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Perplexing Luke Babbit

the27guy
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Perplexing Luke Babbit

After studying all the prospects in this years draft, I'm most perplexed by Luke Babbitt. I began to be interested in Babbitt when I noticed his amazing shooting percentages in college. How often do you see a guy who can pull a 50-40-90 (50% Fg, 40% 3Pt, and 90%Ft)? Name the last guy who wasn't a guard to do that at any level....

What was more surprising was when I looked at his combine numbers. He was 4th overall in total vert (highest Non-guard), and 4rd highest in lane agility. Combine that with the fact that he did excellent on the bench press and he measured at almost 6-9 in shoes and he is one of the best interviewee's in the draft and I'm left with a few questions.

1. How is it possible that his team did not make it to the NCAA's?

2. Who was the last player to have Babbit's shooting percentages, leaping ability, and height?


memphisgriz731
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i'm with you on this one Luke

i'm with you on this one Luke Babbitt is a total mystery to me

like you said he a freak athletically and he can shoot the piss out of the ball

i dont know that i've ever seen a prospect like him before but i do think that he will have a productive NBA career

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He has shocked tons of people

He has shocked tons of people including myself, he has shown he has great athleticism to complement his great shooting stroke, he is an interesting prospect I can't really compare him now to anyone but I can see him helping a team out a lot as a player.

cyclo
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athleticism + elite shooter/scorer

Babbitt recorded the highest max vertical leap among all frontcourt prospects.

His lane agility score was the best among all players 6'7" or taller.

Some players have the athleticism, but not the shooting, while others have the shooting, but not the athleticism.

Babbitt combines both.

I would be interested to know if there's ever been a college frontcourt player that's been able to match Babbitt's level of athleticism + his level of shooting (50%fg 91.7%ft 41.6%3fg).

the27guy
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cylclo, thank you for

cylclo, thank you for agreeing with me... so why isn't he projected higher? If all I told you was that there was a guy who had those fg percentages, with that height and athleticism, you'd say he was the 1st overall pick, right?

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I think the reason why

I think the reason why Babbitt hasn't ranked higher is because of the conference he plays in. Not a lot of national exposure and people think he faced inferior competition. I think he is a really solid player and wouldn't complain if the Jazz signed him if their options at center don't pan out.

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Babbitt

I have been on the Luke Babbitt bandwagon now for weeks, I first started questioning the possibility of him being a player the Jazz could possible pick when I read that the Jazz were high on him. At first I was like no way, we need a PF with height, length and a defensive mindset, surely the Jazz aren't really looking at him seriously. Then the more I looked into him the more I liked him, watching his highlight video's just made me more intrigued, like has been pointed out his vert. was great, his times were very good, and if you seen his shooting percentages at the combine, they too were great. When he measured out at nearly 6'9" in shoes with a decent reach I said OK maybe we should look alittle closer.
To me the Jazz should draft Uhoh, if not him Monroe, if not Monroe then Babbitt. (Patterson if a PF is really what they want and Uhoh & Monroe are gone). The Jazz need a taller, longer, stronger SF, so CJ won't have to play that position, he is more suited to play the 2. Babbitt would be the perfect fit. I love how he can shoot from pretty much any where on the floor, he can dunk with ease, he has very good handles and can create off the dribble going left or right. He can pull up for the mid range jumper, which alot of kids now days can't do. I would love to see the Jazz get Udoh but if they ended up with Babbitt, I would be pretty satisfied that we got a pretty good player that can really help us out.

the27guy
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Captain L, I always respect

Captain L, I always respect your opinion, but I'm going to differ with you on my preference of guys a little. I'm going Babbit #1, Monroe #2, and Udoh #3. The only problem is that I really don't think either Babbit or Monroe will be around by then... so I think you're going to get your wish.

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Steve Novak and Nick Fazekas

Steve Novak and Nick Fazekas were 180 shooters. Have fun with that one. Babbitt was not a particularly good shooter when he faced good teams

1) Nevada was bad against good teams and did not guard anyone.

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Danny Green

Danny Green was in the 50/40/90 club his junior year at North Carolina. SF.

cyclo
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Danny Green was NOT in the

Danny Green was NOT in the 50/40/90 club in any year at UNC.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=27017

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Dirk Nowitzki

Dirk also did it his MVP season in 06-07. So far the only successful non-guard we have named outside of Larry Bird in the 80s

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sportsjunky

Dirk also did it his MVP season in 06-07. So far the only successful non-guard we have named outside of Larry Bird in the 80s
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I think you're right. I just looked up like 20 different players I thought might have done it and no luck.

