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Kevin Love Self Praise and John Wall

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Yah led us to a 3 seed in a

Yah led us to a 3 seed in a weak division. Still a huge accomplishment. We had great role players exceeding their potential at every position (Calderon, Ford, Parker, Garbajosa, Delfino, Nesterovic), and very good coaching Sam Mitchell.

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47 wins that season. Love

47 wins that season. Love took over as the main guy last year and won 17. Kevin Love won 56 games in his first 3 seasons. C'mon now.

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The jury is still out on Love because of inferior teammates

Wolves last year before Ricky Rubio=last in the West and worst overall record. (even worse than the Cavs without Lebron.)

Wolves this year with Rubio= Last in the Northwest division but fighting for a playoff spot. I'll take the latter. Clearly a definite improvement over last year.

Final Assesment: No Love is not the best PF in the game right now, and no those honors do not go to Blake Griffen either. (You don't get called the best PF in the league because you have a superb aerial show and are very explosive even though it is flashy and appetizing.) Currently the jury is still out on Love since he has had inferior talent around him in the past. Now with better talent around him in Rubio, Love is looking a lot better and consquently so are the Wolves, so I think at the end of the day we are going to be talking about both Griffin and Love being possibly the best PF's in the game. (especially when Dirk, KG, and Pau Gasol retire) At the end of the day, I'm not quite sure who is the better PF (Griffin or Love), they both are very good in their own respects.

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I never said Griffin was the

I never said Griffin was the best.

billyk
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Let's not act like Kevin Love

Let's not act like Kevin Love doesn't have TALENT on his team... Derrick Williams, Rubio, Wes Johnson, Darko, Martell Webster are all former lottery picks.. I think if your top 5 at your position and a superstar you should be able to lead your team to the playoffs atleast 8th seed, that's what separates a star from a superstar..

Love is a BEAST on the boards, posses a watery jumper,and basically puts up video games stats, but you play to win the game.. When Love starts piling up the W's the he can make a claim as the top or top 5 power fowards... Personally I would like to see Love produce down the stretch battling for a playoff position, that's when super stars shine...

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yupyup Since you continue to

yupyup

Since you continue to bring up the "Love doesn't win" argument. Let me show you something.

Kevin Love's best teammates since becoming a starter:

  • Michael Beasley: 22 year old failed 2nd overall pick
  • Ricky Rubio: 21 year old rookie

That's it! He played with one pot-head and a 21 year old rookie! How in the world do you expect him to win?!

Now, let's look at the guys you said are better:

Blake Griffin

  • Eric Gordon: Up-and-coming SG averaging 22ppg
  • Chris Kaman: All-Star
  • Baron Davis/Mo Williams: All-Stars
  • Chris Paul: NBA Superstar
  • Chauncey Billups: All-Star, NBA Champion
  • Caron Butler: All-Star, NBA Champion

Amar'e Stoudemire

  • Stephon Marbury: All-Star
  • Shawn Marion: All-Star, NBA Champion
  • Joe Johnson: All-Star
  • Steve Nash: 2x MVP
  • Carmelo Anthony: All-Star
  • Tyson Chandler: NBA Champion

Chris Bosh

  • Vince Carter: All-Star
  • Shawn Marion: All-Star, NBA Champion
  • LeBron James: 2x MVP
  • Dwyane Wade: NBA Superstar

Zach Randolph

  • Rasheed Wallace: All-Star, NBA Champion
  • Derek Anderson: All-Star
  • Brandon Roy: All-Star
  • Jamal Crawford: 6th Man of the Year
  • Rudy Gay: Probable future All-Star
  • Marc Gasol: Probable future All-Star

LaMarcus Aldridge

  • Brandon Roy: All-Star
  • Gerald Wallace: All-Star
  • Jamal Crawford: 6th Man of the Year

Dirk Nowitzki

  • Michael Finely: All-Star
  • Steve Nash: 2x MVP
  • Cedric Ceballos: All-Star
  • Nick Van Exel: All-Star
  • Antoine Walker: All-Star
  • Antawn Jamison: All-Star
  • Jerry Stackhouse: All-Star
  • Jason Terry: 6th Man of the Year
  • Josh Howard: All-Star
  • Devin Harris: All-Star
  • Jason Kidd: All-Star
  • Shawn Marion: All-Star
  • Caron Butler: All-Star
  • Vince Carter: All-Star
  • Lamar Odom: 6th Man of the Year, 2x NBA Champion

