[valentine]

Draftnet cats are nothing if not predictable.

Cue the "Its too early to know how good Wiggins will be" replies.

Followed by the "K-Love has been awful for the Cavs" rhetoric.

I’m sorry, but Wiggins is Rudy Gay. He might be a slice better, but hes probably the same. In fact, Andre Iguodala will have a better career.

The moment Kevin Love helped his team win a championship, the trade leaned in the favour of the Cavs. 1 chip in Cleveland was the under/over on that deal.

Buy now that its pretty clear that Wiggins will never have the all-around skillset that will make him an all-nba type player, its time to give GM Lebron his due for orchastrating the deal.

Now respected draft analyst Dean Damakis is calling him a bust!

Call me crazy, but in a redraft, I’m taking Jabari Parker #1.

 

[SeBirschingParticipant]

 I can see your logic, but I think both teams won. The Timberwolves were not going to contend with or without Kevin Love, so trading him for Wiggins makes sense. Wiggins is only 21, so his peak coincides better with guys like LaVine and now Towns, since they got him the year after Wiggins. 

I’ll admit, I wish Wiggins was filling out the stat sheet better. He’s a great scorer, but that’s all he does. His defense isn’t great either. I know you don’t want to hear the "it’s too early to tell" stuff, but he has had flashes of stardom. I’m not willing to write off Wiggins when he’s only 21. 

The Cavs obviously got what they wanted. They won a championship with him, and they have the chance to win several more.

But seriously, Hype, when did you start this all or nothing approach to everything? You make an opinion, and then you go out of your way to overstate your idea and stir up the users on this site. Not everything has to be black or white, sometimes it can just be gray.

 

 

 

[Hype Machine]

Its all a gimmick to encourage participation. Im actually not antagonistic in real life at all.

Its a poorly executed attempt to entertain American audiences using what knowledge Ive gained through observing American culture. Eg knowing controversial soundbytes and clickbait headlines work. 

Americans love villains even more than heros. The only way to stay relevent in America is to switch from goodcop to badcop. Trump, Lebron, John Cena mastered it. I could go on.

So I leave the logic and rationality to other users on their forum. 

 

[Robb_CParticipant]

Somebody still have the receipt for Hype Machine?? Its starting to scare the kids again.

[Hype Machine]

Ill drop a couple more pipebombs as a villain, and then I’ll consider a face turn.

[Dazzling Dunks and Basketball BloopersParticipant]

 That wolves team was going nowhere with love. They were good enough to just barely miss the playoffs and not bad enough to get a high draft pick. If they didn’t trade love they would have lost him for nothing in free agency most likely. Getting a talent like Wiggins was about as good as they could hope for (whether your a fan or not) and it also put them in a position to draft towns the next season which they probably wouldn’t have been able to do with love on the roster. I’d say they made out quite well. 

Don’t get me wrong, Cleveland made out too. Anytime you have the best player in the league in his prime you have to go for it, and there is no doubt an established star like love would be a more valuable player to have on the roster in the short-term than a rookie Wiggins.

It was a win-win for both teams (even if Wiggins never develops that much beyond what he is now). It’s the rare NBA trade where there were no losers in the deal.

 

 

[mikeyvthedonParticipant]

https://deanondraft.com/2016/11/29/andrew-wiggins-is-a-bust/

It seems like you like to use American trolling patterns or whatever, but why do you never copy and paste the article you seem to get it from in the first place? Not only does it give context, but it also gives the view point you are agreeing with a few extra clicks. If it is a site issue or you do not know how, or maybe even if you are doing this from your phone (if you have the patience to type this all out on your phone, props), but if not, just put a link to the article. Citing sources and providing knowledge on an opinion, especially one you are trying to get across, is a good thing.

Now, Dean makes some good points, although I still think it is kind of funny that he feels vindicated for putting Wiggins at #7 on his 2014 Big Board (he has Jabari Parker at 8, by the way, and Aaron Gordon at 4). I will admit that I have always been someone who sees the upside in Wiggins, though at this point in time it seems that Joel Embiid has far more upside and provides more impact on a basketball game. Jabari Parker is certainly in that discussion as well. Wiggins does not seem to be on the path to greatness and certainly is not carrying a team, though I think his being 21 and averaging a solid 20 ppg + is, at the very least, some indication that he is not a bad basketball player.

Plus, I do feel Wiggins has improved, in efficiency during his second season and in long-range shooting this season. Not to mention, as much as someone wants to blame whoever named Karl-Anthony Towns for all of the Timberwolves woes, there is certainly some ability to see possible improvement once they hopefully build a team. Their core is ridiculously young and the Love trade (not to mention the lack of pieces they had when Love was present) made this a few year rebuilding plan. Not to mention, GM survey ROY favorite Kris Dunn has not exactly helped speed that process along.