Peja came pretty close in 2004. 48FG%, 43 3P%, 93 FT%.

Chris Mullin shot over 50% from the field on eight occasions. Shot over 40% from beyond the three point line in six different seasons and shot over 90% from the charity strip twice. But never all in the same season.

Surprisingly Jason Kapono came really close a few years ago. 49.4 from the field, 51.4 from 3 pt range and 89.2 from the line in 2007.

I have way too much time on my hands.

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the27guy

I hope your right, and we get Uhoh. Like I said before I wouldn't be upset if we drafted Babbitt, he is one of the most talented players in the draft. I think alot of people will be surprised at how good he will end up being. I think they see this white kid and don't think it's possible for him to be a top ten pick. Part of me would hate to see us pass him up even for Udoh or Monroe, because of his skill set, not many players have the total package like Babbitt.

the27guy
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Sorry sportsjunky, DGreen was

Sorry sportsjunky, DGreen was never a 50-40-90 guy... check it out....

http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/player/north-carolina/danny-green

Goodteamsplayedhard... thankyou for the Fazekas and Novak stats. I had a feeling one of those guys might have gotten close. Obviously the issue with both of them is that neither of them has any more athleticism than either you or me...

sportsjunky
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My bad 27 guy.

The site I read had him as a 50/40/90 guy half way through that season. LOL, I should have known better and checked my sources :-p

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superstar

I watched this mix this week and i think maybe the Knicks should offer him a max contract.

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stats

Going off just stats and the fact that they are both about 6'-7" white (yea i said it) SF's i am afraid of Babbit being Luke Jackson 2.0
Babbit: 50/41/92 with 22, 9, 2 in 37 MPG
Jackson: 49/44/86 with 21, 7, 4 in 34 MPG
Jackson also played in the PAC-10 which is a tougher conference and both of them had good numbers at the combine, BUT I am not sold just on stats so this post is simply to point out how similar one current prospect is to a past one.

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Babbitt doesn't play as

Babbitt doesn't play as athletic as he tested out at the combine. That's why some teams probably aren't high on him. Also, he is a poor defender and isn't that good off the dribble. He's going to have to be a spot-up shooter in the NBA, as his post game and off the dribble ability isn't likely to translate to the NBA very much. Add in the fact that Nevada was a mediocre team in a less than mediocre conference and you see why Babbitt has his share of questions.

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Re Therevenger

Are you trying to compare Scalabrine to Babbitt? Not even close, other than they're both white.

apb540
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iggy

That is the best description of Babbit I have heard. BTW having 7100+ posts makes you the person who wanks it the hardest to the NBA draft of anyone I have ever known lol. Do u take off work for the draft?

apb540
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I do

so I hope u do too haha

JNixon
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Nah, lol. I'm getting ready

Nah, lol. I'm getting ready to go to college now and I have alot of time on my hands. So I've just been watching games and posting on here alot. haha

apb540
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haha

I feel ya but college will give u even more time to post lol. Where u headin to school?

Captain L
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Iggy

I think Babbitt will be better than alot of people think, and I think his game will translate into a better NBA player than alot of people think. Think of Korver, Korver is a great outside shooter and has made his mark in the NBA as a great outside shooter. Babbitt can shoot like Korver but has alot more athleticism than Korver. If Korver could handle the ball like Babbitt and go left or right and pull up with a mid range jumper he would be a much better pro. Plus Babbitt is 2 inches taller, longer and stronger than Korver. Babbitt has a much more complete game than Korver.

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don't forget babbitt was a mcdonalds

all american, so he didn't come from nowhere

butidonthavemoney
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Babbitt

Babbitt is a freak athlete???

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

cyclo
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Babbitt does play athletic

Yes, Babbitt does play athletic and uses his above average athleticism to his advantage at the offensive end.

Another website mentioned that no SF in this year's draft spent more time going one-on-one than Babbitt. He's not a catch and shoot player or a player who comes off screens. He creates his own shot off the dribble and did so better than any SF in this year's draft.

That's the mark of one hell of an athlete.

He could be the Dirk Nowitski of the SF position.

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I like Babitt but I think

I like Babitt but I think because he did not guide his team anywhere, he will be compare unfairly to some other white players that did not cut it. I do hope he does not go too high because the higher he goes the less patience people will have with him. I like Babbitt a lot better than Hayward because I think Babbit can come right in and give you some solid minutes while Hayward will need time and may not pan out. Babbitt has enough skill sets and size combine with athleticism that he should be a solid 6th man of Rashard Lewis type scorer on a solid team. He does not have 1st or 2nd option in him to me.

butidonthavemoney
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HA

Ha.. Heh...