Pau Gasol

  • Mike Miller: 6th Man of the Year, Rookie of the Year
  • Bobby Jackson: All-Star
  • Rudy Gay: Probably future All-Star
  • Lamar Odom: 6th Man of the Year
  • Kobe Bryant: NBA Superstar, 3x NBA Champion
  • Ron Artest: All-Star
  • Andrew Bynum: All-Star this season

________________________________________________________________________________

I think it's fair to say that Kevin Love has not had anywhere near the quantity nor quality of talent as the other guys on your list. Thus, rendering your "He doesn't win" argument pretty useless because none of those guys would have won if they did not play with so many All-Stars, NBA Champions and NBA veterans.

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It's arguably whether or not

It's arguable whether or not Kevin Love is the best power forward in the game today. I would argue that Blake Griffin is the best power forward but let's not act as if Kevin Love is nowhere near the conversation or the lack of wins is completely his fault. None of the PFs in the talk of being the best has had it harder in the league than Kevin Love has had it so far.

Remember when the Lakers wont their 2nd ring? Pau Gasol went from a nobody in the NBA to suddenly "The Best PF" simply because he teamed up with Kobe Bryant, Lamar Odom, and Andrew Bynum. Kevin Love doesn't have that luxury, at the moment so why should he get knocked?

___________________________________________________________________________

billyk

"Let's not act like Kevin Love doesn't have TALENT on his team... Derrick Williams, Rubio, Wes Johnson, Darko, Martell Webster are all former lottery picks.."

Don't you ever put the words "Darko, Martell Webster, and TALENT" in the same sentence again.

And guess what? Derrick Williams and Ricky Rubio are barely in their rookie year and Wes Johnson has played about 90 NBA games.

Not to mention, they are one game back from .500 so don't act as if they are completely losing this year. SMH.. That was probably the weakest counter-argument on this thread.

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The point I was making was

The point I was making was Love plays with "talented" players... Geuss what I know Williams and Rubio are rookies but the fact remains they are NOT scrubs.. My point genius is to simply point out you shouldnt be considered the best at a position or a top 5 at position unless you win games, superstars in the league win games... And that list you compiled was weak because for instance Rasheed Wallace wasnt and all star when ZBO played with him, ZBO wasn't even considered a top PF till he lead the Grizz in the playoffs although he is 20 and 10 for his career...

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Based Out

Was that team really 3 times worse then the one Bosh took to a 3 seed? I think not. Lets not forget that everyone on the this forum thought after the beginning of last year Beasley was going to be a perennial all star (I do remember you were not one of them, so props to you for that though), so I think that counts as a pretty talented teammate. The only difference between this year and last year and Rubio, Williams and Adelman and the latter two I give at least as much credit for the Wolves being 7-8 as Love.

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Wow... This is the most

Wow... This is the most overreacting to something I've ever seen.

Hale
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I'm not sure how to take

I'm not sure how to take that.

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I think this thread can be

I think this thread can be simply wrapped up by just saying 3 points

1.Theres is nothing wrong with kevin saying he is the best since no expects him to say someone is better then him. He gave the correct answer everyone wants to here coming from a player.

2. As talented and stat filling Kevin Love is I would not consider him being ELITE(he is an allstar) til he guides his team to either the playoffs or above .500 record. PERIOD. the custudian comment is absolutely absurd and does not bring anything to this agruement whoever said it leave your smarta$$ comments out of it. Same goes for griffin even though his team will most likely make the playoffs.

3.As i was typing this i forgot my 3rd point so....i'll get back to you on that

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That wasn't directed at

That wasn't directed at you.

Just directed at all of this Kevin Love hype in general.

You do need good teammates to be successful, but you just can't throw how winning a player is out of the window just because it doesn't make him look good. Great players ELEVATE the play of their teammates and don't lose like Love has lost.

I think Love is somewhere in the middle... He hasn't had great teammates, but I also don't think he's a guy who elevates the play of his teammates either.

