I understand that this is a topic nobody will agree on but I tried my point guard rankings against my friends the other day and this is what i came up with. Just starting point guards 1-30
Not a bad list, but Curry is a bit low, Lin is really hard to place at this point in time, but where you have him is fine for now, but Derek Fisher at 30, if you're just doing starting Point Guards than that's fine, but all in all he's more like around 50th.
yeah its just starting point guards. Lin was hard to place.
I don't know... you do have a point. Its just that to me D Will has always been compared to CP3 because their styles are so similar and if you look at what CP3 did in new orleans (terrible supporting cast) it drops deron's stock as a pg because he's not producing the same way. So I put nash and rondo above him not as a direct comparisson to d will, because their styles are so different, but because thier value as pg's is as high as ever in terms of what they do for their teams and d will's is just a little suspect now (hes still one of my favorite players, just want to see more of him carrying his bad team and making them better like a pg should)
aamir i can quote you on that!
also the hornets didn't always have a "terrible" supporting cast. young chandler, peJa still doin it it, west. also i think chris paul has never been on team with another go-to guy (besides billups) which imo, paul needs. he is clutch and has a nasty midrange fadeaway, but he is also a short point guard that excels at passing, he is no d. rose. we were all seeing a lot of mr. big-shot in clutch situations but that is no longer available.
To me they are really close but what puts Paul at the top for me is the fact that he is more clutch than Rose. Rose missing two late game free throws in multiple games haunts me and Chris Paul happens to be one of the leagues most clutch players all together.
those free throws were missed because he is relatively young. rose is the better go-to guy.
Talent and skill wise, I think DWill and CP3 have minimal separation. CP3 to me has more "Kobe" in him.
Despite being a GSW fan, I would have to admit that Kyrie is on par if not better than Curry already. Love watching Curry, but he is starting to peak already. Not much difference watching him now vs. rookie year.
I think Curry is almost a finished product, and if that's true all the Steve Nash potential is thrown out the window...I love Curry's fineese and outside shot making ability, but I've always had concerns about his defense and best natural position in the NBA, and he hasn't made me feel any safer with all the ankle injuries he had already...The more I read these list the more I want to fire Coach Collins and hire a fast break style coach in the mold of D'Antoni(with more of a defensive back round of course)...
I'v seen a lot of debate lately concerning who the better point guard is; Chris Paul or Derrick Rose. So I decided to formulate a definitive opinion based on statistics alone. I am comming into this analysis with an unbiased approach as to who the better PG is. The analysis focuses on stats from this year. My final opinion will be formulated based on all around value.
Derrick Rose; 22.0 ppg, 7.8 assists, 3.4 rebounds, 2.9 turnovers, 0.9 steals, 35.5 mpg, 0.462 FG%, 0.310 3P%, 24.8 PER, 28.9 usage%---And he shoots 5.7 freethrows a game
Rose's assist totals have improved since he came into the league. His rebounding per game numbers have decreased, however, he is playing on a team averaging 45.1 rebounds per game (good for 2nd in the NBA) so this decrease probably isnt too big a deal. Rose's usage% is 5 points higher than 2nd place Carlos Boozer.
Chris Paul; 18.2 ppg, 8.8 assists, 3.7 rebounds, 2.1 turnovers, 2.3 steals, 35.7 mpg, 0.492 FG%, 0.472 3P%, 25.8 PER, 22.9 usage%---And he shoots 3.6 freethrows a game
Paul's assist and rebounding numbers are down from his career averages. This is probably due to his adjusting to a new team. Paul's 3P% is very high so far this year, however, his career 3P% is considerably higher than that of Derrick Rose. Also, before Chauncey got hurt, Paul's usage% was good for a 3rd on his team. Griffin, Billups have higher USG%, Mo Williams is identical to Paul's and Caron Butlers is a fraction of a percentage point lower than Paul's.
