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Meditated States 13 years, 1 month ago.
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- Posted on: Tue, 05/21/2013 - 2:58am #49142
The8thDeadlySinParticipantOkay.. I think in a lot of drafts, comparisons get blown out of the water but I have never seen a guy be so closely related to an NBA player as Oladipo is to Tony Allen.
Please Explain to me how everyone thinks that Oladipo is going to be, offensivly, better than Allen???
Look at this:
Tony Allen’s last year of college numbers
PPG – 16.0
RPG – 5.5
Asst – 3.1
Steal – 2.1
Blck – 0.9Victor Oladipo’s last year of college numbers
PPG – 13.6
RPG – 6.3
Asst – 2.1
Steal – 2.2
Blck – 0.8Tony Allen lead his team in scoring with 2 additional NBA player on that team and 3 additional players averaging double digits..
Oladipo is second in scoring on his team with just 1 sure fire NBA player on the team and only 2 other players averaged double digits..
I think Victor will be fine but I just dont see him ever being a better scorer than Tony Allen based on what he has shown me thus far…
This may be a rant post but I get tired of seeing people say he is going to be Dwyane Wade, 21 PPG last year of college plus everything else that Victor showed.
0 - Posted on: Tue, 05/21/2013 - 3:00am #778621
B-ball fanParticipantIt also should be mentioned that Tony Allen shot 39% from beyond the arc on 2.4 attempts per game as a freshman. Oladipo shot 44% on 1.9 attempts per game as a junior.
That said, I do think Oladipo will become a better offensive player than Tony Allent. Just because they look similar does not mean they are identical or that their careers will progress in the same fashion. Oladipo’s jumpshot isn’t broken the way Allen’s was, and his handle could improve. I’m not saying he is going to be Dwayne Wade, but I think, with his tools and game, I would expect him to be able to score fairly well in the NBA. Not 20 ppt, but maybe 16 ppg in his prime and single digits early in his career. Plus, Tony Allen had the tools to be a better scorer than he became if he improved his shot and handle.
0 - Posted on: Tue, 05/21/2013 - 3:00am #778694
B-ball fanParticipantIt also should be mentioned that Tony Allen shot 39% from beyond the arc on 2.4 attempts per game as a freshman. Oladipo shot 44% on 1.9 attempts per game as a junior.
That said, I do think Oladipo will become a better offensive player than Tony Allent. Just because they look similar does not mean they are identical or that their careers will progress in the same fashion. Oladipo’s jumpshot isn’t broken the way Allen’s was, and his handle could improve. I’m not saying he is going to be Dwayne Wade, but I think, with his tools and game, I would expect him to be able to score fairly well in the NBA. Not 20 ppt, but maybe 16 ppg in his prime and single digits early in his career. Plus, Tony Allen had the tools to be a better scorer than he became if he improved his shot and handle.
0 - Posted on: Tue, 05/21/2013 - 3:13am #778623
JCliff24ParticipantOladipo Averaged 13.6 in 3 less minutes per game, and fewer shots per game. Victor shot 59.9 % compared to Allens 50.4 %. From 3pt Oladipo shot 44.1% vs 29.7% and from the FT line Oladipo shot 74.6% as Tony Allen shot 67.5%
In a nutshell, The reason why Oladipo’s PPG is less than Tony Allen is simply because he didn’t shoot often. He is a very effective scorer. Will be interesting to see how his rookie year goes.
0 - Posted on: Tue, 05/21/2013 - 3:13am #778696
JCliff24ParticipantOladipo Averaged 13.6 in 3 less minutes per game, and fewer shots per game. Victor shot 59.9 % compared to Allens 50.4 %. From 3pt Oladipo shot 44.1% vs 29.7% and from the FT line Oladipo shot 74.6% as Tony Allen shot 67.5%
In a nutshell, The reason why Oladipo’s PPG is less than Tony Allen is simply because he didn’t shoot often. He is a very effective scorer. Will be interesting to see how his rookie year goes.