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For those of you saying the

For those of you saying the Wolves suck... They are 7-8; ONE game back from .500. He's played a huge role in getting those 7 wins. Just listing some teams that the Wolves are playing better than right now.. Boston, Washington (who so many people said that team would break out this year), New York. Boston has the original big three, and New York has two superstars (and one PF on your list that you rated ABOVE Love, just sayin). But they can't win. You wanna know the difference between this year and last year? The coaching. Kurt Rambis was an absolute idiot as a coach. He tried running the triangle offense. Who was going to lead that, I mean seriously.

This argument is getting really old really fast because you rely so much on past history. When he was a rookie, Love came off the bench for Al Jefferson who, even in Utah is a black hole of a post player. When he finally got starter minutes, he produced. His next year, they traded Al and gave Love the starting spot, but still had Rambis coaching. They had Wes playing out of position, Ridnour starting with Johnny Flynn backing him up (failed 6th overall pick..), Michael Beasely being the featured player, and lastly Darko who can play defense but this year he's basically in just to win the tip and leave. Now he has a REAL PG to feed him the ball that makes everyone better (look what Steve Nash has been able to do with bad teammates, Channing Frye is an awful player but Nash makes him look good).

I seriously do not understand where all this hate for Kevin Love is coming from. Ya'll act like he's garbage and can't play. Yes he is not a superstar but he's also only been in the league for three years and is just now getting better teammates and he is still producing big numbers. I'm pretty sure everyone would be saying he's the best PF in the game if he was traded for Pau and still produced the same numbers and the only reason would be because then their team would be winning (Kobe is the only player besides Lebron who can take a bad team and still get a +.500 record). And guess what? The Wolves would get worse if they had Gasol instead of Love. Don't forget that the Lakers DID offer that trade before the year started and the Wolves promptly rejected it.

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IndianaBasketball

People are just looking for the "Next Big Thing"

1. Like John Wall being the man last year not he is overrated

2. Like rubio being a bust now he is awesome

3. Like Kevin Love not gonna suceed now he is elite despite his team losing

4.andre drummond being a cant miss prospect now he is overated

and the list goes on and on and on....you get the point its actually amusing and irratating at the same time. Just wish people would stick to their opinions or predictions and just admit their wrong if it doesn't happen instead playing i was always right game.

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kngojc

yeah its what 15 games lol funny how people use that arguement against other people predictions but not against their own. I said bargs(raps havent won a game without him yet) was killing it this year what did i get its only been 8 games, lol cmon who are you kidding like i said if he leads his team to the plays of a above 500 record then we will talk.

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Other than

Other than BothTeamsPlayedHard maybe, I don't think anybody on this site "hates" Kevin Love. I've never heard anybody say he was garbage and couldn't play either. You're overreacting.

All I've ever read was that he wasn't the best power forward in the league... That he wasn't a superstar or franchise player. That his statistics weren't necesarily leading to wins or making as great of a difference as one would think. I've read people who didn't think he was an elite power forward.

Even during this thread, yupyup has said nothing to disrespect Love, but people are overreacting when he's honestly on point with everything he's writing.

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I don't hate Kevin Love for

I don't hate Kevin Love for the record. Just because I rate 5 other PF's ahead of him doesn't mean that I don't think he can play. If I give him a 9/10 and the 5 other guys between like 9.1 and 9.5 doesn't mean I think he sucks.

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No love doesn't suck he just

No love doesn't suck he just have reached that level of elite yet. will he?probably Is he now? not til he wins games. Its sort of like the knicks having all those superstars and being awesome on offense(which they haven't been but for the sake of this agruement pretend they are haha) and being horrible on defense....might get you to the playoffs but wont win you a championship

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Scooter

Agreed. Shameless flip-floping runs rampant through these parts. I've personally felt that Kevin Love was going to be a special player since he beat my old high school with a buzzer-beater back in '06 (or '07). I've also been on the record saying that he's one of the best rebounders in the NBA, and that his numbers weren't exclusively the product of playing for a horrible team. Love has those championship intangibles that set him apart from so many other players, and he'll start winning with that roster eventually.

All that being said, I don't feel like he is the best power forward in the NBA, though Love vs. Griffin is a fun conversation.

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Regardless of where you stand

Regardless of where you stand on love, i think we can all agree that damn near this entire site and everyone else out there was wrong for bashing mchale and the wolves for trading mayo for love on draft day.

