This topic contains 54 replies, has 9 voices, and was last updated by AvatarAvatar IndianaBasketball 8 years, 9 months ago.

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  • #61098
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    SkalAndJamal
    Participant

    Based off a question asked earlier today, if both CP3 and Steph retired today, who would be the greater player? 

    Im going with Steph. Has a ring, a mvp, and is already the greatest shooter ever. Steph also has had more playoff success while not playing with a player as good as Blake.

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  • #1004622
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    he_gets_buckets
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     Not disagreeing with you, but that last point about Steph not playing someone as good as Blake is only partly true.. No, no single player hes played with has been as good, but hes had much better overall rosters than CP3, this Warriors team is stacked and all fit perfectly together and compliment each other so well. CP3 hasn’t ever had a roster stacked with as much talent as Steph. 

    But apart from that, I’d agree that Steph has a more impressive resume at this point, though CP3 does have a lot of honours such as All Defense and All NBA, that keep it somewhat close. Its not an obvious choice to go with Steph by any means, CP3 is right there

     

     

     

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    • #1004638
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      SkalAndJamal
      Participant

       I agree that’s it’s close. But it’s not like CP has been playing with slouches either. Blake, DeAndre, Peja, JJ, Tyson, Jamal, West are examples of guys who do their particular roles just as well as any other players who play similar roles as them. Blake is one of the best pick and roll guys, Peja and JJ one of the besr spot up shooters, Tyson and DeAndre one of the best anchors. Not to mention his coach Doc, has gotten the job done before.

      the thing Steph definitley is lucky to have that CP doesn’t is an owner with a plan. Warriors’ ownership was committed to developing their draft picks and getting them to gel together.

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      • #1004809
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        Stop_basketball_nonsense
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         No way to this point am I picking Stephen over cp3. Cp3 has never made the finals yes, but like what’s been already said his roster has never been as good. Stephen gets the benefit of getting his lack of defense hidden by bogut-, multiple time defensive team, iggy-same, & draymond whose defensive versatility, in my opinion is only overshadowed by lebron & Anthony davis. Not to mention an all stR scorer with d in klay, Livingston is no joke and ezili is a better back up than cp3 ever had coming off the bench for the front court.

         Come on deandre can’t score unless he’s within 4 ft of the basket,also needs help from lobs. Blake is an all star but his defense has always been shaky. So u gott both frontcourt guys who neither is a complete player. Crawford can score wit anyone but his lack of d is just as extreme as his potential on offense. And JJ is solid one of the best 3 pt shooters but its not like he’s a lock down defender, solid but not athletic either.

        When u talk about the amount of good to elite 2 way players curry has versus the many 1,sided ones cp3 has had steph obviously has more talent around him.

        Matter fact if we’re talkin straight up 1 v1. Cp3 has the advantage. Cp3  has not only been all nba but has also all nba defense as well. Also he always averaged more assists than curry &, his turnover ratio is lower. Dribble about a tie. Only thing I give sreph advantage in is 3 pt shot. To be honest I think cuz this generation depends so heavily on the 3 point shot I think people are starting to put to much stock into how good a player is based solely on 3 pt shooting.

         

         

         

         

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      • #1004670
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        Stop_basketball_nonsense
        Participant

         No way to this point am I picking Stephen over cp3. Cp3 has never made the finals yes, but like what’s been already said his roster has never been as good. Stephen gets the benefit of getting his lack of defense hidden by bogut-, multiple time defensive team, iggy-same, & draymond whose defensive versatility, in my opinion is only overshadowed by lebron & Anthony davis. Not to mention an all stR scorer with d in klay, Livingston is no joke and ezili is a better back up than cp3 ever had coming off the bench for the front court.

         Come on deandre can’t score unless he’s within 4 ft of the basket,also needs help from lobs. Blake is an all star but his defense has always been shaky. So u gott both frontcourt guys who neither is a complete player. Crawford can score wit anyone but his lack of d is just as extreme as his potential on offense. And JJ is solid one of the best 3 pt shooters but its not like he’s a lock down defender, solid but not athletic either.

        When u talk about the amount of good to elite 2 way players curry has versus the many 1,sided ones cp3 has had steph obviously has more talent around him.

