[valentine]

East Coast bias being what it is, and the west coast of the east coast being Chicago, and Duke being East Coast Mecca, is it any wonder that Jabari is still considered to have more upside?

Exact same thing happened with Stanley Johnson and Justise Winslow. Winslow went to Duke, where all the games are on for everybody on the east coast to watch.

You think those ESPN bros stay up late for all the Pac 10 action? 

Gordon and Stanley Johnson both shared minutes with fellow first rounder RHJefferson. Parker and Winslow were showcased in max minutes on the most valuable time slot on television, 8 pm EST. 

You want to know why Jaylen Brown’s stock is going to drop? Ask Zach LaVine and Kyle Anderson.

I think it’s about time the East Coast bros in Connecticut got to know Aaron Gordon, and I’m convinced AG is about to introduce himself with a big "boooya".

 

 

 

 

 

[BleedGreen808Participant]

 Sorry but using Zach Lavine as a reason why Jaylen Brown’s stock is going to fall doesn’t make sense.  Lavine was a late riser in high school and was ranked 50th in the ESPN 100.  I believe he never started a game at UCLA yet he still went 13th overall.  So I don’t see how going to a Pac 10 school hurt his draft stock.  

[T Rex]

 Zach shot lights out from all over the floor, especially from 3, for his first 17 college games, which nobody on the east coast watched.

By the end of the season his % was down, and east coast basketball journalists were declaring that he had a weak/mediocre 3 point shot, and that it would take years for him to become a good shooter, if ever.

It never made sense. When a player shoots 45-50% from 3 on high volume for 17 straight games, any future slump in percentage is just that, a slump. Nobody gets lucky for 17 straight games on high shot volume.

 

 

 

[T Rex]

 Zach shot lights out from all over the floor, especially from 3, for his first 17 college games, which nobody on the east coast watched.

By the end of the season his % was down, and east coast basketball journalists were declaring that he had a weak/mediocre 3 point shot, and that it would take years for him to become a good shooter, if ever.

It never made sense. When a player shoots 45-50% from 3 on high volume for 17 straight games, any future slump in percentage is just that, a slump. Nobody gets lucky for 17 straight games on high shot volume.

 

 

 

[BleedGreen808Participant]

 Sorry but using Zach Lavine as a reason why Jaylen Brown’s stock is going to fall doesn’t make sense.  Lavine was a late riser in high school and was ranked 50th in the ESPN 100.  I believe he never started a game at UCLA yet he still went 13th overall.  So I don’t see how going to a Pac 10 school hurt his draft stock.  

[BlueLacesParticipant]

 Stanley Johnson was drafted ahead of Justise Winslow so not sure what point you’re trying to make using that in your argument…

[T Rex]

 Yeah, but Winslow was hyped as the better prospect all draft season. Luckily teams did their homework right before the draft.

 

 

[T Rex]

 Yeah, but Winslow was hyped as the better prospect all draft season. Luckily teams did their homework right before the draft.

 

 

[BlueLacesParticipant]

 Stanley Johnson was drafted ahead of Justise Winslow so not sure what point you’re trying to make using that in your argument…

[NBAjunkie81Participant]

 good prospect, but comparing Parker & Gordon is apples & oranges… According to just about every Talent scount,that 2014 Draft was was considered a 3 player Draft in terms of players who have a chance to be Franchise stars: Embiid, Wiggins & Parker… regardless of how people feel about any of these players today, that was the consensus view back then…. I know other than Wiggins, none of those players drafted in the top 10 did much in their Rookie season… Aaron’s rookie season, he averaged 17.0 minutes per games – not points, Minutes – 41 Games played, 8 Games started, 5.2 ppg, 3.6 rpg. 0.7 apg & 44.5 FG% – so not bad for Rookie #’s – how did Young do in the Summer League??? Did he look good??? I know that he was a bit of a surprise to be taken at #4, most scouts had him going between #5 -10, he was an excellent athlete…. What do people think he will do moving forward??? 

[T Rex]

 Gordon had a dominant d-league and shot the lights out from 3 with maximum swag.

