[Wavy BagelsParticipant]

Being drafted last in the first round of the 2005 NBA Draft, not much was expected out of F/C David Lee coming out of Florida. Fast forward 6 years, Lee is averaging almost a double-double for his career so far (14ppg, 9.7 rpg). Now, a handful of critics and basketball fans alike know that Lee was not been a good defensive player (mediocre at best), but this man plays with tenacity and brings the energy on a nightly basis. Since playing 6 seasons, he has never been part of a winning team nor has ever played in the postseason. My question for you all is do you think David Lee is the problem because of these results (a black hole to any team he plays for)? He can put up great numbers, but has not yet been able to translate them to wins for any team he has played for.

Thoughts?

[ilike.panochasParticipant]

David Lee isn’t the problem with the teams he’s played for, far from it. Just hasn’t been fortunate enough to play with a super star, and as good a player as he is, he’s not the type of player than can carry a team. He’s a great 3rd option type player, it’s just unfortunate he has been with loosing teams.

[A Lil EnglishParticipant]

I thought a black hole was someone who received the ball and hardly ever gave it back

[iguapops420Participant]

 He actually reminds me a lot of Lamar Odom. Not going to carry said team, but skilled and talented enough to play off of others at a highly efficient rate.

[PulseGlazerParticipant]

Lee isn’t worth his current price-tag.  It’s not that he’s bad, just an overpaid complementary peice.

[Johnny Chill]

Lee is a hustle player, with a nice mid range jump shot and good rebounder.

But it is a problem if he is a 3rd option typer player because he is getting paided like a #1 option player.

To call him a "Black Hole" is extreme, maybe work on your own vocabulary.

I’m glad the Warriors got Lee and the Knicks are stuck with a gimpy Amare.

[Memphis MadnessParticipant]

People said the same thing about Z Bo before he came to the Grizzlies.

People basically whispered the same thing about Kevin Love before the T Wolves started to win this year.

I think he would be better off on a different team, or a team with a defensive presence like Anthony Davis or Andre Drummond. 

Steph Curry has been injured off and on this year and then the only real consistent scorer has been Monta Ellis with David Lee being the only legit inside player for the Warriors.  If the Warriors can get the first pick and if Anthony Davis can play center then I would love to see him on the Warriors.  He would really help out their scoring backcourt and help augment David Lee’s game.

 

[Future_Scout]

i posted before in a game thread, david lee is one of the best passing PFs, i said it by looking at that game i was currently watching, and got negged…  now, let’s take a look at the stats… pau gasol and blake are the only two PF averaging more asts than lee, with 3.2 and 2.9 respectively.

david lee, tim duncan, aldridge, and garnett (who is regarded as a great passing big) are the only other legit PFs averaging 2.6 assists. so he’s top 5.

pau gasol plays in that triangle system and 3.2 is great when noting he has a 21% usage rate, compared to duncan 26%, aldridge 27.4%, blake 27.4%, lee 24.5%,  garnett 24%.

so a "black hole" he isn’t, a defensive liability, maybe.

 

 

[bdiddy5115Participant]

Obligatory white hole post

[mikeyvthedonParticipant]

He certainly does not seem to be a guy you want as the featured player on your team. He is not versatile enough as an offensive option and his defense is definitely going to leave you hanging. The thing is, he tries really hard and is a good effort guy. It just so happens that most of the teams he has played on have been devoid of top notch talent or depth at necessary positions.

Really, when you look at where he has played, neither the Knicks or Warriors were strong defensive squads. While Lee certainly does not provide a huge help to the equation, they are just kind of poorly constructed teams. I think he has had to be an overachiever rather than playing the best role possible for a winning team. If he were next to a center like Dwight Howard or Andrew Bogut, I think that would help immensely.

Instead, he has had to at times play center, which I think is generally a bad idea. His numbers and attitude are probably a big reason why he signed a pretty big time deal, but I think in the right structure he can help a team win. The problem is, he has never had the right structure. It has always been either a structure that forces him to play out of position or with players who do not necessarily complement each other well. I think that the Monta Ellis and Stephen Curry backcourt was always going to be very hard to win with and something has to be done about that more than David Lee as far as the Warriors moving closer to the play-offs.

