Avery Bradley

I agree to a sense.

Bradley had about 5 really good games that I have seen. But I don’t wanna take him with no PG experience to learn on the fly. Russell Westbrook played some PG in his freshman(backup) and sophomore year (actually started 14 games at PG if im correct)

Lance is a 2nd rounder right now. He needs another season. He has the body and that drive but I don’t think he’s a top 20 pick. I think he needs either a good end of the season or a monster NCAA or NIT tourney games to be vaulted into the 1st round.

I see the Bucks taking him either way. He’s got Jason Terry potential in my mind. More stroke than Ellis but not as quick. I dont see him as a point in the NBA

I agree with literally everything you said wenich…Avery Bradley would be a defensive-minded role playing in the NBA. He’s essentially Royal Ivey right now..He has the ability to get better if he polishes his offense, but I don’t see him as a PG. He’s shown nothin that has proven he can be a PG.

I think he’s a boobie gibson at best. Don’t see any reason why he is ranked so high.

He has potential. He is feisty defensively. He is a willing (though unskilled) passer. He makes a lot of mistakes when he handles the ball, but he can shoot mid-range off the dribble. He has three-point range. His lateral quickness is outstanding. He is a high-character player.

He is very young still, and most of his problems are experience related. That means that all he needs is playing-time to become a better player. He makes mistakes, but I expect him to become a starter in the NBA. Coaches love players like Bradley because they set a good example for the rest of the team.

If Monta Ellis and Eric Gordon can play shooting guard, so can Avery Bradley. Bradley is already a better defender than either one of them.

I would take Bradley in the top 10.

The fact that Barnes won’t let him play PG for a Texas team who is playing poorly largely because they’re PG’s are weak tells me all I need to know about his PG skills. I wouldn’t dare take him in the top 10. Eric Gordon and Monta Ellis are, and have always been better scorers than Bradley. Bradley is just a defensive role-player who makes open shots. You can find alot of guys past the top 10 for that.

I disagree. Avery Bradley was a remarkable scorer in high school, and though that doesn’t mean he will be a great scorer on the next level, it does show you he possesses scoring skills and intincts. Eric Gordon was every bit as inconsistant of a scorer in college as Avery Bradley is now, and Gordon had to be the number one option while Bradley is more of a role player for a very good (but currently slumping) Texas team.

I said that he could be a shooting guard at the next level. He isn’t capable of playing point guard right now, but he can play effectively without the ball.

“For the first half of his only season in college before all the Kelvin Sampson shenanigans screwed up the season for IU Eric Gordon was a scoring machine. Coming out of HS he was a top 5 talent and known to be a top flight scorer. There is absolutely no comparison between EG and Avery Bradley. I respect your opinion but what kind of SG can a 6 ‘2 guy who can not create his own shot be at the next level?”

Dude, you can’t be serious…

1. Yes, Eric Gordon was a scoring machine for the first half. I said inconsistant, and inconsistant he was.

2. Eric Gordon was a top-5 talent? Really? Is that true? Well I guess you got me there. Wait a second… AVERY BRADLEY WAS THE NUMBER 1 TALENT!!!!!

3. Avery Bradley was also known as a “top flight scorer”. Read the NBADraft.net scouting report I provided in the link below.

Here’s the proof if you don’t believe me.

http://insider.espn.go.com/ncb/recruiting/tracker/espnu100?&season=2009&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fncb%2frecruiting%2ftracker%2fespnu100%3f%26season%3d2009

http://www.nbadraft.net/players/avery-bradley

Oh, and Avery Bradley can create his own shot. He just isn’t a chucker. Which is a good thing. If he wanted to, he could jack up 20 shots a game and score more points, but he has other options. Damion James, Dexter Pittman and a very deep Texas squad.

I wish his teammates would look for him more in this current Texas slump. His game is so unstable though, it’s probably an issue with confidence or experience. His team needs him to look to score more right now. It isn’t a lack of ability though.

I’m not his biggest fan, but everybody is selling him short. I know his decision-making is poor and he fumbles a lot of oppurtunities. He isn’t currently capable of playing point and his scoring is very inconsistant.

