[Tim49461Participant]

 I dont believe that in such a weak draft that Kalin Lucas is projected to go Undrafted.  This kid has lead his team to National Championship Game as a Sophomore.  If he didnt get hurt his junior year he would have done it again.

Given the fact he did get injuried and it is a long process to recover from he started showing why he was once a top 20 pick towards the end of the year.  Controlling the game in almost every aspect he could.  No one could stay in front of him at the end of the season showing his quickness was back.  

I just dont get how people he destroyed or is clearly better/more experienced like Darius Morris, Norris Cole, Malcolm Lee, and every other PG further down in the draft.

He has the speed, the handle,  his shooting is good enough to the point you have to respect it, and the man knows how to run a pro offense.

He should be a bubble 1st rounder.

[JNixonParticipant]

I liked Lucas, but he looked like he lost a good bit of his explosivness this past season and it made him struggle some. That and he seemed to become fascinated in looking for him own shot more than in the past, and he didn’t run the MSU nearly as well as he used to.

[Tim49461Participant]

 I do respect you’re opinion JNixon but im going to disgaree. I literally watch every game.  I think you watched him during the beginning of the season.  He came on strong back to his normal self against Minny where he exploded for 23 or 26 i cant remember correct.  But from there on out he was literally blowing by everyone in the big ten from there on.  Making Battle, Demtri, and Morris like statues.

To his defense they lost Allen, Lucious and was left with Draymond as the only other player on the team able to create his own shot.  And when you have Thorton and Kebler out at the same time the ball is only going to be shot by Lucas because those White kids refuse to attempt a shot.

[esperanzafleet69Participant]

i agree completely with tim here… i think a torn achilles is still tough to come back from and lucas wasnt his usual self until around the last 3rd of the season. Lucas is very fast and quick, i like to think of him as a worse version of tj ford (pre injury).. i definately think he should get drafted, but probably somewhere around the mid to late second round..

[JoeWolf1]

 He’s been a guy with virtually no buzz through the team workout process.  I know he’s been through quite a few and I haven’t really heard anything positive or negative about his performance. I think he’s a bubble 2nd rounder/ undrafted guy.

[jonus grumbyParticipant]

if he goes undrafted I would like to see the Bulls invite him to camp. 

[dodgerParticipant]

He was never that good. Sherron Collins, Scottie Reynolds , two similar sized guys with great college careers are still finding a niche in the NBA is a good reason why you don’t draft Lucas and take a shot on him as a free agent.

[Tim49461Participant]

 Dodger please dont say stuff like that it makes me question your knowledge and ignorance so fast.

Kalin lead his team as a sophomore to the Title Game.

All-American.  2 Final Fours. Faster, More athletic then Collins and Scottie.  Yes i said Collins.  How did collins do against Kalin in their sweet 16 match up.  My point exactly.

Kalin is a POINT GUARD.  Sherron played point but played more like Kemba.  Scottie was never a point guard.

So i have no idea where you are getting this idea they are anything alike besides in height.

[kobyzParticipant]

remind me Chris Duhon

[joecheck88Participant]

He was a very good college player but when it comes to the NBA there are just alot more NBA caliber guards in this draft then him. He was obviously more well known to a casual fan than Reggie Jackson, Norris Cole, Charles Jenkins, or Darius Morris but those guys have NBA bodies and game. Lucas isn’t a great PG and is too small to be a SG. Same thing with Fisher from Villanova. Very good college players that just dont have the size or athletic ability to be effective at what they do best.

[dodgerParticipant]

Who cares what people played in college, they are trying to play in the NBA. 

I’ll give you one more college comparison. Will Bynum on the detroit pistons from Georgia Tech. He is a littler guard who uses speed, quickness, and understanding of the game , to be effective. The knock on Bynum is that he just isn’t extraordinary at one skill, much like Lucas. I think if Kalin Lucas can show he can be explosive and smart, there might be a spot for him on the Maine Redclaws. If he going to defer to other people , I am sure he can find good work in the Puerto Rican league where height does not matter. Bynum took some time to find a role in the NBA, but no one doubted his skill, based on the amount of 10 day contracts he received. Over the course of Bynam’s career he has really refined his game. Obviously Lucas has more accolades and prestige, so maybe his transition will be easier, probably not. 

My point is, if you go to four years of college, and you can’t play right away and contribute, a team wont draft you. The draft isn’t for guys who are a dime a dozen. If you draft a third string point guard, you’re doing it wrong. 

[Tim49461Participant]

Dont be offended when i say this, I’m just defending my position.

Those not house hold names, supposed NBA ready players.  Can you name 5 for me in the last years?

[Tim49461Participant]

 I should add that were also successful in the NBA

[boxn1Participant]

 He can help a good team right away. He can score,a better passer than he is giving credit for,and is a good  defender. He should be back at full speed now since he is a full year + removed from his injury.

[joecheck88Participant]

my point is that he will not be drafted because of these other guards. Of course he can work on his game and eventually become a player in the league. There are examples of those playes everywhere(Sundiata Gaines, Will bynum, anthony morrow). But as of now he is a very undersized 2 guard with an injury history that affects his athletic ability, that is why he won’t be drafted and definately not a 1st rounder.

