This topic contains 12 replies, has 7 voices, and was last updated by AvatarAvatar thparadox 11 years, 11 months ago.

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  • #57188
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    valentine

     When evaluating athleticism, does elite horizontal quickness rump vertical leap?

    Im just asking because some guys get called average athletes if they dont fare well in the vertical leap measurement.

    I see a guy like Cody Zeller and his impressive verticle and wonder whether hes really even athletic as he is otherwise very slow to shift his feet.

    Furthermore, someone like Exum has been branded an average athlete due to 31.5inch verticle. Yet he can beat everyone down the floor and has d-wade like agility getting to the rim. 

    Obviously theyre both important…but if you had just one, which would you take?

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  • #934016
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    BenchWarmer
    Participant

    If I remember correctly, Cody Zeller posted one of the best times in the agility testing in his class.. But you bring up a good point, why not ask Tim Duncan what he thinks about which is more important? 😉

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  • #933887
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    BenchWarmer
    Participant

    If I remember correctly, Cody Zeller posted one of the best times in the agility testing in his class.. But you bring up a good point, why not ask Tim Duncan what he thinks about which is more important? 😉

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  • #933895
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    Grandmama
    Participant

    I think lateral quickness/athleticism is more important than jumping ability.  With great lateral quickness, you have a much better chance at being a great on ball defender.  If you can’t move laterally, you’ll get beat of the dribble more often.

     

    They are both important.  I’d just rather have the guy who can move laterally vs the guy who can jump but can’t defend.

     

     

     

     

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  • #934024
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    Grandmama
    Participant

    I think lateral quickness/athleticism is more important than jumping ability.  With great lateral quickness, you have a much better chance at being a great on ball defender.  If you can’t move laterally, you’ll get beat of the dribble more often.

     

    They are both important.  I’d just rather have the guy who can move laterally vs the guy who can jump but can’t defend.

     

     

     

     

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  • #933919
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    King Calucha
    Participant

    Someone posted about a study that showed a certain correlation between horizontal speed and success in the league (for SGs and big men if I’m not mistaken). I never understood why some people get so excited about vertical leap, which of course, is important for showing off on ESPN’s top 10, but clearly it’s not nearly as important as lateral speed and other athleticism measurements.

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  • #934048
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    King Calucha
    Participant

    Someone posted about a study that showed a certain correlation between horizontal speed and success in the league (for SGs and big men if I’m not mistaken). I never understood why some people get so excited about vertical leap, which of course, is important for showing off on ESPN’s top 10, but clearly it’s not nearly as important as lateral speed and other athleticism measurements.

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  • #933923
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    Memphisboy14
    Participant

     I think some people don’t realize how important having a great first step is. All of the elite players in the NBA have that first step to get by people to draw fouls or get to the basket. 

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  • #934052
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    Memphisboy14
    Participant

     I think some people don’t realize how important having a great first step is. All of the elite players in the NBA have that first step to get by people to draw fouls or get to the basket. 

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  • #933927
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    BennyWestside
    Participant

    The "second" step is also hugely overrated. You see some players who are able to create that initial seperation with that burst, but cant finish the play because their man can catch them again on the way to the hoop. Also, it is much easier to make up for a weaker first step with a great handle or deception, but after that it is all down to athleticism. Watch next time people talk about a guy settling for a lot of mid range jumpers vs. getting to the rim, and I’ll bet that a dissapointing "second" step is at least partly to blame.

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  • #934056
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    BennyWestside
    Participant

    The "second" step is also hugely overrated. You see some players who are able to create that initial seperation with that burst, but cant finish the play because their man can catch them again on the way to the hoop. Also, it is much easier to make up for a weaker first step with a great handle or deception, but after that it is all down to athleticism. Watch next time people talk about a guy settling for a lot of mid range jumpers vs. getting to the rim, and I’ll bet that a dissapointing "second" step is at least partly to blame.

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  • #933943
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    thparadox
    Participant

    Great point.

    First level: Obviously there is correlation here. Some of the same fast twitch muscles used for the vertical movement are used for horizontal movement. Plus, when you combinne these factors, the speed of the jump is important when actually playing.

    Second level: We also forget that the game is not played with the feet.. it’s played with the hands. so what’s more important is vertical jump + standing reach, and other measurements that would be harder to visualize. (Exum is very tall and long for a PG. Huge centers with average verticals can be quite effective. They are also heavier, so they might still have a quick jump, just lower vertical.)

    Third Level: When in motion, it’s about the combination of distance and time. A quick player doesn’t need any vertical leap if he’s created 2 meters of seperation. A player who can jump quicker is better at timing blocks, rebounds, etc.

    Fourth level: There is skill to changing speeds, rhythms, directions, types of moves, which cannot be measured at the combine. Brandon Roy was a masterful at controlling his body to confuse the defender. Danny Green does a similar thing in transition D.

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  • #934072
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    thparadox
    Participant

    Great point.

    First level: Obviously there is correlation here. Some of the same fast twitch muscles used for the vertical movement are used for horizontal movement. Plus, when you combinne these factors, the speed of the jump is important when actually playing.

    Second level: We also forget that the game is not played with the feet.. it’s played with the hands. so what’s more important is vertical jump + standing reach, and other measurements that would be harder to visualize. (Exum is very tall and long for a PG. Huge centers with average verticals can be quite effective. They are also heavier, so they might still have a quick jump, just lower vertical.)

    Third Level: When in motion, it’s about the combination of distance and time. A quick player doesn’t need any vertical leap if he’s created 2 meters of seperation. A player who can jump quicker is better at timing blocks, rebounds, etc.

    Fourth level: There is skill to changing speeds, rhythms, directions, types of moves, which cannot be measured at the combine. Brandon Roy was a masterful at controlling his body to confuse the defender. Danny Green does a similar thing in transition D.

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