0 - Posted on: Tue, 05/21/2013 - 3:28am #778625
JoeWolf1I watch a lot of Big 12 ball, so I saw a lot of Tony Allen as a collegiate player, and that being said, I think Oladipo does have a higher offensive ceiling. Allen was never much of a one on one player and got a lot of his points on breaks and cutting to the hoop. Lucas III was a really ball dominant backcourt mate and was definately the 1st option on the team.
Oladipo was in a similar situation being option 1 B next to Zeller, but I feel Oladipo is more aggressive attacking the bucket and has a more complete offensive game, especially shooting the ball from deep. Allen was a big dog in college and was still an effective scorer, but I don’t think Oladipo will make a living playing D and dropping 9 ppg in the NBA.
I’m not dogging the comparison, because in a best case scenario, I think Oladipo could be a Tony Allen caliber defender. His athletic ability and strength paired with his style of play give him the tools to do so, but I also think Victor could be that good of a defender, but also drop 12-15 ppg during his prime. I think he has the making of a future 3rd option, as he continues to gain reps from range, and that’s something Allen never was, nor will be.
0 - Posted on: Tue, 05/21/2013 - 3:28am #778698
JoeWolf1I watch a lot of Big 12 ball, so I saw a lot of Tony Allen as a collegiate player, and that being said, I think Oladipo does have a higher offensive ceiling. Allen was never much of a one on one player and got a lot of his points on breaks and cutting to the hoop. Lucas III was a really ball dominant backcourt mate and was definately the 1st option on the team.
Oladipo was in a similar situation being option 1 B next to Zeller, but I feel Oladipo is more aggressive attacking the bucket and has a more complete offensive game, especially shooting the ball from deep. Allen was a big dog in college and was still an effective scorer, but I don’t think Oladipo will make a living playing D and dropping 9 ppg in the NBA.
I’m not dogging the comparison, because in a best case scenario, I think Oladipo could be a Tony Allen caliber defender. His athletic ability and strength paired with his style of play give him the tools to do so, but I also think Victor could be that good of a defender, but also drop 12-15 ppg during his prime. I think he has the making of a future 3rd option, as he continues to gain reps from range, and that’s something Allen never was, nor will be.
0 - Posted on: Tue, 05/21/2013 - 3:33am #778627
treytalkssports.comParticipantEverything you said is true, but the eye test says:
1. Allen’s shooting stroke is horrific and as he gets further from the hoop, it gets more forced.
Olidipo’s is pretty smooth, and stays consistent no matter the distance.
This indicates that Olidipo has the potential to be a better NBA outside shooter than Allen.2. Wade was the focus of his offense at Marquette.
Indiana spread the scoring around in their offense, which gave Olidipo less touches. He got points off ball by cutting to the basket and hustle plays, which is similar to how Wade is getting some of his points next to Lebron. I think Olidipo and Wade now are more similar than Wade from 5 years ago, when Wade was more of a primary ball-handler.0 - Posted on: Tue, 05/21/2013 - 3:33am #778700
treytalkssports.comParticipantEverything you said is true, but the eye test says:
1. Allen’s shooting stroke is horrific and as he gets further from the hoop, it gets more forced.
Olidipo’s is pretty smooth, and stays consistent no matter the distance.
This indicates that Olidipo has the potential to be a better NBA outside shooter than Allen.2. Wade was the focus of his offense at Marquette.
Indiana spread the scoring around in their offense, which gave Olidipo less touches. He got points off ball by cutting to the basket and hustle plays, which is similar to how Wade is getting some of his points next to Lebron. I think Olidipo and Wade now are more similar than Wade from 5 years ago, when Wade was more of a primary ball-handler.0 - Posted on: Tue, 05/21/2013 - 3:42am #778629
theballerwayParticipantIt’d interesting to know who Tony Allen was being compared to. Since his celtic days his offense hasnt improved much although he plays much more under control and selectively on the offensive end. Hes always been a tenacious defendef though.