        Matter fact if we’re talkin straight up 1 v1. Cp3 has the advantage. Cp3  has not only been all nba but has also all nba defense as well. Also he always averaged more assists than curry &, his turnover ratio is lower. Dribble about a tie. Only thing I give sreph advantage in is 3 pt shot. To be honest I think cuz this generation depends so heavily on the 3 point shot I think people are starting to put to much stock into how good a player is based solely on 3 pt shooting.

         

         

         

         

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        • #1004817
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          SkalAndJamal
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           I disagree. CP3 has played with all stars and guys who have won big on other teams, if they can win on other teams, why can’t they win with CP? And come on you guys really can’t make many excuses for the fact he has Blake and Doc. Literally after LeBron and KD, if you are talking about the best forwards, Blake is right there. And Doc is one of the very best in the game, not many coaches can react to Pop and beat him like Doc did. Also Steph has really improved his defense too. The collapse Clippers made against Houston and how handily Steph kicked their butt, should be an indication if the goal is to win a championship, you got to go with Steph.

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        • #1004678
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          SkalAndJamal
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           I disagree. CP3 has played with all stars and guys who have won big on other teams, if they can win on other teams, why can’t they win with CP? And come on you guys really can’t make many excuses for the fact he has Blake and Doc. Literally after LeBron and KD, if you are talking about the best forwards, Blake is right there. And Doc is one of the very best in the game, not many coaches can react to Pop and beat him like Doc did. Also Steph has really improved his defense too. The collapse Clippers made against Houston and how handily Steph kicked their butt, should be an indication if the goal is to win a championship, you got to go with Steph.

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          • #1004839
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            Stop_basketball_nonsense
            Participant

             Who are these  allstR guy( s ) that have won big on other teams and not with cp3. ?. Only chandler! And let’s be honest Shawn.Marion and terry were the players getting.into.lebron’,s head when Dallas won the championship, and dirk was the catalyst. Chandler played big on d yes, but west still hasn’t won a ring &,Blake isn’t up there with kd or lebron. What u been smokin?. Blake is still behind Paul George mostly because of defense, Anthony davis, aldridge, in my opinion, and zebo destroys him every time they match, your logic seems to put together very loosely.

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          • #1004700
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            Stop_basketball_nonsense
            Participant

             Who are these  allstR guy( s ) that have won big on other teams and not with cp3. ?. Only chandler! And let’s be honest Shawn.Marion and terry were the players getting.into.lebron’,s head when Dallas won the championship, and dirk was the catalyst. Chandler played big on d yes, but west still hasn’t won a ring &,Blake isn’t up there with kd or lebron. What u been smokin?. Blake is still behind Paul George mostly because of defense, Anthony davis, aldridge, in my opinion, and zebo destroys him every time they match, your logic seems to put together very loosely.

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            • #1004911
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              SkalAndJamal
              Participant

              Posey, Peja, west, JJ, Barnes, C. Butler, Tyson, Ariza all went farther on different teams than with CP. How about you make a list of guys (played 3 years or more on a different squad) who went farther with CP than without him. Only top 8 rotation guys.

              if you think Tyson wasn’t important for that Mavs team than you clearly didn’t watch 2011 NBA bball. He was their 2nd most important player.

              I’m the one smoking something? since CP went to LA, Blake has made all-NBA 2nd team every year behind KD and Bron except for this year. And this year he was still 3rd team, and up to the clips 3-1 lead to Houston, EVERYONE was saying no one is playing better than Blake. So yes I understand the casual fan wants to believe all Blake can do is dunk but if you know at least a decent amount, Blake is definitley in contention for that best forward spot after KD and Bron. I suggest you try to argue with "basketball-reference" and Wikipedia before trying to argue with me, cause literally at this point all I see is fandom fandom fandom.

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            • #1004772
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              SkalAndJamal
              Participant

              Posey, Peja, west, JJ, Barnes, C. Butler, Tyson, Ariza all went farther on different teams than with CP. How about you make a list of guys (played 3 years or more on a different squad) who went farther with CP than without him. Only top 8 rotation guys.

              if you think Tyson wasn’t important for that Mavs team than you clearly didn’t watch 2011 NBA bball. He was their 2nd most important player.

