[lakeshow22Participant]

IM NOT saying Demarcus Cousins is better than Kevin Love and Blake Griffin, but I don’t see how he’s not at least on there level. Im not talking about his 11 techs this year, his run in with coaches,  his team record, off the court and stuff like that. I’m talking about talent and ability he has to be on there level. We all agree that ALL 3 of them are pretty bad defenders for there position. You can go by stats, analytics, PER, anything and Cousins ranks higher than both in multiple categories. Cousins can put up 20/10 on ANY team in the league and is quite simply a man amongst boys out there.

What is the argument that Love and Griffin r better than Cousins? They Probably r better than him right now but what are the reasons?

[cozmojimParticipant]

Talent wise there is no argument. But you can’t just dismiss all the aformentioned baggage.

[cozmojimParticipant]

Talent wise there is no argument. But you can’t just dismiss all the aformentioned baggage.

[prophetmeirParticipant]

I honestly would take Demarcus over blake griffin any day. But no way kevin love hes a two way stretch 4, a great rebounder and outlet passer.

[prophetmeirParticipant]

I honestly would take Demarcus over blake griffin any day. But no way kevin love hes a two way stretch 4, a great rebounder and outlet passer.

[King CaluchaParticipant]

Yeah, don’t get me wrong… Blake’s a great player, but under no circumstance he’s better than Lamarcus Aldridge, Love or Cousins at this moment.

[King CaluchaParticipant]

Yeah, don’t get me wrong… Blake’s a great player, but under no circumstance he’s better than Lamarcus Aldridge, Love or Cousins at this moment.

[MikezParticipant]

 Kevin love can hit the 3 and Blake Griffin is on TV

That rhymes 

 

 

[MikezParticipant]

 Kevin love can hit the 3 and Blake Griffin is on TV

That rhymes 

 

 

[ItsVictorOladipoParticipant]

For the record his 11 techs and volatile temperament are knocks against him when compared to Love and Griffin, you can’t just dismiss that.

He’s similar to Love in many ways, just a little bit worse in most categories, Cousins has a great face up game but not quite the range of Love and Cousins is an excellent rebounder but Love is a once in generation kind of rebounder.

Griffin is simply a more vertical athlete, has a non-stop motor and is a better ball handler, but Cousins has the edge in some categories against him.

In general the biggest thing separating these guys is that Love and Griffin have produced at an All-Star level for several seasons proving their effectiveness over the long term. This is Cousins first half year producing at this kind of level (big improvements in FG%, PPG and PER). If he keeps it up for a couple more years he’ll close the gap. The way he’s playing it wouldn’t surprise me if he made Team USA in 2016.

[ItsVictorOladipoParticipant]

For the record his 11 techs and volatile temperament are knocks against him when compared to Love and Griffin, you can’t just dismiss that.

He’s similar to Love in many ways, just a little bit worse in most categories, Cousins has a great face up game but not quite the range of Love and Cousins is an excellent rebounder but Love is a once in generation kind of rebounder.

Griffin is simply a more vertical athlete, has a non-stop motor and is a better ball handler, but Cousins has the edge in some categories against him.

In general the biggest thing separating these guys is that Love and Griffin have produced at an All-Star level for several seasons proving their effectiveness over the long term. This is Cousins first half year producing at this kind of level (big improvements in FG%, PPG and PER). If he keeps it up for a couple more years he’ll close the gap. The way he’s playing it wouldn’t surprise me if he made Team USA in 2016.

[samosasParticipant]

Demarcus Cousins is your long-term bet.  He’s still improving and we’ve been waiting for Griffin to do something other than dunk since he got into the league.  Cousins puts up better numbers, on a worse team and plays eight fewer minutes per game.  If Cousins can learn to stay out of foul trouble, it’s not even going to be close. For me it’s Kevin love == Cousins >> Griffin

[samosasParticipant]

Demarcus Cousins is your long-term bet.  He’s still improving and we’ve been waiting for Griffin to do something other than dunk since he got into the league.  Cousins puts up better numbers, on a worse team and plays eight fewer minutes per game.  If Cousins can learn to stay out of foul trouble, it’s not even going to be close. For me it’s Kevin love == Cousins >> Griffin

[Jester87Participant]

The fact that when Kevin Love is on the court the Wolves outscore opponents by 7 points per 100 possessions, and when he’s out they get outscored by 9 points is a valid reason, I guess. Very few players have that kind of impact on their teams. Cousins doesn’t, right now, not even close. He’s also a double double machine, an excellent passer and while he can get lazy sometimes (not) running back on defense and while he’s not a shot blocker, he’s not that terrible of a team defender.

