Jeff Green isnt a banger but all his points dont come form the outside
Im tryna think who The pistons had as a post presense when they had joe dumars and zeke.
I know the bulls didnt have much of a post presence after Grant left
KG doesnt back you down and score hes a midrange, post up turn around jump shooter
Ibaka can turn into that post banger/defender and he can already score. Yet another Big who is 4,5 years from entering his prime
No Orlando couldnt win because the lakers are better. Chicago won it with out no offensive post guy
Anbother great thing is we have no idea what OKC can and cant win in the future with the roster they have. Just guessing from what we FEEL they can or can't do
I see what your saying but I just don't agree and I don't really have much else to say on the subject. Final Thoughs then I'm Done: OKC will never win a championship with Green at PF because he doesn't score inside and can't defend high tier PF's. His natural position is SF but since OKC is stacked at the 1,2, and 3 there is no room for Green and since he's their best trading chip they need to move him to get a legit PF or C to move Ibaka to PF.
Disagreed because he doesnt give up more then the players average when he is checking a power forward so thats false and all his shots arent jumpers
Thunder need to keep Jeff Green as a sixth man player, he could be great at that role for a contender and with a big impact ala Lamar Odom in the Lakers.
i do like that idea kobyz that or just slet the team develop since they are all a good 3 years from there prime years on average. Dont know what they have in cole and ibaka yet
Just like when people were saying trade Hibbert. Let the bigs develop first i know the pacers are glad they didnt listen to some fans. OKC seems to be doing the same
except Hibbert is a true Center.
Green as a sixth man would be good in general, but you can't be paying a guy that much money to come off the bench when you can use that money to better your starting five.
Im talking about letting cole and Ibaka develop instead of trading green for one. Im Glad thats what OKC is doing and hope they continue to go with that great plan
Well I don't think Cole is starting material on a championship team either, I love Ibaka at the 4 but Cole is alittle undersized at C and I don't think is a good pair with Ibaka.
Cole is a rookie. Rookie big men are not half of what they will become. soooo many title winning players didnt look like title winning players as rookies
just to name two. No one know whats a rookie is gonna be like when they get to be in there prime
And with the centers no being what they used to be you dont have to be 6'11 or 7feet to be a good effective center.
I agree rookie big men struggle early, but I just don't see Aldrich becoming a back to the basket scorer. Ibaka isn't really a back to the basket scorer either so when their both out there you can't really throw it down low knowing your going to get a basket, I just don't like the combo of both of them at the same time.
They good thing is they dont need a back to the basket scorer. points are points. ibaka can hit midrange jumpers and dunks and they will be alright with that or be like Rasheed wallace with the pistons and hit jumpers and back down every so often.
The Magic are a good example of why you need a legit PF to compete in the current NBA. The Lakers have Bynum and Gasol at the PF position. You can't have a combo forward like Green or Lewis and take down that team. Their length just smothers you. I like Ibaka at the 4 for the future. I wish the Thunder had picked up Hassan Whiteside; he's a legit C, great shot-blocker and would form a great shot-blocking duo with Ibaka. He wouldn't help right away, but Whiteside is a better long-term prospect than Aldrich in my opinion and would have been a great fit with this Thunder team down the track.
As far as Green is concerned, it would be in his best interests to leave the Thunder for a team that needs a SF. I don't think the Clippers qualify as Aminu is raw but showing great potential. Off the top of my head, Cavaliers, Magic, Wizards would all be a great fit for Green.
points are points, but you need a back to the basket scorer for a championship. Sometimes you have bad shooting days and you need that big that can score on the block, which OKC does not have.
Rasheed could score on the block though, he had that turn around jumper that was super affective.
I disagree that you need a back to the basket scorer to win championships, you just need a guy who can defend the opposing low-post scorer. Case in point is the Chicago Bulls; they did it without a low-post scorer because Rodman was a great defender. Defence wins championships and Green isn't a capable enough PF defender to help the Thunder win one.