[Tim49461Participant]

@Dodger

 

 #1 Dont call people children when you’re point makes no sense.

No one goes from playing SG to expected to play PG in the NBA.  So it actually does matter what they played in College meaning that is where they got their experience from.

See i really dont want to get mad at you Dodger because you dont know better.  You just go off what ESPN says.  If you actually knew who you were talking about.  You would understand after his 09 Title run scouts were comparing him to a young Chris Paul/Poor man Isiah Thomas.  

He is small? He is 6’1.  How tall is Paul, Nelson, Rondo, Barea, Parker, Jennings, Teague, Mario, Fisher?  All under 6’2".  Please stop right now if you are saying being 6’1 is a disadvantage for a point guard.

[joecheck88Participant]

 Paul, Nelson, Rondo, Barea, Parker, Jennings, Teague, Mario, Fisher

I think all of those guys are much better players than Lucas. Barea took time to be as good as he is which Lucas can do. I think he is small because he isn’t a PG in my eyes as of now. He would be a 6’1" 2 guard that isn’t very explosive at the moment and may never be what he once was.

[dodgerParticipant]

 Tim49461,

I get it,  and I don’t even disagree. You’re point makes sense. The success rate for a smaller guard is really slim though,  especially those drafted and especially especially those who went to college for four years. Jameer Nelson or Aaron Brooks are probably the best cases.  Acie Law is still figuring it out. Eric Maynor and Toney Douglas are good Back-ups.  I’d say none of these guys had four years like Lucas, so maybe there is something to be said for that. 

In closing, I’d say that Kalin Lucas is a talented guy, proven winner and deserves an opportunity. With all this said, I am not wasting a pick on a person who can be found on every d-league roster. This year its Kalin Lucas, next year it’s Kenny Boynton from Florida. When I want a three string point guard, I’ll facebook message Kalin. 

[Tim49461Participant]

 @Joecheck

I just went to go confirm my thought that unknown not house hold names, with nba ready bodies that have had a impact in the league or basically even playing. Has come down to 1.  George Hill.  I would put Maynor on the list but he was a house hold name for beating duke the year before he came out.

I wasnt comparing skill wise Joe, dont put words in my mouth.  I clearly stated that he is too small.  those players are the same height basically.

Be honest with me Joe have you watched enough MSU games to have a legitimate stance you are willing to stick with.  Or did you just watch the big games and are going from there.  Because without being disrespectful i would say you are bullshitting your way through this argument. 

Kalin was never once asked to play SG.  When Lucious was on the floor along with Appling he was still taking care of point guard duties.  

Also how i know you are bullshitting your information is that if you watched the games Kalin created for himself through the offense no solo.  Thus eliminating any notion that he played SG or is a score first.

[Malik-UniversalParticipant]

 as a michigan state guy

i really hope he gets drafted

[joecheck88Participant]

In closing, I’d say that Kalin Lucas is a talented guy, proven winner and deserves an opportunity. With all this said, I am not wasting a pick on a person who can be found on every d-league roster. This year its Kalin Lucas, next year it’s Kenny Boynton from Florida. When I want a three string point guard, I’ll facebook message Kalin.

That is the perfect way to put it. That is pretty much what I was trying to say.

@Tim

No I didn’t watch many MSU games. What i know about Lucas is that he isn’t a great PG, he likes to score, and is still recovering from a serious injury. He can make a NBA team one day. I think he is a score first PG. That is my opinion of him and in my opinion he shouldn’t be drafted until late 2nd round at best. This is not a knock on Lucas, I just do not think he is ready for the league.

[Tim49461Participant]

 Fair enough Joe ill give you credit but Look

the best way to describe this situation is If i only watched MJ from 84-89.  I would tell you he cant shoot the 3 and isnt a great leader because he hasnt won anything.

To put that example in terms of this conversation.  You havent watched Kalin enough to have opinion that is worth defending.  Because you clearly didnt see his comeback.  The heel is not a question anymore.  You clearly dont watch any other game besides the big ones vs UNC and Duke to realize how much of a PG Kalin is.  To say he likes to score would mean you never watched the games.  He uses the offense to score not create for himself.  

Its fine to have a Opinion but you have to make it match up with the truth or you come across as dumb as the people claiming the world is 4,000 years old.  I really hope you get what im saying.  I respect the opinion on him just make it match up.