Griffin in my opinion doesn’t get all the credit he deserves and there are so many stereotypes about his game. I’m not a fan, because I don’t like the way he behaves on the court and to be honest I think he’s very often a borderline douche (sorry Blake, but there must be a reson if everyone playing PF in the league kinda hates you and you’re everyone’s favorite target for flagrant fouls). That being said, too many people are constantly criticizing him because he hasn’t improved since his rookie season, and that’s hardly true. I mean, all of those are people who usually don’t even look the games, they just see the stats and see he was averaging 21 and 10 as a rookie, so he’s not improved. It doesn’t matter the fact that he was playing in a terrible team in his rookie year, nor the fact that he’s doing a lot of things he couldn’t do back then. He’s shooting over 40% from 18-24 ft this year and that helps his team offense a lot, especially considering DeAndre Jordan’s offensive ineptitude. As weird as his form is, he’s making those shots and he’s also shooting free throws decently. The biggest stereotype is he can’t create his own shot in the post. He doesn’t have many back to the basket moves, but has two or three of them that are really effective and he’s doing really well there. He scores 0,98 ppp in post ups situations, with 49% FG. Both are among the best in the league and post ups make over 29% of his game (just for a comparison, Cousins shots 43% in post ups situations and scores 0,9 ppp). He’s still a questionable defender, but he’s been more consistent this year. He can still improve a lot on his decision making and BB IQ, but he’s been definitely better this year. I think he’s been playing a great role in the Clippers’ success, he has proven he can be a reliable second option in a winning team but he doesn’t always get that kind of recognition. Probably the problem with him is the fact that he gets too much love from younger fans because of his dunks and that annoys more seasoned fans like he’s just some kind of basketball’s Justin Bieber.

Also the biggest knock on Cousins is that as talented as he is (and don’t get me wrong, he’s insane), he plays in the worst position to be a bad defender. If you’re a bad defender on the wing, your coach can manage to somehow hide you. If you’re a point guard, it’s not easy but you can still find some way (Steph Curry is a weak defender, yet the Warriors are a very good defensive team and they are not worse when he’s on the floor). Even a big man, if he’s not a center, hurts you a little, but paired with a decent rim protector you can have good results nonetheless (Boozer, Z-Bo and many others). But if your center is a bad defender you’re in trouble (unless you have another big good at rim protection and at the same time who doesn’t kill spacings on offense; good luck finding one!). It doesn’t help the fact that Sacto has too many minus defenders. Cousins has cut down some of his bad habits, but he’s still a bad defender. I think there’s hope, I mean last year he was a terrible defender. Also it doesn’t help the fact that he’s been immature for most of his time in the Nba. He seems to have grown up this year, but he’s done some dumb things and you don’t know if you can trust him. If he continues in the direction he’s taken this year the sky is the limit for him. But will he? He’s been playing great this year, he’s been one of the best players in the league, but we’re talking about 3 months. Kevin Love’s been great in the last 3 years or so when he’s been healthy. If Cousins keep playing like this there’s no reason he can’t be even better than Love or Griffin. But he has to prove it yet.

[Jester87Participant]

The fact that when Kevin Love is on the court the Wolves outscore opponents by 7 points per 100 possessions, and when he’s out they get outscored by 9 points is a valid reason, I guess. Very few players have that kind of impact on their teams. Cousins doesn’t, right now, not even close. He’s also a double double machine, an excellent passer and while he can get lazy sometimes (not) running back on defense and while he’s not a shot blocker, he’s not that terrible of a team defender.

