the finals.  Perhaps it’s time to admit how great of a team the Bulls put around MJ and accept that LJ has never had that same luxury.  Lebron came into the Eastern Conference slaying teams that won championships. Pistons and Celtics.  MJ did the same to the Pistons, but they quickly blew up after the 91 season.  Pretending the mid 90’s East is significantly stronger than the mid 2000’s east is just silly.  Again Opinion does not a fact make, but it’s pretty obvious that MJ had just as clear cut path to the finals, if not more so, than LJ has, it’s not his fault that his greatness significantly propels whatever eastern conference team he is on to the top.  And since MJ retired the NBA titles have ran in cycles, the Shaq and Kobe Lakers had dynasty, The Spurs are always close, the Dirk Mavs were there twice, winning once,  Kobe and Pau got two, and now GSW,SA,OKC,LAC are a four headed monster that won’t be going away anytime soon, can we just say the WEST as constructed is loaded and stop blaming that on Lebron.  The western conference teams MJ faced in the playoffs never beat him once. Shaq and Penny did. So if you’re gonna make an arguement, please make the right one.  

[J-rueMykelParticipant]

Opinion does not a fact make.  The best argument for a strong Eastern Confernce team in the Jordan era is the Orlando Magic and you all fail to make it, perhpas I should make it for you.  The only team to beat a Jordan Bulls squad in the playoffs after 1990 was the Magic.  

But lets dive into more facts.  The first year Jordan retired, the Bulls w/o Jordan made it to the eastern conference semis where they were 1 game away from beating those same Knicks you’re worshipping, without MJ, who made it to the finals.  Perhaps it’s time to admit how great of a team the Bulls put around MJ and accept that LJ has never had that same luxury.  Lebron came into the Eastern Conference slaying teams that won championships. Pistons and Celtics.  MJ did the same to the Pistons, but they quickly blew up after the 91 season.  Pretending the mid 90’s East is significantly stronger than the mid 2000’s east is just silly.  Again Opinion does not a fact make, but it’s pretty obvious that MJ had just as clear cut path to the finals, if not more so, than LJ has, it’s not his fault that his greatness significantly propels whatever eastern conference team he is on to the top.  And since MJ retired the NBA titles have ran in cycles, the Shaq and Kobe Lakers had dynasty, The Spurs are always close, the Dirk Mavs were there twice, winning once,  Kobe and Pau got two, and now GSW,SA,OKC,LAC are a four headed monster that won’t be going away anytime soon, can we just say the WEST as constructed is loaded and stop blaming that on Lebron.  The western conference teams MJ faced in the playoffs never beat him once. Shaq and Penny did. So if you’re gonna make an arguement, please make the right one.  

[J-rueMykelParticipant]

Do you play basketball?

I live in chicago, lets play a game to 21, one on one, I’ll give you 11 points and ball, make it take it.  If I win you can’t post until after the Finals, if you win I wont post until after the finals, how about that? 

[J-rueMykelParticipant]

Do you play basketball?

I live in chicago, lets play a game to 21, one on one, I’ll give you 11 points and ball, make it take it.  If I win you can’t post until after the Finals, if you win I wont post until after the finals, how about that? 

[Dazzling Dunks and Basketball BloopersParticipant]

 Making it to the finals six straight seasons, regardless of the level of competition in your conference, is an unbelievable accomplishment and unprecedented in this modern era. Lebrons legacy speaks for itself and he would comfortably go down as a top 5 player of all time if he retired right now. The guy has dominated his era as few have done in any era of basketball before. To suggest his legacy is inflated in any way is beyond ridiculous.

[Dazzling Dunks and Basketball BloopersParticipant]

 Making it to the finals six straight seasons, regardless of the level of competition in your conference, is an unbelievable accomplishment and unprecedented in this modern era. Lebrons legacy speaks for itself and he would comfortably go down as a top 5 player of all time if he retired right now. The guy has dominated his era as few have done in any era of basketball before. To suggest his legacy is inflated in any way is beyond ridiculous.

[ChicagoCaseyParticipant]

 I actually never said it was. I said "is his legacy inflated?".  Just asked a question.

[ChicagoCaseyParticipant]

 I actually never said it was. I said "is his legacy inflated?".  Just asked a question.

[J-rueMykelParticipant]

You’ve been arguing that it is, very poorly I might add, and the question remains, do you play basketball? 

[J-rueMykelParticipant]

You’ve been arguing that it is, very poorly I might add, and the question remains, do you play basketball? 

[Ebown5Participant]

The short answer to your question is NO, it is not inflated.

Lebron is legitimately in the running for the top 5 all time players. 

[Ebown5Participant]

The short answer to your question is NO, it is not inflated.

Lebron is legitimately in the running for the top 5 all time players. 

[J-rueMykelParticipant]

He’s a lock to go down as a top 5 player and the greatest SF ever, with a chance to be the best player of all time.  

[J-rueMykelParticipant]

He’s a lock to go down as a top 5 player and the greatest SF ever, with a chance to be the best player of all time.  