Iggy, I invite you to find me other prospects with Bradley’s defensive/shooting ability. I’ve seen him play a lot, and he is a great catch-and-shoot prospect. He moves his feet remarkably well on defense. He is willing to hit the floor, he makes 41% of his threes, and he has a lot of room to get better. And like I said before, he only needs time/experience to get better at most of his flaws.

Please make me a list. I would love to get a player like Bradley outside of the top-10.

OK. Please provide your reasoning. I would like to understand why you think he is straight up trash.

Jacob Pullen, Tweety Carter, Lawrence Westbrook, Trevon Hughes, Scotty Reynolds, Obi Muenolo are all guys that shoot at least 40% on 3’s and play outstanding defense. I ould be STUNNED if any of these players where drafted in the 1st round. How is Bradley so much better than these guys? Should they be top 10 picks too?

I already said he was a good defender and shooter, but that’s where it stops. He isn’t a good ball-handler for his size, thus is not a true scoring threat. He’s a 6’3″ shooting guard without elite scoring ability. If your an undersized SG without real scoring ability, why would he stand out in the NBA? All the HS stats be damned…That has nothing to do with anything. Most high major players averaged eye-popping scoring numbers. Alot of those same players don’t even pose that big a factor on their college teams.

Iggy – You’re lucky I haven’t scouted any of those players or I would totally refute your argument. But seriously I don’t think we are on the same page. I’m saying that Avery Bradley will get better fast and become a scoring threat soon. I think he is on a steep learning curve, because of the skills he already possesses and most of his flaws seem to come from his lack of experience. So I’m under the impression that you think he will be a catch-and-shoot defensive role-player. I think he will be better than that.

EDIT: Pssh, you edited. I’ll just take your word for it that they are all as good at defense as Bradley.

Double EDIT: QUIT EDITING!!!

He has to improve on alot of things offensively, but I don’t ever see him being more than a 4th option scorer in the NBA. Nothing about him is all that special offensively.

What makes him different from a guy like Patrick Beverley? A shooter with good defense, length, and quickness and a SG in PG’s body. Beverley was a 2nd round pick last year and he hasn’t seen action in an NBA game, with pretty much the same exact physical tools and basketball skills as Bradley.

Again, I never scouted Beverley. So I can’t say why he would be different from Bradley. That doesn’t prove you right though.

“All the HS stats be damned…That has nothing to do with anything. Most high major players averaged eye-popping scoring numbers. Alot of those same players don’t even pose that big a factor on their college teams.”

I mentioned that high school stats don’t mean anything, so I don’t know why you would feel the need to reiterate this.

what makes him different than all those players, he is probably the second best athlete at guard besides a kid named John Wall. If you dont believe me, look at his high school videos.

but secondly, I have watched some of his games this year, and the thing im most disappointed with is how he doesnt do anything without the ball. He stands around and watches everyone else play. But I hope barnes lets him loose now that texas is in a slump and see if he can really start making some noise.

Enter quinceyhodges…

Wait…

Derrick Favors is an elite athlete. Look at his high school highlights.

Now…

Enter quinceyhodges.

You said this…

“I personally don’t see him having any value at the NBA level.”

Please excuse my phrasing. I’ll switch it right away.

“Mr. “I haven’t scouted” any player except for Avery Bradley”

I really only scout first-rounders. I won’t lie and say that I’ve scouted players I haven’t. When I scout, I watch one player for the entire game. I don’t watch the ball, I watch one player. It’s very time-consuming, and since nobody is paying me, I can’t scout everybody. I am very maticulous when I scout.

I think I’m done with this little debate. You keep bringing up players I am somewhat unfamiliar with and honestly I don’t even know where you stand…

You said you agreed with everything wenich said, who said he doesn’t see Bradley having any value at the NBA level, and then you said that he is likely a 4th option.

I never said that I thought Bradley could only be a 4th option. I think he can get better.

I was saying that you were focusing on me more than the subject but then I saw your last sentence. I don’t know if you edited or if I just didn’t read it.

I wasn’t calling Iggy out. I respect Iggy, and we have been arguing over stuff like this for a long time. I was simply stating my confusion.

Ron Artest, Paul Millsap, Rajon Rondo, Jameer Nelson, JR Smith, Jason Kidd. Are these guys trash?