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Great List Based-Out-Like -23

I give you credit for putting that list together of the different players people say are better than Love because they won more games. They all forget to say the supporting cast those "better" players had. Billyk called your list weak, but I would like to challenge him to put the list together supporting his view on Love's teammates. (can't wait to see the one that says formers #2 pick Darko and lottery pick Wes Johnson.) Please take the challenge Billyk honestly. If your arguement on not putting him higher on your PF chart is due to lack of wins then you are fooling yourself.

For those that get insulted when someone says that Love is a #2 option on a championship level team, look at it this way. Why is that a bad thing? Clyde Drexler, Charles Barkley, Shaq or Kobe (depends on the year), Scottie Pippen, Tim Duncan and John Stockon were all considered at one time or another the #2 option on a team and all are or will be HOF players. Even in today's game. Bosh, Wade, Westbrook and A. Stoudemire are all #2 or #3 options. So I think being called a second option isn't as bad as some on here take it.

The PF position is one of the hardest to put all the leadership role on. They don't bring the ball up, and the offense doesn't usually flow through them. Look at all the great former PF's without rings. Charles Barkley, Karl Malone and Shawn Kemp. They had better teams than Love does and still didn't win the the championship. We are forgetting that this is not MMA or boxing where it's 1 on 1 this is a team sport and when he has the right team behind him he will win more games.

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Honestly though you can't

Honestly though you can't deny that the Wolves are an up and coming team. If Rubio, Wes, Beasely, Love, and Darko are all starting, their starters are all top 5 picks. Granted Darko isn't that great but he also isn't a scrub. This team WILL be good and it will heavily rely on the play of Love in the future. Adelman in my opinion favors the guards on his team more so he probably wouldn't run the ball through Love but will make sure he gets his touches. If I were going to put together a list of the top 5 PF's in the game right now I would put in this order: Aldridge, Love, Griffin, Nowitski, and Stoudemire. But going forward in the next 5 years, the whole battle is going to be between Love and Griffin which is great for the league because they are both high character and hugely talented guys.

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Bosh is very, very good, but

Bosh is very, very good, but to say he's as good as Love night in night out has become ridiculous. Bosh can be unstoppable or he can dissapear. Consistency counts for a lot in the NBA. Same issue with Amare and Pau this year. At this point Love is clearly better than any of those 3 night in and night out. LaMarcus is better than Love at the moment, thanks largely to defense, and Dirk is better, simply because he's so unstoppable. After that, you get to like Blake Griffin and others who have issues as glaring as Love's without the gaudy numbers and consistent improvement. I've got Kevin as the #3 4 in the league right now, and I wouldn't be shocked if he rises to the top within a year or two, though, obviously, Blake and Aldridge are huge barriers to that. I really, really hate watching Blake play D, though, so I'm not as high on him as everyone else seems to be. I don't think I'm missing anyone but Zach Randolph, who I'm really going to need to see more than 1 mature, healthy year out of after damn near a decade of being a headcase.

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Darkman97

"Kevin Love's best teammates since becoming a starter:"

Michael Beasley: 22 year old failed 2nd overall pick (that played solid on a playoff team, 15 and 6 For his career... How do you call Beasley a bust he is only 23 years old...)

Ricky Rubio: 21 year old rookie (you could argue Rubio is the reason for the Timberwolves being so close to .500)

Now, let's look at the guys you said are better:

Blake Griffin

Eric Gordon: Up-and-coming SG averaging 22pp (I think there are a lot of people that would take Rubio over Gordon plus Gordon's is injury proned)

Chris Kaman: All-Star (was NOT playing like an all star in the matter of fact Jordan made him expendable)

Baron Davis/Mo Williams: All-Stars (Mo "front runner" Williams shouldn't made ANY all star game and Baron was a shell of his former self)

Chris Paul: NBA All-star (first season together and they have a chance to be real good barring injuries)

Chauncey Billups: All-Star, NBA Champion (waaaaay out of his prime, he's basically a jump shooter at this point)

Caron Butler: All-Star, NBA Champion (another player that's way past his prime)

 Stoudemire

Stephon Marbury: All-Star (played with a rookie Amare and they only played together for couple seasons)

When he played with Marion, Johnson, and Nash dude was a BEAST, Shaq even called him the future of the NBA. Not only were those Suns team Great they were also exciting, this is the Amare the averaged 30 and 10 against Tim Duncan and a great Spurs defense in the 04 or 05 playoffs.

