share

where does rondo rank among pg's today?

billyk
Registered User
Joined: 12/05/2008
Posts: 1017
Points: 546
Offline
Rondo impacts the game very

Rondo impacts the game very similar to Jason Kidd in his prime and its obvious Rondo is an elite PG... He cant be that much of a liability at the end of games if he was the starting point guard on a championship team, he has proven that he can raise his game at crunch time...

butidonthavemoney
butidonthavemoney's picture
Registered User
Joined: 02/26/2009
Posts: 6178
Points: 9878
Offline
IB

If Rondo is a role-player than he is the best role player in the NBA.

(Are the terms "complementary player" and "role player" synonymous?")

RUDEBOY_
RUDEBOY_'s picture
Registered User
Joined: 04/09/2010
Posts: 7524
Points: 13813
Offline
Rose have the upper body

Rose have the upper body strength,timing and leaping ability to improve his rebounding numbers..he's still evolving as a player..

Steroid
Steroid's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/13/2010
Posts: 842
Points: 1052
Offline
I think Rondo is the better

I think Rondo is the better PG and he is better at every facet of the game than Rose except for scoring, like some people have mentioned. I think people underestimate how Rondo impacts a game just because he isn't a prolific scorer. Rondo may not be able to score great, but he did carry the Celtics in the playoffs last year. Being able to impact a game without having to score mass points is more impactful than taking a lot of shots and scoring, in my opinion.

IndianaBasketball
IndianaBasketball's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/09/2009
Posts: 12827
Points: 24570
Offline
Kevin Garnett. Paul Pierce.

Kevin Garnett. Paul Pierce. Ray Allen. That's three players headed for the Hall of Fame. Can anyone name another point guard that's had that luxury?

Rondo's a great point guard and he's earned my respect, but I'm not going to ignore how much the Big Three have helped his career.

He's a perfect fit for the Celtics, but I don't think he could be that main guy and carry a team the entire regular season year after year. IF I had to build my team around a point guard, I'm not picking Rajon Rondo.

Im Your Father
Im Your Father's picture
Registered User
Joined: 06/06/2009
Posts: 1231
Points: 1696
Offline
That's pretty much my

That's pretty much my thoughts exactly.

The Celtics lineup fits Rondo perfectly, it masks his weaknesses pretty well, and it allows him to play to his strengths. But, I think that there are other point guards who could do the same thing. I think both Paul and Williams would probably have even more success in the Celtics offense. I don't think that Rondo would do nearly as well in their positions. Any team that is relying on Rondo to be their go to scorer is going to have trouble.

IndianaBasketball
IndianaBasketball's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/09/2009
Posts: 12827
Points: 24570
Offline
And @JNixon-Iggy9Not to call

And @JNixon-Iggy9

Not to call you out at all (I have to say this now before I question something since some people on the site think I have "personal" vendettas against them), but I'm confused... You had Rose ranked above Rondo on your top 50 list, but not on your top point guard list. What's the difference?

mj23mj23bestever
Registered User
Joined: 09/29/2010
Posts: 1081
Points: 361
Offline
heres mine

1 paul 2 dwill 3 nash 4 rondo 5 rose i magine nash wiht boston hed get 15 to 20 assists every game and i barely put rose over west brook

Mr.Knick 32
Mr.Knick 32's picture
Registered User
Joined: 02/17/2010
Posts: 4648
Points: -72
Offline
So, your building a team with

So, your building a team with Derrick Rose?

Let me ask you this, do you think Derrick Rose can win a title as a #1 guy? I ask because that what he has to be in the NBA today. Rondo gives you the luxary of another rebounder, a elite defender, a passer and he doesn't force shots.

IndianaBasketball
IndianaBasketball's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/09/2009
Posts: 12827
Points: 24570
Offline
I wouldn't build my team

I wouldn't build my team around a point guard, BUT IF I had to... I'd build my team around Rose instead of Rondo. I think that's a no brainer.