Comparriason: I don't know what you guys think about the win shares (WS) statistic, but its worth noting that in 7 seasons in the NBA, Chris Paul has 3 seasons with a WS better than that of Derrick Rose's MVP campaign. Paul WS(17.8 3rd season)(18.3)(13.9 same year that Rose won MVP) to Rose WS(13.1 MVP 3rd Season). Having said that, Rose took a 33-49 lottery team and took them to the playoffs in each of his first 3 seasons, they were 62-20 in his third year. They are on pace to go 50-16 this season. Paul carried a 18-64 hornets team into a 56-26 #2 seed in his third season. Last year the clippers finished 32-50, this year they are 19-9 and on pace for a 42-24 record.
So far this year, statistically Chris Paul is superior to Rose in the following categories; Assists, Rebounds, Steals, Turnovers, FG%, 3P%, and PER
Rose is superior in the following categories; PPG and Freethrow attempts per game.
Having said that, heres a look at one of Chris Pauls seasons in which he averaged a similar usage% as Rose has this year.
Paul (2008-09) 22.8 ppg, 11.0 apg, 5.5 rpg, 2.8 stl, 3.0 turnovers, 0.503 FG%, 0.364 3P%, 30.0 PER, 27.5 USG%, and he averaged 6.7 free throw attempts per game.
When comparing these two point guards with numbers alone, its a no brainer. Chris Paul is superior Derrick Rose in basically every calculable way. Don't get me wrong, watching Derrick Rose is an absolute treat, his desire to win, his speed, and his athleticism are unbelievable. Rose is also younger and hasn't had arthoscopic knee surgery. But this isn't about who you would rather start a franchise with, its about who the better player is right now. It appears that the real reason for this debate stems from two major sources, the first has to do with the size of the market each player has played for in their respective careers. Derrick Rose is in his 4th year playing for Chicago, the 3rd largest metropolitan area in the US and home to one of the NBA's most storied franchises. Chris Paul spent the majority of his career playing in New Orleans, the 46th largest metropolitan area in the US. Though he is now playing in LA, the 2nd largest metropolitan area, it has only been for a portion of one season. He also plays for one of the most consistantly terrible franchises in the history of the NBA and shares this market with another one of the NBA's most storied franchises. The other factor is how much weight many people commonly give to the PPG stat. Scoring is important, but not so important that it can elevate Derrick Rose to Chris Paul's stature. Paul is superior in every category except for points per game. And despite this, Paul scores more efficiently than Rose anyway. From what I'v seen, Rose doesn't even possess intangibles that trump Paul's. If I'm in game 7 of the NBA finals, I want Chris Paul running the point.
Is it from The new Ridley Scott film coming out this summer, The Alien Prequel titled "Prometheus"...because if it is, kudos, if not then you still have a cool user name lol...
I agree that Paul is a better player the Derrick Rose at that point and that Paul in his absolute prime can put up stats similar to those of Rose at his peak right now...
Good statistical post...plus 1...
The Ridley Scott film is what made me think of the name, then i remembered that in Greek mythology prometheus stole fire from the gods and brought it to Earth...which is badass
...he also gets his liver eaten out by a harpy everyday...oh well
Someone had Rubio 6th really after 30 games in the league and he's shooting under 38%.
As for DWill saying his supporting cast is anywhere near as good as CP3's in New Orleans would be stupid.
David West, Chandler, Peja are better than NJ guys.
1. Chris Paul
- Still the "point god" of the NBA. Still guilty of cruising from time to time, but he has mastered the art of running a team like no other.
2. Derrick Rose
- One could make a legit argument for Rose as a better player than Paul (I'd still side with Paul), but as a PG, he's still #2.
3. Deron Williams
- Started the year terribly, but has been lighting it up, scoring wise more recently.
4. Russell Westbrook
- Embarassing A/TO ratio for a "top PG" but still a much better player than people give him credit for.
5. Rajon Rondo
- Still doing his thing in Boston, and amongst the best 2-way PGs in the league.
6. Tony Parker
- Has carried SA to their record, and still lives under the radar. Played inspired ball this year.
7. Steve Nash
- Still the king of efficiency and a master of offense. But his D has gotten worse - and it wasn't good to start with.
8. Kyle Lowry
- Has had some bumps of late, but amongst the best 2-way high-energy players around.
