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- Posted on: Wed, 04/23/2014 - 6:59am #55031
ProudGrandpaParticipantThis is incredibly dumb. From ESPN’s Marc Stein:
One playoff win has not eased the mounting pressure on Indiana Pacers coach Frank Vogel.
Sources close to the situation told ESPN.com that Vogel, despite a 56-win season that secured the No. 1 seed in the Eastern Conference, is "coaching for his job" in the wake of a prolonged slide that has stretched into its third month.
After Indiana’s 101-85 triumph over Atlanta in Game 2 of the teams’ first-round playoff series, sources told ESPN.com that coming back to win the series against the Hawks would not automatically ensure Vogel’s safety. After a 40-11 start, the Pacers went just 16-15 the rest of the way before a humbling loss in the series opener to the eighth-seeded Hawks.
[+] EnlargePat Lovell/USA TODAY SportsFrank Vogel is on the hot seat in Indiana, according to sources.The decision on whether to retain Vogel at season’s end ultimately rests with Pacers president Larry Bird, sources said, but frustration throughout the organization has been mounting thanks to a nose dive that began in February with a loss in Orlando just before the All-Star break and has shown few signs of abating.
Expectations were raised not only externally but also internally after in-season moves Bird made to acquire Evan Turner from Philadelphia and add Andrew Bynum for bench depth on top of last summer’s additions of Luis Scola and C.J. Watson. All of Bird’s moves, sources said, were made with the intent to get the team at least one step further and back to the NBA Finals for the first time since 2000, when Bird was the coach.
Team sources on Wednesday confirmed aYahoo! Sports report that Turner and Lance Stephenson got into a practice-floor fight on the eve of Game 1 against Atlanta. But sources told ESPN.com it wasn’t the first time in recent weeks that Stephenson has clashed with a teammate.
Sources said that Stephenson and guard George Hill had to be separated on the bench during a 26-point home loss to San Antonio on March 31. And when Roy Hibbert made his well-chronicled complaints to NBA.com in late March about "some selfish dudes in here," sources say he was essentially referring to Stephenson, who ranks as one of the league’s most improved players this season as he approaches free agency in July and is well-known to be a Bird favorite.
Vogel and his staff coached the Eastern Conference All-Stars in February on the strength of Indiana’s fantastic start, but questions about his job security began to bubble in coaching circles in March after Bird told The Indianapolis Star that he’s been disappointed at times with the team’s approach this season.
"A lot of times, we don’t take the fight to [the opponent]," Bird told the newspaper. "A lot of times we sit back and wait and see how it goes. And that was the case even when we were winning a lot of games early in the season. We’ve got to be mentally prepared to really go after the teams we’re playing against. We can’t have the mindset it’s just another game; it’s a very important game. All of them are.
"I’m sort of going to Frank’s side because he’s had so much success by staying positive. We do have to stay the course. But I also think he’s got to start going after guys when they’re not doing what they’re supposed to do. And stay on them, whether you’ve got to take them out of the game when they’re not doing what they’re supposed to do, or limit their minutes. I will say, he hasn’t done that enough."
During the last week of the regular season, though, Bird told local ABC affiliate WRTV-6 that "I back Frank 100 percent."
Vogel received a two-year contract extension during the 2012-13 campaign that has him under contract through next season. Yet it should be noted that Vogel received the extension while Bird was away from the Pacers on a one-year sabbatical.
ESPN The Magazine’s Chris Broussard reports that sources with knowledge of the Pacers’ locker room dynamic have been insisting for months that Indiana would miss the presence of assistant coach Brian Shaw, who left the club last summer to become the Denver Nuggets‘ head man.
Broussard reports that, with Vogel known for being "completely positive" in his approach to dealing with players, Shaw often played the role of "bad cop" and helped keep the Pacers’ potentially volatile locker room from imploding. Shaw’s absence didn’t appear to be an issue early this season, but some insiders think it has been felt during the Pacers’ splintering over the past few months."