Answer me this anyone.. who thought a team of
A undersized ben wallace
A hot headed Rasheed wallace
would not only go to the eastern conference title game three straight years but also win a title???
that's my point when i say there's no blue print. many different types of teams can win it. Imagine if they were as younger???
The thunder have plenty of time to see what this team can do before thinking of trading
they aren't winning a title anytime soon with this young team so there's no rush to trade when you already have a playoff team unless you can get someone that you KNOW will score just as much as green and rebound better. Other wise doesn't make much sense. Would make more sense if they were already in there prime or about to pass it but they have a couple years before they are even there
Except the Pistons big men could defend there positions
Reguardless no one thought they could win a title with that team.
And green is so bad on defense that power forwards dont go off on him and on average he doesnt give more points then other good big back to the basket big men. And OKC was one of the best defense of teams in the NBA last year. i dont think Defending big men has been the problem although people keep trying to make it seem lik it is.e
Presti values players who can play multiple positions, and nearly every Thunder player passes that test. Some may discount Green at the four after looking at his rebounding and blocks numbers, but remember that Oklahoma City led the league in blocks and ranked third in total rebounds last season. The Thunder has adopted a true "team playing" philosophy. They seem to differentiate very little between small and power forwards, in favor of considering it simply the forward position. Once a true or traditional center (Cole Aldrich, perhaps?) is established, their schemes could support a change.
This team also greatly values chemistry among its players. You can't buy it. As a general manager, you put the pieces together that make the most sense to win basketball games, and you look at how the players will mesh…on court, in practice, in travel, in general. Take away a key piece when your team is on the rise, and you risk everything.
Jeff Green knows his role on this team, and he understands that Kevin Durant is the superstar. And Presti is not about to risk disrupting the core when it worked so well last season and looks to only improve…which makes him very valuable indeed-Susan Bible
And i Agree. His true value to the team is much more important then getting that prototypical power forward
You know another team that liked players who defended multiple positions? The Atlanta Hawks, and they never got out of the second round. They too have players out of position like Horford but kept the core together for chemistry reasons. They got swept in the second round the past two years. If the Thunder aren't careful they'll be the Hawks West.
Difference is the thunder are younger. there key player is 3 years from his prime and already better then joe johnson who is on the wrong side of his prime
I agree with omphalos, guarding multiple positions with your guards is fine but doing it with your forwards can be very risky and OKC is going to have to watch out or they will be Atlanta(top 4 but never win a championship).
I agree there chemistry is good, but bad players can also have good chemisty, so it's not really worth it if the pieces on your team have OKC if they don't fit into a championship type team.
The post about no absolutes is right on, there really are none. However, the trend you notice with teams that have won chips has been that they either have talented guys in the middle, one of the better players in the league or defense and rebounding. Sometimes all of the above, at least two out of three. When the Pistons won the chip, it was unexpected, that is for sure, but they were the elite defensive squad in the NBA. Their starting line-up played really well together and they all were stalwart defenders. They even had 4 All-Stars in a single season. Not to mention that when they won the championship, they had Mehmet Okur coming off of the bench, who later blossomed into an All-Star (not to mention Darko). So, I agree, like KG said "anything is possible" (as I rolled my eyes with the way he said it, not what he said). But, all I am saying is, it has yet to happen and the Thunder still will more than likely have to address a few issues and possibly make a major move to contend with what might be going on in the league. There is a reason that Miami kept Jamaal Magloire instead of Jerry Stackhouse. You need big guys and you need fouls, the premier teams in the league have all loaded up on big men. I attribute this in large part to the Lakers incredible size right now, which I think has been very advantageous as well as having an incredible player and a rugged supporting cast. It is in large part about chemistry, which OKC has done a great job of building in such a short time. Durant is a great player, Westbrook looks fantastic as well, but Michael and Kobe always had body guards when they won titles. Whether they were skilled bigs in the case of Kobe or rugged defenders and rebounders in the case of Michael, they had parts that won them titles. As I said before, Green might break the mold, but history is not on his side.