              I’m the one smoking something? since CP went to LA, Blake has made all-NBA 2nd team every year behind KD and Bron except for this year. And this year he was still 3rd team, and up to the clips 3-1 lead to Houston, EVERYONE was saying no one is playing better than Blake. So yes I understand the casual fan wants to believe all Blake can do is dunk but if you know at least a decent amount, Blake is definitley in contention for that best forward spot after KD and Bron. I suggest you try to argue with "basketball-reference" and Wikipedia before trying to argue with me, cause literally at this point all I see is fandom fandom fandom.

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    • #1004777
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      SkalAndJamal
      Participant

       I agree that’s it’s close. But it’s not like CP has been playing with slouches either. Blake, DeAndre, Peja, JJ, Tyson, Jamal, West are examples of guys who do their particular roles just as well as any other players who play similar roles as them. Blake is one of the best pick and roll guys, Peja and JJ one of the besr spot up shooters, Tyson and DeAndre one of the best anchors. Not to mention his coach Doc, has gotten the job done before.

      the thing Steph definitley is lucky to have that CP doesn’t is an owner with a plan. Warriors’ ownership was committed to developing their draft picks and getting them to gel together.

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  • #1004761
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    he_gets_buckets
    Participant

     Not disagreeing with you, but that last point about Steph not playing someone as good as Blake is only partly true.. No, no single player hes played with has been as good, but hes had much better overall rosters than CP3, this Warriors team is stacked and all fit perfectly together and compliment each other so well. CP3 hasn’t ever had a roster stacked with as much talent as Steph. 

    But apart from that, I’d agree that Steph has a more impressive resume at this point, though CP3 does have a lot of honours such as All Defense and All NBA, that keep it somewhat close. Its not an obvious choice to go with Steph by any means, CP3 is right there

     

     

     

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  • #1004811
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    rich.homie.mitch
    Participant

    Cp3 imo

    Say curry was playing with the hornets when cp3 was with them. I don’t think curry could get them into the playoffs like cp3 did. Paul was avergaging 23 points and 11 assists that 08 season along with 3 steals a game. I also think steph’s biggest weakness is hidden. His defense. 

     

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  • #1004672
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    rich.homie.mitch
    Participant

    Cp3 imo

    Say curry was playing with the hornets when cp3 was with them. I don’t think curry could get them into the playoffs like cp3 did. Paul was avergaging 23 points and 11 assists that 08 season along with 3 steals a game. I also think steph’s biggest weakness is hidden. His defense. 

     

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    • #1004875
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      nateoak10
      Participant

       All defensive advanced stats say Steph is hardly weak at defense, in fact he’s turned into a very solid player. I firmly believe the only reason why someone would say he’s weak at defense is because they don’t watch many Warriors games and think of Steph as stll the skinny little guard from when the W’s couldn’t defend. He’s not small anymore (quite bulky now) and has excellent defensive timing. 

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    • #1004736
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      nateoak10
      Participant

       All defensive advanced stats say Steph is hardly weak at defense, in fact he’s turned into a very solid player. I firmly believe the only reason why someone would say he’s weak at defense is because they don’t watch many Warriors games and think of Steph as stll the skinny little guard from when the W’s couldn’t defend. He’s not small anymore (quite bulky now) and has excellent defensive timing. 

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      • #1004879
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        rich.homie.mitch
        Participant

        "All the advanced stats mean this" The thing about the warriors defense is that they switch everything. This makes perfect sense when you longer guys like Barnes, Thompson, Livingston, Holiday and you can throw Green in at Center. I do agree Steph has gotten bigger and stronger, he has to cause when he switches from a point to a forward he’s gotta be able to bang down low. But like I said the warriors defense hides his biggest weakness. His on ball defense. 

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      • #1004740
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        rich.homie.mitch
        Participant

        "All the advanced stats mean this" The thing about the warriors defense is that they switch everything. This makes perfect sense when you longer guys like Barnes, Thompson, Livingston, Holiday and you can throw Green in at Center. I do agree Steph has gotten bigger and stronger, he has to cause when he switches from a point to a forward he’s gotta be able to bang down low. But like I said the warriors defense hides his biggest weakness. His on ball defense. 

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        • #1004927
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          SkalAndJamal
          Participant

           Bro if they switch everything that still means Steph has to be able to be a versatile defender too or else it all falls apart and coaches take advantage of that. Which clearly no coach couldn’t. 