Even comparing him to Wiggins, Gordon is much more of the prototype Small Forward than scrawny 200 lb Andrew Wiggins.

Gordon is 30-40 lbs stronger than Wiggins, while being even taller and just about as athletic. 

Unlike Wiggins, Gordon has great natural passing instincts, and ball handling at least as good and natural as Wiggins, if not better an more natural.

Gordon can switch onto a SG waaaaaaay better than Wiggins can switch onto a PF. 

Wiggins is about the same weight as the average NBA point guard, 200 lbs. 

There’s nothing archetypal or legendary about a 200 lb small forward, or a 6’8 shooting guard who can’t shoot outside.

Gordon is downright prototypical, straight-outta-da-laboratory NBA SF, and almost as outstanding a set of tools at PF.

 

 

[drose24Participant]

Who do you believe will be the best player in Wiggins’s draft class than ?

 

 

[T Rex]

 It could be any of the following:

Embiid, Gordon, Smart, Nurkic, or Wiggins.

Kyle Anderson has an outside shot if he can beef up and play PF full time.

 

[T Rex]

 It could be any of the following:

Embiid, Gordon, Smart, Nurkic, or Wiggins.

Kyle Anderson has an outside shot if he can beef up and play PF full time.

 

[drose24Participant]

 Its quite misleading how you bash wiggins on most posts but still believe that he can be the best player from his class. I dont see how you can put Nurkic into the conversation of top five player in his class unless he is truly a dark horse canadate. Nurkic can set solid screens due to his muscle mass and have decent foot speed to defend the league dominat pick and roll. However thats just about what he can do at this point. He doesnt have great foot work to show signs that  he will be a dominate low post scorer and mainly relies on his strong frame to put up points in the paint currently. 

[drose24Participant]

 Its quite misleading how you bash wiggins on most posts but still believe that he can be the best player from his class. I dont see how you can put Nurkic into the conversation of top five player in his class unless he is truly a dark horse canadate. Nurkic can set solid screens due to his muscle mass and have decent foot speed to defend the league dominat pick and roll. However thats just about what he can do at this point. He doesnt have great foot work to show signs that  he will be a dominate low post scorer and mainly relies on his strong frame to put up points in the paint currently. 

[T Rex]

 Nurkic has really soft touch for a big man, and he’s stronger than Okafor. He has an elite spin move that will only get better.

His quick feet mean he’ll be able to keep up with smaller centers which are the trend, but those smaller centers will be utterly helpless to contain him on the other end.

If Wiggins gains more strength than I think he will, and doubt he will, AND develops a 3 point shot he can take more than once a game or whatever, then sure he’s got upside.

But getting much stronger and much better on defense, AND improving his 3 point shot, is what it’s going to take for him to live up to the ridiculous upside that people ascribe to him.

There’s a couple tweeners in this next draft who might not be as great as people think, because one’s a 185 lb small forward, and the other’s a 210 lb pf.

 

 

 

  

[T Rex]

 Nurkic has really soft touch for a big man, and he’s stronger than Okafor. He has an elite spin move that will only get better.

His quick feet mean he’ll be able to keep up with smaller centers which are the trend, but those smaller centers will be utterly helpless to contain him on the other end.

If Wiggins gains more strength than I think he will, and doubt he will, AND develops a 3 point shot he can take more than once a game or whatever, then sure he’s got upside.

But getting much stronger and much better on defense, AND improving his 3 point shot, is what it’s going to take for him to live up to the ridiculous upside that people ascribe to him.

There’s a couple tweeners in this next draft who might not be as great as people think, because one’s a 185 lb small forward, and the other’s a 210 lb pf.

 

 

 

  

[drose24Participant]

 Nurkic shot slightly under 45 percent as a bigman last year. That is well below average for efficent scoring big mens. To make matters worse,  most of Nurkic’s shot attempts came within 5-8 feet of the basket last year which inflated his 2 offensive rebound average per game he accumulated last year. Now, given that it was his rookie year, Nurkic can obviously improve his efficency.