Avery Bradley needs some more time in college…it wouldnt hurt him…the NBA is looking at a lockout for there 2012 season, i could be wrong..so why not stay and gain some experience in the Big 12 conference…..I think alot of these kids are getting a raw deal because we all know that if the NBA wouldnt have put the rule up to where you have to spend a year in college…Bradley, Wall, Cousins and Favors would all have been in the NBA as we speak.
I remember seeing a peice on Bradley narrated by Pat Summeral when in High School..I believe he is going to be a good point guard but he is not a University of Texas PG..he picked the wrong school…with his athletism he is a point guard that can score..he should have went to UCLA where they give guards like Bradley freedom, Barnes is going to try to change his game and mess him up. Bottom line is right now we dont know what type of player he is…we know that he wont step up and take full control of a Texas team that lacks leadership at the guard position.

Rondo is trash for the record……. Anyone can play PG for the Celtics under the age of 30 and suceed. Jameer Nelson is solid the others are all great NBA players.

Fair enough. We’ll just have to wait until he plays in the NBA…

PS: Whoever took all my points, just want you to know that I own you. You barely made a dent in my mass-collection of pointy-awesomeness. I personally challenge you to take away every single point I have. If you suceed I will be like, “Wow, he proved me wrong.” However, I will only think it. It won’t say it aloud, and I certainly won’t type it.

someof ya’ll post are laughable…the one about not showing anything off the dribbleshows who ever said that hasnt watched many games since hes shown many times he can score off the dribble. does anyone know if he can play pg?..nope just like westbrook who didnt show any signs of being a pg in the nba. and who ever said he looks like a 3 man really should just cancel there account. should he go in the draft?..nope hes not ready. he would get drafted because he is good and teams tend to draft off of potential.

powerguard97 you sound very dumb right now with the comment about rondo. not sure why you hate on his skills but he’s shown plenty of times how good he is when everyone is healthy and when there best players are hurt. ..its obvious you just hate on the guy..not sure why

Quincey you’re late. Where were you when I said Favors was an elite athlete?

Russell Westbrook never was given a chance to play PG because UCLA had an All-American PG in Darren Collison ahead of him. Texas’ weakest position is PG, where Dogus Balbay has averaged 4 ppg and 4 assists, aka way below average numbers for a starter on a top 25 team. And Justin Mason, who played PG last season, has been just as bad now playing on the wing. Jai Luas has been ineffective. If there was a time to see if Bradley could play PG, it would be now. My point being, if Bradley was capable of playing PG, why hasn’t he played there this season at all when they have such poor overall guard play from their floor generals? Westbrook was never going to get to play PG unless he stayed at UCLA until his Senior year when Collison graduated.

There is a huge difference as to why Westbrook didn’t play PG until he was in the NBA, as he was behind the “Big Man on Campus” UCLA. Bradley, in contrast, is hasn’t been given a chance to play PG and that is easily the weakest spot on Texas’ team. Something about that tells me that he isn’t a PG at all. If he had the PG skills that you guys are saying he does have, I honestly don’t see why their starting lineup doesn’t look like this:

PG: Avery Bradley
SG: Jordan Hamilton
SF: Damion James
PF: Gary Johnson
C: Dexter Pittman

That would be a great lineup…..if Bradley was a PG.

“If he had the PG skills that you guys are saying he does have”

I really hope you weren’t referring to me. In fact, looking back, I don’t see anybody saying he has point guard skills…

 "if Bradley was capable of playing PG, why hasn’t he played there this season at all when they have such poor overall guard play from their floor generals?"

Iggy- to answer your question….the Coach  doesn’t know what he is doing. Clearly he has no idea who to play & where to play them & for how many minutes. 

"Jai Luas has been ineffective."  

He is more effective than Balbay & Brown.  Lucas shoots a higher FG% & 3 point % than any guard on the team.  His defense isn’t that great but neither are any of the other Texas guards except Bradley. He deserves more than 10 minutes of playing time a game.  Poor coaching.

