[SeattleSuperChronicsParticipant]

The most important part for an organization is to always nail the easy ones. We have been hearing that it’s Ayton at 1 but could it be a ploy by Ayton’s agent to put pressure on the Suns to take him. The fact is the Suns Coach Igor Kokoskov is has said Doncic is a “future super star”. According to Bill Simmons and several people on this forum Doncic is the easy no brainer pick. (personally I lean Ayton). I don’t understand why you would hire the Wonder Boy’s national coach if you don’t have plans drafting him. How many super stars are in a draft. How much friction is that going to add to a locker room and an organization if Ayton struggles. Could it really be the suns plan to hire a coach that may resent coaching Ayton. I have some very sketchy sources telling me Kokoskov Likes Bender and wants Doncic but these jobs don’t come around every year for European coaches.

[SwatLakeCityParticipant]

 I can see why Kokoskov likes Bender over Chriss, especially since I am a Jazz fan and Kokoskov was the Jazz’s assistant coach before being hired by the Suns. I can also see why he likes Doncic over Ayton for the same reasons, however think of the team fit for Doncic. Booker is their starting SG who is the future of the team. The Suns also drafted a very young Josh Jackson who plays SF to play defense alongside the offensive Booker as sort Jimmy Butler type role. Doncic plays SG or SF, those spots as I have just described are already filled by young players who are in their future plans. Doncic can play point but it will be temporary in a Ben Simmons type of role. But I also don’t think Kokoskov will use Doncic like Philly used Simmons his rookie year. Personally, I have a hard time seeing Doncic play point, I can more see him play point forward from the small forward position like the Jazz did when they had Gordon Hayward. Oh wait, the Suns already have a future small forward in Josh Jackson and future two in Devin Booker. They could trade Jackson but why trade him if you just drafted him last year? 

To me Ayton, just makes more sense fit wise, and look at it this way. Kokoskov is the coach not the GM. The GM still has the final say on who is the draft pick and the coach often has to make do. Ayton doesn’t have a bad attitude, so I don’t know why you’d think he’d be a headache for a smart coach like Kokoskov, who has had to deal with many coach/player relationships as a Jazz assistant coach, and probably as a european coach too. Doncic isn’t the only player he’s coached. He can learn to like several players. And I think he has or will realize how hard it would be for Doncic to fit into Suns system when they already have Booker and Josh Jackson playing his two most prominent positions.

 

[Robb_CParticipant]

Ayton needs to be drafted by the suns.. 

Igors system needs a big man comfortable playing in those high elbow sets, Hes has great hands and is a very good passer, Hes extremely valuable and in my opinion a freak of nature.. 

The Suns need to either make a trade at four or take it on the chin..

Ayton literally can open up that entire offensive approach While being the defensive anchor thats able to get Josh Jackson in transition, hes also comfortable in those pitch actions that Igor likes to run which is huge plus for a guy of his size!!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[The GoatParticipant]

There are photos on IG and Twitter of Ayton signing Suns jerseys. He is an absolute idiot if he is doing that without knowing he is going there. It’d be such a dumb move that I’d toss him further down my board I was a GM. Drafting someone as dumb as JR Smith or worse cannot be a good idea.

[BallerScriptParticipant]

 Woah, calm down cowboy

 

[llperez]

 ayton’s worst case scenario is still very high. I mean he has the size and soft touch and physical attributes to go along with the fact he has actual athleticism and is a knock down shooter. I mean i hear people try and make kwame references, but kwame was a terrible finisher and was never anywhere remotely considered a money jump shot shooter like ayton is. I mean he really is a no brinaer in this draft. 

[sheepish_moParticipant]

 I agree i think any team that passes on Doncic will regret it.  Clear best player in the draft IMO and you pick BPA at 1.  Having said that i think Suns draft Ayton without a doubt.  How many big men are there in the league leading a team to a ring? None since Duncan, Doncic equals instant relevancy while Ayton at best is KAT. 

[ndbigdaveParticipant]

I count myself in the Doncic camp as well and it has nothing to do with the Suns’ new coach having familiarity with him (though it sure doesn’t hurt). I just see him as being a perfect player for the modern style of basketball that requires outside shooting, smart passing, switching on defense. Though it isn’t quite “position- less basketball” the NBA playoffs have headed closer and closer to it. If we do away with the thought that you have a PG, SG, SF, PF and C and just try to have enough size to not be bullied in the post and grab defensive rebounds then you could really run with 5 traditional Small forwards (guys usually 6’6” to 6’10” who can handle, shoot, pass and switch on defense). The Suns are well on their way to that by having Booker, Jackson, Warren and could add Doncic to that mix (while still having Chriss/Bender as developmental big men).

Why couldn’t Doncic/Booker bring the ball down and run the offense? If they wanted to push the pace there would be many times Jackson/Warren could grab a board and just run down the court. Jackson naturally needs to improve his outside shot (it is why Tatum was a superior prospect in my eyes last year though that wasn’t the consensus in the draft community) but they have the makings of a super-switchy defensive team that has multiple ball handlers, shooters and “smart players” to make the right play.