The camparisons to guys like Wade i can see being based on his explosive drives off thhe curl or a good cut but maybe thats it . I cant say I look at him and say to my self – that was aTony Allen play/move
If Olidipo can show the ability to even initiate the offense I feel that could increase his value as a player as I cant see him playing small forward. He occasionally did ths at Indiana but not much
0 - Posted on: Tue, 05/21/2013 - 3:42am #778702
theballerwayParticipantIt’d interesting to know who Tony Allen was being compared to. Since his celtic days his offense hasnt improved much although he plays much more under control and selectively on the offensive end. Hes always been a tenacious defendef though.
The camparisons to guys like Wade i can see being based on his explosive drives off thhe curl or a good cut but maybe thats it . I cant say I look at him and say to my self – that was aTony Allen play/move
If Olidipo can show the ability to even initiate the offense I feel that could increase his value as a player as I cant see him playing small forward. He occasionally did ths at Indiana but not much
0 - Posted on: Tue, 05/21/2013 - 3:49am #778639
jjbutler73ParticipantExcept, to an extent, shooting percentages. Different leagues, different coaches, different teammates, different styles. People make the closest comparison they can. No two players are identical. If you don’t like the comparison, offer a new one.
0 - Posted on: Tue, 05/21/2013 - 3:49am #778712
jjbutler73ParticipantExcept, to an extent, shooting percentages. Different leagues, different coaches, different teammates, different styles. People make the closest comparison they can. No two players are identical. If you don’t like the comparison, offer a new one.
0 - Posted on: Tue, 05/21/2013 - 4:53am #778661
mikeyvthedonParticipantAgree with the original poster and think it is totally viable to ask, as I have seen Oladipo compared to Dwyane Wade (His name is spelled "Dwyane". Yes, I know it is weird, just seeing that mistake a lot), David Thompson (who was a FAR superior offensive option, as is Dwyane Wade) and Dion Waiters (who also was at the very least a better all-around offensive player). Oladipo is a more explosive athlete than Allen and I believe has more offensive potential than Allen had at the pro level, if anything at least cleaner shooting mechanics. Still, I find the Allen comparison much more viable due to his defense being far more of a likely factor than his offense.
Oladipo had a fantastic season last year and people will point to his improvement plus value to a talented Hoosiers squad. However, the Wade comparisons are over the top. Dwyane Wade was a far superior ball handler, passer and had ability to penetrate that Oladipo has not come close to showing. Dwyane Wade got to the FT stripe twice as much as Oladipo in college, it is not just something he picked up once he got to the league.
Oladipo had a much harder time creating offense for himself off of the dribble. People will point to his crossing up Tim Hardaway Jr., throwing it down (on a beautifully set screen by Cody Zeller on an out of position Mitch McGary) and say "well that is him creating off the dribble". How many times did that happen this season? I feel his high shooting % this season will also lead people to believe it is due to raw offensive efficiency. While it is good that Victor was fantastic at picking his spots, I think his shooting % is also attribution to him having a hard time getting offense for himself. Cody Zeller may have had a hard time with Cuse’s zone, however why did it hold Victor to only 6 shots? Getting shots is key and Victor did not show much ability to create shots for himself beyond hustle plays and cuts.
Oladipo’s outside shooting and offensive efficiency took leaps and bounds his junior season, just nowhere close to Dwyane Wade or David Thompson territory. Combine numbers be damned, those guys were just flat out better scorers and had far superior ability to create shots. Tony Allen is honestly one of the more viable comparisons out there, because it is really hard to find someone that fits Oladipo as an offensive counterpart. If you want a comparison to one of the better players Oladipo could maybe become down the line, Alvin Robertson might not be a bad player to look up. Oladipo certainly has a lot of potential, just needs A LOT of work to become a superstar like David Thompson or Dwyane Wade, not to mention an All-Star SG who can be a second option scorer on the NBA level.
