[valentine]

"Cleveland Cavaliers’ teammates were puzzled by how he recorded just one assist in 39 minutes. During one possession in the second quarter, Irving dribbled for 24 seconds and went nowhere before settling for a tough mid-range jumper."
I had always one problem with Irving, he makes no one better around him. That’s just resulted in the box score now and it’s not the first time, that’s implying his game. He’s a great scorer, but anyway he’s listed as a point guard.

 

[TarHeelRavenParticipant]

I mean, that’s who he is as a player.  He’s a long ways from being a Steve Nash or a John Stockton.  If the Cavs think they can win a title with their starting point guard playing no defense and jacking up shots and not caring about getting anyone else involved, then that’s on them. 

[TarHeelRavenParticipant]

I mean, that’s who he is as a player.  He’s a long ways from being a Steve Nash or a John Stockton.  If the Cavs think they can win a title with their starting point guard playing no defense and jacking up shots and not caring about getting anyone else involved, then that’s on them. 

[phila9012Participant]

 Irving is best suited to play off lebron and lead their second units. Irving can shoot and score. I thought he would fit a lot better with lebron than wade since he can shoot. I think if Irving was five years older and just wanted to win he would be a better fit. He is still trying to establish himself in the NBA and still doesn’t really play defense. They need to accept a side kick role and do the little things. He can still make a lot of money with endorsements if he is the number to lebron. Westbrook does well with durant there. Wade did well with endorsements with lebron in miami.

[phila9012Participant]

 Irving is best suited to play off lebron and lead their second units. Irving can shoot and score. I thought he would fit a lot better with lebron than wade since he can shoot. I think if Irving was five years older and just wanted to win he would be a better fit. He is still trying to establish himself in the NBA and still doesn’t really play defense. They need to accept a side kick role and do the little things. He can still make a lot of money with endorsements if he is the number to lebron. Westbrook does well with durant there. Wade did well with endorsements with lebron in miami.

[OaktownWarriorsParticipant]

is really a scoring guard and not a point guard. True he can handle the rock, but that doesn’t equal to a true point guard. This issue and others on the Cavs, is the reason why the Cavs have team issues. They don’t know there true roles on the team?

[OaktownWarriorsParticipant]

is really a scoring guard and not a point guard. True he can handle the rock, but that doesn’t equal to a true point guard. This issue and others on the Cavs, is the reason why the Cavs have team issues. They don’t know there true roles on the team?

[Kokayne_DawkinzParticipant]

I don’t think you need a PG who’s going to run the offense because it’s kind of redundant when you have a ball dominant wing. Wade, Kobe, Mj all played PG who weren’t pass first guards because it takes the ball out of their hands 

[Kokayne_DawkinzParticipant]

I don’t think you need a PG who’s going to run the offense because it’s kind of redundant when you have a ball dominant wing. Wade, Kobe, Mj all played PG who weren’t pass first guards because it takes the ball out of their hands 

[NJHooper95Participant]

Assist doesn’t really mean you make players better, although I agree Irving doesn’t. Neither did Marbury and he average like 8 assist for his career. Irving makes the team better with his scoring ability and he is by FAR the most Clutch player on the team. He needs to be who he is, he is not Stockton or Nash,  but he can be a more dynamic scorer than both. He can get you 30 with ease, and you all say the won’t win with but they damn sure won’t win without him.

[NJHooper95Participant]

Assist doesn’t really mean you make players better, although I agree Irving doesn’t. Neither did Marbury and he average like 8 assist for his career. Irving makes the team better with his scoring ability and he is by FAR the most Clutch player on the team. He needs to be who he is, he is not Stockton or Nash,  but he can be a more dynamic scorer than both. He can get you 30 with ease, and you all say the won’t win with but they damn sure won’t win without him.

[NJHooper95Participant]

Great point! 

[NJHooper95Participant]

Great point! 

[doubledribblerParticipant]

There was a reason why the Cavs were terrible to start last year and terrible with Irving pre-Lebron. Irving needs to learn to do other things besides score. It’s great that he can score, but he wasn’t even efficient last game. He doesn’t make anyone better. Not saying the Cavs have a great team, but he doesn’t move the needle. If I’m Cleveland I would rather trade Irving than Love, but would consider trading both.

[doubledribblerParticipant]

There was a reason why the Cavs were terrible to start last year and terrible with Irving pre-Lebron. Irving needs to learn to do other things besides score. It’s great that he can score, but he wasn’t even efficient last game. He doesn’t make anyone better. Not saying the Cavs have a great team, but he doesn’t move the needle. If I’m Cleveland I would rather trade Irving than Love, but would consider trading both.

[NJHooper95Participant]

 His shooting percentages besides the three ball this year are good. I agree he needs to do other things such as play defense, but the team was not bad because of him. Did they win the title without, No. He was gone and the Cavs struggled to score, so obviously he was missed. Lebron had to put up wilt chamberlain type of numbers just for them to be in the game. So let’s not act like Irving isn’t needed. Lebron is the best passer on the team, Irving just needs to step up on defense, I can live with his offense.