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        • #1004788
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          SkalAndJamal
          Participant

           Bro if they switch everything that still means Steph has to be able to be a versatile defender too or else it all falls apart and coaches take advantage of that. Which clearly no coach couldn’t. 

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        • #1005083
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          nateoak10
          Participant

           His on ball defense is very good. There is no way around it he is a good defender now. And the stats account for a single player, not that guy and his team. He has had to switch onto bigger guys many times and has done just fine. Steph’s biggest weakness is he can get a little care less with the ball but that is nitpicking with how good he is at everything else.  

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        • #1004944
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          nateoak10
          Participant

           His on ball defense is very good. There is no way around it he is a good defender now. And the stats account for a single player, not that guy and his team. He has had to switch onto bigger guys many times and has done just fine. Steph’s biggest weakness is he can get a little care less with the ball but that is nitpicking with how good he is at everything else.  

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  • #1004901
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    sitlbito
    Participant

     I take Steph Curry. I can’t believe there are still some pasionate CP3 fans who still think he’s the best point guard in the league. He’s close,maybe top3 but come on with the season Steph just had,it’s disrespectful.

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  • #1004762
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    sitlbito
    Participant

     I take Steph Curry. I can’t believe there are still some pasionate CP3 fans who still think he’s the best point guard in the league. He’s close,maybe top3 but come on with the season Steph just had,it’s disrespectful.

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  • #1004919
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    Anton123
    Participant

     Are  people who are choosing Steph saying he’s better right now or has had a better career? Because the question was about their careers.

    In my opinion it’s preposterous to say Curry’s career has been better, he’s been a very good player for three years and a top 3 point guard for two. Chris Paul has been a top 5 point guard in each of the last 8 seasons, he’s:

    4x all-NBA first team; 2x all-NBA second team; 1x all-NBA third team; 5x all-NBA defensive first team; 2x all-NBA defensive seond team; he finished top 5 in MVP voting 4 times.

    Chris Paul is 24th all-time in steals and 16th all-time in assists. He has had a great career.

    Curry is a one time all-NBA 1st teamer and one time all-NBA 2nd teamer. Yes, he’s an MVP, yes he has a championship, but saying he’s had the better career is outrageous. If Derrick Rose had won an NBA championship in his MVP season, would you say he’s also had a better career than Chris Paul?

     

     

     

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  • #1004780
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    Anton123
    Participant

     Are  people who are choosing Steph saying he’s better right now or has had a better career? Because the question was about their careers.

    In my opinion it’s preposterous to say Curry’s career has been better, he’s been a very good player for three years and a top 3 point guard for two. Chris Paul has been a top 5 point guard in each of the last 8 seasons, he’s:

    4x all-NBA first team; 2x all-NBA second team; 1x all-NBA third team; 5x all-NBA defensive first team; 2x all-NBA defensive seond team; he finished top 5 in MVP voting 4 times.

    Chris Paul is 24th all-time in steals and 16th all-time in assists. He has had a great career.

    Curry is a one time all-NBA 1st teamer and one time all-NBA 2nd teamer. Yes, he’s an MVP, yes he has a championship, but saying he’s had the better career is outrageous. If Derrick Rose had won an NBA championship in his MVP season, would you say he’s also had a better career than Chris Paul?

     

     

     

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    • #1004923
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      SkalAndJamal
      Participant

       If you were a gm and you can have a draft pick who would have the career curry just had or CP just had, you go with Curry, cause you know you might get at least 1 ring from your mvp with curry.

      yes if rose could have got past the heat and mavs, give me Rose. Goal is to win rings, with all the talent CP played with, I’m sure if he was my franchise guy I’d be bounced before the conference finals and get my butt kicked by a healthy Tony Parker.

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    • #1004784
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      SkalAndJamal
      Participant

       If you were a gm and you can have a draft pick who would have the career curry just had or CP just had, you go with Curry, cause you know you might get at least 1 ring from your mvp with curry.

      yes if rose could have got past the heat and mavs, give me Rose. Goal is to win rings, with all the talent CP played with, I’m sure if he was my franchise guy I’d be bounced before the conference finals and get my butt kicked by a healthy Tony Parker.

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      • #1004929
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        Anton123
        Participant

        If I was a GM and had to choose between having a great player for 2-3 years or a great player for 9? I choose the second. 

