This topic contains 26 replies, has 9 voices, and was last updated by AvatarAvatar TONYDABOSS77 10 years, 5 months ago.

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  • #62308
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    TONYDABOSS77
    Participant

    Who’s your top 4 of this class? I’m going to give you mine with comps for them all. I’m really high on this class with these 4 in particular. 

    Comps are going to be 4 versions of who they could be…from tha least to the best. Most guys settle between tha 2nd & 3rd spots…

     

    Mine is Ben Simmons, Brandon Ingram, Jamal Murray, & Dwayne Bacon.

    Simmons is obviously the guy. 6’10 240 & has a handle & vision that I’ve never seen from a guy that size. The LO comps were cute at first, but he’s just different. LO could handle it & create for your 2nd unit, but he couldn’t have an entire offense run through him the whole game. BS can though. BS is averaging a 19/13/6 without a jump shot. Terror to guard. Unstoppable in tha open floor. He gets wherever he wants on the floor. His IQ is through the roof. His style of play is like LeBron’s. No, he’s not the athlete like LeBron (nobody is). But he’s still a special athlete to be able to run, jump & contort his body like he does at his size. Bigger Grant Hill. Transcendent talent. 

    Lamar Odom/Grant Hill/LeBron James

     

    The more I go back & watch Ingram, the more I like him. The only guy I’d take in front of him would be Simmons. If you combined this class with the previous 2, he’s still top 5 talent. 6’10 with crazy ball skills. Can handle it, pass it & shoot it. Youngest guy in this class…will only be 19 his rookie year so he could possibly be 7 feet. Just play him & take the lumps because later, he’ll be a perennial all star. Great touch. He’s going to be amazing. His game is so smooth. I’d use him like they used KD his rookie year…let him play the 2 & use his size advantage & length to score over guards until he’s put on enough size to settle in at the 3. Multi-positional type guy though. Will be able to guard different spots & allow you to play different lineups. 

    Darius Miles or Jonathan Bender/Giannis/Paul George/KD

     

    Jamal Murray is a big time scorer. Flat out player. He can score from all 3 levels. Can finish at the cup. Would be one of tha rare guards that score at a high clip without that crazy athleticism. Competitor. He’s big time. If I needed a bucket, he’d be one of the guys I called on.

    OJ Mayo/Goran Dragic/Chauncey Billups/Gilbert Arenas

     

    Dwayne Bacon

    Has tha talent to be a 25 point scorer in the league. Has the ball on a string. That handle with his body allows him to get to the cup at will. He’ll be able to score on any 2 guard from Day 1. Can fill it up from all 3 levels. Elite level athlete. Soooo explosive. Rises on anyone. A terror in the open floor & can play in traffic. I know he’s already 20, but I’m not worried about it. The last high ranked guy that was older than his class was Shabazz & this guy is everything we wanted Shabazz to be. 6’7, really athletic scoring machine. His athleticism & size will allow him to get boards just by being on the court. If I needed a bucket, he’s the top guy for it. No one in the country can guard him. 

    Jamal Crawford/Tyreke Evans/Latrell Sprewell/Harden

     

     

     

     

     

     

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  • #1034068
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    TripleDoubleScout
    Participant

     Everyone is knocking Kris Dunn’s age because he’s not a teenager. 23 is NOT the new 30. He is clearly a Day 1 impact rookie and the third best prospect in this class. Whoever gets him (hopefully the Sixers) is going to be VERY happy. Jaylen Brown could challenge for #3 if his court awareness/IQ improves over the next four months. Now do I think Dunn WILL be picked #3 in the draft? No I don’t. But this is my own ranking. Murray is my 4# rated prospect behind Simmons, Ingram, and Dunn in that order. Ingram, who I love as a prospect, has a flaw that may keep him from being a lock at #2: that subpar first step. I wouldn’t say he is slow at all, but he just has average NBA quickness. This is why I agree with the OP about putting him at SG at least at first because the kid will have some sort of physical advantage. He would get eaten alive right now by starting SFs. Dwayne Bacon is an interesting call by the OP, and I think he could be a lottery sleeper after workouts.