Griffin in my opinion doesn’t get all the credit he deserves and there are so many stereotypes about his game. I’m not a fan, because I don’t like the way he behaves on the court and to be honest I think he’s very often a borderline douche (sorry Blake, but there must be a reson if everyone playing PF in the league kinda hates you and you’re everyone’s favorite target for flagrant fouls). That being said, too many people are constantly criticizing him because he hasn’t improved since his rookie season, and that’s hardly true. I mean, all of those are people who usually don’t even look the games, they just see the stats and see he was averaging 21 and 10 as a rookie, so he’s not improved. It doesn’t matter the fact that he was playing in a terrible team in his rookie year, nor the fact that he’s doing a lot of things he couldn’t do back then. He’s shooting over 40% from 18-24 ft this year and that helps his team offense a lot, especially considering DeAndre Jordan’s offensive ineptitude. As weird as his form is, he’s making those shots and he’s also shooting free throws decently. The biggest stereotype is he can’t create his own shot in the post. He doesn’t have many back to the basket moves, but has two or three of them that are really effective and he’s doing really well there. He scores 0,98 ppp in post ups situations, with 49% FG. Both are among the best in the league and post ups make over 29% of his game (just for a comparison, Cousins shots 43% in post ups situations and scores 0,9 ppp). He’s still a questionable defender, but he’s been more consistent this year. He can still improve a lot on his decision making and BB IQ, but he’s been definitely better this year. I think he’s been playing a great role in the Clippers’ success, he has proven he can be a reliable second option in a winning team but he doesn’t always get that kind of recognition. Probably the problem with him is the fact that he gets too much love from younger fans because of his dunks and that annoys more seasoned fans like he’s just some kind of basketball’s Justin Bieber.

Also the biggest knock on Cousins is that as talented as he is (and don’t get me wrong, he’s insane), he plays in the worst position to be a bad defender. If you’re a bad defender on the wing, your coach can manage to somehow hide you. If you’re a point guard, it’s not easy but you can still find some way (Steph Curry is a weak defender, yet the Warriors are a very good defensive team and they are not worse when he’s on the floor). Even a big man, if he’s not a center, hurts you a little, but paired with a decent rim protector you can have good results nonetheless (Boozer, Z-Bo and many others). But if your center is a bad defender you’re in trouble (unless you have another big good at rim protection and at the same time who doesn’t kill spacings on offense; good luck finding one!). It doesn’t help the fact that Sacto has too many minus defenders. Cousins has cut down some of his bad habits, but he’s still a bad defender. I think there’s hope, I mean last year he was a terrible defender. Also it doesn’t help the fact that he’s been immature for most of his time in the Nba. He seems to have grown up this year, but he’s done some dumb things and you don’t know if you can trust him. If he continues in the direction he’s taken this year the sky is the limit for him. But will he? He’s been playing great this year, he’s been one of the best players in the league, but we’re talking about 3 months. Kevin Love’s been great in the last 3 years or so when he’s been healthy. If Cousins keep playing like this there’s no reason he can’t be even better than Love or Griffin. But he has to prove it yet.

[domeico7Participant]

 Winning.

[domeico7Participant]

 Winning.

[highflyer0Participant]

 I believe that Kevin Love is better than Demarcus Cousins in a number of way so I will just focus on the matchup between Cousins and Griffin.  If you look at stats, it would seem as though they are very similar.  However, when I watch their games I feel like Griffin is the guy I would rather have on my team.  Demarcus Cousins, as petty as it sounds, is a bit of ballhog at times.  He forces the issue a lot, and although his assist numbers are solid, he misses a lot of open opportunities to kick the ball out to shooters.  It’s great to have a big guy you can just throw the ball down to and get an easy score, but a lot of times you don’t even have to run plays for Griffin.  Blake’s athletic gifts allow him to score very efficiently on fast breaks and alley-oops.  Demarcus Cousins makes a lot of great offensive moves and has more pure basketball talent than Griffin, but I think Griffin has a better grasp of his role and plays more within himself right now.  Cousins still has games where he shoots 30%, and although every star has bad games at times, Griffin is much less prone to forcing the issue and having an inefficient night.  In time though, Cousins will probably be the better player because he has a more well rounded offensive repertoire. 

 

 

 

 

[highflyer0Participant]

 I believe that Kevin Love is better than Demarcus Cousins in a number of way so I will just focus on the matchup between Cousins and Griffin.  If you look at stats, it would seem as though they are very similar.  However, when I watch their games I feel like Griffin is the guy I would rather have on my team.  Demarcus Cousins, as petty as it sounds, is a bit of ballhog at times.  He forces the issue a lot, and although his assist numbers are solid, he misses a lot of open opportunities to kick the ball out to shooters.  It’s great to have a big guy you can just throw the ball down to and get an easy score, but a lot of times you don’t even have to run plays for Griffin.  Blake’s athletic gifts allow him to score very efficiently on fast breaks and alley-oops.  Demarcus Cousins makes a lot of great offensive moves and has more pure basketball talent than Griffin, but I think Griffin has a better grasp of his role and plays more within himself right now.  Cousins still has games where he shoots 30%, and although every star has bad games at times, Griffin is much less prone to forcing the issue and having an inefficient night.  In time though, Cousins will probably be the better player because he has a more well rounded offensive repertoire. 

