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Legacies

Hale
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Legacies

Knicksboy brought up a nice point on twitter. Where does this ring put LeBron and Wade on the All Time list? We both agreed at about Top 40 for Wade, and LeBron is probably in the Top 15. What do you guys think?


Kayjay
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Thats tough

I say why evaluate it right now. We should wait until the guy is atleast past his prime. There is no garuntee that he will/or wont win more rings. But if I was taking a shot in the dark, he's got to be in the top ten all time. Hard to argue against a 3 time mvp, and NBA champ.

Meditated States
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Do you work for ESPN?

? Legacies?Really?

Hale
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I see what you're saying but

I see what you're saying but it's going to be talked about anyway, so I thought I'd bring it up. I know I can't name 15 players who are better then LeBron James, and like you said he might even be in the Top 10.

Edit: @SCOUT4REAL

What do you want me to call it? Where do Wade and James rank All Time? That's 7 more words then I'd need. And I hardly watch ESPN, let alone work for it.

For_Never_Ever
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I think a player needs

I think a player needs atleast four rings to be top ten all time.

Hale
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So Larry Bird isn't in your

So Larry Bird isn't in your Top 10? Or Oscar? Or Wilt?

Edit: Or Jerry West?

For_Never_Ever
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Ok I didn't think about it.

Ok I didn't think about it. Lol

My dislike for Lebron is getting to me again. My bad.

Nbanflguy
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I would def have Lebron in

I would def have Lebron in the top 10

For_Never_Ever
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I do think when his carreer

I do think when his carreer is done he will likely be in the top 5 disussion.

frogman
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For_Never_Ever - That's one

For_Never_Ever - That's one of the dumbest things I've read on this site.. wow

For_Never_Ever
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Good insult, cool story bro.

Good insult, cool story bro.

surve
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History will be kinder to

History will be kinder to Lebron. He obviously is a top 15 player. The ring is a small part of his legacy IMO. What will ultimately weigh heavy in his favor and consideration when compared against others is his impact on winning. What heights he took Cleveland to and the depths that they sank to after his departure. He was a true MVP who just needed a little more help. Whether he will ever be considered in the conversation of the GOAT is for time to tell....but right now, I think its safe to say he is what Roy Jones was to boxing....the most talented individual the sport has ever seen and the most unselfish superstar of the sport. I cant think of another sports figure who had as much hype and expectation to actually live up to it all as Lebron has. Love him or hate him, we are priveleged to be witnessing an all-time great sports icon.

FastAndFurious
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3MVPS Championship

3MVPS

Championship Ring

Finals MVP

27.6 PPG, 7.0 APG, 7.2 RPG(Career Stats, 9 yrs)

27 Yrs OLD!!!!

Yea man dude is already top 10 of all time.....all he can do is go up from here.

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He's not top 10. Michael,

He's not top 10.

Michael, Magic, Bird, Kareem, Wilt, Russell, Shaq, Kobe, Oscar, Jerry West

and possibly Duncan, Hakeem....may be missing a guy or two

I'd put him around the 15 range at this point, but it really doesn't matter he's only half way through his career.

IndianaBasketball
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Well, when you look at his

Well, when you look at his career body of work, he's clearly top ten.

Now, he'll only continue to add to his resume. It's all about how high he can go now. I don't think he'll reach MJ when it's all said and done, but I think he can put himself in the conversation with the other great ones like Magic and Larry.

I look at LeBron similar to I look at Oscar Robertson right now.

Hale
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IndianaBasketball

Who is in your Top 10?

IndianaBasketball
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@Grandmama Damn... Well, now

@Grandmama

Damn... Well, now that you name names lol. I'll change "clearly" to "arguably" top ten.

When it's all said and done, he'll be top ten though.

For_Never_Ever
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Do you guys think he will

Do you guys think he will pass Bird and Magic ?

Grandmama
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@ Indiana Yeah, when it's all

@ Indiana

Yeah, when it's all said and done he will be top 10, barring a Jay Williams type injury

Hale
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It's possible. I expect him

It's possible. I expect him to be Top 5 for sure when he retires, maybe even #2. But he has a long way to go to get there.

IndianaBasketball
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Ranking top ten is tough

1. Michael Jordan

2. Kareem Abdul-Jabar

3. Magic Johnson

4. Bill Russell

5. Larry Bird

6. Wilt Chamberlain

7. Tim Duncan

8. Kobe Bryant

9. Shaquille O'Neal

10. Oscar Robertson

IndianaBasketball
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LeBron is knocking on the

LeBron is knocking on the door to enter top ten, but it's clear he'll be there when his career is over.

