[mixtape2003Participant]

Just saw this on real gm, the package would be centered around Jimmy Butler and Gibson plus more assets. Is this a bluff by the Wolves to get more out of the Cavs and Golden State? Thoughts?

[Wavy BagelsParticipant]

[Wavy BagelsParticipant]

[TimberTrollParticipant]

I imagine this is just a response by the Wolves to the Cavs reporting yesterday that they wouldn’t deal Wiggins. 

[TimberTrollParticipant]

I imagine this is just a response by the Wolves to the Cavs reporting yesterday that they wouldn’t deal Wiggins. 

[FearTheStacheParticipant]

 Flip Saunders needs to learn a lesson. "Don’t play poker when everyone else at the table knows your hand."

[FearTheStacheParticipant]

 Flip Saunders needs to learn a lesson. "Don’t play poker when everyone else at the table knows your hand."

[druneave3Participant]

I have a feeling the Love rumors will be going until February. Like other poster said, this is probably more lies/leverage attempts from Minnesota. 

[druneave3Participant]

I have a feeling the Love rumors will be going until February. Like other poster said, this is probably more lies/leverage attempts from Minnesota. 

[XYRYXParticipant]

Read this on ESPN too. What for assets aside from picks röntge Bulls really have NOW? I think all of their new players need at least a few months before they can be traded right? 

Not that this whole K-Love drama can’t go on for a few months but what kind of offer can they make now? 

This is a either a smokescreen from the Wolves to raise the bar for offers or just bullsh!t. 

Btw, why are the Wolves so desperate to add SGs (asking heavily for Thompson) when they already have Martin and LaVine? If they want to dump Martin too, there has to be a third team involved. 

[XYRYXParticipant]

Read this on ESPN too. What for assets aside from picks röntge Bulls really have NOW? I think all of their new players need at least a few months before they can be traded right? 

Not that this whole K-Love drama can’t go on for a few months but what kind of offer can they make now? 

This is a either a smokescreen from the Wolves to raise the bar for offers or just bullsh!t. 

Btw, why are the Wolves so desperate to add SGs (asking heavily for Thompson) when they already have Martin and LaVine? If they want to dump Martin too, there has to be a third team involved. 

[GlenTaylorSucksParticipant]

Remember, the Bulls WERE one of the places Love initially listed as somewhere he wanted to go, and there were initially exploratory talks with the Bulls that got canned because of draft time/Minnesota not wanting Snell and demanding too much. Now that the Bulls have made some FA moves, they definitely have a logjam in the PF position and would offer the best individual proven pieces of any team in the running (Wiggins hasn’t played a single minute of NBA basketball (SL doesn’t count, haha), and Bennett is like the the far opposite of proven). The Bulls have the following that they could include: 

Jimmy Butler

Tony Snell

Nikola Mrotic

Taj Gibson

Dougie Buckets

While none of those pieces have the potential of a Wiggins, they are all very solid. Gibson is one of the most underrated players in the NBA, Butler is a solid 3 & D guy, Snell showed improvement at VSL, Mrotic is the highest rated Euro prospect and could end up very good, and Dougie is Dougie. I think if the Bulls wanted to, they could put together a very attractive deal for Love, and Love would fit in extraordinarily well with the Bulls. Love and Noah would wreak havoc with their passing, and Gasol/Mrotic/Gibson (whoever stays behind) could spell them. Assuming Minnesota dumps Martin as well, Martin brings them a proven scorer/outside shooter, something the Bulls have sorely lacked recently. Love would also greatly improve their outside shooting. A big 3 of Love/Rose/Noah (provided Rose returns to pre-injury form) is probably the best big 3 in the NBA. 

So no, I don’t think this is a smokescreen. However, I do think the Wolves will definitely be using this interest as leverage to get more out of Cleveland. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[GlenTaylorSucksParticipant]

Remember, the Bulls WERE one of the places Love initially listed as somewhere he wanted to go, and there were initially exploratory talks with the Bulls that got canned because of draft time/Minnesota not wanting Snell and demanding too much. Now that the Bulls have made some FA moves, they definitely have a logjam in the PF position and would offer the best individual proven pieces of any team in the running (Wiggins hasn’t played a single minute of NBA basketball (SL doesn’t count, haha), and Bennett is like the the far opposite of proven). The Bulls have the following that they could include: 

Jimmy Butler

Tony Snell

Nikola Mrotic

Taj Gibson

Dougie Buckets

While none of those pieces have the potential of a Wiggins, they are all very solid. Gibson is one of the most underrated players in the NBA, Butler is a solid 3 & D guy, Snell showed improvement at VSL, Mrotic is the highest rated Euro prospect and could end up very good, and Dougie is Dougie. I think if the Bulls wanted to, they could put together a very attractive deal for Love, and Love would fit in extraordinarily well with the Bulls. Love and Noah would wreak havoc with their passing, and Gasol/Mrotic/Gibson (whoever stays behind) could spell them. Assuming Minnesota dumps Martin as well, Martin brings them a proven scorer/outside shooter, something the Bulls have sorely lacked recently. Love would also greatly improve their outside shooting. A big 3 of Love/Rose/Noah (provided Rose returns to pre-injury form) is probably the best big 3 in the NBA. 