I can make an argument that if you subtract Melo and Chandler off the Knicks and Rubio and Beasley off the Wolves, the Timberwolves would have a more talented roster. 

Chris Bosh

Vince Carter: All-Star (Bosh's rookie year Vince Carter played his way out of Tornto, it was clear that we wanted to leave. Bosh kept the Raptors competitive when he was the face of the franchise.)

Shawn Marion: All-Star, NBA Champion (Marion past his prime)

With the  Heat Bosh as more than held his own in the regular season and playoffs, which he should of. Switch players would the Heat be as Dominant on Defense??

Zach Randolph (it took last years playoffs for ZBOto be considered one of the best even though he's 20 and 10 for his career). Could Love carry the a team like ZBO did as a go to player down the stretch?.

Rasheed Wallace: All-Star, NBA Champion (they were a playoff team and Rashad was in his prime at the time. In his prime Rasheed Wallace was one of the best two players in the league)

Derek Anderson: All-Star (was NOT an all star when he played for Portland I dont even remembering him making a all star game)

LaMarcus Aldridge

Brandon Roy: All-Star (really!?!? What happen when Roy started to decline LA stepped his game up, with Wallace and Crawford the Blazers a championship contenders with LA as their BEST player)

Dirk Nowitzki (HOFER and perhaps the greatest shooting big man (mid range, 3pt) of all time. Dirk proven on the games biggest stage that he can be the ONE)

Pau Gasol (Gay was a rookie that people doubt would ever pan out, Jackson was NOT an all star when he played with Pau, Miller was a rookie like Rubio)

I believe that list is weak because you are naming players that were on decline or former all stars... It's purely subjective list, using the logic of comparing the players Love plays with, with players that all those top Pf played with doesn't make sense because most of those players except for Blake has been in the league for 6 years or more.

"I think it's fair to say that Kevin Love has not had anywhere near the quantity nor quality of talent as the other guys on your list. Thus, rendering your "He doesn't win" argument pretty useless because none of those guys would have won if they did not play with so many All-Stars, NBA Champions and NBA veterans."

That's an excuse how bout give Love time to prove he's the best player by winning NOT by stats... I pefer to see players make their name by leading their team to the playoffs..  In time Minny might have a playoff team but let's wait for that time before we consider him a superstar.. In the NBA greatness comes with making your teammates elevate their games and producing when it counts.. 

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When Love hits a game winner,

When Love hits a game winner, everybody on the site goes nuts, but then when he lays a stinker the following night and is outplayed by his matchup, everyone is quiet.

5-21, 1-7 three point... Love is shooting .41% from the field this season.

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Indiana - 3rd game in 4

Indiana - 3rd game in 4 nights and 2nd of a back-to-back. It happens.

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Did you see Gasol tonight?

Did you see Gasol tonight? Only 8 points on terrible shooting. Clearly he can't be among the top 4s. Guys have off games.

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"Kevin Love's best teammates

"Kevin Love's best teammates since becoming a starter:"

Michael Beasley: 22 year old failed 2nd overall pick (that played solid on a playoff team, 15 and 6 For his career... How do you call Beasley a bust he is only 23 years old...)
I never said Beasley was a bust, I said he was a failed 2nd overall pick. I mean, what has he done in his career that indicates he's worthy of being a 2nd overall pick? Tell me.

Ricky Rubio: 21 year old rookie (you could argue Rubio is the reason for the Timberwolves being so close to .500)
Ricky Rubio is the reason that they're .500? So if you subtract Kevin Love from the Wolves, they would still be winning? Get real.

Now, let's look at the guys you said are better:

Blake Griffin

Eric Gordon: Up-and-coming SG averaging 22pp (I think there are a lot of people that would take Rubio over Gordon plus Gordon's is injury proned)
Gordon was not injury prone when Griffin played with him. Plus, Beasley hasn't played this season, wouldn't that subtract him from being one of Kevin Love's best teammates as well since you want to disregard Eric Gordon because of injuries? Too easy. Plus, show me one person that would take Rubio over Gordon, aside from yourself.