0 - Posted on: Wed, 04/23/2014 - 7:04am #892472
imAboutDatActionParticipantits not dumb.
they have seriously fell apart after the all star break. if they lose in the 1st round, he probably deserves to be gone. that will show somthing was obviosuly wrong and he couldnt correct it. as a coach, you cant allow that kind of collapse. if they lose to the Hawks, this can possibly be one of the most epic NBA collapse off all time.
from looking like the best team in the NBA in the 1st half of the year, to falling apart, fighting in practices ( Lance & turner) , and losing to an 8th seed in the 1st round????
0 - Posted on: Wed, 04/23/2014 - 7:04am #892362
imAboutDatActionParticipantits not dumb.
they have seriously fell apart after the all star break. if they lose in the 1st round, he probably deserves to be gone. that will show somthing was obviosuly wrong and he couldnt correct it. as a coach, you cant allow that kind of collapse. if they lose to the Hawks, this can possibly be one of the most epic NBA collapse off all time.
from looking like the best team in the NBA in the 1st half of the year, to falling apart, fighting in practices ( Lance & turner) , and losing to an 8th seed in the 1st round????
0 - Posted on: Wed, 04/23/2014 - 7:07am #892474
ProudGrandpaParticipantBut the fact that he had them in a position where they had that collapse and STILL held on to the 1 seed (albeit in the Eastern Conference) means he had to be doing something right at the beginning of the season. After all he’s done to get this team where they are, the fact that a third of a season of dysfunction could cost Vogel his job is a joke. A big part of the issue is the Danny Granger trade and that’s on Larry Bird. I’d be very disappointed if Bird tried to make Vogel a scapegoat and blame him for not bringing together a locker room that Bird uprooted.
0 - Posted on: Wed, 04/23/2014 - 7:07am #892364
ProudGrandpaParticipantBut the fact that he had them in a position where they had that collapse and STILL held on to the 1 seed (albeit in the Eastern Conference) means he had to be doing something right at the beginning of the season. After all he’s done to get this team where they are, the fact that a third of a season of dysfunction could cost Vogel his job is a joke. A big part of the issue is the Danny Granger trade and that’s on Larry Bird. I’d be very disappointed if Bird tried to make Vogel a scapegoat and blame him for not bringing together a locker room that Bird uprooted.
0- Posted on: Wed, 04/23/2014 - 7:27am #892484
imAboutDatActionParticipantgetting them the #1 seed is all cool, but nobody can ignore how poorly they’ve played in the 2nd half. this team had alot of expectations and were locked to be in the ECF, anything less isnt accepted. ESPECIALLY losing in the 1st round to an 8th seed.
yes Bird didnt make the right move trading for Turner, but that alone should not explain the collapse if Pacers lose.
fact is, if Pacers blow this, this may be the biggest collapse in NBA history. he deserves to go if he doesnt fix it.
0 - Posted on: Wed, 04/23/2014 - 7:27am #892374
imAboutDatActionParticipantgetting them the #1 seed is all cool, but nobody can ignore how poorly they’ve played in the 2nd half. this team had alot of expectations and were locked to be in the ECF, anything less isnt accepted. ESPECIALLY losing in the 1st round to an 8th seed.
yes Bird didnt make the right move trading for Turner, but that alone should not explain the collapse if Pacers lose.
fact is, if Pacers blow this, this may be the biggest collapse in NBA history. he deserves to go if he doesnt fix it.
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- Posted on: Wed, 04/23/2014 - 7:31am #892489
RUDEBOY_Participant
0 - Posted on: Wed, 04/23/2014 - 7:31am #892379
RUDEBOY_Participant0 - Posted on: Wed, 04/23/2014 - 7:40am #892491
Make’Em Say UGHParticipantAnd this is why I always side with college coaches staying in college. The pro’s are brutal man. In 3 years flat you can go from virtually unknown to hero to fired. Frank Vogel has done a great job in his tenure, after last night’s W hopefully they’ll look more like that juggernaunt team from the beginning of the season.
0 - Posted on: Wed, 04/23/2014 - 7:40am #892381
Make’Em Say UGHParticipantAnd this is why I always side with college coaches staying in college. The pro’s are brutal man. In 3 years flat you can go from virtually unknown to hero to fired. Frank Vogel has done a great job in his tenure, after last night’s W hopefully they’ll look more like that juggernaunt team from the beginning of the season.
