first off, good win by the Celts.
Now to spew my mind on the Talk of the nation, the Heat.
=LeBron had a LeBron-like game. Give or take in certain aspects of the game.
=Wade played very badly to say the least.
=Bosh had no impact on the game at all, and disappeared for literally the whole game.
=The Heats closeout D was horrendus...Shooters were constantly getting fabuolous looks and they played Allen horribly coming off screens. Ultimately, this cost them the game.
=I see a problem here already.... A fairly big one..------> If LeBron is completely taking over in the ladder stages of the game, you feed him till the fat lady sings. Instead, down 5 itt a little less than a minute rmaining they give Wade the ball and it resuls in a miss. Keep in mind, he had a horrible game to that point contrary to LeBron who was unstoppable down the stretch...I just don't see hy Wade got the ball in tha situation one bit.
=The Heat had probaly the worst possible game they will have all year. First game, no chemistry, injured players, missing players. etc.... And they still had a legit chance to win the game against a team of Bostons caliber. Amazing, even for such a bad game....
1. Lebron James is the Miami Heat point guard. Why is Arroyo starting? Without Miller you need someone at guard but Id rather have Jones for now
2. Anthony and Big Z played well at the 5 and Bosh had nothing going no matter who he was matched against
3. They played better without Wade and Bosh on the floor in the third. It worked with CLE in the reg season last year. This will change as the season goes on though and they start getting everyone involved in the right situations
4. Big Baby killed Miami on offense and Boston looked great on D and O for 90% of the game
As Indiana said on the other thread, Wade and Lebron's games don't compliment each other very well right now. But personally I think they can and will. Both are very used to having the ball all the time, which in their previous situations was the best way for their team to win. Now they need to learn to play off of each other.
Going off of what I just said, and assuming that Lebron is going to be the primary ball handler, I think this is an adjustment that they ought to be able to make. The good thing is that Wade and James both, especially James have very good court vision, which should make this easier. While it will be an adjustment, it will be more of learning how to integrate themselves into a fluid offense rather than having to learn how to pass.
I do think though, that there are going to bet times when they just need to let Lebron take over. I know someone(I can't remember who, LLperez?) said that that strategy doesn't work in the playoffs, and my counter would be that strategy doesn't work all the time. Lebron in isolation is the most unstoppable force in the league, and I think it will be even more effective when it is a part of his team's game plan as opposed to their only game plan.
I also so glimpses of potential for the new big 3, both Lebron and Dwade made some very nice passes to each other, like that one oop that wade couldn't finish. And I think eventually will develop a very nice chemistry.
Also, Bosh needs to hit mid range jumpers. The other two were creating them for him and he just was't finishing. Bosh being a deadly third option is going to be the key to their success moving forward.
All in all, Miami wasn't particularly impressive, but I think there were definite glimpses of potential, and I think they will evolve into a great team as the season moves on.
i agree with most of what you say. I doubt the heat play this bad again all year. Lebron does need to cut down on turnovers though, lots of sloppy passes. But otherwise, he was the only guy who brought it.
2 legit long term concerns are size(which everyone knew coming in) and the fact all 3 of the stars need the ball in their hands and for the floor to clear out and give them time to go one on one. Its gonna be hard for all 3 to excell together like that. And one of them have great post games, which means 3 guys settling for jumpers or going all the way to the hoop which is predictable to gaurd
yeah, I think Arroyo is fairly horrible also...If you suck as bad as him you should aleast be able to knock down a midrange J..He can't
Once LeBron and Wade hit their stride, this will be a totally different team. Getting Miller back wouldn't hurt at all, either.
Did Miami give up their first round pick this year? I think if they can grab a solid role player in the late first or early second round it will really help them going forward.
- LeBron, Wade and Bosh are all ball stoppers... That needs to change. LeBron and Wade both have the same strengths and weaknesses. Neither has a post game and neither is very good off of the ball. That's a problem and I think people are underestimating how long it's going to take for them to build chemistry. They don't compliment each other. Both of them have to sacrifice their games and I think Wade is going to have to sacrifice the most.
- Size. I don't think Anthony and Big Z can get it done in the post. Then add in the fact Bosh will probably finish games at center. Size is going to be a problem for this team all year.
- Spoelstra. I think Charles or Kenny said it, but he needs to figure out a rotation, which will come with time.