@Future Scout: I was confused by his wording as well, but he meant "black hole" as in I guess killing whatever team he touched. I agree that he is actually a great passer and that the term "black hole" is usually a term for a player being passed the ball and it being swallowed and never coming back. Either way, I think he was more trying to ask, "Is having David Lee on your team the kiss of death?" Black holes do also suck things in, so I guess that was just a colorful use of it as a metaphor for any team getting David Lee, well, sucking.

[Mr. 19134Participant]

 The only black hole on the Warriors in Monta Ellis.  No seriously tho you didn’t use the word right, a black hole is a ball hog.  Somebody you pass the ball too and get in rebound position because you know passing is not an option.

Is David Lee a "Team Cancer"?  I think that’s the question you wanted to ask and that’s a  no too.  I think everybody forget that David Lee was a 20 n 10 guy for the Knicks right before he got that big contract, and was their best player that season.  If David Lee is your best player I don’t know how many games you’re expected to win.  

The Warriors are competive right now they just suffer from bad luck, and bad descisions.  I think if Curry was healthy all year this team’s record is completely differen or a trade would of went down by now.  But Curry is hurt, Ellis is still there, and they seem to be stuck in basketball purgatory right now.

I don’t know where the idea for this post came from.  David Lee is a hard worker who brings it every night.  He’s not the type of player that’s going to bring a team down by his presence, and furthermore his playing style is very complimentary.   He don’t need the ball to have a good game and he’s a really good facilitating big man.

[Memphis MadnessParticipant]

That team needs a defensive minded center like Anthony Davis or Andre Drummond. Then David Lee will have his complementary big
man to go along with a high-octane backcourt.

One of the reasons Zach Randolph thrived last year was due to the presence of Marc Gasol who is a legit center
who can do some of everything, taking a bit of scoring and rebounding pressure off Z Bo — also similar to how
Pau Gasol thrived in LA with Bynum (and Odom) up front and with Kobe being the primary scorer.

[Future_Scout]

 i agree ^. he needs a complementary big

[Johnny Chill]

Well the Warriors know they need a defensive mind center that is actually good. They made a play for Tyson Chandler but the Knicks offered more. They signed Deandre Jordan to an offer sheet but the Clippers matched.

It’s going to be very hard for them to get a legit center like Anthony Davis or Drummond, they pretty much have to win the lottery to get it. Warriors lose their pick if it is not in the top 7  or 8.

Should the Warriors try to trade for Brook Lopez? He isnt much of a defensive center though, but he is a upgrade over Beidrins.

[aamir543Participant]

 A Warriors fan here, he is not a problem, and remember, the teams he’s played for haven’t been the greatest, although our team this year is massively underachieving, although it is in part due to all the time Steph Curry has missed.

I feel that if we can get say an Omer Asik(yes, we’re that desperate) than I bleieve that would open things up. Asik is a solid Center that rebounds and plays D. He would fit in nicely with our core.

The problem with my Dubs is not that Ellis or Curry are sub-par defenders, it’s that Ellis is a sub-par defender when forced to defend two guards, and even though Curry isn’t the worst, he’s not neccesarily a good defender either. That then results in a lot of penetration, which forces our bigs to help which then opens the backdoor. I love both Ellis and Curry, I feel Ellis is the most underated player in the league, however if trading him allows us to A) Prepare Klay as our future at the two guard, and B) get a borderline All-Star in reuturn, say an Al Jefferson, than I would go with it, but I didn’t like the Ellis for Iggy rumors, and I was a bit spectecile about a Beasley and Pek for Ellis deal. We’ll see what happens. At least we have talent and some sort of foundation for success.

[lukestine13Participant]

 if you are a jazz fan which i am you would say no because we gotta watch Big Al play. congrats to him on the career high in assists on monday with seven. he knows he shouldnt shoot it when he is double or triple teamed but he jacks it up anyway.

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