Getting into top five is going to be tough though. I could see him realistically getting to #6.

For_Never_Ever
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Do you guy's think he can and

Do you guy's think he can and will pass Kobe? Also who will go down as the better winner between Kevin Durant and Lebron James ? Really tough questions I can't decide on. Because these two will be seeing each other again in the finals.

IndianaBasketball
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I could probably switch Kobe

I could probably switch Kobe and Duncan places just because I feel like Duncan has slowed down with age, while Kobe still looks like a superstar. Kobe has him on being dominant for a much longer time period.

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Yeah he's top 12 my top 12 in

Yeah he's top 12 my top 12 in no order is mj bird magic shaq wilt bill Oscar Kobe Kareem duncan and bron I put him slightly over the dream which is hard but lets give bron credit the man has been a flat out baller since he came in his ring just puts the icing on it. The dream was a great to but bron just has him beat imo even tho dream did help him with post moves

anthonymatthew24
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my top ten

1. Micheal Jordan

2. Magic Johnson

3. Kareem Abdul jabbar

4. Wilt Chamberlain

5. Bill Russell

6. Kobe Bryant

7. Larry Bird

8. Tim Duncan

9. Shaquille O'neal

10. Oscar Robertson

No particular order, no matter what goes down when its all said and done Lbron will be on this list as well as Kevin Durant.

anthonymatthew24
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@indianabaskeball

I love your list I totally agree after I wrote mine I noticed they were the same LOL

Memphis Madness
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LeBron has 3 MVP awards, a

LeBron has 3 MVP awards, a title, a Finals MVP, a gold medal and will work on another one. In only 9 seasons so far. So he is up there with some more time left on the clock. He is a top 10-15 guy all time.

I have a Top Four (based on talent, MVP's, and winning) of Michael Jordan, Bill Russell, Kareem, and Magic.
Other six in the top ten are Bird, Wilt, Big O, and Shaq. Those are 8. Last two in is between Kobe, LeBron, Duncan, and Jerry West.
I will take Kobe based on his 5 titles and scoring feats and then LeBron for the 3 MVP's, title, Finals MVP, scoring title, and gold medal.
Duncan and West along with Hakeem, Moses Malone, Karl Malone round out my top 15.

I have LeBron in the Top Ten but of course there are some other guys who have a great case. The real goal for him is to get into that top Four with Magic, Michael, Kareem, and Russell. For him to get there I think he needs a couple more of titles and two more MVP awards.

He just finished his 9th season. MJ won his first title at the same age as LeBron. Jordan won his last title in his 14th season. That would give LBJ five more years. I think he has a shot at 3 more titles and 3 more MVP awards in the next five years. That would tie him with Kareem for a record 6 MVP's. Four titles would put him past several greats and tie him with Shaq and Duncan, trailing only Kobe, Magic, Kareem, Jordan, and Bill Russell.

IndianaBasketball
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IF you did a Mount Rushmore

IF you did a Mount Rushmore of the NBA, it'd probably be:

Michael Jordan, Magic Johnson, Larry Bird and Bill Russell/Kareem-Abdul Jabar.

I just don't think LeBron can get on there.

ChrisCross
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I only can jude modern era

I only can judge modern era guys, so like anyone who played majority of their career in late 80's and after.

Lets see, in no order

Jordan

Bird

Johnson

Shaq

Kobe

Hakeem

Duncan

Lebron

Barkley

For_Never_Ever
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This likely be the Bird vs

This likely be the Bird vs Magic of our Generation. I think Thunder will win more Rings if Hardin doesn't leave. Wade is athleticism is declining, he isn't skilled as Kobe or Manu to make up for as well like these two have.

lilballa141
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Cant

Cant start talking legacies for a dude whose 27 ....but you know who cemented his legacy? Juwuan Howard as the best of the Fab 5 and Eddy Curry's hard work paying off LMAO

Jlv2012
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lebron's legacy took a hit

the moment he coped out and took the easy path with dwayne wade.

IndianaBasketball
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@Jlv2012 To be real, I kind

@Jlv2012

To be real, I kind of agree with you. I don't think LeBron will ever catch MJ because of that.

Had he stayed in Cleveland and brought championships to a city that never had any... I think he would've had a REAL chance to put himself in MJ's class. Now, I just think he can get top ten... As high as 6.