     

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  • #1033932
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    TripleDoubleScout
    Participant

     Everyone is knocking Kris Dunn’s age because he’s not a teenager. 23 is NOT the new 30. He is clearly a Day 1 impact rookie and the third best prospect in this class. Whoever gets him (hopefully the Sixers) is going to be VERY happy. Jaylen Brown could challenge for #3 if his court awareness/IQ improves over the next four months. Now do I think Dunn WILL be picked #3 in the draft? No I don’t. But this is my own ranking. Murray is my 4# rated prospect behind Simmons, Ingram, and Dunn in that order. Ingram, who I love as a prospect, has a flaw that may keep him from being a lock at #2: that subpar first step. I wouldn’t say he is slow at all, but he just has average NBA quickness. This is why I agree with the OP about putting him at SG at least at first because the kid will have some sort of physical advantage. He would get eaten alive right now by starting SFs. Dwayne Bacon is an interesting call by the OP, and I think he could be a lottery sleeper after workouts.

     

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  • #1034072
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    Taylor Gang Mike
    Participant

     Good list. I would say Simmons, Ingram, Jaylen Brown and Bacon.. I like Murray ad Skal though.  People forget Michael Jordan came into the league at 21.. Yeah Bacon is 20, but he is still young and should be the top SG in the draft. 

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  • #1033936
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    Taylor Gang Mike
    Participant

     Good list. I would say Simmons, Ingram, Jaylen Brown and Bacon.. I like Murray ad Skal though.  People forget Michael Jordan came into the league at 21.. Yeah Bacon is 20, but he is still young and should be the top SG in the draft. 

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  • #1034078
    AvatarAvatar
    Proximo
    Participant

    Ingram
    Murray
    Bender
    Simmons

     

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  • #1033942
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    Proximo
    Participant

    Ingram
    Murray
    Bender
    Simmons

     

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  • #1034086
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    Dazzling Dunks and Basketball Bloopers
    Participant

    I would personally substitute brown or bender for bacon. Agree with your other 3 though.

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  • #1033950
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    Dazzling Dunks and Basketball Bloopers
    Participant

    I would personally substitute brown or bender for bacon. Agree with your other 3 though.

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  • #1034103
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    Memphis Madness
    Participant

     Ben Simmons is at the TOP of my list.  His FLOOR seems to be Lamar Odom or Danny Manning.  His UPSIDE is really high, like a Magic Johnson/LeBron James hybrid.  Maybe not NBA Mount Rushmore Quality but multi-time All Star worthy.

    I am putting Buddy Hield in my Top Four.  Scoring still matters.  Long distance shooting matters more than ever.  The 2 guard position is fairly week and will soon lose Kobe Bryant.  So, Hield helps you in areas that really matter.

    After Ben Simmons, I think things drop off.

    Not exactly who my other "Top Two" guys are but Buddy Hield is in my Top Four.

    I will let Brandon Ingram, Poetl, and Sabonis fight it out for the other two spots.  There are probably some other guys in this range, too.  BUT, I would consider trading down, if you are at 2-4 and don’t see a guy who really, really stands out.  I might consider trading down and go get some fairly known quantities (albeit with lower ceilings) like Sabonis, Grayson Allen, and possibly even waterbug dynamo Tyler Ulis.  IF I could trade the 4th pick and wind up with ALL THREE of those guys I would probably do it.  

    So if the Sixers DO get the Lakers pick at 4 and they also win the 1st pick, they MIGHT think about trading the 4th pick after drafting Ben Simmons at 1.

    Trade the 4th pick to Denver and get 11 and 17.  At 11 they can get Buddy Hield to be their 2 guard of the future.  That INSTANTLY gives them a core of Okafor, Simmons, Hield, Noel, and Embiid.  With Ish Smith and some other decent point guard options.  At 17, they can go with a big like Stephen Zimmerman (as Embiid/Saric insurance), or Grayson Allen as a guy who can bring some offensive firepower off he bench.  Denzel Valentine as a do-everything backup wing would be an ideal pick at 24 with their other first rounder.   