[patdawg5Participant]

I just want to start by saying I have watched every single MSU basketball game Kalin has played in, I have ties to Michigan State athletics. Tim you are being extremely arrogant with your messages, and you are making MSU fans look bad. (you kinda sound like a wolvie) First off I want to say that Kalin never had 1st round buzz other then after his freshman year when he played with Neitzel.. He had a very good soph year from a college bball perspective, but his true point guard skills were not what they were his freshman year. Did you know Darius Morris averages almost 7 dimes a game this season? Just thought I’d throw that out there because it seems like u went out of ur way a couple times to call out Darius.. I also want to say that over the past two season when Korie Lucious would play with Kalin in the back court Kalin would absolutely play off ball. Korie was considered the only true point MSU had, before he got into his legal trouble. Kalin used to run off screens all day to get jump shots. Tim I would have to say your MSU knowledge is lacking.. very much. You could go back to Kalins prep days at St. Marys, hes always been a shoot first PG. He didnt even win Mr. Basketball.. that went to Manny Harris… another undrafted guy like Kalin is about to be. Kalin is undersized, no longer has the burst he once had, and hes not a PG. He will get invited to camp but if you want a good comparison for Kalin look back at a couple former MSU PG’s, Marcus Taylor and Brandon Cotton. Where are they at now? We all know Kalin could have a great career over seas. So in the long run quit acting like you have all this inside info no one has. Your just an angry Sparty fan because Kalin, Summers and the rest of the squad this season could have been the most underachieving team in the last 20 years.

[Tim49461Participant]

 So Patdawg5,

apparently having ties to the program makes you have more knowledge? I can address each point you have. With everything you stated. I’ll even number it off so it is organized and flows.

1.Never a Wolverine

2. Kalin never had Buzz his freshmen year unless you are commenting on the fact the Big Ten Network made comments about him having potential to be a good replacement for Drew.  His 1st round buzz and comparisons to Paul and Thomas came from Dickie V and the Staff doing the Final Four halftime shows. ( I do know my stuff thank you).  Just to rub it in a little further about how little i know.  After his title game run where everyone thought he would leave since he was stirring up buzz.  He didnt leave because he was still a 1st round bubble.  And if you remember right 09 draft was the year of the PG.   Where 11 points guards were taken in the first round. 

3.I did know Darius averaged 7 dimes a game.  Im sorry Izzo’s plays revolve around more then one pass to shoot.  Most of the time it is high post entry to shot. or a pass to a wing for a pick an roll while the point guard rotates opposite side for a spot of up 3.( I never watched a single game dont worry)

4. Given the fact i believe i did say Kalin played PG when Korie was on the floor.  it was still 40% Kalin 60% Korie handling the ball and I dont remember a time where Kalin didnt play PG under 5 mins left.  Maybe you could help me out since being associated with the program lets you flow with facts.

So just in conclusion so you understand.  I showed where is buzz came from and it was legit.  I showed you how a Izzo PG operates under his system to show why his assist total was not 7.  And why Korie was never trusted with the ball under 5 mins.  Have anything else you want to test me with.

[patdawg5Participant]

I just gave a very informal response to someone who is talking about his opinions and strictly sticking with them? LOL that is not how you post in a sports forum.

1. Yes I do have ties to MSU athletics.

2. Kalin Lucas will never be a legit true PG. (any nba fan would know this)

3. Kalin is an afterthought in this draft.

4. I love this post because in all honesty this has no relevance to this draft.

3. Did you really use Dickie V as a reference? Once again ill say LOL…

4. Korie may not have been trusted at the end of games. But Kalin sure wasnt going to come up with a great pass at the end of the game like a TRUE PG should. (a nice example for u would be chris paul, true pg)

5. I just wish you would stop talking about anything to do with MSU in general, not only are you making yourself look bad but all Sparty fans in general.

6. Tim is just a dbag and will most likely never be respected on this site again.

peace out.

[Tim49461Participant]

 1. I would curious as to what ties those would be

2. Any nba fan? You mean the same ones that have had him slated between 30-50pick in each mock draft since the end of his sophomore season?  Makes sense right.

4. I guess,  I dont think you understand how to use the relevance correctly.  Because it clearly states he should be a 1st rounder in this years draft.  Come on I know MSU people can be bad at grammar and spelling but we know the meaning of words.

3. I actually did because 1. He brings attention the baby dandys to the casual fan and not only that but i also stated the Half Time staff. Meaning both Gregs and whoever the guest apperance was at the time.  Not only to mention that but Chad Ford explaining he was intrigued by Kalin Lucas.  So Yup.

4.  So let me point this out for you since i feel really ashamed to be a MSU fan with your associated with the team.  Chris Paul, Thomas, and every other Great PG knew when to pass correct.  But if you understand the slightest bit of basketball you understand you put the ball in the best players hand.  If Chris Paul ever pasted up a shot at the last second he would be burned.  the fact is Kalin was the best player.  Dont be stupid of course he takes the last shot over.  Roe, Payne, Appling, Summers.  Thank you for showing me you actually are just ignorant at this point.

5.  So far you havent done anything to set me in my place.  I even gave you credit when you said Korie said the ball.  So im willing to admit when im wrong.  

6.  Thats fine, dude be childish.  People will read a post no matter who writes it as long as it is good.

[Tongue-Out-Like-23Participant]

The only thing he had going for him was his speed and quickness, without that, he’s just an average player that’s going to make a living in Europe.

[iguapops420Participant]

 ^^^^+1. Let’s not act like an achilles injury isn’t anything that can’t be always in the back of your mind.

[Author]

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