0 - Posted on: Wed, 04/23/2014 - 8:09am #892519
Mad MaxParticipantThe pacers are overachievers and because of that and the fact they play in a weak east they are being overrated by people. They’re no better than the Bulls were a few years back. Blue-collered and tough on defense, but average on offense. Not a title contender. If you take care of the ball and make this team play half court offense they’ll have a tough time.
Pacers may not be better than any of the 8 playoff teams from the west.
Point is, Vogel is a victim of his own success.
0 - Posted on: Wed, 04/23/2014 - 8:09am #892408
Mad MaxParticipantThe pacers are overachievers and because of that and the fact they play in a weak east they are being overrated by people. They’re no better than the Bulls were a few years back. Blue-collered and tough on defense, but average on offense. Not a title contender. If you take care of the ball and make this team play half court offense they’ll have a tough time.
Pacers may not be better than any of the 8 playoff teams from the west.
Point is, Vogel is a victim of his own success.
0 - Posted on: Wed, 04/23/2014 - 8:38am #892428
Memphis MadnessParticipantPhil Jackson should look into Frank Vogel for the Knicks job. Vogel is a top notch coach. … I don’t think Phil should roll the dice on Steve Kerr. If Phil does roll the dice I would go with Kevin Ollie, even though he might not take that job.
0 - Posted on: Wed, 04/23/2014 - 8:38am #892539
Memphis MadnessParticipantPhil Jackson should look into Frank Vogel for the Knicks job. Vogel is a top notch coach. … I don’t think Phil should roll the dice on Steve Kerr. If Phil does roll the dice I would go with Kevin Ollie, even though he might not take that job.
0 - Posted on: Wed, 04/23/2014 - 9:27am #892459
Memphis MadnessParticipantHe’s not the guy who traded Danny Granger for Evan Turner, Gerald Green and Miles Plumlee for Luis Scola, and Kawhi Leonard for George Hill on draft night.
0 - Posted on: Wed, 04/23/2014 - 9:27am #892569
Memphis MadnessParticipantHe’s not the guy who traded Danny Granger for Evan Turner, Gerald Green and Miles Plumlee for Luis Scola, and Kawhi Leonard for George Hill on draft night.
0 - Posted on: Wed, 04/23/2014 - 10:53am #892512
GrandmamaParticipantIf they lose the series vs the Hawks he will be fired.
0 - Posted on: Wed, 04/23/2014 - 10:53am #892623
GrandmamaParticipantIf they lose the series vs the Hawks he will be fired.
0 - Posted on: Wed, 04/23/2014 - 11:55am #892546
ChoppyParticipantI personally don’t think he should be fired, but if he is I think the pistons should take a look at him. He has shown himself to be a good coach, particularly on the defensive end and can develop young players. I think he’s the type of coach the pistons need.
0 - Posted on: Wed, 04/23/2014 - 11:55am #892657
ChoppyParticipantI personally don’t think he should be fired, but if he is I think the pistons should take a look at him. He has shown himself to be a good coach, particularly on the defensive end and can develop young players. I think he’s the type of coach the pistons need.
0 - Posted on: Wed, 04/23/2014 - 12:09pm #892552
GlenTaylorSucksParticipantI don’t totally blame Vogel. I think the big mistakes were the FA and trade gambles they made for Bynum and Turner. Turns out Granger was an awesome locker room guy and fit the team a hell of a lot better. Bynum is by now well deserving of his reputation of a cancer, and though I don’t think ET has the same character issues, I think he and Lance do a lot of the same things (Lance better) and they’re struggling to fit him in.
As a Wolves fan, I would gladly take Vogel as a coach if they let him go.
0 - Posted on: Wed, 04/23/2014 - 12:09pm #892663
GlenTaylorSucksParticipantI don’t totally blame Vogel. I think the big mistakes were the FA and trade gambles they made for Bynum and Turner. Turns out Granger was an awesome locker room guy and fit the team a hell of a lot better. Bynum is by now well deserving of his reputation of a cancer, and though I don’t think ET has the same character issues, I think he and Lance do a lot of the same things (Lance better) and they’re struggling to fit him in.
As a Wolves fan, I would gladly take Vogel as a coach if they let him go.
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