 

 

 

 

[Tallest Nigga N DA BuildingParticipant]

 We all no way and its the things that have nothing to do wit basketball if he was winning then maybe you can look pass it like they did for Rodman

[Tallest Nigga N DA BuildingParticipant]

 We all no way and its the things that have nothing to do wit basketball if he was winning then maybe you can look pass it like they did for Rodman

[KayjayParticipant]

Is actually an average defender. But he’s at the Center position which has the biggest responsibility of protecting the paint. I can assure you Isaiah Thomas is terrible defender by default due to his size. And because of this it exposes Cousins alot more to helping on defense letting his man go. He’s actually good at one on one defense and when he’s locked in he’s decent at pick and roll defense. Other than that, I agree with just about everything Jester said. I’m also a Kings fan, and I acknowledge how beastly Cuz is. But until they replace some pieces in that starting line up, they will continue to lose and Cousins will never get the recognition he deserves. As for the Techs, the guy has improved tremendously this season,and doesn’t Blake Griffin have 10 or so? So does Dwight? I swear every mistake Cuz makes are magnified, but the rest of the league gets off scott free.

Love is good, and as of overall accomplishments I’d take him over Cousins despite the numbers swaying in Big Cuz favor. As for Griffin? I’m sorry but I have yet to be impressed by the guy in terms of playing for someone other than himself. He doesn’t have a go-to-guy personality when his team is in trouble. His team overall is better than Cousins and is paired with one of the best, if not the best point guards in the NBA and still manages to dissapear every year in the playoffs. Z-Bo completely made him a non factor and bullied the living shit out of him in front of everybody. Both him and Cousins are young, and play two different positions. But we know what type of player Blake will be and can be. He’s and athletic power forward that will struggle when defenses lock in on him.

Thats the real issue with saying Griffin is better just because he’s on a winning team. Defenses show up to just stop Cousins from doing what he does every night and aside from Marc Gasol and Bogut no real player can give Cousins trouble. He takes it to Dwight everytime they play, he just lit up Hibbert for 31 points who is considered to be one of the best centers in the nba. Cousins skill set is rare, and has an attitude similar to David West in how he handles himself on the court. Can we honestly sit here and say he won’t get better than he already is? Inside, outside, rebounds, nice touch around the rim. He dominates on a nightly basis with out having a ton of alley-oops and easy dunks. Griffin is surrounded by consistent shooters from the outside. Cousins is not surrounded by consistent shooters from the outside and still puts up good numbers.

[aztwulfParticipant]

Owns Cuz

[aztwulfParticipant]

Owns Cuz

[KayjayParticipant]

Is actually an average defender. But he’s at the Center position which has the biggest responsibility of protecting the paint. I can assure you Isaiah Thomas is terrible defender by default due to his size. And because of this it exposes Cousins alot more to helping on defense letting his man go. He’s actually good at one on one defense and when he’s locked in he’s decent at pick and roll defense. Other than that, I agree with just about everything Jester said. I’m also a Kings fan, and I acknowledge how beastly Cuz is. But until they replace some pieces in that starting line up, they will continue to lose and Cousins will never get the recognition he deserves. As for the Techs, the guy has improved tremendously this season,and doesn’t Blake Griffin have 10 or so? So does Dwight? I swear every mistake Cuz makes are magnified, but the rest of the league gets off scott free.

Love is good, and as of overall accomplishments I’d take him over Cousins despite the numbers swaying in Big Cuz favor. As for Griffin? I’m sorry but I have yet to be impressed by the guy in terms of playing for someone other than himself. He doesn’t have a go-to-guy personality when his team is in trouble. His team overall is better than Cousins and is paired with one of the best, if not the best point guards in the NBA and still manages to dissapear every year in the playoffs. Z-Bo completely made him a non factor and bullied the living shit out of him in front of everybody. Both him and Cousins are young, and play two different positions. But we know what type of player Blake will be and can be. He’s and athletic power forward that will struggle when defenses lock in on him.

