[GrandmamaParticipant]

Anyone else catch what they said about Bill Russell during the all-star game?  Everyone knows he won 11 rings, but what I found out today is he won two state championships in high school, and two national championships in college.  Simply amazing.  

 

 

 

 

[Hector_Reyes_8Participant]

He is one. Heh, seriously though, he’s one of the biggest winners ever, and had a career full of success. Even more respectable when you factor in how tough it was for him considering how much he was hated by the fans of his teams because of his ethnicity. Dude is a role model, one of the greatest ever.

[Hector_Reyes_8Participant]

He is one. Heh, seriously though, he’s one of the biggest winners ever, and had a career full of success. Even more respectable when you factor in how tough it was for him considering how much he was hated by the fans of his teams because of his ethnicity. Dude is a role model, one of the greatest ever.

[Hector_Reyes_8Participant]

He is one. Heh, seriously though, he’s one of the biggest winners ever, and had a career full of success. Even more respectable when you factor in how tough it was for him considering how much he was hated by the fans of his teams because of his ethnicity. Dude is a role model, one of the greatest ever.

[Hector_Reyes_8Participant]

He is one. Heh, seriously though, he’s one of the biggest winners ever, and had a career full of success. Even more respectable when you factor in how tough it was for him considering how much he was hated by the fans of his teams because of his ethnicity. Dude is a role model, one of the greatest ever.

[mjfan83Participant]

 bill Russell.  great man, great player. both unquestioned. however off the top of your head can you name 20 great players he played against? unquestionably tough aswell. not disputing his dominance,  however, he  could not dominate todays nba IMO, as per hid tweet/instragram a couple days ago. do you think he could play in todays game? 6’8 maybe 6’9, 220 maybe 230 tops. his intangibles surpass ever known player however could his skill level and athleticism catch up, to point of making him one of the best players ever? 

[Prime TimeParticipant]

 Bill Russell was an elite athlete. Worst case scenario, he’d be a player similar to Dwight Howard in today’s game. It seems that  you’re downplaying his skill. That’s just ignorance, he was very skilled for a big man. He didn’t have Hakeem moves in the post, however, he could handle the ball better than most people playing center, and he had pretty good court vision. His basketball IQ is also off the charts, that’s why he was a good player-coach.

Here’s a video of him jumping OVER a guy!

youtu.be/j2AlFrOj5Mc

[aztwulfParticipant]

Kind of makes one of the earlier posters comments about lack of athleticism look kind of silly doesn’t it. That dribble-drive-dunk would have made MJ smile.

I watched Russell play many times in the early 60’s. For those of you that aren’t old enough to have seen some of these players, don’t kid yourself that they lacked skills, or couldn’t otherwise play in todays game. With modern weight training and year-round practice they all would have been bigger, stronger, and better shooters than they already were.

Russell played in the Olympics after first agreeing to an NBA contract. There was some talk about whether he should be able to participate as an amateur basketball player (only amateurs were eligible then). The IOC ultimately ruled in his favor and he led the US to gold. Russell was quoted as saying that if they had ruled him ineligible, he would have simply gone to the Olympics as a high jumper.

Oscar Robertson is another one. Robertson would have been a dominant PG in any era, including this one.

[aztwulfParticipant]

Kind of makes one of the earlier posters comments about lack of athleticism look kind of silly doesn’t it. That dribble-drive-dunk would have made MJ smile.

I watched Russell play many times in the early 60’s. For those of you that aren’t old enough to have seen some of these players, don’t kid yourself that they lacked skills, or couldn’t otherwise play in todays game. With modern weight training and year-round practice they all would have been bigger, stronger, and better shooters than they already were.

Russell played in the Olympics after first agreeing to an NBA contract. There was some talk about whether he should be able to participate as an amateur basketball player (only amateurs were eligible then). The IOC ultimately ruled in his favor and he led the US to gold. Russell was quoted as saying that if they had ruled him ineligible, he would have simply gone to the Olympics as a high jumper.

Oscar Robertson is another one. Robertson would have been a dominant PG in any era, including this one.