    I would trade the 27th pick to the Bucks for 38 and 39.  Then go get Kyle Wiltjer as a long shooter at 38, a shot blocker like Amida Brimah at 39, and then point guard insurance in Tyler Ulis at 40 (their own second rounder) if he comes out.  Other 2nd round options could include Ron Baker, Wayne Selden, and Perry Ellis.  

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

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  • #1033966
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    Memphis Madness
    Participant

     Ben Simmons is at the TOP of my list.  His FLOOR seems to be Lamar Odom or Danny Manning.  His UPSIDE is really high, like a Magic Johnson/LeBron James hybrid.  Maybe not NBA Mount Rushmore Quality but multi-time All Star worthy.

    I am putting Buddy Hield in my Top Four.  Scoring still matters.  Long distance shooting matters more than ever.  The 2 guard position is fairly week and will soon lose Kobe Bryant.  So, Hield helps you in areas that really matter.

    After Ben Simmons, I think things drop off.

    Not exactly who my other "Top Two" guys are but Buddy Hield is in my Top Four.

    I will let Brandon Ingram, Poetl, and Sabonis fight it out for the other two spots.  There are probably some other guys in this range, too.  BUT, I would consider trading down, if you are at 2-4 and don’t see a guy who really, really stands out.  I might consider trading down and go get some fairly known quantities (albeit with lower ceilings) like Sabonis, Grayson Allen, and possibly even waterbug dynamo Tyler Ulis.  IF I could trade the 4th pick and wind up with ALL THREE of those guys I would probably do it.  

    So if the Sixers DO get the Lakers pick at 4 and they also win the 1st pick, they MIGHT think about trading the 4th pick after drafting Ben Simmons at 1.

    Trade the 4th pick to Denver and get 11 and 17.  At 11 they can get Buddy Hield to be their 2 guard of the future.  That INSTANTLY gives them a core of Okafor, Simmons, Hield, Noel, and Embiid.  With Ish Smith and some other decent point guard options.  At 17, they can go with a big like Stephen Zimmerman (as Embiid/Saric insurance), or Grayson Allen as a guy who can bring some offensive firepower off he bench.  Denzel Valentine as a do-everything backup wing would be an ideal pick at 24 with their other first rounder.   

    I would trade the 27th pick to the Bucks for 38 and 39.  Then go get Kyle Wiltjer as a long shooter at 38, a shot blocker like Amida Brimah at 39, and then point guard insurance in Tyler Ulis at 40 (their own second rounder) if he comes out.  Other 2nd round options could include Ron Baker, Wayne Selden, and Perry Ellis.  

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

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    • #1034323
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      TripleDoubleScout
      Participant

       Thank you for downplaying the Odom/Simmons comparison. So tired of that one, clearly inaccurate, and that was before Simmons arrived at LSU. People have to trust their eyes and not worry about sounding over the top in the moment. Simmons isn’t quite LeBron, not quite Magic, but somewhere in between, You nailed it. 

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    • #1034181
      AvatarAvatar
      TripleDoubleScout
      Participant

       Thank you for downplaying the Odom/Simmons comparison. So tired of that one, clearly inaccurate, and that was before Simmons arrived at LSU. People have to trust their eyes and not worry about sounding over the top in the moment. Simmons isn’t quite LeBron, not quite Magic, but somewhere in between, You nailed it. 

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  • #1034339
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    TeslaBaller
    Participant

    Simmons, Ingram and Bender.

    Those are my top 3. I think all can special players and real difference makers in 3 years. Simmons having the more immediate impact of the 3.

    I like the idea of playing Ingram at the 2 spot early in his career, good call. SF is the toughest position position in the league. You have guys 6′ 7" to damn near 7 feet tall who can do it all.

    No love for Dragan. I think at worse he’s a Detlef Schrempf/Kirilenko type. I like his ball skills and think he will be deadly in the pick and roll/pop game as a facilitator or screener. 