For_Never_Ever
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Yeah I agree with you

Yeah I agree with you Jlv2012. I'm not sure, but I think all the guy's in the top ten didn't make the move Lebron did. My dislike didn't come until the South Beach move. Because it really was the easiest way out.

ItsVictorOladipo
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C'mon lets be honest, Wade

C'mon lets be honest, Wade wasn't the dominant force he was in seasons past. This was very much Lebron's team and he put them on his back countless times while Dwyane came up short. Wade is now clearly the Robin to Lebron's Batman (and Bosh is kinda like Batgirl).

Dr J had Moses Malone. Magic had Kareem and Worthy. Bird had McHale and Parrish. Jordan had Pippin. I don't see it as a knock against Lebron's legacy that he needed help from another future hall of famer to win a chip.

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Magic Johnson should never be

Magic Johnson should never be lower than #2 on any list that man was great! Had it not been for AIDS he might have challenged Mike J for #1, and some people do think Magic is the best to ever play.

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@For_Never_Ever; Shaquille

@For_Never_Ever; Shaquille O'Neal is a pretty obvious example of a guy in the top 10 who won after leaving in free agency.

Also, I wouldn't be so quick to put Lebron ahead of Olajuwon, the Dream did something very few players have ever done; win without a second star, and in back-to-back years no less! I know MJ was out, but the league was still strong in the 90s beyond the Bulls.

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I don't think that LeBron can

I don't think that LeBron can pass Mike, Magic, Kareem, and Russell since all those guys had at least five titles. Those guys, to me, are like
the Fab Four. I think LeBron could go to fifth place though ahead of Oscar, West, Hakeem, Duncan, Shaq, and even Bird. I think a couple more rings and a couple more titles would do it. The next five seasons will determine, I think, where he winds up on the all-time list. After five more years in the league I think LeBron could still have a few more good seasons but not really at an first team all-NBA MVP level. But, the guy can do a lot of damage in the next five years.

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you guys have to remember

you guys have to remember Jordan quit on his team to play pro baseball, that still didnt affect his legacy...

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Here's my top 15... no

Here's my top 15... no particular order other than Jordan at the top. (I didn't include Earl Manigault, just best all time in the NBA) Next to each player I have their case of the most important categories in the NBA which consists of Championship rings, Finals MVP, MVP, and NBA first team (which obviously puts you in the "hunt" for an MVP)

Michael Jordan - nuff' said

Magic Johnson - 5 rings, 3 time finals MVP, 3 time MVP, 9 time NBA first team

Wilt Chamberlin - 2 rings, Finals MVP, 4 time MVP, 7 time NBA first team (some awards mentioned not given yet early in career)

Larry Bird - 3 rings, 2 Finals MVP, 3 time MVP, 9 time NBA first team

Bill Russell - 11 rings!, 5 time MVP, 3 time NBA first team (some awards mentioned not given yet early in career)

Hakeem Olajuwon - 2 rings, 2 Finals MVP, MVP, 6 time NBA first team

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar - 6 rings, 2 Finals MVP, 6 time MVP, 10 time NBA first team

Tim Duncan - 4 rings, 3 Finals MVP, 2 time MVP, 9 time NBA first team

Kobe Bryant - 5 rings, 2 Finals MVP, MVP, 10 time NBA first team

Oscar Robertson - 1 ring, MVP, 9 time NBA first team

Shaquille O'Neal - 4 rings, 3 Finals MVP, MVP, 8 time NBA first team

David Robinson - 2 rings, MVP, 4 time NBA first team

Jerry West - 1 ring, Finals MVP, 10 time NBA first team

Kevin Garnett - 1 ring, MVP, 4 time NBA first team

LeBron James - 1 ring, Finals MVP, 3 time MVP, 6 time NBA first team

For_Never_Ever
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It will be really tough for

It will be really tough for Lebron. Wade athleticism is declining, he isn't skilled as Kobe or Manu to make up for as well like these two have. While kevin and the rest of his important teammates aren't in their prime yet, and will only get even better. If he does win rings over these guy's my dislike will subside, and he will get all credit for all the hate he has gotten.

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Ooops

Forgot Moses Malone too!!! He belongs somewhere on the list!

1 ring, Finals MVP, 3 time MVP, 4 time NBA first team.

jaysmith1987
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When its all said and done

1. Mj
2. Magic
3. Lebron.
Lebron is a mix of magic and Mj only he just developed his killer instinct. He already is better than Bird. Bird could pass and rebound buut he never had to do it by hisself and he was more hype than production the way people talk youd think he had 6 rings but he had 3 and always played on a loaded team. Im sure lebron will at least get 4 rings if not more.

