[Tongue-Out-Like-23Participant]

Now that they’ve done 11-15, who are you guy’s top 10?  

It’s obvious these are the last 10 players, where would you rank them?

(Note: they are in alphabetical order by last name, no ranked)

• Kobe Bryant
• Kevin Durant
• Dwight Howard
• LeBron James
• Kevin Love
• Chris Paul
• Derrick Rose
• Dwyane Wade
• Russell Westbrook
• Deron Williams

[MJ FOR LIFE 23Participant]

 1. LeBron

2. Durant

3. Bryant

4a. Rose

4b. Paul

6. Howard

7. Westbrook

8. Wade

9. Love

10. D-Will

[F_S]

 1- lebron

2- kd

3- dwight

4- rose

5- paul

6- wade

7- kobe

8- westbrook

9- bynum

10- deron

[jmarg25Participant]

They ranked him 13 already. 

[BruinSteveParticipant]

 1) Lebron 

2) Durant

3) Kobe

4) Wade

5) Chris Paul

6) Rose

7) Dwight Howard

8) Love

9) Williams

10) Westbrook

 

[F_S]

 i too feel like putting the combo of wade and kobe over paul and rose, but at this point the SGs are going downhill while the PGs are going into their prime.

[RUDEBOY_Participant]

1.Lebron

2.Kobe

3.Durant

4.Wade

5.Derrick Rose

6.Dwight Howard

7.CP3

8.Deron Williams

9.Russell Westbrook

10.Kevin Love

 

[Lebron’s HairlineParticipant]

 Why are you guys putting rose ahead of Paul? He’s easily the best point guard in the league, he killed rose when they went head to head last year

[IndianaBasketballParticipant]

Are you sure?

They went head to head once last year and Rose *DOMINATED* Paul.

[EDEDnowisgone]

 

• Kobe BryantNA
• Kevin Durant 3
• Dwight Howard 2
• LeBron James 1
• Kevin Love NA
• Chris Paul 7
• Derrick Rose 5
• Dwyane WadeNA
• Russell Westbrook 4
• Deron Williams 6

8. Bynum

9. Rondo

10. Aldridge

[Tongue-Out-Like-23Participant]

10. Russell Westbrook
He’s an unfinished product but one of the best ball players out there today.  Completely unstoppable and isn’t even done improving.  When he gets his jump-shot and decision-making under control, we can see him rise a lot higher than 10.  For now, as a 2nd option, I can’t put him any higher than the following guys.

9. Kevin Love
The numbers guy.  One would assume if the best player on a team efficiently scored 25PPG and was the leading rebounder in the league, he would lead his team to the playoffs.  He hasn’t.  This might be the T-Wolves year though and if it is, we could see Kevin Love higher on the list.

8. Deron Williams
One of the most underrated superstars in the game today.  Overshadowed by the shadyness in Utah and how he left that team, he is the best all-around point guard in the league today.  Not only can he score in a myriad of ways (better shooter than Rondo, Rose, and Westbrook.  Better driver/post up player than CP3) but he is also a pure-point guard in a league that has very few of them.

7. Derrick Rose
There are various reasons why I have Derrick Rose at 7.  1) He didn’t play much last season and didn’t show much when he did because of injuries.  2) Will he be back to his old MVP form?  And if he does, will it be in the 2012-2013 season?  2013-2014? 2014-15?  Who knows?  3) He is the only superstar in the league that gets away without playing defense and is not crucified.  To be a top-5 player in this league, you have to atleast put some effort and Rose is usually lost and uninterested on that end.  

6. Kobe Bryant
Year after year, we think Kobe is going to take a step-backwards and age will catch up.  Year after year, he proves us wrong.  This is the year his numbers take a hit though and not in a bad way.  With more passing options and open looks off double-teams, this could be the first time in 8 years that Kobe might get some open shots.  This could really help his effiency as well as his passing, two things that have been knocked at his entire career.