Chris Kaman: All-Star (was NOT playing like an all star in the matter of fact Jordan made him expendable)
I agree, he didn't play that well.

Baron Davis/Mo Williams: All-Stars (Mo "front runner" Williams shouldn't made ANY all star game and Baron was a shell of his former self)
Shells of their former selves? Mo Williams is still averaging his career average of 13PPG... OFF THE BENCH.

Chauncey Billups: All-Star, NBA Champion (waaaaay out of his prime, he's basically a jump shooter at this point)
Just a jump shooter? Try 4APG and 3RPG at this age while playing solid defense and tell me he's just a jump shooter. Plus, Chauncey Billups at this very moment is better than Rubio and an injured Beasley.

Caron Butler: All-Star, NBA Champion (another player that's way past his prime)
May be past his prime, but a player that brings so many intangibles, toughness, defense, and 15ppg, he's pretty damn good. Brings more to the table than Beasley.

Stoudemire

Stephon Marbury: All-Star (played with a rookie Amare and they only played together for couple seasons)
Starbury averages 20ppg and 8apg while Amar'e averaged 14ppg and 9rpg. Amar'e was no slouch at the time.

I can make an argument that if you subtract Melo and Chandler off the Knicks and Rubio and Beasley off the Wolves, the Timberwolves would have a more talented roster.
Well this is stupid. If you take Kobe and Gasol off the Lakers; Dwight and Turk off the Magic, you can argue the Magic have more talent. Obviously, if you're going to subtract 2 of the best players on any team, it makes them worse. What kind of counter-argument is that?

Chris Bosh

Vince Carter: All-Star (Bosh's rookie year Vince Carter played his way out of Tornto, it was clear that we wanted to leave. Bosh kept the Raptors competitive when he was the face of the franchise.)
That does not disregard the fact that Bosh played with an All-Star. Plus, Bosh was a starter so it is not like he wasn't playing with him.

Shawn Marion: All-Star, NBA Champion (Marion past his prime)
A Shawn Marion that was averaging 15ppg and 8rpg while shooting 49% from the field isn't far from his prime.

With the Heat Bosh as more than held his own in the regular season and playoffs, which he should of. Switch players would the Heat be as Dominant on Defense??
Is Bosh dominant on defense or is it because of the athleticism of LeBron and Wade that come on the weak side to double team or help?

Zach Randolph (it took last years playoffs for ZBOto be considered one of the best even though he's 20 and 10 for his career). Could Love carry the a team like ZBO did as a go to player down the stretch?.
Has Love played with anybody as good as Marc Gasol, Rudy Gay, O.J. Mayo? He hasn't. Has he had role players like Mike Conley, Darrel Arthur, Tony Allen, Sam Young, and Shane Battier? I think not. That team was so stacked with defensive talent, it wasn't even funny.

Rasheed Wallace: All-Star, NBA Champion (they were a playoff team and Rashad was in his prime at the time. In his prime Rasheed Wallace was one of the best two players in the league)
So you agree that Rasheed Wallace is better than Beasley and Rubio? Okay, just wanted to clear that up.

Derek Anderson: All-Star (was NOT an all star when he played for Portland I dont even remembering him making a all star game)
14ppg, 4rpg, 3apg. He wasn't a slouch at all.

LaMarcus Aldridge

Brandon Roy: All-Star (really!?!? What happen when Roy started to decline LA stepped his game up, with Wallace and Crawford the Blazers a championship contenders with LA as their BEST player)
Yeah, he did step up but that does not disregard that a regressing Brandon Roy was still better than Beasley and Rubio. Plus, just adding that he's playing with Wallace and Crawford again proves me right. LaMarcus is and was playing with much more talent that Kevin Love has/is. What exactly were you trying to argue there?

Dirk Nowitzki (HOFER and perhaps the greatest shooting big man (mid range, 3pt) of all time. Dirk proven on the games biggest stage that he can be the ONE)
Yes, but we can't continue to give out life-time awards. Dirk has had a terrible season and he has played with so many legendary players his entire career.