So no, I don’t think this is a smokescreen. However, I do think the Wolves will definitely be using this interest as leverage to get more out of Cleveland. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[BiggysmallsParticipant]

I don’t get why people are ripping on Flip Saunders. Its like they are offended he hasn’t traded Love for 45 cents on the dollar. His best player wants to leave and he has an opportunity to get a good deal out of it. Teams aren’t going to rescind their offers if he doesn’t accept them today.

Again the leverage thing is getting old. Its not that hard of a concept to grasp. If multiple teams want Love, they will bid against each other. Classic supply/demand. Nobody cares that Love is leaving Minnesota. If Cleveland wants him, they need to trade for him. Same goes for Chicago, same goes for Golden State. Him wanting out of MN has no bearing on trade possibilities with those teams because they cant sign him as a Free Agent. People are still not getting that.

Chicago’s offer still does nothing for me. Butler has a ceiling of a 4th option scorer and a very good defender. Nice piece, but would be wasted in MN. Gibson is in the same boat. Nice role player but he’s also getting old and Minnesota wouldn’t be any better then they are now, nor would they be in position to grow organically in the future.

Flip Saunders doesn’t HAVE to trade Kevin Love right now. I hope he does and I hope it is for Wiggins. I ultimately think that deal will get done, but people hating on him for trying to get the best deal possible are coming off as stupid. That’s kind of his job. In no way should he deal the best PF in basketball for a bunch of spare parts.

[BiggysmallsParticipant]

I don’t get why people are ripping on Flip Saunders. Its like they are offended he hasn’t traded Love for 45 cents on the dollar. His best player wants to leave and he has an opportunity to get a good deal out of it. Teams aren’t going to rescind their offers if he doesn’t accept them today.

Again the leverage thing is getting old. Its not that hard of a concept to grasp. If multiple teams want Love, they will bid against each other. Classic supply/demand. Nobody cares that Love is leaving Minnesota. If Cleveland wants him, they need to trade for him. Same goes for Chicago, same goes for Golden State. Him wanting out of MN has no bearing on trade possibilities with those teams because they cant sign him as a Free Agent. People are still not getting that.

Chicago’s offer still does nothing for me. Butler has a ceiling of a 4th option scorer and a very good defender. Nice piece, but would be wasted in MN. Gibson is in the same boat. Nice role player but he’s also getting old and Minnesota wouldn’t be any better then they are now, nor would they be in position to grow organically in the future.

Flip Saunders doesn’t HAVE to trade Kevin Love right now. I hope he does and I hope it is for Wiggins. I ultimately think that deal will get done, but people hating on him for trying to get the best deal possible are coming off as stupid. That’s kind of his job. In no way should he deal the best PF in basketball for a bunch of spare parts.

[BiggysmallsParticipant]

GlenTaylorSucks…Chicago could put a decent offer together but I just think no matter what they put on the table, its the 3rd best deal out of Cleveland and Golden State. You say Wiggins is unproven, which is entirely fair. Bennett is nothing more than a throw in with upside. 1st rounders wont have much value.

BUT

What has Tony Snell done in the NBA? Zip

What has Douglas Mcbuckets done in the league? Zip

What has Mirotic done in the league? Nada

Gibson is no longer underrated, and he’s 29. Butler is a nice 3 n D guy.

How good are the Wolves if they get Butler, Gibson and Mirotic?

Rubio-Martin-Butler-Gibson-Pek

Backup-Bud-Brewer-Mirotic-Dieng

That teams nothing more than a 7 seed, but isn’t bad enough to get a top 5 pick. Classic middling roster.

[BiggysmallsParticipant]

GlenTaylorSucks…Chicago could put a decent offer together but I just think no matter what they put on the table, its the 3rd best deal out of Cleveland and Golden State. You say Wiggins is unproven, which is entirely fair. Bennett is nothing more than a throw in with upside. 1st rounders wont have much value.

BUT

What has Tony Snell done in the NBA? Zip

What has Douglas Mcbuckets done in the league? Zip

What has Mirotic done in the league? Nada

Gibson is no longer underrated, and he’s 29. Butler is a nice 3 n D guy.

How good are the Wolves if they get Butler, Gibson and Mirotic?

Rubio-Martin-Butler-Gibson-Pek

Backup-Bud-Brewer-Mirotic-Dieng

That teams nothing more than a 7 seed, but isn’t bad enough to get a top 5 pick. Classic middling roster.