As far as your statement on the Cavs winning the trade, any championship in my mind gave them the win. As much as people want to rag on Kevin Love and his deficiencies, he helped them to a NBA title, that was all he had to do. Winning one of those for any team is a big deal, to me worth whatever they were paying any of them. Especially beating a team like the Warriors. I do feel Andrew Wiggins might have benefitted a great deal playing next to LeBron James, though there is no guarantee he would have provided any more impact than what Kevin Love provided, even if he maybe has the legs to keep up with a team like GSW. All in all, if you were going into a Game 7 last year, Kevin Love provided an impact that would be doubtful for Wiggins to duplicate.

I feel that with the article, a lot of the stats he is bringing to the table are absolutely effected by the team around someone. You have to put some of the blame on Wiggins himself as far as his poor overall defensive numbers in terms of rebounding, steals and blocks, though I truly feel that he has and will improve as he gains experience. Guys who can create their own shot like him do not grow on trees. Plus, while Demakis may feel he projects poorly, beyond Embiid and possibly Parker, their is no guarantee that a handful of others will project to be THAT much better.

Ultimately, people expected a lot out of Andrew Wiggins and even more so given just how high expectations were for the 2014 Draft overall. If you look at those expectations and thought he would blossom into a franchise player, it certainly seems to have missed the mark. Embiid looks to be headed down that trajectory and Parker absolutely could be a better player (though it is still not a landslide as of yet. His team made the play-offs without him as a rookie, not bad. They were 13-12 with him, 28-29 without him). However, in the classic sense of the word "bust", I think it is much too early to call a 21-year old scoring 20 points consistently a bust. I think he can improve and I definitely know his team will, even if it is not at the light speed everyone thought it would be once Tom Thibodeau took the helm. 

 

[DolanCareParticipant]

 To be fair, I still have trouble copy & pasting into these typeboxes. 

[mikeyvthedonParticipant]

If it is a site issue, I get it. Just think it is always cool to cite your sources. Especially if the entire basis is kind of drawn upon from a particular article.

[CynthiaParticipant]

Click “Switch to plain text editor” just under the text box. Once you’ve done that you should be able to copy/paste just fine, it also helps with other chat features like writing code for inserting images.

I don’t know why this site defaults to rich text editing, that’s more of a developer thing (even then it’s a joke).

[Hype Machine]

 I dont wanna throw too much salt on the site, but its always problematic.

I risk losing my work if I get caught up in a word verification spin cycle.

 

[ZachAttackParticipant]

Did you forget that Delly is no longer on the Cavs? No need to ride their d***. Also… you’re crazy

[Hype Machine]

 Lol ease up zacharia. 

Isn’t it time you stepped up your draftnet game?

 

[ZachAttackParticipant]

 It’s Zachari…

[HitsterParticipant]

K-Love would have been an FA in 2015 so the T-Wolves risked losing him for nothing so the trade was a no-brainer for them.

Part of me would have still loved to see Wiggins riding shotgun to LBJ and Kyrie for a few years then looking to assume mantle with Kyrie when LBJ took on a more supporting role. Also with Wiggins on his rookie deal the Cavs might have been able to bring in a couple of good supporting players to give bench depth.

But trade has worked out well for all concerned, Wiggins is developing nicely and K-Love and Cavs have won title.

[SeattleSuperChronicsParticipant]

 There’s American culture….then there’s the rest of the western world trying to copy it..so keep trolling Americans while we provide you with the best sport entertainment ever known to man. 

Too early to tell with Wiggins. I can see the Rudy Gay comparison but Rudy has head issues and I don’t think that’s the case with Wiggins. 

The narrative would be much different right now if the wolves were winning games. The funny thing is they are blowing teams out the first half…they are a year away from learning how to win and playing together the whole game. Thibs will get them there. I see a deep playoff run coming in years to follow.

[binetParticipant]

 If it’s a year away I doubt Thibs will get them there, he should be fired before that. After all, the team has not improved at all with him.

[BiggysmallsParticipant]

 This seems to imply that the Cavs won the trade basically because they won the ship last year. Which implies that Love was a big part of that success. He wasn’t. Mixing up "winning a trade" and "winning."

Love is a really good player but for a majority of the time he’s been in Cleveland, he’s been the guy everybody thinks they should trade away. They don’t maximize his talent. He’s a name brand guy for them or at least was in their title run. Insert Wiggins on that team over Love and the Cavs still win the title. 

Wiggins may not be the transcendent star he was billed as, but I’ll take at least 6 more years of Wiggins in MN over the 1 year they would’ve had had they not dealt Love. 

 

 

 

 

 

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