This joke isn't funny anymore.

cyclo
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Babbitt tested better than

Babbitt tested better than Aminu athletically.

Why can't Aminu jump as high as Babbitt?

I'd like an answer to that question.

cyclo
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Yes, Babbitt does play

Yes, Babbitt does play athletic and uses his above average athleticism to his advantage at the offensive end.

Another website mentioned that no SF in this year's draft spent more time going one-on-one than Babbitt. He's not a catch and shoot player or a player who comes off screens. He creates his own shot off the dribble and did so better than any SF in this year's draft.

That's the mark of one hell of an athlete.

butidonthavemoney
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The

Why can't Aminu jump as high as Babbitt?

Athleticism is about more than jumping high. Aminu is more explosive, and jumps faster. Aminu has a faster and higher second and third bounce.

Now, if a defender in the NBA (and there are a few) who would let Babbitt gather his feet and bend his knees properly, then yes. His high jump would come in handy. Aminu can use his athleticism to finish at the hoop, contest shots better, and chase down boards.

Keep in mind, that Aminu played on a better team, against better competition.

Also, take combine results with a grain of salt. Monta Ellis tested out as the worst athlete in his draft class (he came to the combine hungover).

Aminu is clearly the better athlete. The combine results really don't tell you anything. I really only look at the measurements. For bigs the standing reach is the most important measurement and for wings the wingspan is the most important measurement.

butidonthavemoney
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Hmmm

"Another website mentioned that no SF in this year's draft spent more time going one-on-one than Babbitt. He's not a catch and shoot player or a player who comes off screens. He creates his own shot off the dribble and did so better than any SF in this year's draft.

That's the mark of one hell of an athlete."

Noooo. Adam Morrison went one-on-one a lot, and Rudy Gay came off screens more. Your logic would suggest that Adam Morrison is more athletic than Rudy Gay.

cyclo
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complete offensive skill set

Based on his skill set, I think the best comparison is Paul Pierce or a SF version of Dirk Nowitski.

Offensively, Babbitt is the most skilled, most complete forward in this year's draft.

He's a post up player.
He's a face up player.
He's a mid range player.
He's a long range player.
He's a three-point shooter.
He's a creator off the dribble.
He's a one on one player.
He's a transition player.
He's a half court player.
He's a ball handler.
He's a passer.

butidonthavemoney
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Actually

He is not a very good transition player.

Also due to his poor lower body strength, it's hard to imagine him becoming a threat in the post at least during his first few years in the NBA.

He was able to school all of those mediocre athletes in the WAC one-on-one but I'm not sure that will translate too well either.

He is a solid ball-handler and passer, but only off of short, quick and direct dribbles.

I think that Hayward is a better fit for the Jazz off the bench. I think he is more of a system player and Babbitt is better at creating his own offense. I think they both have 15-18 PPG potential. Wouldn't mind taking either if we decide to go wing. (But I do NOT want Paul George!)

butidonthavemoney
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Found

Found this in an article about his workout with the Grizzlies.

"The downside with Babbitt is the legitimate concern about his strength and explosiveness. Babbitt tested well athletically at the draft combine, but matched here with really physical small forwards (Lance Stephenson and Quincy Pondexter) and longer true power forwards (Evans, Craig Brackens), those combine results didn't translate quite as much as I'd hoped. He's going to have to get stronger and quicker to make contested plays around the rim or defend slashing perimeter scorers."

http://www.memphisflyer.com/BeyondtheArc/archives/2010/06/14/workout-rep...

For the record, I'm not down on Babbitt. I would like him on the Jazz. He just isn't as athletic as you guys give him credit for.

cyclo
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the athletic testing is reliable

The athletic testing proved Morrison is not athletic and less athletic than Rudy Gay who tested very athletic. In the NBA, Morrison cannot create his own shot and cannot score one on one, because he is not athletic. This is not the case with Gay and will not be the case with Babbitt both of whom tested athletic.

In 2006:
Gay tested better than Morrison in leaping ability.
Gay tested better than Morrison in agility.

In 2010:
Babbitt tested better than Aminu in leaping ability.
Babbitt tested better than Aminu in agility.

Anyone who questions Babbitt's athleticism isn't questioning it based on facts, but on prejudices.

cyclo
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Babbitt is an excellent

Babbitt is an excellent transition player.