Every away game is going to be a circus and they're going to get teams best shot every night. Every away game is going to be playoff type atmosphere and they're going to get boo'd viciously. It'll be interesting to see how they deal with that pressure.
@Indianabasektball, you have been very critical of the Heat, how would you assign roles and make them fit together? By the way I'm not trying to be facetious, I'm just curious.
One thing I would say, is that Lebron is much better than Wade at knocking down outside shots, so I think some Wade to LBJ drive and kicks might be effective.
Oh and also, I think Spolestra deserves a chance, but I think having Riley Coach might be a good thing, as he knows how to handle teams with all-star casts.
Haslem played to his expectations, but no one else really did. When Lebron "took over" in the 3rd, he was basically playing with the 2nd unit and taking all the shots. That will only get you so far. Wade was kind banged up and rusty, I expect him to be playing much better by the end of the week. I agree with a lot of you who said they need to establish a half court game, when they weren't running they were struggling. I don't know what they should do with Bosh, except run pick and roll or pick and pop situations for him in the half court. He really doesn't have a post game and was getting shoved around by everyone in green and white tonight. Might as well use his jump shooting and length to their advantage by running the pick and roll.
Haslem played great? More like solid imo. At best.
Lebron is the one who got them back in this game, and it is irrevelant who was on the court with him hen he did. IMO
I'm not dogging on Lebron, and I changed what I said about Haslem as soon as I read it. The reason I said that is that he wasn't working with the "big 3" to put up offense, it was very reminiscant of when he was in Cleveland 3 years ago
I guess thats true, but only because they weren't putting up offense at all even when they got good looks.
Im just sayin...
Here are a few things I'd do:
- More ball movement and making the right pass instead of the pass that'll get you the assist. Both LeBron and Wade's games are too statistics oriented in my opinion.
- Activity. LeBron needs to move when the ball is in Wade or Bosh's hands, and vice versa. Too much standing around and watching. There was one great play where Bosh spinned off of KG and caught the alley oop. More plays like that. Spoelstra needs to find more ways to get them easy baskets instead of just isolations all of the time.
- Quicker decisions. Wade is going to have to be ready to catch and shoot, or move the ball. The same goes for LeBron and Bosh. The holding the ball for majority of the shot clock needs to stop. It's too stagnate and predictable. Leaving your teammate two seconds to make a decision isn't good basketball.
- More Eddie House and less Carlos Arroyo. Due to LeBron and Wade being the primary ball handlers anyway, Arroyo is irrellivant. And when Arroyo is on the floor, he needs to push the ball. He's too slow.
- I'd also like to see Wade and LeBron run the pick and roll. I don't think we saw that all game.
- Bosh needs to be more aggressive in the post. LeBron also needs to get a post game. Somebody having a post game would open the floor up.
- I'd also like to see LeBron and Wade defend more aggressively on the perimeter. Chalmers too when he returns. I think creating turnovers and getting out in transition would be a great idea for this team, because I see them struggling to score consistently in the half-court vs great defensive teams with size.
its gonna be interesting to watch all season.
@Indianabasketball, I think those are all great points.
No one has brought it up on this thread, but I have seen people say that Wade and Lebron will clash in the locker room. I think fortunately for the Heat this won't be a problem. I think what they do have going for them is that the two are friends and want to play together. They know what they signed up for. I think a lot of those things Indianabasketball pointed out will come as they develop better chemistry overtime.
I think it is probably a hard adjustment for both Wade and Lebron to not dominate the ball. Both were in a situation before where they needed to do that in order for their teams to be successful, and that is no longer the case. They need to adjust to playing with other similarly talented players, and I think that that will come over time.
In retrospect, I think it was foolish to expect this team fire on all cylanders from day one, they have to many adjustments to make, new pieces to fit together and kinks to work out. When they do start clicking though, look out.
Anyone noticed that its the fourth qtr of a tight game in Por..And nobody gives a crap.
Hey, Rudy Fernandez is actually playing.
Oh, I'd also like to add that I actually think it was good for them to play the Celtics on the road for their first game. This way they know how a good team will exploit their weaknesses and can work on them. Had they started off playing the Raptors, they likely would have dominated immediately and possibly faltered when tested against a good team.
i just turned it to the pho/por game. Armon johnson looks good.
That's another thing... People always say they had to do it in order for their teams to be successful. That's true to a certain extent, but I also just don't think either is good playing off of the ball. It's literally a weakness in their games. I mean, did you see LeBron try to post up Pierce? He looked awful. He and Wade both just literally stand on the perimeter when the ball isn't in their hands. Everything Wade tried to do tonight was off of the dribble.