Texas needs to cut down on their gurad rotation.  Right now they play 5 guards who all get 10-28 minutes per game of playing time.  Hard to get into the flow of the game playing like that. Hard to develop chemistry when you are constantly chaging lineups.  Personally I would like to see the Coach make a decesion and pick 3 guards to play the majority of the game.  1 guard should never play. 1 guard is there just for depth concerns in case foul trouble is an issue.  No need to play Lucas, Brown, Balbay, Mason, & Bradley. 

I’m not saying Bradley can play PG (I have no idea if he can really) but…I would like to see him get a shot at it.

I would also like to see Lucas start at PG to see how things go.   

Balbay isn’t getting the job done.  Brown is just a chucker who hurts the team by shooting bricks.  

Honestly if it was up to me this would be my starting lineup:

PG- Lucas, SG- Bradley, SF- Mason, PF- James, C-Pittman 

First off the bench: Hamilton, Gary Johnson 

Balbay rarely plays, Brown never plays 

he plays sg because thats what he is best at for them. balbay is the point because he is a very good defender. just because you dont play pg doesnt mean you cant play it iggy. in the past college was full of guys who could play point but they were better suited for the team as a sg. tru he isnt a pg now but youre talking like he cant become a pg. you dont have to play it all youre life to become a pg. you have enough basketball knowledge to know that. if we are gonna go by how a player is playing right now as far as the future then favors isnt a first round pick and neither is bledsoe or many other first year players because youre basically saying bradley is what he is and cant get better. alos yout have to add some players in the nba …a.randolph cant play sf then since hes playing pf most of the time. t.young for the sixers is more of a pf then a sf etc. just because a player doesnt play a position doesnt mean he cant play it. also dexter strickland must not be starting matterial as a pg since he cant take the spot from drew…..see how i make zero sense if i went by that logic. and im not commenting on favors being a elite athlete because he isnt

I have a drinking game…

Everytime quinceyhodges mentions Derrick Favors, you take a drink.

*This drinking game is sponsered by The Betty Ford Center for Rehabilitation.

how about add john wall to it. or is it just for players who arent living up to expectations that you like?

It was a joke.

I don’t really like Derrick Favors. What makes you think I do? I don’t like his court-demeanor.

Jai Lucas has been very bad this season every game I’ve seen him play this season. He played his best (versus a decent team) against UConn, a game where he had 7 points, 3 assists, and 2 turnovers in 21 minutes. Not the stuff legends are made of.

He hasn’t had 1 game were he’s gotten more than 3 assists.

The reason he shoots a better percentage than all of Texas PG’s is because he only attempts 1.5 a game, 5 of his 11 3’s this season came against Gardner Webb, Balbay is a terrible shooter, and Brown shoots 3’s at a higher clip and at with no discretion. I wouldn’t even bring up Lucas’ stats because he plays so little and has an extremely small sample size ( 2.7 fg attempts a game, 1.5 are 3’s). He is a better shooter than Balbay and Mason, but he isn’t playing better than either one at all. And that is really saying something.

I stand behind everything I say about Lucas this season, I liked him at Florida and he was an effective player for them, but this season for Texas has been terrible for him. It really does show whenever he plays.

I think Bradley will be fine I think the coach is trying to get him and hamilton to come back next year because its no way you dont start both guys. like somebody else start Lucas with Bradley, Hamilton, James, Pittman. This would give them supreme athletic ability and also a team that had very few weaknesses. The main thing is to shorten up the rotation because guy cant get the fill of the game too many diff lineups. Thats whats killing Texas as a whole right now. I feel after niext year everybody will see what all the hype was about

He doesnt have to be a true point because in the nba there are few true points and you can pair him with a big guard that can run the offense and he can slash and do what he does best. Nobody said he couldnt guard the other teams point which he would be great at.

Iggy- ^ Hard to get more than 3 assists when you only play 10 minutes a game. 

Lucas shoots 50% from 3 point range this season.  You can’t say it is just because he doesn’t shoot much haha that is ludicrous.  He shot better than Balbay & Brown when he was at Florida too.  

He is a better shooter than Balbay, Brown, & Mason…the stats prove it.  You’re argument is flawed if you are basing on the fact that he doesn’t take many shots.  Stop making lame excuses.