Thats the real issue with saying Griffin is better just because he’s on a winning team. Defenses show up to just stop Cousins from doing what he does every night and aside from Marc Gasol and Bogut no real player can give Cousins trouble. He takes it to Dwight everytime they play, he just lit up Hibbert for 31 points who is considered to be one of the best centers in the nba. Cousins skill set is rare, and has an attitude similar to David West in how he handles himself on the court. Can we honestly sit here and say he won’t get better than he already is? Inside, outside, rebounds, nice touch around the rim. He dominates on a nightly basis with out having a ton of alley-oops and easy dunks. Griffin is surrounded by consistent shooters from the outside. Cousins is not surrounded by consistent shooters from the outside and still puts up good numbers.

[redeyejediParticipant]

 Argument based on number of T’s: Invalid
The Stats:
Blake Griffin- 11
Demarcus Cousins- 11

 

[redeyejediParticipant]

 Argument based on number of T’s: Invalid
The Stats:
Blake Griffin- 11
Demarcus Cousins- 11

 

[ball4life23Participant]

 Nothing, this is a popularity contest and Kevin Love and Blake Griffin has been popular for a long time, people are only starting to realize Demarcus Cousins as a top 3 Center in the league. Demarcus Cousins is better than both of them, only problem is that the fans decide the starters and Demarcus doesn’t have enough fans at this point. It should be LaMarcus Aldridge and Demarcus Cousins starting, not Blake Griffin and Kevin Love.

[ball4life23Participant]

 Nothing, this is a popularity contest and Kevin Love and Blake Griffin has been popular for a long time, people are only starting to realize Demarcus Cousins as a top 3 Center in the league. Demarcus Cousins is better than both of them, only problem is that the fans decide the starters and Demarcus doesn’t have enough fans at this point. It should be LaMarcus Aldridge and Demarcus Cousins starting, not Blake Griffin and Kevin Love.

[TallmanNYCParticipant]

 Cousin is shooting at a much higher percentage this year, so actually the OP is kind of right. Cousin is sort of, this year, in the ballpark of Love and Griffin. The thing is we are only halfway through one season. Let’s see if he can keep this up. And even if he does, Love is still more efficient. And this season of Love is not his best shooting year and not that different from his rookie year. So we kind of all believe Love can keep doing this. If Cousin keeps this up through the full year, he will be looked at very differently. 

[TallmanNYCParticipant]

 Cousin is shooting at a much higher percentage this year, so actually the OP is kind of right. Cousin is sort of, this year, in the ballpark of Love and Griffin. The thing is we are only halfway through one season. Let’s see if he can keep this up. And even if he does, Love is still more efficient. And this season of Love is not his best shooting year and not that different from his rookie year. So we kind of all believe Love can keep doing this. If Cousin keeps this up through the full year, he will be looked at very differently. 

[Jester87Participant]

Wow, while I was showing some love for Griffin and I really appreciated his game throughout the whole season, especially in the last two months, I never really checked how good they have been since CP3 went down. Well, the Clips are 8-3 since and Griffins’s been averaging really impressive numbers in those 11 games: 25,9 ppg, 8,5 rpg, 4,7 apg, 1,6 spg, shooting around 53.89% FG, 2.7 topg, 75% FT. It has to be said that it wasn’t a really tough schedule, but it’s still remarkable. He definitely seems to have stepped up this season.

[Jester87Participant]

Wow, while I was showing some love for Griffin and I really appreciated his game throughout the whole season, especially in the last two months, I never really checked how good they have been since CP3 went down. Well, the Clips are 8-3 since and Griffins’s been averaging really impressive numbers in those 11 games: 25,9 ppg, 8,5 rpg, 4,7 apg, 1,6 spg, shooting around 53.89% FG, 2.7 topg, 75% FT. It has to be said that it wasn’t a really tough schedule, but it’s still remarkable. He definitely seems to have stepped up this season.

[TEQU1LAParticipant]

I’m happy fans r finally realizing how great Griffin been this season. For all the talk of Aldridge improvement this season, people fail to see Blake’s improvement in his FT shooting, Defense, jump shot and most impressive his post game the man been great. He has definately elevated his game to another level once CP3 comes back Clips will be deadly….

[TEQU1LAParticipant]

I’m happy fans r finally realizing how great Griffin been this season. For all the talk of Aldridge improvement this season, people fail to see Blake’s improvement in his FT shooting, Defense, jump shot and most impressive his post game the man been great. He has definately elevated his game to another level once CP3 comes back Clips will be deadly….

[Author]

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