His pull-up jumper off the dribble is rated the best among all forwards in this year's draft.

He handles well.
He drives well.
He finishes well.
He passes well.

cyclo
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what is explosive

Aminu is more explosive? Really? Based on what facts?

If Aminu "explodes" to his max vertical of 33.5 inches, then how does Babbitt reach his max vertical of 37.5 inches? By slowly rising?

Sorry. The more explosive leaper is the leaper who jumps higher.

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If that's true, then Luke

If that's true, then Luke Jackson is more athletic than Andre Iguodala. After all, Jackson did record a higher vertical leap than Iguodala in 2004. Sure, Babbitt is more athletic than Morrison, but you'll be eating your words if you say he's more athletic than Aminu.

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Explosiveness isn't just

Explosiveness isn't just about leaping ability. Guys explode out of their first step as well as when they jump. Quickness off the ground, first-step explosiveness, and second/third jump quickness are all factors of explosiveness. Besides, guys can train and prepare for these type of tests, but the results don't always translate out onto the court.

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OrangeJuiceJones

Dude, I wish Quincey was here. He does not like the term "freak athlete" being thrown around...

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Also

I will give you three Mollom points, if you can somehow work this dude into your next tli232 Basement update.

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memphisgriz731 is the first

memphisgriz731 is the first person on my brand new "Non-Valid" list.

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I have to bump that post up

I have to bump that post up somehow. I'm trying to find by looking through my points, but it's buried.

Also, I have a feeling that you're not gonna believe this, but Mollom owes me tree fitty.

cyclo
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Once again, no facts, need facts

If you claim one player is more athletic than another, you'll have to provide facts to back up your assertion. Personal opinions don't cut it.

The NBA has determined that no step vertical, max vertical and agility testing are key factors towards determining a player's athleticism.

No step vertical is the key factor towards determining a player's bounce athleticism.

In 2004:
L.Jackson 26.5 inches
A.Iguodala 30.5 inches

In 2006:
Morrison 25.5 inches
Gay 33.0 inches

In 2010:
Aminu 27.5 inches
Babbitt 29.5 inches

Babbitt tested better than Aminu in no step vertical (bounce measurement).
Babbitt tested better than Aminu in max vertical (leaping ability).
Babbitt tested better than Aminu in lane agility (lower score = more agile).

Again, the NBA has determined these to be the most valid measurements of player athleticism and in these core areas, Babbitt topped Aminu in each category by a significant margin.

This doesn't even take into consideration the fact that Babbitt is the more skilled offensive player by far.

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Dude

This is a scouting site. You're supposed to scout. Find me one scout who thinks that Babbitt is more athletic than Aminu, and I will give you the deed to my haunted yacht.

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Now you're using no-step

Now you're using no-step verticals? Just all of a sudden, you're gonna pull no-step verticals out of your ass? With absolutely no prior mention of it in your previous posts? Wow, man. What are you gonna use next, sprints? Hand size?

Your method of using numbers as a way to determine a guy's athletic ability is exactly what I said it is: a method. A belief. A way of doing things. I like to actually watch the guys and compare their games and see how well they move/jump on the court. By the way, when did the NBA determine that "no step vertical, max vertical and agility testing are key factors towards determining a player's athleticism"? Would you care to provide a link?

You know what? That's all right, though. You're more than titled to your opinion, as am I. Neither one of us are right or wrong. I just hope you aren't so close-minded as to say somebody else is wrong just because they have a different opinion than you.

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I think the issue is that

I think the issue is that many times a player is labeled as non-athletic or not athletic enough and many times he is a white player. I haven't seen enough of each player to give my opinion on who I think is more athletic, but I think we can all agree that both players are somewhere in between. When I read that one of Babbitt's shortcomings was his lack of athleticism I wondered, if the combine numbers and watching video of his play doesn't indicate that he is athletic, what does?

I don't know that Babbitt is going to be a great NBA player. It remains to be seen how he stacks up against superior competition. From what I've read, he is a fierce competitor which is to his advantage, and he supposedly works really hard to improve his game. I don't see an Adam Morrison level bust here.

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The NBA has determined that

The NBA has determined that no step vertical, max vertical and agility testing are key factors towards determining player athleticism. In each instance, Babbitt topped Aminu.

I brought up the no step vertical because someone claimed Babbitt doesn't have the bounce of Aminu, but the no step vertical measures bounce and Babbitt topped Aminu in that category too. It's also a key measure of athleticism because only very athletic players have impressive no step verticals.

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