How can you say he was effective at Florida but not at Texas? Haha that makes no sense.  He has played more efficiently at TEXAS 

He played more. I would think if he played was better than Balbay, Mason, or even Brown he’d play more. He has made 11/22 shots from 3, 5 of which came against 1 team (Gardner-Webb, he was 5/7). I know he’s a better shooter than Balbay and Mason and statistically Brown, but that’s only 1 part of the game, and he’s done nothing else better than them. His stats are skewed drastically because he takes a very small amount of shots. That’s basic statistics.

Saying that his extremely limited sample size of shots makes him a great shooter is like me saying that Gary Johnson is a great shooter because he makes 100% of his 3 point shots, which he actually does. Is Gary Johnson a better shooter than Jai Lucas since he shoots 100% compared to Lucas’ 50%?

HAHA

I have a big enough sample size.

Look at his stats from a full season at Florida… 46% FG, 43% 3 point

Guess what?  Once again that is better than Balbay, Mason, & Brown 

double post

As I said before, he shoots better than Balbay, Mason and statistically Brown, but that is one part of the game. He’s done nothing else better than any other of those guys.

And if I liked Lucas at Florid more than at Texas, that does make since. He’s shooting 3’s and FG’s at a higher clip, but he didn’t get called for traveling, turn the ball over and make the bone-head plays he’s making this season at Texas. Players regress and progress, so it’s not like I didn’t make since by saying that I liked him more last year than this year.

You just can’t go on with your debate as if I didn’t put in a picture of Chewbacca sexually harrassing Princess Leia…

Acknowledge the wookie….

i can see both points but i cant say hes degressed. when you are playing less minutes it can sometimes make it seem like you have degressed since if you dont play well it can make you look very bad but it can also make you look very good or even great if you play well. a player tends to look better when they play more minutes but worst when they play less mibnues. not in all cases but in most

Lucas has a better Ast/TO ratio than any guard on the team except for Balbay.  Talk about crazy turnovers & not many assists…you got the wrong person…better look at J Brown.  

Lucas has played more effeciently at Texas.  All you have to do is look at the #’s.  He is shooting better %’s from the field & 3 point line at Texas than he did at Florida, his Ast/TO ratio is better at Texas than it was at Florida,  he is scoring more points per minute at Texas than he did at Florida…………..Liking him at Florida but not at Texas makes absolutely zero sense.

Coach Rick Barnes isn’t doing a very good job coaching this team at the moment.

to be honest i cant blame the coahc. i think hes doing a good job. i think its the players. too many times the coach gets all the blame but they arent the ones missing easy shots or letting a guy drive right pass tghem. some of the players just arent stepping up like they were earlier in the season and one of them is pittman. and although i like jordan and think he has worlds of potential i dont think ive ever seen a guy who looks to shoot every single time he touchs the ball

“Coach Rick Barnes isn’t doing a very good job coaching this team at the moment.”
-Yea….Jai Lucas is the game-breaker. Excuse me. No.

“Lucas has a better Ast/TO ratio than any guard on the team except for Balbay. ”

-Whoopdy-doo, there are only 3 PG’s on the team since Mason has played the wing this whole season except for the 4 games Varez Ward was playing in before his injury.

Lucas’ stats are better than when he played at Florida because he plays such a limited amount of minutes compared to then. I could find plenty of examples besides the Gray Johnson one I used a minute ago as to why you can have skewed stats when you have a small sample of something.

if we are gonna go by what he does at limited minutes at the point then shoulsdnt bledsoe fall under the same standards?..as well as dexter strickland and peyton silvia?…i mention those because they also dont play alot of minutes at the pg position

All 3 of them are more productive than Jai Lucas has been this season

i agree some have been but if we use the stats with jai we have to do it with both and bledsoes stats say he’s not close to being a good pg( his ast to turnover ratio is horrible) as well as dexter and his below average numbers. to be honest none are worth talking about as far as being point guards

Your right, I don’t think any of them are polish enough or productive enough to be anything more than a college player right now. All of them need to work on their games before being pro players. Bledsoe and Avery Bradley are in about the same boat to me. Neither is ready for the NBA, and they need to show the ability to play PG. Bledsoe would probably declare for the draft (for better or worse) if Brandon Knight signed with Kentucky though, whereas Bradley comes off as someone that knows he needs to return. But who knows for sure?

i agree although to me bradley is better then bledsoe. some say well its because he has wall and thats why he doesnt play better but that same arguement could be made for why he does play as well as he does since teams are too worried about stopping the other 3. i think most would have bradley over bledsoe also by looking at a coupel of mock drafts. i do think both need to come back to college. bradley has shown hes a better sg then bledsoe but both need to prove they can be a nba pg. both have the potential to do so though

It’s a draw for me between who’s better to me. Bradley is more efficient, but Bledsoe is more explosive and he seems to have more upside to me. But it’s really about prefernce to me, they both bring the same exact things to the table.