[daggers818Participant]

Disagree with the premise of Op.  I’m an old head, and have a 45+ year perspetive on the NBA.  I grew up watching The Logo and Elgin get devastated by the Celtics throughout the 60’s.  They were both incredibly gifted, magical ball players (let’s agree not to compare eras).  I never felt West’s career was diminished by his final’s losses (1-8 final’s record).  I mean he averaged over 46 ppg one year and was the final’s MVP on a losing team (btw imho, I felt LBJ deserved that last year).  Should his legacy be deflated?  I don’t think so.

And btw, never been an LBJ fan, but I do respect his greatness and accomplshments and don’t question them.

[J-rueMykelParticipant]

+1,000,000

Thanks for bringing perspective and wisdom into the conversation!!!!!

Well done on all accounts.

Tell me, who made you fall in love with the game of basketball? 

[J-rueMykelParticipant]

+1,000,000

Thanks for bringing perspective and wisdom into the conversation!!!!!

Well done on all accounts.

Tell me, who made you fall in love with the game of basketball? 

[daggers818Participant]

Disagree with the premise of Op.  I’m an old head, and have a 45+ year perspetive on the NBA.  I grew up watching The Logo and Elgin get devastated by the Celtics throughout the 60’s.  They were both incredibly gifted, magical ball players (let’s agree not to compare eras).  I never felt West’s career was diminished by his final’s losses (1-8 final’s record).  I mean he averaged over 46 ppg one year and was the final’s MVP on a losing team (btw imho, I felt LBJ deserved that last year).  Should his legacy be deflated?  I don’t think so.

And btw, never been an LBJ fan, but I do respect his greatness and accomplshments and don’t question them.

[daggers818Participant]

Used to watch the games with my dad and grandfather on an old 9" black & white t.v. listening to the great Chick Hearn who I will give credit to for making me love the game.  I competed for over 40 years in high-level pickup and various rec and work leagues.  Worked for Disney for 15 years, we had 40 teams in our league at one point and won 34 games in a row over multiple seasons.  Had to shut it down 4 years ago due to bone on bone in my hip (facing and researching hip replacement surgery now, sucks cuz I can still play well against 20 somethings!).

Laker fans seem to get pummeled here, and even though I’ve been a huge fan of this website since its inception, I never really posted until recently because of not usually being able to have a sensible exchange without all the bashing.  Many youngsters have no clue about the tragic history of the Lakers vs the Celtics.  When my Lakers won in ’72, it was like God finally shined a light on us.  I remember cutting the final scoreboard results form the newspaper at the time and laminating it for my "basketball wall".  I had that thing for years and years until I threw it away.  Then we started winning with Magic, later with Shaq and Kobe, and then all the hate started.  People don’t like winners, it’s part of our culture, I guess, to tear things down.  Or, maybe people don’t like LA – idk, but having been born and raised here, I can say that most who live here are transplants, not true angelenos, so say what you want, but "we" are mostly chill folks living in a big city that has lots to offer (excluding freeway traffic for sure!).

Sigh…I just love bball and finding out what you guys all think.  I never mean to diminish a poster’s opnion (since it is only that), and enjoy exchanging with those that can keep an intelligent conversation, otherwise I’m out.  Hope to hear from you again.

[daggers818Participant]

Used to watch the games with my dad and grandfather on an old 9" black & white t.v. listening to the great Chick Hearn who I will give credit to for making me love the game.  I competed for over 40 years in high-level pickup and various rec and work leagues.  Worked for Disney for 15 years, we had 40 teams in our league at one point and won 34 games in a row over multiple seasons.  Had to shut it down 4 years ago due to bone on bone in my hip (facing and researching hip replacement surgery now, sucks cuz I can still play well against 20 somethings!).

Laker fans seem to get pummeled here, and even though I’ve been a huge fan of this website since its inception, I never really posted until recently because of not usually being able to have a sensible exchange without all the bashing.  Many youngsters have no clue about the tragic history of the Lakers vs the Celtics.  When my Lakers won in ’72, it was like God finally shined a light on us.  I remember cutting the final scoreboard results form the newspaper at the time and laminating it for my "basketball wall".  I had that thing for years and years until I threw it away.  Then we started winning with Magic, later with Shaq and Kobe, and then all the hate started.  People don’t like winners, it’s part of our culture, I guess, to tear things down.  Or, maybe people don’t like LA – idk, but having been born and raised here, I can say that most who live here are transplants, not true angelenos, so say what you want, but "we" are mostly chill folks living in a big city that has lots to offer (excluding freeway traffic for sure!).

Sigh…I just love bball and finding out what you guys all think.  I never mean to diminish a poster’s opnion (since it is only that), and enjoy exchanging with those that can keep an intelligent conversation, otherwise I’m out.  Hope to hear from you again.

[CavFanPRParticipant]

Seven finals appearances, four regular season MVP awards. Numerous of other achievements. Why is his legacy inflated? Your post makes zero sense.

[CavFanPRParticipant]

Seven finals appearances, four regular season MVP awards. Numerous of other achievements. Why is his legacy inflated? Your post makes zero sense.

[Author]

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