5. Dwyane Wade
Here it is, finally.  Dwyane Wade will finally be the best SG in the league (How long have we been saying this for?)  Dwyane Wade completely and utterly shut down every SG in the playoffs and showed why he’s the best 2-way guard in the league for the last 5 years, even while injured.  Now that he took a summer off to help his injury woes, we could see a rejuvinated Wade next season that could step up his game.

4. Dwight Howard
After a year and a half, the Dwight-Drama is over… for now.  He’s by far the best center in the league and the best interior defender in the league. (Yes, Chandler.  He’s better than you.)  The only reason Howard did not win the DPOY this season is simply because his image took a hit and he was losing the popularity contest.  He was basically boycotted because of the negative exposure the league would get  (Remember the ’11 MVP award; LeBron does).  Still, I would not be surprised if Dwight Howard averages 24+ PPG and shoots over 58-60% from the field this season… unless his back has anything to say about it.

3. Chris Paul
He took the laughing stock of the last 30 years in the NBA to the 2nd round of the playoffs.  He did it while playing without Billups, a spot-up shooting shell named Caron Butler, a chucker in Nick Young, Reggie Evans as their 6th man, and the most pass-dependent (superstar) in the NBA today.  He’s not a numbers guy, he’s a results guy.  He’s proven this for years and proved it again this season.

2. Kevin Durant
How can you NOT like KD?  He’s a winner, he’s a hard-worker, he’s humble and he’s only getting better.  Unfortunately for him, the Thunder have been matched up against the eventual NBA champions three consecutive times (Lakers in ’10, Mavs in ’11, Heat in ’12).  He will win championships in his career (I’m leaning towards 2) but as of now, he’s improving and so is the team around him.  His numbers go up year after year and so does his team success, can he seal the deal?

1. LeBron James
Fresh off the most successful season by ANY NBA pro since Jordan in ’92.  He won an MVP award, Finals MVP, NBA Championship, and Olympic Gold.  Not only that, he was the main catalyst for his team during the regular season, playoffs, and Olympic trial.  He’s only getting better.  He’s getting hungrier.  He is one of the greatest two-way players in the NBA today and challenges Jordan for that title all-time.  He is the best defensive player in the league and I would not be surprised if he wins 2 DPOY when it’s all set and done… as a perimeter player.  LeBron has a chance to do something very special and this is his chance to cement his legacy as one of the greatest players of all time.  3x MVP, NBA Champion, x2 Gold Medalist, Finals MVP, 8x All-Star, 6x NBA 1st Team, 4x All Defense 1st Team….. Oh, I forgot to mention, he’s barely half-ways through his career.  

LeBron haters, you have another 8-9 years of hating, so why not just enjoy greatness as it unfolds right before your eyes.

[IndianaBasketballParticipant]

I disagree with you 110% about Derrick Rose’s defense. You could’ve made that argument maybe during Rose’s first two seasons, but that’s no longer the case.

According to Synergy Sports Technology ratings, Rose is one of the best defenders at the toughest position to defend in the league. Other than Chris Paul and Rajon Rondo, nobody gives up less points per possession or points in isolation situations.

Rose isn’t a great defender, but he’s a very good one who could become elite.

[Tongue-Out-Like-23Participant]

Synergy doesn’t take into account the fact that he plays with Deng, Brewer, Noah, Gibson and has the best defensive coach in the NBA.  It simply takes into account numbers and percentages.  He gets beat to the paint but his opponent still misses because of the help-side defense and all Synergy shows is that Rose’s opponent missed a shot while defended by him even if he did little to nothing to stop it.

[IndianaBasketballParticipant]

Can’t you say the same about Rondo though? He’s a part of a great defensive system as well. I can’t count how often he gambles and gets beat, but the Celtics help covers up his mistakes.

Not saying Rose is a great defender, but he’s a very good defender who could become elite.

[Tongue-Out-Like-23Participant]

Yes you could say the same about Rondo but a lot of the time, Rondo and Garnett are the two main defensive catalysts.  Can’t say the same about Rose. 