Nothing to support your opinion…..pretty bad

I give facts

People give excuses

I’m not hearing it 

Never said Lucas was a game breaker.  Do I think he deserves more minutes? Yes. I’ve already given the reasons why.  Just my opinion, its cool if people disagree.

Do I think Coach Barnes is doing a poor job? Yes. No chemistry. He has too many players playing the wrong amount of minutes.  Just my opinion, its cool if other people think he is doing a good job. I would like to hear the reason why you think that though.

Out of all the Texas guards do I think Lucas is the best shooter on the team? Yes (the #’s support that).  That is a fact.

Iggy don’t back peddle…. You said Lucas shoots better than all the other Texas guards because he takes less shots.  That simply isn’t true. He shot higher %’s than all of them throughout his entire college career. There is no denying that.  IT is a fact.  Look at the #’s thoughout all the players’ careers.  We are talking about 100’s of shots.  The small sample size argument doesn’t come into play here.  

On to the next point Iggy you said he was effective at Florida but terrible at Texas.  That makes absolutely 0 sense.  I’m sorry but you are way off base.  I’ve already given you the #’s. It is a fact..there is no way you can say Lucas was effective at Florida but terrible at Texas hahahahha what a joke.  Go Look at the #’s…it is pretty obvious.

The reason he played more at Florida is because Florida wasn’t a top 25 team.  Texas is a top 15 team with tons of depth.  That Florida team wasn’t nearly as good as this Texas team.  That Florida team went to the NIT. 

bradley brings better defense while being taller and being the higher leaper. he’s shown hes a better scorer against better comp( compare each player in big games)

Tons of depth?? Texas has Balbay and J’Covan Brown…..Florida had Nick Calathes and Walter Hodge. Florida backcourt> Texas’ backcourt. So all that “Texas is number 15 and Florida went to the NIT” crap is irrrelevant.

If he could get as much PT as he did with an NBA draft pick in Calathes and an above average college guard like Hodge, why hasn’t he gotten any other the time with a weaker backcourt at Texas? He’s regressed in some way, because there is no way that if he was as solid a player as he was with Florida, he’d be struggling to even see 10 mpg playing in the weaker backcourt at Texas.

I stated that he’s a better shooter than Texas’ guards, which I know he is (even though I think Brown is at least just as good, but not statistically, so I included him too). I just think that his 3 point percentages are skewed because he has a small sample size. Not that I think he’s a worse shooter than Balbay or Mason or Brown. I have a hard time believing that he’s a 50% shooter if he took the same amount of shots or even close to the amount he did at Florida.

I mean, it’s fairly obvious that Lucas is ineffective in game situations for the most part, if you watch Texas play. I don’t think you would say he deserves PT if you’ve watched him play this season as much as I have. He has played at least decent in only 1 game I’ve seen this season, and that was against UConn. The rest have been terrible. I’ve seen Texas play about 10 times this year too, at least. I think you should watch him play more and look past reading his stats to see if he is really a better player than his other backcourt mates.

I’ve watched Texas a ton this year.  I also watched nearly every Florida game (I’m a Florida fan) the year Lucas played for them as well as watching him in person. Overall he is basically the same player as he was at Florida (even though the stats support he is more effecient now).

Lucas played off the ball some at Florida. He transfered because. Calathes was the PG & Lucas wanted to be the main PG. Walter Hodge isn’t a PG.

More excuses….

If you are going to count Walter Hodge than you have to count Mason & Bradley.

Texas has a better team than Florida did…that is a fact.  Texas had more depth…that is a fact.

I’m done with this nonsense. 