9. John Wall
- Could be higher or a lot lower...here I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt, based on his recent play.
10. Steph Curry
- Amongst the most efficient scorers at his position, but not an elite playmaker. His effort on D mostly drops him.
11. Kyrie Irving
- So young, but so good. Should rise up this list quickly with his offensive arsenal/feel. Needs to improve on his A/TO and on D, understandably.
12. Ty Lawson
- The engine for a balanced Denver team, and as fast as they come.
13. Jrue Holday
- Not the best statistically, but runs the show for a very solid team, and plays both ends.
14. Brandon Jennings
- Has quietly had himself a much improved season.
15. Ricky Rubio
- I was/am a big critic of his, but he runs an offense impeccably well, which overrides most of his weaknesses.
Andre Miller - Is still top 15 worthy, but splitting time hurts his overall impact.
Darren Collison - Simply solid but unspectacular.
Jeff Teague - At times looks like he's ready to take a step up, in others he's not.
Mike Conley - Smooth and smart, but doesn't consistently make as big of an impact of those ahead.
Jeremy Lin - WAY too early to put him on any list, but he has played some great ball.
if you have seen rubio play you cant judge him based on shooting percentage what he does for his team makes him worthy of 6th spot and thats not jump shooting. and tyosn chandler on the hornets averaged less pts and rebounds than kris humbphries does, marshon brooks averages as much as peja ever did, no anthony morrow type contributer for the hornets and david west is the only really clear advantage (but did so well because of what chris paul did for him- look at numbers now). so the hornets and nets supporting casts are really not that uneven
1.Paul-Best pure PG in the L, he has to be #1
2. Rose- Probably the most talented player at this position,but not the best "PG".
3.Rondo-May sound crazy, but you tell me why not? Rebounds at a high level,defends at a high level, can penetrate as well as anyone, and has a ring to show for it, only thing holding him back is a jumper.
4.Russell Westbrook- In elite company with Oscar Robertson and Magic Johnson for 5,000 points, 1,900 assist, 1,300 rebounds in first 274 games, and also each year Westbrook improves so does the Thunder, Durant and Co. has alot to do with that as well, but your team goes as your PG goes, and as long as the Thunder keep improving you can't knock Westbrook.
5.Deron Williams- Still elite just is in an awful situation and isn't being discussed as much as he used to, but he's still playing at a great level.
6-10 is interchangable with alot of guards(Nash,Irving,Rubio,Lowry,Wall,Lawson,Curry,Jennings,etc.) So I'll just do a top 5.
BDiddy's list is right on, and I agree with witholding Lin at the time. Honestly, he's played like a top three guard the past two weeks, but we should give it a little more time.
New Orleans won 56 games with that team and the Nets are 9-24 this year and even last yr with Lopez n Deron they struggled.
You can't tell me Chris Paul is that much better than Deron Williams.
As for Rubio if he's a top 6 PG shooting 38% what does that make Rondo who is a better defender and scorer.
Youre right Chris Paul isnt 56 wins to 9 better than Deron Williams but his supporting cast in NO wasn't 56 to 9 better than the nets either. Thats what leads me to believe Paul does more for his team than Williams does and that determines PG value thats all I'm saying.
And that distrubing plus great defense and scoring when necessary makes Rondo 3rd to me behind rose and cp3. I don't think any other pg's do more to control and contribute to the success of their team
You guys really think Derrick Rose is a mediocre defender still? That has change full circle since about the All-Star break of LAST YEAR. He's a nice defender now, Coach Thibs still has a vaunted D and trust me, in the games I've watched Rose has not been the weak link. He denies penetration better than most PG's in the NBA. Behind only guys like Lowry, Rondo and CP3. And even with CP3 it's close.
Twolves fan here... I have seen most games this year and I am not sold on Rubio yet. He is a big part of our improvement, but he must become a better shooter. He is a very good passer but sometimes tries to hard and commits to many turnovers. However, Rubio can be special on D. I like how he runs the offense as long as he does not get to fancy. He is very good at taking it inside but sometimes does not finish. Needs to be more consistant with that. Very good free throw shooter.