Onto wiggins, Yes he only weighs 200 pounds at the moment. However, people have different body frames. Like Michael Jordan, Wiggins have a strong wirery frame. Wiggins was able to post up against bigger wings last year with enough sucess to show promise in the future. Moreover, Wiggins does have board shoulders so theres no reason to see why he can’t gain weight/ muscle unlike joakim Noah coming into the league. Wiggins have smooth mechanics on his jump shot as you can see and attempted 3.2 Threes a game in FIBA. He shot roughly 36 percent which doesnt scream Kevin Durant esque but it is getting more respectable by the year. But I can see what you mean by Wiggins living up to the hype everyone ascribed to him. In his defense, the hype was not fair but if Wiggins manages to become a top 5 player in the NBA, that hype can be validated. 

 

[drose24Participant]

 Nurkic shot slightly under 45 percent as a bigman last year. That is well below average for efficent scoring big mens. To make matters worse,  most of Nurkic’s shot attempts came within 5-8 feet of the basket last year which inflated his 2 offensive rebound average per game he accumulated last year. Now, given that it was his rookie year, Nurkic can obviously improve his efficency.

Onto wiggins, Yes he only weighs 200 pounds at the moment. However, people have different body frames. Like Michael Jordan, Wiggins have a strong wirery frame. Wiggins was able to post up against bigger wings last year with enough sucess to show promise in the future. Moreover, Wiggins does have board shoulders so theres no reason to see why he can’t gain weight/ muscle unlike joakim Noah coming into the league. Wiggins have smooth mechanics on his jump shot as you can see and attempted 3.2 Threes a game in FIBA. He shot roughly 36 percent which doesnt scream Kevin Durant esque but it is getting more respectable by the year. But I can see what you mean by Wiggins living up to the hype everyone ascribed to him. In his defense, the hype was not fair but if Wiggins manages to become a top 5 player in the NBA, that hype can be validated. 

 

[T Rex]

 Wiggins is very thin boned. Michael Jordan always had bigger, stronger bones.

Wiggins takes after his mother, a super thin olympic track star who is still super skinny in her 40s.

Thin bones don’t add a lot of muscle like stronger, bigger bones do.

RJ Hunter has broad shoulders but it doesn’t really matter, because his bones are so skinny. Wiggins is very much in the same body type as Hunter, but somehow nobody expects Hunter to gain 20 lbs like they do with Wiggins.

If you think many supposed draft gurus took note of Wiggins thin bones, you’d be as wrong as they were in just assuming Wiggins would pile on the weight like a bigger boned player.

Wiggins stopped growing like 3 years ago, and he’s still the same string bean. Tayshaun Prince never filled out either, nor should people have expected him to. But Tayshaun had alot more length than Wiggins, much better defensive instincts and mentality, and a better 3 point shot as well.

Wiggins can be better than Tayshaun of course, but he’s probably always going to be a bit of an empty stats guy, at least if he settles in at SF rather than SG.

 

 

 

[T Rex]

 Wiggins is very thin boned. Michael Jordan always had bigger, stronger bones.

Wiggins takes after his mother, a super thin olympic track star who is still super skinny in her 40s.

Thin bones don’t add a lot of muscle like stronger, bigger bones do.

RJ Hunter has broad shoulders but it doesn’t really matter, because his bones are so skinny. Wiggins is very much in the same body type as Hunter, but somehow nobody expects Hunter to gain 20 lbs like they do with Wiggins.

If you think many supposed draft gurus took note of Wiggins thin bones, you’d be as wrong as they were in just assuming Wiggins would pile on the weight like a bigger boned player.

Wiggins stopped growing like 3 years ago, and he’s still the same string bean. Tayshaun Prince never filled out either, nor should people have expected him to. But Tayshaun had alot more length than Wiggins, much better defensive instincts and mentality, and a better 3 point shot as well.

Wiggins can be better than Tayshaun of course, but he’s probably always going to be a bit of an empty stats guy, at least if he settles in at SF rather than SG.