Now if you are a 5-11 guard…what team are you going to have a harder time finding playing time for?….

Team A- top 15 team, with 4 guards….Bradley, Brown, Balbay, Mason

or

Team B- not even a top 35 team, with 2 guards…Calathes, Hodge

Pretty obvious why Lucas played more at Florida.   

its clear that this texas team is better more talented then that florida team

If you thought he is terrilbe now at Texas than you have to say he was terrible at Florida as well.

His stats at Florida:

30 minutes, 8.5 points, 1.7 rebounds, 2.3 assists, 1.6 TO, 1.4 A/T ratio, .5 steal, 0 blocks, 46% FG, 71% FT, 43% 3 point

His stats at Texas: 

10.8 minutes, 3.6 points, .5 rebound, 1.7 assists, .9 TO, 1.92 A/T ratio, .1 steal, .1 block, 47.5% FG, 71% FT, 50% 3 point

Easy, he’s worse now because he plays about 3 times less minutes, and averages less ppg, assists, rebs, stls. None of Texas’ guards are anywhere near as good as Walter Hodge or Nick Calathes, and Lucas played more with them. Quality over quantity. If your really that good and haven’t taken some sort of step back, I would think that he would be able to play alot of minutes for Texas at the PG spot, when it’s their weakest spot on the team by far. Especially playing guard for a team with an NBA player at the same spot.

It doesn’t matter if Texas has more PG if all of them aren’t real good, or if Texas had a better team than Florida. Yes, Texas’ team is better but there backcourt isn’t. So the fact that he is playing far less is troubling in some way or another.

he has worst stats but you cant say hes a worst player. if wall went to kansas instead of kentucky im sure ghis stats would go down right now but that wouldnt mean he is a worst player. i think youre looking at texas pg position more as who scores then anything else. balby plays the minutes he plays because he is a very very good defender. i can tell you are just looking at how he is on offense. then you have jacovn brown who is bigger and a better offensive player then lucas is. nick is better but you have to remeber they also played him together with jai alot. you cant play balbay and jai together

We are talking about that 2007-2008 Florida team.

Walter Hodge was a Junior.  Nick Calathes was a Freshman.  Hodge never got drafted. Calathes was a mid 2nd round pick after his Soph. year.

Look at the Texas backcourt now… Avery Bradley is a Freshman. J’Covan Brown is a Freshman. Dogus Balbay is a Jr. Justin Mason is a Senior. 

Bradley will get drafted higher than Calathes did & it probably isn’t close. 

Texas backcourt > Florida backcourt

Once again it is easy to see why Lucas played more at Florida.

Iggy- you are clueless about PER… You really don’t know how to look at #’s. Your logic explaining how Lucas was effective at Florida but terrible at Texas is extremely flawed & quite frankly humorous. 

You honestly think Texas would be a better team IF you replaced Balbay, Mason, Bradley, & Brown with a Freshman Nick Calathes & a Junior Walter Hodge?  No Way

i forgot that nick was a freshman..

If his stats went down dramatically…am I missing something. PER is something I really don’t care to learn anyway. I’d much rather watch a game than look at stats of what a player can do if he played 48 minutes and all that kind of unreal stuff. Maybe if I wanted to be a Fantasy Basketball guru or something I’d try to figure that out.

The laughable thing is that you keep bringing up stats and not bringing up that when Lucas steps on the floor in real life, he is not an effective player for Texas. I really am convinced you haven’t watched Lucas play much if at all for Texas, because he’s done nothing at all for him to justify him playing more than any of the Texas guards he’s currently behind. And that’s what it all comes down to….PER or not to PER.

but if youre minutes go down dramatically then doesnt it make sense for youre stats to go down dramatically? i dont think anyone can put up the same stats when they go from 30min a game to 10 min a game. come on now. lucas isnt a great or very good player so of course he’s not gonna be able to put up great numbers in limited minutes. most players cant but the ones who are real good or great can still put up solid numbers with limited time. i agree i dont see any reason to play him more. that doesnt mean hes gotten worst or is a bad player. are you sure you never go by per? it seems we have had discussion where you have said a player or 2 would do better if they were given more time. i do think one was dexter strickland