[Prime TimeParticipant]

 Bill Russell was an elite athlete. Worst case scenario, he’d be a player similar to Dwight Howard in today’s game. It seems that  you’re downplaying his skill. That’s just ignorance, he was very skilled for a big man. He didn’t have Hakeem moves in the post, however, he could handle the ball better than most people playing center, and he had pretty good court vision. His basketball IQ is also off the charts, that’s why he was a good player-coach.

Here’s a video of him jumping OVER a guy!

youtu.be/j2AlFrOj5Mc

[ItsVictorOladipoParticipant]

however, he could not dominate todays nba IMO, as per hid tweet/instragram a couple days ago. do you think he could play in todays game? 6’8 maybe 6’9, 220 maybe 230 tops. his intangibles surpass ever known player however could his skill level and athleticism catch up, to point of making him one of the best players ever?
—————————————————————————————————————

Umm, he was 6’9.5 BAREFOOT. That would actually make him 6’11 in today’s NBA since they use measurements in shoes. He was 220 lbs, but that’s without modern day strength training and conditioning. With those advantages he would probably be closer to 245lbs. Anthony Davis is capable of averaging 10 RPG and 3 BPG as a 20 year old despite being 6’9 barefoot and 220 lbs what makes you think Russell couldn’t dominate?

As far as athleticism goes, he was a ridiculous athlete who could have been an Olympic level track and field athlete; he was ranked 7th in the world in the high jump in 1956 and had a 440m time of 49.6 seconds.

As far as competition goes, he excelled in the same era as Wilt Chamberlain and Walt Bellamy (who was 6’11 barefoot) and since there was only 8 other teams in the league in the early 60s that meant 1 out of every 4 games he was going up against one of those.

[ItsVictorOladipoParticipant]

however, he could not dominate todays nba IMO, as per hid tweet/instragram a couple days ago. do you think he could play in todays game? 6’8 maybe 6’9, 220 maybe 230 tops. his intangibles surpass ever known player however could his skill level and athleticism catch up, to point of making him one of the best players ever?
—————————————————————————————————————

Umm, he was 6’9.5 BAREFOOT. That would actually make him 6’11 in today’s NBA since they use measurements in shoes. He was 220 lbs, but that’s without modern day strength training and conditioning. With those advantages he would probably be closer to 245lbs. Anthony Davis is capable of averaging 10 RPG and 3 BPG as a 20 year old despite being 6’9 barefoot and 220 lbs what makes you think Russell couldn’t dominate?

As far as athleticism goes, he was a ridiculous athlete who could have been an Olympic level track and field athlete; he was ranked 7th in the world in the high jump in 1956 and had a 440m time of 49.6 seconds.

As far as competition goes, he excelled in the same era as Wilt Chamberlain and Walt Bellamy (who was 6’11 barefoot) and since there was only 8 other teams in the league in the early 60s that meant 1 out of every 4 games he was going up against one of those.

[mjfan83Participant]

 bill Russell.  great man, great player. both unquestioned. however off the top of your head can you name 20 great players he played against? unquestionably tough aswell. not disputing his dominance,  however, he  could not dominate todays nba IMO, as per hid tweet/instragram a couple days ago. do you think he could play in todays game? 6’8 maybe 6’9, 220 maybe 230 tops. his intangibles surpass ever known player however could his skill level and athleticism catch up, to point of making him one of the best players ever? 

[jmarg25Participant]

 If only Wilt Chamberlain had his mentality…

[jmarg25Participant]

 If only Wilt Chamberlain had his mentality…

[thatdude44Participant]

 Bill Russel was amazing, playing at such a high level especially in that era with all he had to deal with. He made winning an art, what working hard would do. Congrats to him for it all. As for Wilt, there’s know way you watch his footage and not be blown away! The way he moved, at that size at that time was unreal. We’re talking about two of the games elites and most storied players ever! 

[thatdude44Participant]

 Bill Russel was amazing, playing at such a high level especially in that era with all he had to deal with. He made winning an art, what working hard would do. Congrats to him for it all. As for Wilt, there’s know way you watch his footage and not be blown away! The way he moved, at that size at that time was unreal. We’re talking about two of the games elites and most storied players ever! 

[HitsterParticipant]

Bill is a legend and is right up there with any other of the greatest players ever. His record of titles for a player is unlikely to ever to be beaten and he’s also fairly unique in coaching and playing on a title winning team. In my opinion he was certainly the greatest defensive frontcourter ever and this was well before the DPOY award was introduced.