 

 

 

[drose24Participant]

 What do you believe Wiggin’s stateline will be this year? 

[drose24Participant]

 What do you believe Wiggin’s stateline will be this year? 

[T Rex]

 As far as Nurkic, taking his rookie FG% too literally is just as foolish as drafting Julius Randle or Vonleh or Stauskas or other low ceiling guys over Nurkic.

Just a year ago, everybody declared that Nurkic was years away from being NBA ready, which was a case of collective ignorance mascarading as informed opinion.

 

 

[T Rex]

 As far as Nurkic, taking his rookie FG% too literally is just as foolish as drafting Julius Randle or Vonleh or Stauskas or other low ceiling guys over Nurkic.

Just a year ago, everybody declared that Nurkic was years away from being NBA ready, which was a case of collective ignorance mascarading as informed opinion.

 

 

[drose24Participant]

 It is obvious that Vonleh and stauskas both need tremendous work done in order to be consistent contributers on a night end basis, but saying Nurkic’s ceiling is way above Julius Randle’s is an extreme exageration that you often tend to do on this site. 

[drose24Participant]

 It is obvious that Vonleh and stauskas both need tremendous work done in order to be consistent contributers on a night end basis, but saying Nurkic’s ceiling is way above Julius Randle’s is an extreme exageration that you often tend to do on this site. 

[drose24Participant]

Who do you believe will be the best player in Wiggins’s draft class than ?

 

 

[OhCanada-Participant]

 I wonder how Wiggins or Parker would have done in the D-League. Andrew would have probably dropped 30-ppg.

[OhCanada-Participant]

 I wonder how Wiggins or Parker would have done in the D-League. Andrew would have probably dropped 30-ppg.

[T Rex]

 Gordon had a dominant d-league and shot the lights out from 3 with maximum swag.

Even comparing him to Wiggins, Gordon is much more of the prototype Small Forward than scrawny 200 lb Andrew Wiggins.

Gordon is 30-40 lbs stronger than Wiggins, while being even taller and just about as athletic. 

Unlike Wiggins, Gordon has great natural passing instincts, and ball handling at least as good and natural as Wiggins, if not better an more natural.

Gordon can switch onto a SG waaaaaaay better than Wiggins can switch onto a PF. 

Wiggins is about the same weight as the average NBA point guard, 200 lbs. 

There’s nothing archetypal or legendary about a 200 lb small forward, or a 6’8 shooting guard who can’t shoot outside.

Gordon is downright prototypical, straight-outta-da-laboratory NBA SF, and almost as outstanding a set of tools at PF.

 

 

[NBAjunkie81Participant]

 good prospect, but comparing Parker & Gordon is apples & oranges… According to just about every Talent scount,that 2014 Draft was was considered a 3 player Draft in terms of players who have a chance to be Franchise stars: Embiid, Wiggins & Parker… regardless of how people feel about any of these players today, that was the consensus view back then…. I know other than Wiggins, none of those players drafted in the top 10 did much in their Rookie season… Aaron’s rookie season, he averaged 17.0 minutes per games – not points, Minutes – 41 Games played, 8 Games started, 5.2 ppg, 3.6 rpg. 0.7 apg & 44.5 FG% – so not bad for Rookie #’s – how did Young do in the Summer League??? Did he look good??? I know that he was a bit of a surprise to be taken at #4, most scouts had him going between #5 -10, he was an excellent athlete…. What do people think he will do moving forward??? 

[TarHeelRavenParticipant]

I think Aaron Gordon could physically leap over Jabari Parker.  I’ll be tuning into the Magic-Bucks game this year to see if it actually happens. 

[TarHeelRavenParticipant]

I think Aaron Gordon could physically leap over Jabari Parker.  I’ll be tuning into the Magic-Bucks game this year to see if it actually happens. 

[ZachAttackParticipant]

 First of all, it’s Pac 12 not Pac 10. Secondly, No… Jabari Parker will be a star… I don’t care what you all say. He will be a star. The Bucks have Jason Kidd who happens to be really good at expanding the teams talent. Meanwhile, Aaron Gordon is just an energy guy that I think could be a 6th man on a mid-seed playoff team, 3rd to 6th place. He wouldn’t be a starter for a contender unless that team had an LBJ or KD. He just won’t. I love Aaron Gordon. Great kid, could be good. But not as good as Jabari.