Saying that Strickland needed more time had nothing to do with PER, it had to do with me thinking Larry Drew wasn’t a very good starting PG. I said Strickland was a better natural scorer than Larry Drew, but you and Gatorheels said that Drew’s stats said otherwise. I said what I said without looking at stats, that was you 2 saying that his stats didn’t go with what I was saying.

i remeber you mentioning per though when talking about strickland. think you said if he had more minute sor campared it to larry or something like that. at any rate i put stricklnad in the same boat with lucas and that boats name is “irrelavent ” because thats what both players are in the grad scheme of things right now. lucas being even less since hes older. i dont even know why ya’ll are even arguing about a 3rd string pg. i could see if he was a freshman or had nba talent

I have literally NEVER even typed the word “PER” until this topic for as long as I’ve had an account on here. I don’t even know how it works. I did say that if given Drew’s minutes, Strickland would average more points. But I didn’t say he has a higher PER or whatever.

thats all per is… what a player might average if they play more minutes. you didnt have to say per its the same thing

http://www.basketball-reference.com/about/per.html

Looks like it involves other things besides just points.

yeaqh it involves other stats but its still per when you mention some ones points if they got more time. its pretty simple

Going from effective to terrible is a really dumb thing to say.  I have a hard time believing Lucas is terrible now after working on his game a year & a half since his days at Florida.  Players don’t just all of a sudden go from effective to terrible at this age.  

I’ve already said why he plays less now than he did at Florida…everybody can see that.  So obviously his stats will be down. 

So with your logic since Lucas scores 3.9 less points, 1.2 less rebounds, .6 less assist, .4 less steal while playing 20 less minutes he is no longer an effective player but he is terrible.  Think about that. 

Plus if you are going to use that logic than you forgot to mention that Lucas is shooting a higher FG% now, higher 3 point % now, less turnovers, more blocks, & a higher A/TO ratio than he did at Florida…Hello 

His stats show that he is more EFFECTIVE/EFFICIENT now at TEXAS than at FLORIDA…that is a FACT.  Get over it

Lucas plays for a MUCH BETTER team now, that has MUCH MORE DEPTH in the backcourt, & overall is a more TALENTED backcourt.  

Who cares if he only plays 10 minutes a game as long as he is effective.  He has been effective. I think a lot of teams would like a guard to come in the game & have a really high A/TO ratio & shoot great %’s. Out of the 5 guards Texas plays (Lucas, Balbay, Brown, Bradley, Mason)…Lucas has the 2nd highest A/TO ratio, the highest FG%, the highest 3 point %, 2nd highest free throw %.

One of the reasons Texas is struggling is because J’Covan Brown has a terrible A/TO ratio for a small guard.  And he is shooting terrible. Shooting 38% FG & 28% 3 point while shooting as many shots as he is, is Not helping the team. 

Another reason Texas is struggling is because BOGUS..I mean Dogus Balbay is not a threat to shoot at all.  Teams can just sag off of him on defense because he can’t shoot.  It is basically like Texas is playing 4 on 5 when he is in the game.  He can’t score.  Lucas can & would score more than Balbay (Lucas proved at Florida he could score more than 4 points a game like Balbay is scoring now) .  Lucas would make the defense play honest. 

You win games by being effecient.  

Iggy- Don’t take this personal man.  It really isn’t that serious. You know I respect your opinion. I give you credit when credit is due.  I’m just trying to get you to look at things from a different angle…maybe you will learn something.  That is what we are all here for.

You are probably the best person on this site as far as predicting the winner of games. You also talked about Wesley Witherspoon before anybody else.  He is starting to climb up draft boards. Memphis is going to be scary good next season ha. You’ve been right about a lot of prospects.

I’m not taking it personal at all lol. I’m just going by what I see when Lucas plays for Texas as opposed to how he plays now. I haven’t seen anything about him at all this season where he deserves an increase in PT. I’m not big on looking up stats unless a player is really playing outstanding and I want to see how he’s doing. He is a better shooter than Texas’ other guards for sure, no doubt, but I don’t think he’s been a better player than any of those guys this season. That’s just me. But I don’t really care that much either. I like Lucas, but he’s not doing very well to me this season. I didn’t think anybody did lol, but hey, to each its own I guess.