0 - Posted on: Tue, 05/21/2013 - 4:53am #778735
mikeyvthedonParticipantAgree with the original poster and think it is totally viable to ask, as I have seen Oladipo compared to Dwyane Wade (His name is spelled "Dwyane". Yes, I know it is weird, just seeing that mistake a lot), David Thompson (who was a FAR superior offensive option, as is Dwyane Wade) and Dion Waiters (who also was at the very least a better all-around offensive player). Oladipo is a more explosive athlete than Allen and I believe has more offensive potential than Allen had at the pro level, if anything at least cleaner shooting mechanics. Still, I find the Allen comparison much more viable due to his defense being far more of a likely factor than his offense.
Oladipo had a fantastic season last year and people will point to his improvement plus value to a talented Hoosiers squad. However, the Wade comparisons are over the top. Dwyane Wade was a far superior ball handler, passer and had ability to penetrate that Oladipo has not come close to showing. Dwyane Wade got to the FT stripe twice as much as Oladipo in college, it is not just something he picked up once he got to the league.
Oladipo had a much harder time creating offense for himself off of the dribble. People will point to his crossing up Tim Hardaway Jr., throwing it down (on a beautifully set screen by Cody Zeller on an out of position Mitch McGary) and say "well that is him creating off the dribble". How many times did that happen this season? I feel his high shooting % this season will also lead people to believe it is due to raw offensive efficiency. While it is good that Victor was fantastic at picking his spots, I think his shooting % is also attribution to him having a hard time getting offense for himself. Cody Zeller may have had a hard time with Cuse’s zone, however why did it hold Victor to only 6 shots? Getting shots is key and Victor did not show much ability to create shots for himself beyond hustle plays and cuts.
Oladipo’s outside shooting and offensive efficiency took leaps and bounds his junior season, just nowhere close to Dwyane Wade or David Thompson territory. Combine numbers be damned, those guys were just flat out better scorers and had far superior ability to create shots. Tony Allen is honestly one of the more viable comparisons out there, because it is really hard to find someone that fits Oladipo as an offensive counterpart. If you want a comparison to one of the better players Oladipo could maybe become down the line, Alvin Robertson might not be a bad player to look up. Oladipo certainly has a lot of potential, just needs A LOT of work to become a superstar like David Thompson or Dwyane Wade, not to mention an All-Star SG who can be a second option scorer on the NBA level.
0 - Posted on: Tue, 05/21/2013 - 5:24am #778674
JNixonParticipantOldaipo has a better natural jumper than Allen, I dont think Oladipo will be more than average as an NBA shooter either. Oladipo is also a more polished offensive player than Allen was. Oladipo should never be more than a 3rd or 4th option scorer in the NBA, but at his best he could definitely be a guy whose ppg is in the teens. I do think he will have to keep working on his game to do so, but he seems like a very hard worker considering how far his game has come since I 1st watched him as a Fr.
0 - Posted on: Tue, 05/21/2013 - 5:24am #778749
JNixonParticipantOldaipo has a better natural jumper than Allen, I dont think Oladipo will be more than average as an NBA shooter either. Oladipo is also a more polished offensive player than Allen was. Oladipo should never be more than a 3rd or 4th option scorer in the NBA, but at his best he could definitely be a guy whose ppg is in the teens. I do think he will have to keep working on his game to do so, but he seems like a very hard worker considering how far his game has come since I 1st watched him as a Fr.
0 - Posted on: Tue, 05/21/2013 - 7:10am #778820
Meditated StatesParticipantIs a way better shooter. Better athelete too. Much greater potential.
0 - Posted on: Tue, 05/21/2013 - 7:10am #778746
Meditated StatesParticipantIs a way better shooter. Better athelete too. Much greater potential.
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