LeBron was better with a bunch of scrub shooters and role players than he was with Wade and Bosh on the floor. And it's because they spread the floor for him and he took all of the shots... Kicking it out to shooters when he couldn't get to the rim. That's great for his statistics and getting wins in the regular season, but we all know it'll fail in the playoffs.
when you are shooting 3-13 and 4-16 thats on you. The chemstry will come, and its mostly there already, but everyone needs to get healthy and learn the system, then they will flourish...It has nothing to do with their individual games.. at all.
I don't think the outlook is quite as bad you are suggesting. Neither are good at playing off the ball because they've never had to do it before. But they are both among the top 3-4 players in the world and they will adjust. It's not like they are both so old and set in their ways that they can't learn to adjust their games. They want to win, that's why they are playing together and I'm sure they will try to make the necessary adjustments. As I said early, maybe Riley is the guy that ought to help them do that.
I think you need to give them a chance to develop some chemistry before you judge them quite so harshly.
It has everything to do with their individual games. Each player tried to go one on one vs the Celtics defense. They made it easy.
I'm not judging them. I think they'll adjust. I just don't think the transition will be as easy as people think. I mean, 72 wins this season? No way... They basically had a championship celebration after landing LeBron and Bosh via free-agency. And I don't think the championship is a given for them this season. I'm not even sure they can get to the Finals.
Ok, than I agree with that. I do think that the Heat will be title contenders this year, and most likely have the best record in the east, but I do think they will be the most deadly in the years to come, once they have more experience playing together and possibly the chance to make some solid picks in the late first and early second round.
I think one thing that's obvious is that there are still no easy dunks and layups against the Celtics.....playing one on one will not work against that team idgaf if they're all 50....
The problem I see with the heat they need a real PG 14 turnovers between wade and lebron that is unacceptable. It was actually pretty amazing that they got it down to 3 points the way they were playing and whats up with bosh he didnt show me anything I know its the first game but he looked lost out there.
If James wanted to play PG he would be the best PG in the league so thats not a problem.
The biggest problem here is that I'm not sure Riley and Wade TRULY understand what they have brought to Miami. Miami is now James' town and everybody else just lives in it. I know Wade is a lil out of shape, but was it not obvious watching this game that Lebron James is in a class all his own shared with only Kobe.
My major observation is that I don't think James ever needed another superstar to win just better overall players around him. He did better with Bosh and Wade on the bench because he was most comfortable he didn't have to conform all he had to do then was dominate and thats what he does best.
If this team don't revolve around Lebron, which it will, it will fail.
This is pretty simple, the Heat are most dangerous when the ball is in Lebrons hands.
Another observation is if anybody taped this game go back and listen to the commentary who were anti- Lebron all game. Every foul that went Bron's way they said should of went the other way. They were very critical of everything he did.
And Wade literally cried all game and had a sour face he was like a little whiny kid tonight who is just starting to understand that it is going to be hard to see the sun in Miami nowadays living in Lebron's shadow. But hey Wade got what he wanted I guess.
This is going to be very interesting all year, the Heat played very bad tonight but they would of beat almost 90% of the league anyway because it was a very physical game and other teams don't have the close out experience or the defense or size that Boston does.
The Celtics played like game 7 of the finals tonight and will be playing with a chip on their should all year.
With Lebron casting Wade and Bosh in his shadow and taking over this Miami team which will be a top 3 team all year with the ability to become the best team once their timing and chemistry come together their should be no doubt about BRON being the best player in the world during the regular season.
And I never noticed how little of a post game Bosh has...That dude has barely no moves on the low block and KG bad knees and all owned him.
wade looked rusty, bosh looked injured (even tho he isnt) and he was scared to take it to the rack settling for jumpers (after two missed jump shots, u gotta go to the hoop) and there were a lot of unforced turnovers, for all the hype, they didnt live up to it, but give credit to the celts, they took care of business at home like a team that was minutes away from winning in the finals should do
I agree with you on the commentary thing. You can tell those guys and probably all of the older guys are hoping the Heat fail.