[GlenTaylorSucksParticipant]

I honestly would rather have the Wiggins deal myself. Wiggins is the only player that has been formally offered that has superstar potential, and that counts for a lot. Whether he’s going to get there or not is a legitimate concern, but that doesn’t change that he’s the best piece that’s been offered thus far. I just worry that the other pieces potentially being offered in that deal are absolute crap. We are losing a top 5 player in the NBA right now. Wiggins is nice, but you can already make a case for Bennett being the worst #1 overall pick of all time (side note: I would have liked this trade a LOT more if Cleveland hadn’t messed their pick up in the first place and taken Noel). Waiters seems to not know the difference between a good shot and a bad shot, and Thompson isn’t really that good, plus he’s looking to get paid as an RFA. 

The Bulls deal would give more assets (though admittedly with a lower ceiling). I think the sum of the Bulls parts is greater than the sum of the Cavs parts (Wiggins, picks that might be valuable (Clevelands will be late first- eh, Miami’s could be nice in a couple of years, Memphis’ could be nice if it falls between protections), Bennett is a negative at this point, if Waiters is included he’s a negative and so is Thompson). That said, Wiggins is still the only potential superstar of the lot (MAYBE Mrotic if he pans out, but he doesn’t have as high a ceiling as Wiggins). 

I’d prefer ANYTHING over a trade with GSW though. Klay Thompson is in no way, shape, or form worth the money he’s going to demand, David Lee is Love + 5 years older – 3 pt shooting – any defensive skill Love has – passing ability, Barnes is still managing to get by on his high school hype, yeah…

 

[GlenTaylorSucksParticipant]

I honestly would rather have the Wiggins deal myself. Wiggins is the only player that has been formally offered that has superstar potential, and that counts for a lot. Whether he’s going to get there or not is a legitimate concern, but that doesn’t change that he’s the best piece that’s been offered thus far. I just worry that the other pieces potentially being offered in that deal are absolute crap. We are losing a top 5 player in the NBA right now. Wiggins is nice, but you can already make a case for Bennett being the worst #1 overall pick of all time (side note: I would have liked this trade a LOT more if Cleveland hadn’t messed their pick up in the first place and taken Noel). Waiters seems to not know the difference between a good shot and a bad shot, and Thompson isn’t really that good, plus he’s looking to get paid as an RFA. 

The Bulls deal would give more assets (though admittedly with a lower ceiling). I think the sum of the Bulls parts is greater than the sum of the Cavs parts (Wiggins, picks that might be valuable (Clevelands will be late first- eh, Miami’s could be nice in a couple of years, Memphis’ could be nice if it falls between protections), Bennett is a negative at this point, if Waiters is included he’s a negative and so is Thompson). That said, Wiggins is still the only potential superstar of the lot (MAYBE Mrotic if he pans out, but he doesn’t have as high a ceiling as Wiggins). 

I’d prefer ANYTHING over a trade with GSW though. Klay Thompson is in no way, shape, or form worth the money he’s going to demand, David Lee is Love + 5 years older – 3 pt shooting – any defensive skill Love has – passing ability, Barnes is still managing to get by on his high school hype, yeah…

 

[BiggysmallsParticipant]

GlenTaylor…agreed completely. If Cleveland would’ve gotten Oladipo/Len/McLemore/Noel I’d be peeing my pants. I wasn’t even that high on Noel and still think he’s a tad overrated but Bennett doesn’t do much for me besides provide matching money. He has upside but I think he’s destined for a 3rd big role at best.

I’m not huge on the GS deal simply because of Klay wanting max money. He’s a nice player but he’s the 3rd guy on a team that lost in the 1st round and is a perennial 4-7 seed. Him as a 1/2 just isn’t that great but again we wouldn’t be bad enough to get high level draft picks.

I think Wiggins would be the best because we could take a step back in the short term, rack up lottery picks and groom a bunch of young talent together like OKC. Except hopefully get more than 2 guys.

[BiggysmallsParticipant]

GlenTaylor…agreed completely. If Cleveland would’ve gotten Oladipo/Len/McLemore/Noel I’d be peeing my pants. I wasn’t even that high on Noel and still think he’s a tad overrated but Bennett doesn’t do much for me besides provide matching money. He has upside but I think he’s destined for a 3rd big role at best.

I’m not huge on the GS deal simply because of Klay wanting max money. He’s a nice player but he’s the 3rd guy on a team that lost in the 1st round and is a perennial 4-7 seed. Him as a 1/2 just isn’t that great but again we wouldn’t be bad enough to get high level draft picks.

I think Wiggins would be the best because we could take a step back in the short term, rack up lottery picks and groom a bunch of young talent together like OKC. Except hopefully get more than 2 guys.

[Author]

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