Mr.Knick 32
Mr.Knick 32's picture
Registered User
Joined: 02/17/2010
Posts: 4648
Points: -72
Offline
I still don't understand why.

I still don't understand why. I need to understand are you basing this more on his upside?

We seen the breakdown, he's not the better player. Scorer? Yes but in the NBA where the point guard doesn't have to score alot usually win titles: Why Rose over Rondo?

Steroid
Steroid's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/13/2010
Posts: 842
Points: 1052
Offline
The whole thing about having

The whole thing about having KG, Paul, and Allen as team mates masks his weaknesses is moot, and it is farfetched to say that he wouldn't have success without them. For argument's sake, that is like saying the main reason D. Rose scores a lot is because the bulls have no team offense right now. He wouldn't score nearly as much as he does right now if he had another proven scorer on his team or a better team. The fact that D. Rose scores a lot masks his weakness, which is his playmaking ability, so he has to carry the load without worrying about getting others the ball much.

Btw, isn't that a PG's main responsibility: to get others involved? For all we know, Rondo could make a team full of good players look like all-stars with his playmaking ability. A PG can carry a team for moments, but a PG, alone, won't win you a championship. The difference is Rondo will play well with a team full of high caliber players. If you put D. Rose on a championship caliber team like Rondo is playing with, I HIGHLY DOUBT that he could keep all of them happy and involved. Rondo does a lot of work for the Celtics that is underrated or unappreciated from a TEAM aspect and not an INDIVIDUAL aspect.

IndianaBasketball
IndianaBasketball's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/09/2009
Posts: 12827
Points: 24570
Offline
This just isn't that

This just isn't that difficult for me.

I'm not building my franchise around Rajon Rondo over Derrick Rose (IF I had to choose a point guard, which I wouldn't). I wouldn't build my team around a player who couldn't score the basketball. It's that simple. Rondo is horrible at every single last facet of shooting. Without great teammates (and the defense keying in on him) I think he'd struggle tremendously. He has benefited from the respect teams show KG, Pierce and Allen. Deron Williams hasn't had that. Chris Paul hasn't had that. Rose hasn't had that.

And I'm tired of people acting like Derrick Rose can't pass or get his teammates involved. He's not as great of a passer as Rondo, but let's kill this notion that he can't pass. Rose is respectable at every facet of the game, while being an unbelievable scorer.

Mr.Knick 32
Mr.Knick 32's picture
Registered User
Joined: 02/17/2010
Posts: 4648
Points: -72
Offline
Derrick Rose never averaged 7

Derrick Rose never averaged 7 assists in a season, he's a average defender and is not a premier shooter.

I'm not building a team around Rondo either. I feel it's easier to build around Rondo then Rose though.

RUDEBOY_
RUDEBOY_'s picture
Registered User
Joined: 04/09/2010
Posts: 7524
Points: 13813
Offline
I thought Rondo not making

I thought Rondo not making TEAM USA would prove to people he have other holes in his game besides not being a good shooter....

Mr.Knick 32
Mr.Knick 32's picture
Registered User
Joined: 02/17/2010
Posts: 4648
Points: -72
Offline
I thought Rondo not making

I thought Rondo not making TEAM USA would prove to people he have other holes in his game besides not being a good shooter....

Like what since you know them..... Tell us what they are.

marcusfizer21
marcusfizer21's picture
Registered User
Joined: 06/09/2009
Posts: 2570
Points: 4775
Offline
can I get into this

Derrick Rose has always been an unselfish player... Yes, he averaged less than 7 apg in his first two seasons.. I watched him play more often and have come to conclude that his teammates are the problem... He creates for his team but guys like Deng, Johnson, Hinrich, they could not knock their shots down... That's why had Ben Gordon got another extension for the Bulls, I think he would complement Rose' game a little bit better.. He would have upped his average by a little bit although I don't think Rose will ever average more than 9 or 8 a game... He's a very good playmaker than people give him credit for... That's because he has come to realize last season that he NEEDS to be an Allen Iverson now for Chicago rather than become a Jason Kidd type... He realized that his team was winning when he scores more.. I saw his early games last season and he looked really passive, nevermind the sprained ankle, he seems to defer to his "un" reliable teammates who doesn't have that takeover mentality...