Yeah I don't think you can overestimate the impact the length of the Lakers has had on the current NBA climate. Only a few teams could realistically hope to win a seven game series against them when healthy and firing on all cylinders, and every one of them has a stack of 7 footers or close to; thinking of Celtics, Spurs, Dallas here.
This is how I think of it I guess; if it comes down to game seven, up one point with twenty seconds on the clock, do you really want to have an obvious defensive mismatch that could be exploited to lose the lead and ultimately the championship? This is the worst-case scenario I envision when I think of players like Green and Lewis who are simply not long enough to defend the Gasols, the Garnetts, the Duncans.
I 100% agree with the last 2 posts, that's why I think he needs to be traded, his contract is up so trade him now and get a big guy that can start building chemistry now with the current players.
the thing about that is there are no PF to defend the gasols/bynums right now so ya'll are talking about trading green for a non existing player. Gortat cant do it, thompson,mcgee, amare. the Thunder is not good enough to beat them now with any reasonable trade but in 3 years when the two best players are in there prime??? what teams are gonna be so great down low that the thunder can't beat them?
It again all depends on what happens in 3 years, but I do not see the Heat or Lakers fading away by than unless something pretty drastic happens. To me, those two teams have a core much stronger than the Thunder, though the Thunder are indeed younger. But, my opinion has always been that in 3 years LeBron James will more than likely be the best player in the NBA bar none, so, I see him being better than Durant. It will be an interesting match-up, but I just believe that LeBron will be that guy. Westbrook and Wade kind of cancel each other out, it will be interesting to see what Wade looks like in 3 years. Will Westbrook indeed continue his assurgence to being one of the closest players in the NBA to Wade? So far we have signs he may, but again, that is in due time. One thing I do know is that when comparing these two teams, I would much rather have Chris Bosh as my third option/PF than Jeff Green. So, that is the Heat, the Lakers are a different story as Odom/Gasol/Kobe/Artest are all older than the Heat's core and it will be an issue of how they age.
One thing I think you are sleeping on though Quincey is the importance of having someone that could maybe at least attempt to neutralize these teams size. You say no one can stop Pau Gasol, that we are looking for someone who does not exist, but I will tell you what I walked away from that series last year impressed with. Serge Ibaka, when playing against Pau Gasol, did not back down. The kid rebounded, held his ground and I feel did the little things to either keep the Thunder in the game or even take an advantage. Ibaka is one of the guys I am talking about, because if you look at Green's totals from that series, they are miniscule in about every aspect. He brings to mind Shawn Marion, the third banana (in a radically different situation) who would usually come up short in the post season. Shawn also was a better rebounder/defender than Green, though his teammates were not as prolific as KD/Westbrook, but I digress. Another guy that comes to mind when you think of Green is Lamar Odom, though their games are quite different. They do play similar roles to their team however, and LA did not start winning until they got that PF to come in and take some of the heat off of Kobe. Now, the Thunder are a different scenario, but I just think they should focus on getting some big, rugged players in to help ease the load. After all, while so many people were impressed with them taking the Lakers to 6 games, they did in fact lose the series, and the only players who really played up to or above their ability were Westbrook and Ibaka. You may not find a 4 in the league who could stop Pau Gasol, but the Thunder have one more effective than Jeff Green who they might have to use out of position if they do indeed play the Lakers again. I just know I would rather have a player in the mold of a Chris Bosh (long, productive rebounder) than a Jeff Green who will get eaten alive by a Pau Gasol. Hate on Bosh's rebounding and defense all you want, but he is putting up more of a fight against size than Green for real. Pau is tough for anyone to stop, but in my opinion Green will never come close, and this will lead to problems against other teams as well.
So if the Lakers are still very good by then ( which i hope they are) its not gonna mater who they get for green realistically. I keep hearing trade him but theres no big thats gonna make them better that they can realistically get