    While I like Bacon a lot and he’s in my top 10, top 5 is just a little too high for him. I like his swagger and killer instinct and I think being drafted in the teens will give him that chip on his shoulder that’s needed sometimes to be successful. 

    #4 is where the drop off happens. I like Dunn, Brown and Poeltl but if I had to pick 1, I would said Brown who looks like at worse Stackhouse and best case Jimmy Butler. 

     

     

     

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  • #1034197
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    TeslaBaller
    Participant

    Simmons, Ingram and Bender.

    Those are my top 3. I think all can special players and real difference makers in 3 years. Simmons having the more immediate impact of the 3.

    I like the idea of playing Ingram at the 2 spot early in his career, good call. SF is the toughest position position in the league. You have guys 6′ 7" to damn near 7 feet tall who can do it all.

    No love for Dragan. I think at worse he’s a Detlef Schrempf/Kirilenko type. I like his ball skills and think he will be deadly in the pick and roll/pop game as a facilitator or screener. 

    While I like Bacon a lot and he’s in my top 10, top 5 is just a little too high for him. I like his swagger and killer instinct and I think being drafted in the teens will give him that chip on his shoulder that’s needed sometimes to be successful. 

    #4 is where the drop off happens. I like Dunn, Brown and Poeltl but if I had to pick 1, I would said Brown who looks like at worse Stackhouse and best case Jimmy Butler. 

     

     

     

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  • #1034341
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    Uncledrew
    Participant

    Simmons isn’t as athletic as lebron but he’s taller at 6’10 so that compensates. His floor game is similar so he’s hybrid of magic and lebron. He’s the best prospect. Then Ingram at 2. His ceiling is a baby Durant but if he does fall short he should be atleast Rudy gay level. Murray looks like a brandon roy clone, a do it all guard with similar athleticism just a couple inches shorterat 6’4 I think he’s a better shooter at the college level then brandon was. At least murray can be at brandon knights level. Jaylen brown might be a better prospect than murray but I think his game is more raw. Brown is much bigger and physical at 6’7 and an elite athlete. Ceiling seems like a better Jimmy butler but if he doesn’t work on his handle he will live in Terrence Ross level basement.

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  • #1034199
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    Uncledrew
    Participant

    Simmons isn’t as athletic as lebron but he’s taller at 6’10 so that compensates. His floor game is similar so he’s hybrid of magic and lebron. He’s the best prospect. Then Ingram at 2. His ceiling is a baby Durant but if he does fall short he should be atleast Rudy gay level. Murray looks like a brandon roy clone, a do it all guard with similar athleticism just a couple inches shorterat 6’4 I think he’s a better shooter at the college level then brandon was. At least murray can be at brandon knights level. Jaylen brown might be a better prospect than murray but I think his game is more raw. Brown is much bigger and physical at 6’7 and an elite athlete. Ceiling seems like a better Jimmy butler but if he doesn’t work on his handle he will live in Terrence Ross level basement.

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  • #1034347
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    TONYDABOSS77
    Participant

     I like Bender a lot. I had him as my 2nd guy, but as I watched the other guys more, I had to move them up as I saw fit. I do think he could be a really good player, but I don’t know about his athleticism/movement skills. I know he looks great in overseas, but you can’t just assume that it’ll translate to America. Not everyone’s Dirk or Porzingis or Giannis. I’ll have a more definite opinion on him when he gets to workout over here pre-draft. He’s also only 18 though so there’s a lot of intrigue. I think he’s safely in the top 10, maybe top 5.

     

    Dunn reminds me a lot of Marcus Smart. I don’t knock Dunn for his age as much as I knock him for his lack of a jumpshot. If you’re LeBron or Simmons, you can get away with that, but not really when you’re anyone else. To get the most out of Dunn, he’ll need the ball & the only way I can really trust you with the ball that much is if you’re flat out SPECIAL.

    Buddy Hield’s a terrific college player, but, to me, when you start talking top of the draft you have to factor in upside & what they’ll be down the line, which is why Ingram, Murray & Bacon are in & he’s out of mine.