Also as mentioned above Bill was playing in an era only 10 years after the MLB had removed the colour bar and at a time when lots of states still had a huge underlying racial problem so he overcame all those issues too.

[HitsterParticipant]

Bill is a legend and is right up there with any other of the greatest players ever. His record of titles for a player is unlikely to ever to be beaten and he’s also fairly unique in coaching and playing on a title winning team. In my opinion he was certainly the greatest defensive frontcourter ever and this was well before the DPOY award was introduced.

Also as mentioned above Bill was playing in an era only 10 years after the MLB had removed the colour bar and at a time when lots of states still had a huge underlying racial problem so he overcame all those issues too.

[contestwinnerParticipant]

Not to take too much away from Russell, but he did play when the league only had 9 or 10 other teams in the league as opposed to 30 today. So that is one way to explain his 11 championships. Still one of the All time greats, just something worth noting.

It’s hard to decide if Wilt or Russell was better, so I just have them even.

[contestwinnerParticipant]

Not to take too much away from Russell, but he did play when the league only had 9 or 10 other teams in the league as opposed to 30 today. So that is one way to explain his 11 championships. Still one of the All time greats, just something worth noting.

It’s hard to decide if Wilt or Russell was better, so I just have them even.

[ItsVictorOladipoParticipant]

Not to take too much away from Russell, but he did play when the league only had 9 or 10 other teams in the league as opposed to 30 today. So that is one way to explain his 11 championships.
————————————————————————————————

Yep Russell won his first 4 championships in an NBA with 7 other teams. his next 5 titles in a league with 8 other teams and his last two rings in an NBA with 11 and 13 other teams. MJ won his 6 titles in a league with 26 to 28 other teams.

That’s part of the reason I hate using rings as a primary argument for rating players from different eras. One of my pet peeves from people are those that say Russell is the greatest of all time and when asked why, just say “11 rings”. there’s got to be more to it than that.

[ItsVictorOladipoParticipant]

Not to take too much away from Russell, but he did play when the league only had 9 or 10 other teams in the league as opposed to 30 today. So that is one way to explain his 11 championships.
————————————————————————————————

Yep Russell won his first 4 championships in an NBA with 7 other teams. his next 5 titles in a league with 8 other teams and his last two rings in an NBA with 11 and 13 other teams. MJ won his 6 titles in a league with 26 to 28 other teams.

That’s part of the reason I hate using rings as a primary argument for rating players from different eras. One of my pet peeves from people are those that say Russell is the greatest of all time and when asked why, just say “11 rings”. there’s got to be more to it than that.

[imAboutDatActionParticipant]

why hasnt more people called out Bills accomplishments? like someone here said, his rings came against a league with 9 or 10 teams. he played with 4 HOF. during that era, the celtics bascially had to win 8 games to win a championship,so they face someone in the conference championship and than if they win already in the championship.

he also played against inferior competition. someone here posted a vid of him "jumping over someone" you see the people in that video? lol you’re jus proving peoples point with that vid. he looked like a GIANT in that vid against those people,when he was 6’9.

im not one to say he wouldnt be nothing in this era,he’ll be a real good player. but he damn sure wouldnt have been as dominate and wouldnt have won half of those rings as the main man.

its no coincidence all the mindblowing/ridiculous stats are from way back in the day. the competition was shit. imagine if someone like Lebron or Shaq played in that era,their stats would be INSANE.

[imAboutDatActionParticipant]

why hasnt more people called out Bills accomplishments? like someone here said, his rings came against a league with 9 or 10 teams. he played with 4 HOF. during that era, the celtics bascially had to win 8 games to win a championship,so they face someone in the conference championship and than if they win already in the championship.

he also played against inferior competition. someone here posted a vid of him "jumping over someone" you see the people in that video? lol you’re jus proving peoples point with that vid. he looked like a GIANT in that vid against those people,when he was 6’9.

im not one to say he wouldnt be nothing in this era,he’ll be a real good player. but he damn sure wouldnt have been as dominate and wouldnt have won half of those rings as the main man.

its no coincidence all the mindblowing/ridiculous stats are from way back in the day. the competition was shit. imagine if someone like Lebron or Shaq played in that era,their stats would be INSANE.