[NJHooper95Participant]

 His shooting percentages besides the three ball this year are good. I agree he needs to do other things such as play defense, but the team was not bad because of him. Did they win the title without, No. He was gone and the Cavs struggled to score, so obviously he was missed. Lebron had to put up wilt chamberlain type of numbers just for them to be in the game. So let’s not act like Irving isn’t needed. Lebron is the best passer on the team, Irving just needs to step up on defense, I can live with his offense.

[Hype Machine]

 ‘I agree he needs to do other things such as play defense’….

Lol @ this killer analysis

It is 50% of the game after all….

[xJumpManxParticipant]

yet he was MVP last year. neither plays any defense. 

[Dale WorthingtonParticipant]

 No way, Jorge! Curry is 4th among 82 PGs in DBPM. Irving is a paltry 79th.

[xJumpManxParticipant]

 I suggest you watch Curry play. He is awful on defense.He regualry does nto even guard the other teams pg they put Thompson on them.

[xJumpManxParticipant]

 I suggest you watch Curry play. He is awful on defense.He regualry does nto even guard the other teams pg they put Thompson on them.

[Dale WorthingtonParticipant]

 No way, Jorge! Curry is 4th among 82 PGs in DBPM. Irving is a paltry 79th.

[xJumpManxParticipant]

yet he was MVP last year. neither plays any defense. 

[Hype Machine]

 ‘I agree he needs to do other things such as play defense’….

Lol @ this killer analysis

It is 50% of the game after all….

[BigChamp12Participant]

 Hopefully this will hush everybody that says the Cavs struggle because Lebron won’t let Kyrie run the point. He cant! He’s a dynamic scorer. Not a playmaker for other guys.

[BigChamp12Participant]

 Hopefully this will hush everybody that says the Cavs struggle because Lebron won’t let Kyrie run the point. He cant! He’s a dynamic scorer. Not a playmaker for other guys.

[Hype Machine]

 I did some research on Kyrie Irvings Advanced stats…and needless to say…they’re terrible.

According to ESPN, Irvings ‘Real Plus/Minus’ is 29th in the League. Dellavedova is 16th,

Irving has a ‘Plus/Minus per 36m’ of +5.9. Dellavedova per 36m is +8

His Assists per 36m is 5.2. Dellavedova 6.4

His True Shooting % is 55 same as Dellavedova. 

And his defensive rating is the most damning statistic…Ranking 79th of 82 Qualified PGs. Dellavedova Ranks 20th of 82.

The Cavs best "2 man lineups" with a +16.9 Rating – James/Dellavedova & Love/Dellavedova

 

Summary

If you take pure Volume of shots out of the equation, Dellavedova is better in every way than Irving. 

Kyrie Irving gives you absolutely nothing on the offensive end over Dellavedova except volume. Their True Shooting % is the same, however Dellavedova assists at a higher rate. The Cavs Score more efficiently when Dellavedova is on the court….and their defense is better with Dellavedova on the court. In fact…anyone aside from Derrick Rose (81st) and JJ Barea (82nd) plays better defense than Irving. 

The Cavs don’t need a score-first PG. They need a player who knows his role and plays defense and makes simple but effective passes. 

Its clear forom my research that the Cavs do not need Irving and Love because they both only provide offense….yet Irving provides his at an efficiency rate that is no better than a $1.5m per season backup. 

Feel free to poke holes in my analysis….but the evidence is clear. Irving is a volume scorer and nothing else. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Hype Machine]

 I did some research on Kyrie Irvings Advanced stats…and needless to say…they’re terrible.

According to ESPN, Irvings ‘Real Plus/Minus’ is 29th in the League. Dellavedova is 16th,

Irving has a ‘Plus/Minus per 36m’ of +5.9. Dellavedova per 36m is +8

His Assists per 36m is 5.2. Dellavedova 6.4

His True Shooting % is 55 same as Dellavedova. 

And his defensive rating is the most damning statistic…Ranking 79th of 82 Qualified PGs. Dellavedova Ranks 20th of 82.

The Cavs best "2 man lineups" with a +16.9 Rating – James/Dellavedova & Love/Dellavedova

 

Summary

If you take pure Volume of shots out of the equation, Dellavedova is better in every way than Irving. 

Kyrie Irving gives you absolutely nothing on the offensive end over Dellavedova except volume. Their True Shooting % is the same, however Dellavedova assists at a higher rate. The Cavs Score more efficiently when Dellavedova is on the court….and their defense is better with Dellavedova on the court. In fact…anyone aside from Derrick Rose (81st) and JJ Barea (82nd) plays better defense than Irving. 

The Cavs don’t need a score-first PG. They need a player who knows his role and plays defense and makes simple but effective passes. 

Its clear forom my research that the Cavs do not need Irving and Love because they both only provide offense….yet Irving provides his at an efficiency rate that is no better than a $1.5m per season backup. 