[drose24Participant]

 I think Jabari can very well make a couple of all star teams down the line in his career. The kid seems to work and has  a very advance OFFENSIVE skill set for his age. But its hard to see jabari as a future top 5 NBA player that wiggins can be because of his lack of defensive abilties. 

[drose24Participant]

 I think Jabari can very well make a couple of all star teams down the line in his career. The kid seems to work and has  a very advance OFFENSIVE skill set for his age. But its hard to see jabari as a future top 5 NBA player that wiggins can be because of his lack of defensive abilties. 

[drose24Participant]

 I think you may have undervalued Gordons place in the league. He might not be a consistent all- star but he will most likely not be a 6th man for most of his career. With his athleticism, coachability, attitude, defense, and average offensive skill set, all things point to him being at least a 10 year NBA vet that started most of his career. What type of star do you envision Jabari to be? Top 5 NBA player, top 10? or boarderline allstar.

[drose24Participant]

 I think you may have undervalued Gordons place in the league. He might not be a consistent all- star but he will most likely not be a 6th man for most of his career. With his athleticism, coachability, attitude, defense, and average offensive skill set, all things point to him being at least a 10 year NBA vet that started most of his career. What type of star do you envision Jabari to be? Top 5 NBA player, top 10? or boarderline allstar.

[ZachAttackParticipant]

 First of all, it’s Pac 12 not Pac 10. Secondly, No… Jabari Parker will be a star… I don’t care what you all say. He will be a star. The Bucks have Jason Kidd who happens to be really good at expanding the teams talent. Meanwhile, Aaron Gordon is just an energy guy that I think could be a 6th man on a mid-seed playoff team, 3rd to 6th place. He wouldn’t be a starter for a contender unless that team had an LBJ or KD. He just won’t. I love Aaron Gordon. Great kid, could be good. But not as good as Jabari.

[The Scare Crow RisesParticipant]

im honestly jealous of the Bucks and Magic, those two could be very special, they both have their flaws of course but I’m sure they’ll figure it out

Right now, I think Parker is the better player, he scores and rebounds at a respectable rate for a F, if he can extend his range and stay aggressive he can be an All Star in the mold of Melo or Glen Robinson

Aaron Gordon is a better defender and energy player, if he ever starts to knock down outside shots consistently he can turn everyone’s opinion around on him as an offensive threat, I’ve always liked Air Gordon’s skill set minus his jump shot, he can dribble drive and pass, we already know he can finish at the rim and if he adds some healthy weight he’ll be an even better threat down low 

[The Scare Crow RisesParticipant]

im honestly jealous of the Bucks and Magic, those two could be very special, they both have their flaws of course but I’m sure they’ll figure it out

Right now, I think Parker is the better player, he scores and rebounds at a respectable rate for a F, if he can extend his range and stay aggressive he can be an All Star in the mold of Melo or Glen Robinson

Aaron Gordon is a better defender and energy player, if he ever starts to knock down outside shots consistently he can turn everyone’s opinion around on him as an offensive threat, I’ve always liked Air Gordon’s skill set minus his jump shot, he can dribble drive and pass, we already know he can finish at the rim and if he adds some healthy weight he’ll be an even better threat down low 

[T Rex]

 If Gordon’s 3 point shot from summer league holds up in the regular season, the sky’s the limit.

That will open up his dribble drive game wide open, and I think Gordon is one of the next great dominant finger roll finishers in the NBA.

 

[T Rex]

 If Gordon’s 3 point shot from summer league holds up in the regular season, the sky’s the limit.

That will open up his dribble drive game wide open, and I think Gordon is one of the next great dominant finger roll finishers in the NBA.

 

[Sand]

Gordon will pass Parker the season after next.

[Sand]

Gordon will pass Parker the season after next.

[Author]

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