ItsVictorOladipo
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1. Mj 2. Magic 3. Lebron.

1. Mj

2. Magic

3. Lebron.

Lebron is a mix of magic and Mj only he just developed his killer instinct. He already is better than Bird. Bird could pass and rebound buut he never had to do it by hisself and he was more hype than production the way people talk youd think he had 6 rings but he had 3 and always played on a loaded team. Im sure lebron will at least get 4 rings if not more.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

You're obviously entitled to your opinion about career rankings but to say that Bird was more hype than production is a huge exagerration.

Bird produced at a similar clip to LBJ in his prime; 28.7 PPG, 10.5 RPG, 6.6 APG in 1985, 28.1 PPG, 9.2 RPG, 7.6 APG in 1987, 29.9 PPG, 9.3 RPG and 6.1 APG in 1988. One of the most efficient scorers in history, shooting 50/40/90 is considered a benchmark for shooting efficiancy with only 5 players hitting the mark in a season, Bird came close to averaging that for his career; 49.6 FG%, 37.6 3pt%, 88.6 FT%. Despite a debilitating back injury that cut short his career and seriously affected 3 of his last 4 years in the league he managed to average 20.2 PPG, 9.6 RPG and 6.6 APG at the age of 35 in 1992. That's some pretty ridiculous production.

Winning three championships in the 1980s is very impressive. Yes his Celtics were loaded but so were several other teams in the league like the Lakers, 76ers and Pistons.

Right now Bird IMO still has the career edge on Lebron but that might change in a few years. However I'm surprised at the amount of people that still place West higher than LBJ. West had a great career but he was never considered the top player in the game, LBJ has been the top player in the league for years.

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..

I want to see him win one with Cleveland... It is still a huge possibility for him to come back... never say never... Then we can talk about him being among the top 5...

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Chuck Barkley

1. Allen Iverson

2.LBJ

omphalos
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@TaylorCondrin; Mike quit

@TaylorCondrin; Mike quit after winning three straight championships and his father being murdered. That's just a little different to what Lebron did.

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Jordan didn't quit on his

Jordan didn't quit on his team to play baseball he was suspended for the year for gambling on games and decided to play baseball with his time off. If you look at the MJ situation it is fairly obvious that it was not his decision to retire initially...he was punished by the commish but they did not want to tarnish his legacy so instead of telling the truth he used the baseball cover up.

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Jerry West

As far as career achievement, is pretty fantastic. Sure, he may never have been the official best player in the league, that was much more of an open discussion back than. He did average 27 ppg in the regular season and 29 ppg in the play-offs, while providing fantastic shooting with great All-Around numbers.

10 time All-NBA 1st team, 14 time All-Star, first player in history to win the Finals MVP on a losing team. Plus, was arguably the best player on a 1971-72 Lakers team that went 69-13 and won 33 games in a row, considered possibly the best team in NBA history. The team had Wilt Chamberlain (who won Finals MVP) and Gail Goodrich (a great scorer in his own right), but West averaged 25.8 and 9.7 apg that season. Hell, in the 1964-65 play-offs, he averaged 40.6 ppg over 11 games (they lost to the Celtics in the Finals).

Definitely feel LeBron's individual greatness surpasses Jerry West, just is hard for me to go past historically incredible players such as "Mr. Clutch" aka "The Logo". Over 25,000 points, 5,000 rebounds and 6,000 assists, plus one could only imagine how great he would have been if there had been a three point line.

Also, his defense was fantastic. The All-Defensive team was not around until the end of his career and he made the inaugural 2nd team, with 4 1st team appearances afterwards. They did not keep steals as a statistic until his last season. He only played in 31 games and averaged 2.6 (!) steals per game. One could only imagine how padded his stat sheet might look if steal numbers were around sooner. LeBron will ultimately pass Jerry West, but the mans body of work career wise is incredibly formidable. I would not be against ranking LeBron ahead of him now, but it certainly is not a blow out at this current point of time.

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Just thinking about it,

Just thinking about it, LeBron could retire with a minimum of 30,000 points (probably being the 7th guy to do it), 8,000 rebounds and 8,000 assists (which will be about Top 10 All Time). That with shooting around or near 50% from the field and being an incredible defender could get him Top 5, with more rings.

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