I would run out with:
Devin Booker, 6’6” 210
Luka Doncic, 6’8” 230
TJ Warren, 6’8” 215
Josh Jackson, 6’8” 200
Dragan Bender, 7’1” 225

The oldest player in the starting lineup will 25 during the regular season. This is a starting lineup under team control for years. While I would love slightly more shooting out of Jackson and Warren, but I have hopes for Jackson specifically (at least as a streaky shooter). That is a line-up that could switch out Bender for a slightly more agile post presence to really be a “modern NBA team” that has space, moves the ball, switches on defense. I like that far, far more than going with Ayton, burring Bender on the bench (those two will never play together at the same time) while still having the shooting/defensive issues of Jackson/Warren on the floor with a third player Ullis? At the point or perhaps a healthy Knight.

The argument FOR Ayton is all about that potential peak/ceiling. IF he hits his absolute peak we are talking about a 7’1” guy with a 7’5” reach who can protect the rim, space the floor and show enough agility to perhaps stay on the floor against small-ball teams while abusing the small-ball teams on offense. Could he be that? Sure. I don’t know what we saw during his high school/EYBL and lone season in college to think he will be an average defender (let alone a “plus defender”) and his jump shot, though better than the “average” 7-footer is not on some sort of elite level (like Lauri Markkanen as an example while at Arizona).

We have seen this story so many times and what is even more confusing is that we have history as a guide and the way the modern NBA is being played to know that Ayton is a guy who (more likely than not) cannot play crunch time minutes in a playoff series, is likely a net-negative defensively and likely never becomes a “weapon” from the 3-point line.

It feels like a no-brainer to go Doncic, or any other known shooting commodity for how the modern NBA is played and will be played into the future where the 3-point shot is king, teams will establish match-ups with the pick-and-roll and where a big man who cannot play in space and isn’t a real threat to space the floor has limited value.

Finally, for those things you really hope to get out of a big man, rim protection, rim running, rebounding – this draft alone is a great example where guys who can do that will be available much later in the draft, if not into the 2nd round. Why spend the #1 pick on a guy who in the fairest projection, becomes a “really good rim-running offensive big man” with some jump shooting, and is not a difference maker on defense? There are players that will go immediately after Ayton who are either better offensively (Bagley) or defensively (Jackson Jr., Bamba) and are likely to be elite in those traits. It does not even seem to be a debate, and this does not address the very real red flags when it comes to Ayton’s motor, off-court personality and simple desire to get better. There aren’t just “signs” that this won’t go the way the Suns expect it to, there are huge fireworks telling them that this isn’t how you build a championship roster and this isn’t the player to select.

[Robb_CParticipant]

Im not solid on Doncic, FT% is very questionable and defensively asking Doncic to guard shooting guards would be a liability.

If you really watched Ayton play this season at Arizona, You’d see his prospect is not merited off just “potential” He has a very advanced skillset and some of the best footwork and hands Ive seen in the Draft, He has a great passing ability and was literally hitting 4 to 5 assist per game towards the end of the season! The kid gives me Wilt Chamberlain vibes in terms of his body coordination for his size.. You dont see 7’1 basketball players with the type of hand and eye coordination Ayton has..

Ayton has a generational skillset, Doncic FT% is questionable and defensively hes going to go through some growing pains..

I like Doncics Skillset but calling him the Number 1 pick is laughable.

Ayton is going to be a nightmare in the league..

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[apb540Participant]

I see Ayton & Doncic as a 1A – 1B personally. Such different players with unique skillsets, but I think they both offer super star potential.

My choice between the two is Deandre Ayton. When you look at the top two-way centers in the league today, the list is pretty short at the top. For me, it’s essentially Anthony Davis, Joel Embiid…….and then everyone else. For example, Karl-Anthony Towns & Demarcus Cousins are two of the top 5-7 centers in most everyone’s book, but they don’t play the defense required to be in the convo of top two-way centers. Rudy Gobert & DeAndre Jordan both play outstanding defense but don’t have the offensive skills to be in the conversation. Deandre Ayton has a legit chance to be at the very top of that list within a year or two.

This isn’t a knock on Doncic – hence why I see him as 1B. Good range, great versatility, supreme basketball IQ, size, experience & understanding of his physical limitations are the obvious things that stick out with Luka. Can’t wait to watch him run the P&R for 82 games. 15 years ago the NBA would of pigeon holed Luka as stretch 3 who could play a little point forward; in 2018 he’s a Point Guard. 

However, Luka’s lack of athleticism knocks him down below Ayton in my book. Would be really fun to watch Luka & Ayton run the P&R together thou……

 

 

 

 

 

  

[Robb_CParticipant]

 Doncic is perfect for the Suns or Denver..

In Denver, Jokic and Luka would be extremely difficult to defend in Halfcourt sets..

In Phoenix, If Doncic can show the motor to handle the rapid pace the Suns have been playing it gives the Suns a player with great IQ and court vision they desperately need.

 

I wouldnt pass on Ayton for Doncic that would be a huge reach.. Ayton is literally a video game center..

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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