[IOIwingParticipant]

What case does Scottie Pippen really have to be ranked over Sam Jones? Jones was a member of 10 championship teams, one of the best clutch shooters to ever play the game, a fantastic defender, and the 2nd best player on at least 4 title teams.

[tiberiusParticipant]

 I don’t speak only for myself but even for the media when I say this. I think that we tend to forget about the ancients of the nba. When you go beyond the Magic/Bird days people tend to forget about the impacts of those players. At the time there was less media coverage and less individual awards players could aquire which compared to today would garner them half the attention and half the qualification that nba players have today.

I’m not an old dog but my highschool coach provided me with footage of Wilt Chamberlain and Bill Russell when I was a high school basketball player and I really hooked on to both of them. I think that Sam Jones is very underrated. Let’s not forget that the Celtics were the only TRUE dynasty of basketball when Russell was there with Havlicek, KC, Jones and the gang. There has never been another team with such a record and competition wasn’t easy at all. You had Chamberlain, Jerry, Oscar and in the later days Kareem.

I think that if Defensive Player of the year awards and defensive teams existed when he entered the league his resume would have been all the more impressive.

BUT…

The role that Scottie Pippen played was much bigger than Sam’s and Scottie’s impact on the game was much more profound. Scottie is arguably the greatest defender of all time, and was an incredible athlete and good "point forward" shall we say. Sam had KC by his side on the perimeter and Hondo and Russ behind him as well as the deepest team in nba history whilst the bulls had their big 3 with the rest being really good role players. Scottie’s stats were also more impressive and I personally believe that championship numbers don’t depict greatness accurately. Scottie for me but Jones is still a legend

[ItsVictorOladipoParticipant]

The role that Scottie Pippen played was much bigger than Sam’s and Scottie’s impact on the game was much more profound. Scottie is arguably the greatest defender of all time, and was an incredible athlete and good "point forward" shall we say. Sam had KC by his side on the perimeter and Hondo and Russ behind him as well as the deepest team in nba history whilst the bulls had their big 3 with the rest being really good role players. Scottie’s stats were also more impressive and I personally believe that championship numbers don’t depict greatness accurately. Scottie for me but Jones is still a legend ————————————————————————————————————————- Agreed. The other thing that I think people always seem to forget is that Jones and the Celtics won those championships in an era where there was 8-14 teams in the league, Pippen and the Bulls won their chips in an era with 27-29 teams.

Jones is an all-time great but Pippen was the better passer, rebounder and an even better defender (Jones has a superb reputation but Pippen is the best wing defender I have ever seen). In terms of scoring Jones, might have the slight edge but Pippen took less shots, has just as many career 20 PPG seasons, and would probably have a similiar career scoring average if he hadn’t played an extra 5 more years than Jones.

IMO I find John Havlicek to have more similarities to Pippen. Both highly skilled, hard-nosed, versatile small forwards, both could pass, rebound, defend and score at an elite level for a wing. Both were a part of multiple championship winning streaks (Hondo winning 6 in the 60s and then two more in the 70s while Pippen had 6 of his own in the 90s). Both played second fiddle to other greats during those championship runs (Hondo to Bill Russell in the 60s and then Cowens in the 70s, Pippen to Jordan during both three peats). Both proved between those dynasties that they could be dominant franchise players of their own with Pippen averaging a combined 21.7 PPG, 8.4 RPG, 5.4 APG and 2.9 SPG in the two seasons between Bulls championships and Havlicek aeraging a combined 28.2 PPG, 8.6 RPG and 7.5 APG during the 1971 and 1972 seasons.

[F_S]

 ya’ll say pippen is one of the best wing defenders. bazz muhammad thinks that "pippen cant guard lebron" – "he aint strong enough", which i thought it was ridiculous and just goes to prove that people forget about older players.

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[LerinErinParticipant]

Had Pippen roughly tens spots higher than Jones in his book. I imagine part is when Sam played the league was much smaller than when Pippen played and that more recent players are fresher in memory of most people. I see your thinking but in my mind, Pippen the player I would rather have.. The league was so different when Sam played.

[sportspolymathParticipant]

 I think Pippen is one of the most overrated players of all time.  Funny how we only remember great defenders from championship teams.  Had Scottie not been paired with Jordan and been on those championship teams.  People would look at him a lot differently.  

[Bird_YearsParticipant]

@sportspolymath: You have a point but at the same time I think we’d look at Jordan a little differently if he didn’t have Pippen.

How many other great defenders average 20pts, 8rbs, 6ast, 2st and 1blk while shooting around 50% in their best seasons?

[ItsVictorOladipoParticipant]

I think Pippen is one of the most overrated players of all time. Funny how we only remember great defenders from championship teams. Had Scottie not been paired with Jordan and been on those championship teams. People would look at him a lot differently.

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I disagree with most of that. Yes his championships raise him up among the all-time greats but as he proved in MJs absence he could be a franchise player on his own. Without MJ he might not have won as many chips (or perhaps any) but he would’ve scored at a higher pace and probably made just as many All-star games and All-defensive teams. Honestly without MJ, I think his career would have gone alot like Grant Hill’s, a do everything SF that turned into primarily a defensive specialist late in his career. And Grant Hill, without injuries and surrounded with better players, could have been an all-time great.

[Bird_YearsParticipant]

A good comparison for Pippen would be John Havlicek, who’s commonly recognized to be a top 20 player all time. He was first team all defense 5 years, averaged similar rebounds and assists to Pippen (more points but lower FG%, which is what would likely happen if Pippen played without Jordan)

[Bird_YearsParticipant]

I didn’t realize ItsDwightHoward already mentioned Hondo, my bad

[HobbyOGParticipant]

Scottie Pippen will go down as the greatest NBA sidekick of all-time….

[Author]

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