This could be the year where DRose could prove that he's a playmaker now that he's got some shooters, slashers and ESPECIALLY an offensive low post presence... If he doesn't come out impressive in all of your eyes, then I'll say I'm wrong about Rose...

Steroid
Steroid's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/13/2010
Posts: 842
Points: 1052
Offline
Of course Rose can pass. Any

Of course Rose can pass. Any starting PG in the NBA should have some type of passing ability, but he is the only "top tier" PG whose passing skill is lacking compared to the other top tier PGs. His passing is slightly above average for a NBA PG. Even Wall's playmaking is above Rose's right now, and Wall, supposedly, is the same type of PG Rose is. There is no denying that. I agree that KG, Allen, and Paul have helped Rondo become a better player, but these guys are past their primes, and KG is a shell of his former self. He was bullied around last year in the finals. And really, the only legitimate guy on their team who can get their shot by themself is Paul. Rondo makes this team work.

And really we just agreed on something in your first statement: "I'm not building my franchise around Rajon Rondo over Derrick Rose (IF I had to choose a point guard, which I wouldn't)." There have been a lot of great PGs who never won championships. A PG can't carry a team, and that is why I wouldn't even bother picking a PG who looks to score first.

Mr.Knick 32
Mr.Knick 32's picture
Registered User
Joined: 02/17/2010
Posts: 4648
Points: -72
Offline
Last real PG's to lead there

Last real PG's to lead there teams to a title

Chauncey Billups and Isiah Thomas

IndianaBasketball
IndianaBasketball's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/09/2009
Posts: 12827
Points: 24570
Offline
"Derrick Rose never averaged

"Derrick Rose never averaged 7 assists in a season, he's a average defender and is not a premier shooter."

This is only his third season in the league. He's not an elite passer, but he hasn't had the best teammates either. He's still averaging over 6 per game for his career. He should average at least 7 this season.

He's not a great defender, but he's respectable. He's still improving there. Was LeBron James as good of a defender during his third season as he is now?

What's your definition of a premier shooter? Kyle Korver? Jason Kapono? Kevin Durant? I mean, not everybody can be a premier shooter. However, Rose knocks that mid-range jumper down consistently and comfortably. He's even gaining confidence in his three-pointer.

JNixon
JNixon's picture
Registered User
Joined: 04/14/2009
Posts: 12962
Points: 11539
Offline
"Not to call you out at all

"Not to call you out at all (I have to say this now before I question something since some people on the site think I have "personal" vendettas against them), but I'm confused... You had Rose ranked above Rondo on your top 50 list, but not on your top point guard list. What's the difference?"

For one, my list was a player list as opposed to this being a PG list. I think Rose is a more dominant player than Rondo is. Not a better PG though. Rondo is a better PG than Derrick Rose, but Rose is a more dominant player.

marcusfizer21
marcusfizer21's picture
Registered User
Joined: 06/09/2009
Posts: 2570
Points: 4775
Offline
to answer that question for tezo
LBJ was an average defender in his first few years... But during his 5th-6th season he has started to show how hard he worked on defense and he has improved dramatically... I think that was the time he finally won MVP...
Mr.Knick 32
Mr.Knick 32's picture
Registered User
Joined: 02/17/2010
Posts: 4648
Points: -72
Offline
Yes, this is his 3rd year in

Yes, this is his 3rd year in the L but your putting him up there like he lit the world on fire. He's not a elite playmaker and honestly, I think his ceiling is 8apg at the most.