Pau Gasol (Gay was a rookie that people doubt would ever pan out, Jackson was NOT an all star when he played with Pau, Miller was a rookie like Rubio)
How are you going to say that Gay was doubted? 20ppg as a sophomore is no joke. Plus, why are you disregarding the fact that Pau is playing with Kobe, Bynum, and Artest? Pau was not known whatsoever until he teamed up with Kobe, Odom, and Bynum. He had to start winning before he was put into the conversation as one of the top power forwards in the league. He never made his Memphis teammates better than they were, Kobe is the one that made Pau look better than he is/was.

I believe that list is weak because you are naming players that were on decline or former all stars... It's purely subjective list, using the logic of comparing the players Love plays with, with players that all those top Pf played with doesn't make sense because most of those players except for Blake has been in the league for 6 years or more.
Do you not agree that these players have won because they play with better players than Kevin Love has in his career? It's a pretty simple question that you continue to dodge.

That's an excuse how bout give Love time to prove he's the best player by winning NOT by stats... I pefer to see players make their name by leading their team to the playoffs.. In time Minny might have a playoff team but let's wait for that time before we consider him a superstar.. In the NBA greatness comes with making your teammates elevate their games and producing when it counts..
Just as you said, give Love time to win. Writing him off now isn't the right idea. He's never played with good players and that should not be a knock on him. Wilt Chamberlain won ONE ring and he's considered the greatest center of all time. Why? Because of stats. Ridiculous stats. Like the one's Kevin Love is dropping night in and night out.

3-6 Mafia
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wait didn't rose one of the

wait didn't rose one of the most liked players say that he was the best pg and nuttriders on espn were saying they love his mentality bla bla bla... love is a top 3 PF and he knows it, he will start winning eventually

darkman97
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Well Indianabasketball

You are right that after KLove's stinker, his supporters went kinda mute, but it goes both ways. Love's critics didn't say much after the game winning shot either. In my case, I had to wait til work to get on a computer. But I was anticipating this question and think I came prepared.

B. Griffin Jan 11 2012 9-23 39%

Aldridge Jan 10 2012 8-20 40%

Nowitzki Jan 7 2012 2-11 18%

Bosh Jan 11 2012 6-16 37%

P. Gasol Jan 16 3-11 27%

Now all but Nowitzki was better than Love's 23% but I'm pretty sure most were dunks on in-the-paint buckets due to the style of these particular players.

This is also to you Indianabasketball, I want to go over some of the criticisms you have on Love.

His shooting % is down for a PF. Well you know he has taken his game away from the basket. He is more of a jump shooter than a back to the basket type of player now. He is #15 from the 3pt line among forwards, and all the forwards before him are Small Forwards. Love is shooting way better than even Dirk from behind the line 35% to 23%

Love doesn't make his teammates better? I struggled with this one for a couple days. Wondering how to prove or disprove this arguement. Best thing I came up with is look at what the players did before they joined up with Love and how they are doing with Love. This is what I came up with.

  • Michael Beasley in MN 19.2 ppg, .7 bpg, 2.2 apg, .7 spg, 5.6 rpg. MIA 14.8 ppg, .6 bpg, 1.3 apg, 1.0 spg, 6.4 rpg
  • Darko Milicic in MN 8.8 ppg, 2.0 bp, .9 apg, .8spg, 5.2 rpg. Best other 8.0 ppg, 2.1 bpg, 1.1 apg, .6 spg, 6.1 rpg
  • Anthony Randolph in MN 11.7 ppg, .7 bpg, 1.1 apg, .8 spg, 5.2 rpg, Best other 11.6 ppg 1.5 bpg, 1.3 apg, 6.5 rpg
  • Luke Ridnour in MN 11.8 ppg, .1bpg, 5.4 apg, 1.2 spg, 2.8 rpg. Best other 11.5 ppg, .3 bpg, 7.0 apg, 1.6 spg, 3.0 rpg

Then there are the guys that played with Love then went elsewhere

  • Corey Brewer in MN 13 ppg, .4 bpg, 2.4 apg, 1.4 spg, 3.4 rpg. Dallas 5.3 ppg, .2 bpg, .9 apg, .9 spg, 1.8 rpg
  • Johnny Flynn in MN 135.ppg, .1 bpg, 4.4 apg .1 spg, 2.4 rpg. Houston No stats can't even get on court

Can't say anything about Rubio, Ellington. Wes Johnson, D. Williams since we have no other stats of them playing without Love on their team.

Open to any feedback

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