A good PG makes a team, they get others involved and really control tempo. Miami either needs Chalmers to develop or play Lebron at PG and hope for the best cause they need that PG to hold their team together.
lebron and wade are the pg's. I dont care if arroyo has "pg" next to his position title, lebron has always basically been a pg.
suprised no mention of how rondo dominated this game with out having to score because of how badly the miami pg played d on him
I kind of wonder why Mario did not get any PT. He is not as quick or athletic as Rondo, but he has a nice jumper and was always known for his defense. I was a little disappointed he did not at least get a chance to play, must be in Spoelstra's dog house. The Heat most definitely need to work on moving the ball as Indiana Basketball points out time and time again, that is definitely true. But, one thing that is evident is, this team will more than likely never be out of a game. I do not want to take anything away from the Celtics, they played great defense, hit huge shots and had role guys come in and step up. Also, did anyone think Paul Pierce was really hurt from that LeBron thing? As soon as he went to the locker room, I knew it would be a huge mistake to leave him open as a trailer (which he somehow gets to happen anyway). But, even with those huge shots from the Celtics, with Rondo finding everyone for assists (maybe the PG thing will not work out, but they will more than likely get Wade to guard him eventually, maybe even James on Allen and James Jones/Mike Miller on Pierce), the Celtics should have just destroyed this game. I so badly wanted the Boston crowd to eat it when they started chanting "Overrated", and Miami had them $hitting themselves when they almost came back. It was quite obvious that Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh had fairly awful debuts, and I do not know how much I would blame that on LeBron James. LeBron I felt was very much letting both of those guys try and find their flow, and when that very obviously was not happening, that is when he started to get a little more assertive, which kept them in the game. This was such a tough first game for them, it reminded of the Cavs going through the same thing last year (Though it might have been in Cleveland, but still tough to play Boston none the less). Wade was quite obviously out of rhythym, and I think that might have been the worst I have ever seen him play. But, for as poorly as the Heat played as a team (LeBron also played very poorly and made some really bad decisions), the fact that they were in it until about a minute left in this game has to show you the potential upside. As much as Bosh hates playing Center, he has done it time and time again, so yes it will suck to guard Shaq in spot time, but that is why Joel Anthony will be in their for the start of the game, they have a behemoth like Ilgauskas (who I thought looked pretty good honestly) and they also will have the fact that Shaq will more than likely play less than half of the game. Honestly, the only thing that scares me about the Celtics downlow is Shaq. Jermaine O'Neal can be fairly neautralized by Bosh, Kendrick Perkins as well and with Big Baby, hopefully Udonis Haslem will play his usually stalwart defense. But thinking about it, Mike Miller might fit in perfectly to that Heat starting 5. Arroyo is a great offensive player, but he is a back-up PG and Rondo made him look ridiculous. Still, I do not give up on the Heat after one game. They have a lot to work on, and looked completely awful during the first 3 quarters, but they were progressing more and more as the game went on. They definitely do need to try and run more, and LeBron/Bosh should really work on their post games, which should develop as the season progresses. But a line-up of Wade, LeBron, Miller, Haslem and Bosh at the end of a game is nothing to scoff at. Heck, with James Jones (a shooter I have always loved and a great role player) in place of Mike Miller, they gave a Boston team that had dominated the paint a run for their money. Also encouraging for the Heat was their play on the offensive glass, they kept a lot of possessions going. Also, I am guessing Jerry Stackhouse is just working himself into game shape, but he could be a very nice piece for the Heat. I thought Jerry still looked very good last year on the Bucks, and he might be a person who could try and keep up with Ray Allen so LeBron can beast on Paul Pierce like he has been doing pretty consistently for the last while.
Bosh played horrible, Wade couldnt hit a shot and Lebron played a decent game by his standards, but Boston barely won the game... This a preview of how could the Heat can and will be, this was their FIRST game together and it was aganist the most toughest defensive team in the league at home..
Its intresting that people take so nuch information off of one game, you would have thought the Heat was never in the game reading some of these comments.. Anytime you put together such a dynamic trio of players it takes time for them to understand their roles and gel together... I actually think that they played very well on defense and once thy develop some offensive cohesion they will be a tough team to beat..
Lebron and Wade will figure it out, certain people act like they lack the IQ or will to make adjustments and get better over the course of the season.. Both players are ball dominant and struggled to play off the dribble, but thats all about understand each other tendencies and playing off of each other..
I would give the Heats performance a C...
this is why I don't know why Mario Chalmers never saw the floor....I'm expecting big things from him this year, if he doesn't come through they're fugged....is hurt or something and I don't know it????