        You’re basically saying that having Chris Paul makes your playoff chances slimmer, do you think if you replace Tony Parker on those SA teams – the Spurs don’t win a championship?

        That’s like saying Karl Malone had a worse career than Bill Walton, would you agree with that as well?

        I’ve never been a CP3 fan, but you gotta give a player the respect he is due.

         

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      • #1004790
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        Anton123
        Participant

        If I was a GM and had to choose between having a great player for 2-3 years or a great player for 9? I choose the second. 

        You’re basically saying that having Chris Paul makes your playoff chances slimmer, do you think if you replace Tony Parker on those SA teams – the Spurs don’t win a championship?

        That’s like saying Karl Malone had a worse career than Bill Walton, would you agree with that as well?

        I’ve never been a CP3 fan, but you gotta give a player the respect he is due.

         

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        • #1004804
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          SkalAndJamal
          Participant

           Aight well if you never win a ring that’s on you. Unless Chris hops on another superstar’s squad he’s never making the NBA finals.

          karl Malone got stopped by Michael Jordan, chris Paul gets stopped by old 10 years past his prime tim Duncan,  and james harden, way different situations.

          Well if you put CP on the Spurs that’s not his team. The Warriors are Steph’s team.

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        • #1004943
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          SkalAndJamal
          Participant

           Aight well if you never win a ring that’s on you. Unless Chris hops on another superstar’s squad he’s never making the NBA finals.

          karl Malone got stopped by Michael Jordan, chris Paul gets stopped by old 10 years past his prime tim Duncan,  and james harden, way different situations.

          Well if you put CP on the Spurs that’s not his team. The Warriors are Steph’s team.

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  • #1004933
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    machu46
    Participant

    Yeah… if you wanna say Curry will surpass CP3 in all-time rankings by the time they both retire, that’s definitely possible; but if they both retired today (CP3 after a pretty lengthy career and Curry after 6 years), I’m not sure how this is a close debate.

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  • #1004794
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    machu46
    Participant

    Yeah… if you wanna say Curry will surpass CP3 in all-time rankings by the time they both retire, that’s definitely possible; but if they both retired today (CP3 after a pretty lengthy career and Curry after 6 years), I’m not sure how this is a close debate.

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    • #1004806
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      SkalAndJamal
      Participant

       If the goal is to win as many rings as possible, give me Curry’s career over CP’s.

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      • #1004810
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        Anton123
        Participant

        You’re giving Curry way too much credit. Curry was the best player on the team that won the finals, yes. But Curry didn’t just win the finals himself. He wasn’t even the finals MVP. The Warriors had an amazing team with an amazing coach. It was the definition of a team effort, You make it seem that Curry is THE guy you need to win a championship, a GM MUST draft Curry if he wants a ring, but that’s just not true. That’s a way too radical and simplistic approach to a career and to comparing players.

        Your attitude in this discussion is extremely annoying, why create a thread and offer a subject to debate if you are 100% sure in who has had the better career and what makes a better career and are unwilling to listen to other arguments?

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        • #1004814
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          SkalAndJamal
          Participant

          I’m not saying Steph is the greatest, but you guys all make it seem CP is. I’m just saying give Steph a little more cred and CP a little less. Steph was relied on heavily to produce offensively especially with Klay not getting the looks he got during regular season. And it’s not easy to win with a rookie coach. Steph before this season gave San Antonio with a healthy Parker, a run for their money also. I’m not going to take that CP didn’t have the players around him either as a valid point. 

          its a debate and what’s really annoying is when you guys have nothing to say to counter so you just whine to me lol. Come up with something that’s true not Steph had a great team and Blake, DeAndre, JJ and Doc with Jamal off the bench just doesn’t cut it.

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          • #1004816
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            Anton123
            Participant

            Chris Paul isn’t the greatest he has just done more than Stephen Curry, despite not having an MVP or a ring, that’s all.

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            • #1004824
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              SkalAndJamal
              Participant

              Why hasn’t CP been to the conference finals yet?

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              • #1004876
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                Anton123
                Participant

                 Do you expect me to give you some profound answer or do you expect me to choke and admit defeat?

                CP hasn’t been to the conference finals because his teams never made it there. However, you can’t disregard his entire career based on this single fact. 