     

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  • #1034205
    AvatarAvatar
    TONYDABOSS77
    Participant

     I like Bender a lot. I had him as my 2nd guy, but as I watched the other guys more, I had to move them up as I saw fit. I do think he could be a really good player, but I don’t know about his athleticism/movement skills. I know he looks great in overseas, but you can’t just assume that it’ll translate to America. Not everyone’s Dirk or Porzingis or Giannis. I’ll have a more definite opinion on him when he gets to workout over here pre-draft. He’s also only 18 though so there’s a lot of intrigue. I think he’s safely in the top 10, maybe top 5.

     

    Dunn reminds me a lot of Marcus Smart. I don’t knock Dunn for his age as much as I knock him for his lack of a jumpshot. If you’re LeBron or Simmons, you can get away with that, but not really when you’re anyone else. To get the most out of Dunn, he’ll need the ball & the only way I can really trust you with the ball that much is if you’re flat out SPECIAL.

    Buddy Hield’s a terrific college player, but, to me, when you start talking top of the draft you have to factor in upside & what they’ll be down the line, which is why Ingram, Murray & Bacon are in & he’s out of mine.

     

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  • #1034352
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    OhCanada-
    Participant

     I don’t like your comparisons for Bacon so here’s a few.

    Jr Smith/Terrence Ross/Ben Mclemore/Gerald Green

     

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  • #1034209
    AvatarAvatar
    OhCanada-
    Participant

     I don’t like your comparisons for Bacon so here’s a few.

    Jr Smith/Terrence Ross/Ben Mclemore/Gerald Green

     

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  • #1034354
    AvatarAvatar
    TONYDABOSS77
    Participant

     His handle is one of his biggest strengths so I don’t think those comps really work, but I respect your opinion tho.

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  • #1034211
    AvatarAvatar
    TONYDABOSS77
    Participant

     His handle is one of his biggest strengths so I don’t think those comps really work, but I respect your opinion tho.

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  • #1034380
    AvatarAvatar
    Hype Machine

    On Simmons: He’s working out what to do when teams sag off him. I actually don’t know if its a good strategy because there’s no pressure on his passing game. Kinda like how you dont sag off an NFL quarterback. 

    And it gives him 2 or 3 easy steps to attack defenses and he’s basically uncontested until he hits the paint, where he shoots 60% with either hand, and jumping off either foot.

    Throw in Euro Steps, crossovers, fakes and interior passing…it just isn’t working. Why not just play defense the old fashioned way and just avoid biting on shot fakes.

    If his teamates could hit open shots, they’d be a potent offensive lineup.

    Should be a good game against Wake Forest

     

     

     

     

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  • #1034239
    AvatarAvatar
    Hype Machine

    On Simmons: He’s working out what to do when teams sag off him. I actually don’t know if its a good strategy because there’s no pressure on his passing game. Kinda like how you dont sag off an NFL quarterback. 

    And it gives him 2 or 3 easy steps to attack defenses and he’s basically uncontested until he hits the paint, where he shoots 60% with either hand, and jumping off either foot.

    Throw in Euro Steps, crossovers, fakes and interior passing…it just isn’t working. Why not just play defense the old fashioned way and just avoid biting on shot fakes.

    If his teamates could hit open shots, they’d be a potent offensive lineup.

    Should be a good game against Wake Forest

     

     

     

     

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  • #1034247
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    TONYDABOSS77
    Participant

     Exactly! He’s a lot like LeBron, where as they don’t have tha quickest first steps, but their 2nd & 3rd steps are what makes them amazing. Giving them a full head of steam is dangerous. 

    I’m not worried about his shooting at all. Once he gets drafted & he’s putting up shots all day, it’ll naturally become better. 

     

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  • #1034389
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    TONYDABOSS77
    Participant

     Exactly! He’s a lot like LeBron, where as they don’t have tha quickest first steps, but their 2nd & 3rd steps are what makes them amazing. Giving them a full head of steam is dangerous. 

    I’m not worried about his shooting at all. Once he gets drafted & he’s putting up shots all day, it’ll naturally become better. 

     

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