[ItsVictorOladipoParticipant]

Yes his 11 championships were a bit easier to get than they would be in today’s game, I realize that and have mentioned it many times on this board. But some of those arguments hold little water.

“the competition was &$#%#&@!.” – Actually with far fewer teams in the league it actually means talent is more concentrated and the competition was superior. The St Louis Hawks team that the Celtics defeated in the 1961 Finals had 4 hall of famers. The Lakers teams that constantly lost to the Celtics when it counted had the best SG in NBA history till MJ and the best SF in NBA history till Bird along with a 5 time All-Star in Rudy LaRusso. Also, with fewer teams in the league it meant Russell was battling guys like Chamberlain and Bellamy more often. In the modern game for example someone like LBJ only plays against the top guys like Melo, KD and Paul George maybe 8 times a year in the regular season while Russell was playing against Chamberlain and Bellamy about 16 times a year.

“He looked like a giant” – The height difference between players from the 60s and players from the modern day is vastly overrated by current fans, try to keep in mind that players back then were measured barefoot whereas most players today are measured in shoes. Lets start listing his competition with what their heights would be listed at in today’s NBA; for example in 1965 the last year he won NBA MVP the other starting centers in the league were Wayne Embry (6’10), Chamberlain (7’2), Willis Reed (6’10), Leroy Ellis (7′), Zelmo Beaty (6’10), Walt Bellamy (7′) , Reggie Harding (7’1) and Nate Thurmond (7′).

The mindblowing/ridiculous stats have little to do with the competition and more to do with the differences in pace and strategy from the 50s/60s to the modern day. Teams used to play at a breakneck pace accounting for far more possessions which meant more shots and more scoring/rebounding opportunities. Also the top players routinely played 43+ minutes (Wilt once averaging over 48 for an entire season) which is about 5 minutes more per game than guys like LBJ and KD today. Using stats to compare players from different eras is bogus anyway (in any sport), but the fact remains that Russell won 5 MVPs and was widely considered neck and neck with Wilt as the greatest players of all time until MJ started to dominate.

[ItsVictorOladipoParticipant]

Yes his 11 championships were a bit easier to get than they would be in today’s game, I realize that and have mentioned it many times on this board. But some of those arguments hold little water.

“the competition was &$#%#&@!.” – Actually with far fewer teams in the league it actually means talent is more concentrated and the competition was superior. The St Louis Hawks team that the Celtics defeated in the 1961 Finals had 4 hall of famers. The Lakers teams that constantly lost to the Celtics when it counted had the best SG in NBA history till MJ and the best SF in NBA history till Bird along with a 5 time All-Star in Rudy LaRusso. Also, with fewer teams in the league it meant Russell was battling guys like Chamberlain and Bellamy more often. In the modern game for example someone like LBJ only plays against the top guys like Melo, KD and Paul George maybe 8 times a year in the regular season while Russell was playing against Chamberlain and Bellamy about 16 times a year.

“He looked like a giant” – The height difference between players from the 60s and players from the modern day is vastly overrated by current fans, try to keep in mind that players back then were measured barefoot whereas most players today are measured in shoes. Lets start listing his competition with what their heights would be listed at in today’s NBA; for example in 1965 the last year he won NBA MVP the other starting centers in the league were Wayne Embry (6’10), Chamberlain (7’2), Willis Reed (6’10), Leroy Ellis (7′), Zelmo Beaty (6’10), Walt Bellamy (7′) , Reggie Harding (7’1) and Nate Thurmond (7′).

The mindblowing/ridiculous stats have little to do with the competition and more to do with the differences in pace and strategy from the 50s/60s to the modern day. Teams used to play at a breakneck pace accounting for far more possessions which meant more shots and more scoring/rebounding opportunities. Also the top players routinely played 43+ minutes (Wilt once averaging over 48 for an entire season) which is about 5 minutes more per game than guys like LBJ and KD today. Using stats to compare players from different eras is bogus anyway (in any sport), but the fact remains that Russell won 5 MVPs and was widely considered neck and neck with Wilt as the greatest players of all time until MJ started to dominate.

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