Feel free to poke holes in my analysis….but the evidence is clear. Irving is a volume scorer and nothing else. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Dale WorthingtonParticipant]

Excellent analysis.

It’s a shame Kyrie went #1 overall while Delli was a lowly UDFA. Coaches and Front Office executives don’t forget that stuff, and because of it, Kyrie’s spot as a starter is secure, even though he’s quite probably the very worst facilitator and defender among starting PGs.

[Dale WorthingtonParticipant]

Excellent analysis.

It’s a shame Kyrie went #1 overall while Delli was a lowly UDFA. Coaches and Front Office executives don’t forget that stuff, and because of it, Kyrie’s spot as a starter is secure, even though he’s quite probably the very worst facilitator and defender among starting PGs.

[NJHooper95Participant]

 Give me the eye test over analytics all day

[Hype Machine]

Good players stack up in both…

 

[Hype Machine]

Good players stack up in both…

 

[NJHooper95Participant]

 Give me the eye test over analytics all day

[r377Participant]

I like exposing overrated players…

First it was Amare, then Melo and K Love. Now I am onto Cousins, Harden and also Irving.

Are they all talented physically ? yes they are, but they also lack certain aspects you need to be seen as “NBA elite” or to win a championship.

You need bball IQ, chemistry, leadership, mental toughness and defense. All these guys lack at least one or two of these aspects needed to be classified as Elite….. You also need to not be soft/injury prone and miss games (Amare, Melo, Love and Irving)

All these players are great on NBA 2k on your playstation or on your Yahoo Fantasy team – they are just not that great in real life…..

[xJumpManxParticipant]

Harris and Jackson play no defense either. 

[xJumpManxParticipant]

Harris and Jackson play no defense either. 

[r377Participant]

I like exposing overrated players…

First it was Amare, then Melo and K Love. Now I am onto Cousins, Harden and also Irving.

Are they all talented physically ? yes they are, but they also lack certain aspects you need to be seen as “NBA elite” or to win a championship.

You need bball IQ, chemistry, leadership, mental toughness and defense. All these guys lack at least one or two of these aspects needed to be classified as Elite….. You also need to not be soft/injury prone and miss games (Amare, Melo, Love and Irving)

All these players are great on NBA 2k on your playstation or on your Yahoo Fantasy team – they are just not that great in real life…..

[BiggaveliiiParticipant]

espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine  Rudy gay, bellineli, collison for irving and Shumpert. I think Sac would do it in heart beat and take a chance to give Big cuz another legit scorer. Where as rudy, marco, and Darren could fix some of the holes the cavs have currently. Let Lebron run the point and Rudy can slide in at the three. Again just something that could "possibly" happen.

[BiggaveliiiParticipant]

espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine  Rudy gay, bellineli, collison for irving and Shumpert. I think Sac would do it in heart beat and take a chance to give Big cuz another legit scorer. Where as rudy, marco, and Darren could fix some of the holes the cavs have currently. Let Lebron run the point and Rudy can slide in at the three. Again just something that could "possibly" happen.

[HitsterParticipant]

Around LBJ you want guys who will do a lot of Intangibles work and who are good shooters to take open shots when LBJ draws a double team. If Kyrie is trying to play "Heroball" or "Be the man" then it doesn’t really help. I’m sure he’d only do this if LBJ wasn’t playing or wasn’t on court as otherwise there would be words said.

[HitsterParticipant]

Around LBJ you want guys who will do a lot of Intangibles work and who are good shooters to take open shots when LBJ draws a double team. If Kyrie is trying to play "Heroball" or "Be the man" then it doesn’t really help. I’m sure he’d only do this if LBJ wasn’t playing or wasn’t on court as otherwise there would be words said.

[SpaceghostParticipant]

I think the Combo of Mo Willaims and Dellie is more than enough to win. Kyrie good for the mix tape circuit. Watch games from early in the year when MO started, the offense of the Cavs was much better. 

 

  

[Hype Machine]

 Indeed. Per 100 possessions…

With Love, Lebron, Delly, Cavs are +21.4 (3rd best in NBA)

With Love, Lebron, Irving just +9.5 (48th).

Irving is a 12pt hole for the Cavs.

Im not saying hes a bad player….just a bad fit. Huge ego, chemistry killer. Hog.

 

 

 

 

[Hype Machine]

 Indeed. Per 100 possessions…

With Love, Lebron, Delly, Cavs are +21.4 (3rd best in NBA)

With Love, Lebron, Irving just +9.5 (48th).

Irving is a 12pt hole for the Cavs.

Im not saying hes a bad player….just a bad fit. Huge ego, chemistry killer. Hog.

 

 

 

 

[SpaceghostParticipant]

I think the Combo of Mo Willaims and Dellie is more than enough to win. Kyrie good for the mix tape circuit. Watch games from early in the year when MO started, the offense of the Cavs was much better. 

 

  

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