[ZYHEHEWAParticipant]

wow, thanks

[alex23Participant]

 1.lebron

2. durant

3. Dwight

4. Kobe

5 Chris paul

6.wade

7.rose

8.kevin love

9.westbrook

10. deron williams 

 

[dolla130Participant]

1. Lebron James – hands down the best player on the planet and if you have any argument what so ever thats due to your hate for lebron and your bias for who you would say is better

2. Kevin Durant – best scorer in the nba hands down

3.Dwight howard – i put him here because he still more dominate then alot of the othert superstars in the nba not named Lebron and durant

4.Derrick Rose – no he may not be the best PG at the postion but, IMO hes the best Player at the position and might be the best guard in the nba and when healthy he makes opposing pgs look avg, he easily dominates paul rondo and williams who are considered the top of the pg class and if he comes back to full strength i believe he could rival dwight for that number 3 spot

5. Dwayne Wade- when healthy is the best SG in the league im probably going to get alot of negatives for putting he and rose ahead of kobe but i dont really care yes kobe is still good but we still think about kobes previous greatness, when in reality kobe is up there not in age but in miles and his game is predicated on pump fakes and fadeaways hes not the same anymore

6. Kobe Bryant – still a great player but no longer top 5 to me

7.Chris paul – best PG at the position hands down but dosent have that gear anymore or he would have been higher on that list

8.Deron williams -3rd best pg in the nba

9.Kevin Love – i honeslty wouldnt have put him top 10 because i think carmelo anthony is better then him deron and westbrook but i gotta go with what was listed

10. Russell Westbrook- good player more of a sg then pg him and durant work off each other perfectly, they help each other do what they do

 

[druneave3Participant]

 1. LeBron

2. KD

3. Rose

4. Kobe

5. Paul

6. Howard

7. Wade

8. Love

9. Westbrook

10. Williams

I’ll take Rondo and Nowitzki at number 9 and 10.

[alex23Participant]

 love and rose ahead of wade on espn , idk about that

[lalailaParticipant]

1.LeBron

2.Durant

3. Kobe

4.Dwight

5.Wade

6.Rose

7.Paul

8.Westbrook

9.Love

10.Williams 

[UUMUYYOSAParticipant]

good picks

[RUDEBOY_Participant]

SMH!! For the Last 3 Years people keep saying Kobe is no LONGER a top 5 player and he Keeps Proving them WRONG!!!

The only reason i would rate Durant ahead of Kobe, is because Durant is a decade younger…

[NbanflguyParticipant]

Durant is better than today’s Kobe and it is not even close

[HaleParticipant]

Kobe wasn’t even a top 15 player in 2010-2011 so what are you talking about?

[RUDEBOY_Participant]

I thought Kevin Love had the talent to be a nba all star while seeing him at UCLA..

But i dont feel he’s a top 10 player..Maybe top 15….

 

[druneave3Participant]

Do you think Kevin Love is the best power forward in the NBA? If so he should be in top 10.

[IndianaBasketballParticipant]

1. LeBron James – He’s grown on and off of the floor. His offensive game is improving (less three-pointers, better post game and off of the ball activity) and he has the best body, athleticism and probably endurance in NBA history.

2. Kevin Durant – He’s the best offensive player in the NBA, but can still get so much better. Imagine him with added strength and a dominant low post game where you have to double him. He’s already a very good all-around player and is still improving.

3. Dwight Howard – When healthy, he’s the most dominant big man in the NBA. He’s a monster defensively and on the glass… Offensively, he’s very good (look at his numbers), but still not a go-to player. His free-throw shooting is an issue.

4. Derrick Rose – When healthy, he’s a lion. He’s the best player at his position in my opinion and does whatever it takes to win. How he returns from his injury remains to be seen. I’d have no problem switching Paul and him places since Rose was hurt most of last season. I thought Rose was better before the injury though.