                 

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                • #1005077
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                  SkalAndJamal
                  Participant

                  But why lol

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                • #1004938
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                  SkalAndJamal
                  Participant

                  But why lol

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              • #1005015
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                Anton123
                Participant

                 Do you expect me to give you some profound answer or do you expect me to choke and admit defeat?

                CP hasn’t been to the conference finals because his teams never made it there. However, you can’t disregard his entire career based on this single fact. 

                 

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            • #1004962
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              SkalAndJamal
              Participant

              Why hasn’t CP been to the conference finals yet?

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          • #1004954
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            Anton123
            Participant

            Chris Paul isn’t the greatest he has just done more than Stephen Curry, despite not having an MVP or a ring, that’s all.

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        • #1004952
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          SkalAndJamal
          Participant

          I’m not saying Steph is the greatest, but you guys all make it seem CP is. I’m just saying give Steph a little more cred and CP a little less. Steph was relied on heavily to produce offensively especially with Klay not getting the looks he got during regular season. And it’s not easy to win with a rookie coach. Steph before this season gave San Antonio with a healthy Parker, a run for their money also. I’m not going to take that CP didn’t have the players around him either as a valid point. 

          its a debate and what’s really annoying is when you guys have nothing to say to counter so you just whine to me lol. Come up with something that’s true not Steph had a great team and Blake, DeAndre, JJ and Doc with Jamal off the bench just doesn’t cut it.

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        • #1005085
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          nateoak10
          Participant

           But he is the league MVP on that awesome team. Have you ever thought about what would happen to the W’s if he wasn’t on the team? He carries an enormous load and just because he doesn’t handle that load the same way someone like a Kobe would (Ball dominant , jacking up shots) he still has to do so much for this team for us to win the 3rd most games in NBA history throughout the entire season. 

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        • #1004946
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          nateoak10
          Participant

           But he is the league MVP on that awesome team. Have you ever thought about what would happen to the W’s if he wasn’t on the team? He carries an enormous load and just because he doesn’t handle that load the same way someone like a Kobe would (Ball dominant , jacking up shots) he still has to do so much for this team for us to win the 3rd most games in NBA history throughout the entire season. 

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          • #1005093
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            SkalAndJamal
            Participant

             He simply gets the job done 

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          • #1004955
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            SkalAndJamal
            Participant

             He simply gets the job done 

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      • #1004948
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        Anton123
        Participant

        You’re giving Curry way too much credit. Curry was the best player on the team that won the finals, yes. But Curry didn’t just win the finals himself. He wasn’t even the finals MVP. The Warriors had an amazing team with an amazing coach. It was the definition of a team effort, You make it seem that Curry is THE guy you need to win a championship, a GM MUST draft Curry if he wants a ring, but that’s just not true. That’s a way too radical and simplistic approach to a career and to comparing players.

        Your attitude in this discussion is extremely annoying, why create a thread and offer a subject to debate if you are 100% sure in who has had the better career and what makes a better career and are unwilling to listen to other arguments?

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    • #1004945
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      SkalAndJamal
      Participant

       If the goal is to win as many rings as possible, give me Curry’s career over CP’s.

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  • #1005110
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    IndianaBasketball
    Participant

    Does Stephen Curry’s 2014/2015 season really trump what Chris Paul has done over his entire 10 year career? I don’t know about that… Paul’s resume is packed and his numbers rival the all-time greats at his position. He hasn’t made it to a conference final (real close a couple of seasons) and he hasn’t won a MVP (2007/2008 was a toss-up), but he’s been great… And he’s been great at both ends too. I mean, he’s been a complete point guard and has had barely any holes in his game for a long time. 

    I think Paul has had the better career so far, despite Curry’s and GSW’s success last season. I’d go with Curry as the better player right now though. 

     

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  • #1004970
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    IndianaBasketball
    Participant

    Does Stephen Curry’s 2014/2015 season really trump what Chris Paul has done over his entire 10 year career? I don’t know about that… Paul’s resume is packed and his numbers rival the all-time greats at his position. He hasn’t made it to a conference final (real close a couple of seasons) and he hasn’t won a MVP (2007/2008 was a toss-up), but he’s been great… And he’s been great at both ends too. I mean, he’s been a complete point guard and has had barely any holes in his game for a long time. 

    I think Paul has had the better career so far, despite Curry’s and GSW’s success last season. I’d go with Curry as the better player right now though. 

     

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