He's not a respectable defender either. He's a average defender. He also doesn't get steals. So he is just a average defender.

A perimeter shooter is someone who's respectable from the perimeter. He is not. I seen both his game this season AND his last two seasons, he gets most his baskets from the slashing ability he possesses. He also doesn't get to the line alot ( He averaged 3.1 and 4.3 FTA his 1st two seasons)

So I ask again....right now. Other then scoring: How is Rose better then Rondo?

Hale
Hale's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/08/2009
Posts: 5956
Points: 12848
Offline
In my opinion, Rose is a

In my opinion, Rose is a better player (not pg) then Rondo. Also he would be the one you build a team around over Rondo because typically your best player has to be able to be a top scoring option which Rose is and Rondo is not. Rondo with a bunch of role players doesn't seem like they would go far, as he needs scorers around him and I believe Rose would take them a little farther because he can be that go to scorer in big situations. I just don't see how Rondo could take a team like say the T-Wolves or Suns w/o Nash very far. Rose imo is definitely the better player to build a team around.

Grandmama
Grandmama's picture
Registered User
Joined: 09/20/2009
Posts: 2237
Points: 4308
Offline
"For one, my list was a

an ape scratching his head

"For one, my list was a player list as opposed to this being a PG list. I think Rose is a more dominant player than Rondo is. Not a better PG though. Rondo is a better PG than Derrick Rose, but Rose is a more dominant player."

huh?

Mr.Knick 32
Mr.Knick 32's picture
Registered User
Joined: 02/17/2010
Posts: 4648
Points: -72
Offline
In my opinion, Rose is a

In my opinion, Rose is a better player (not pg) then Rondo. Also he would be the one you build a team around over Rondo because typically your best player has to be able to be a top scoring option which Rose is and Rondo is not

So you're saying you'd build around Rose even though in the last 21 years, 2 teams won titles with a point guard as thier best player?

Mr.Knick 32
Mr.Knick 32's picture
Registered User
Joined: 02/17/2010
Posts: 4648
Points: -72
Offline
NOT TO MENTION: RONDO WOULD

NOT TO MENTION: RONDO WOULD HAVE BEEN FINALS MVP HAD BOSTON WON THE TITLE LAST YEAR.

Hale
Hale's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/08/2009
Posts: 5956
Points: 12848
Offline
No you're misunderstanding.

No you're misunderstanding. I'm not saying Rose is a great number option. I wouldn't want to build my team solely around him, I just think that he is the better option of the two to build a team around.

billyk
Registered User
Joined: 12/05/2008
Posts: 1017
Points: 546
Offline
Rose has a above average mid

Rose has a above average mid range and i think he is an ok defender... I never liked Rondo but, he is a gamer his swagger on the court and his the uncanny ability to be a dominant player without scoring is what makes him so unique.. Rondo has performed at a championsip level, but Rose has also proven he can take his game up another notch... You can make a logical debate for either player...

The Scare Crow ...
Registered User
Joined: 04/17/2010
Posts: 3185
Points: 1004
Offline
I'm not readin a million post...who's winning...

somebody has to have a problem with some body in this debate...Is this Rondo/Rose...Rose/Westbrook...Rondo/Westbrook...or a all out slug fest for Best Point Guard...I'll take a Rondo all day and night...Westbrook is a\looking like he's on a mission and Rose is just so Rosey.....

The Scare Crow ...
Registered User
Joined: 04/17/2010
Posts: 3185
Points: 1004
Offline
are D Will and Paul really even the best 2 point guards any more

Because I'm not sold on that whole 2 man race between D.Will and Paul...I think it's a 5 guy scrum and 15 other guys that can take it up a notch if they know whats good for them...

leppy
Registered User
Joined: 05/08/2009
Posts: 214
Points: 89
Offline
it goes

williams

paul

rose

rondo

by the end of the season

rose

williams

paul

westbrook

rondo

RSS: Syndicate content