5. Chris Paul – He’s the most complete player at his position (little to no holes in his game), but I feel he’s lost a gear since his knee injury. He dribbles too much and waits too long to take over games. He’s still very clutch though and can carry a team. It’s really hard to nitpick him.

6. Dwyane Wade – Due to Kobe’s age, Wade has finally surpassed him as the best shooting guard in the NBA. He just has more impact on a game. I felt Wade coasted too often though last season, letting LeBron carry the load.  

7. Kobe Bryant – It’s no longer about being the MVP, best in the NBA, etc for him. It’s about getting another ring or two. It’s not a disrespect to him that he’s #7. The fact he’s quite a few seasons past his prime and still in the handfull of best players in the NBA says something.

8. Deron Williams – He’s a complete point guard with size, but he’s just missing something in my opinion. I can’t quite put my finger on it.

9. Kevin Love – He’s the game’s best rebounder and he’s a great shooter, but I don’t think he belongs in the top ten. He’s never won during his career despite his numbers, which says something. He fills a stat sheet, but it doesn’t lead to wins.

10. Russell Westbrook – His talent and ability is undeniable, but his decision making and shot selection keep him out of the top ten. He’s made some improvements every season, but I’d like to see his assists go back up and just overall better decision making.

[Pistol Pete. The PelicanParticipant]

1. Lebron-He’s Lebron James
2. Dwight- He affects more parts of the game than anyone else on the list besides Lebron
3. Chris Paul, tremendous leader, great pure point guard but can definitely score with the best, check his 4th quarter of any game, also pesky in the passing lanes.
4. Kobe Bryant, has slowed down a little but still good at everything, his brain actually gets taken for granted on list like these. He knows the game of basketball better than anyone on the list besides maybe Lebron.
5. Kevin Durant, I’m going to catch flack for putting Kevin Durant at 5, but he’s still a very limited defender, a limited passer, and he is really only a scorer. He also still hasn’t developed a post game, and he has problems with strength on the court. Ron Artest(Metta World Peace) made his games tougher, and Lebron did an even better job. Besides rebounding, you can’t say he does anything greatly better than Kobe.
6. Derrick Rose- I think he and Russell Westbrook are a toss up, but Rose gets the edge for being a better “Point Guard,” really turnovers and assists wins him the battle in my opinion.
7. Russell Westbrook- one of the best competitors in the game right now. See everything Derrick Rose does and then add his turnovers.
8. Dwyane Wade- I honestly think he and Westbrook’s playing styles are very similar, this is just young dog got the old dog.
9. Deron Williams, I honestly think it’s a toss up between the 2 best point guards in the NBA between him and CP3, but your team has to win, I’m predicting Deron Williams to be top 5, after this season.
10. Kevin Love- Great shooter, still needs to work on post moves, amazing rebounder, Horrible defender.

Nota Bene(Please Note)- I think Carmelo should be in the top 10. I don’t think there is much of a difference between he and Durant, but Durant is the more likable and bankable player so he doesn’t get all of the backlash that Carmelo gets. Also Carmelo is in New York, that makes the microscope on him amazingly larger. I would take out Kevin Love.

[IndianaBasketballParticipant]

I feel like you’re really nitpicking and selling Durant short.

He can get better as a defender, but we’re talking about a player who ranked 5th out of small forwards in steals at 1.33 per game and 2nd in blocks at 1.17 per game. He made strides as a defender last season defending on the perimeter and in the post.

He was 4th amongst small forwards in assists at 3.5 per game. He made strides as a passer/playmaker last season, but did average too many turnovers. Post game wise, he doesn’t bully anyone, but I thought he did a solid job posting up on the low, mid or high block. Like I said, he’s not bullying anyone, but he’s turning around and shooting over any defender.

Just don’t understand how you can say there’s not much difference between Durant and Carmelo Anthony when Durant is better at just about every offensive statistic.

[Pistol Pete. The PelicanParticipant]

 If you’re usin Carmelo Anthony’s career as his worth, then you’re nitpicking. Because everyone saw once Mike Dantoni left, how great Carmelo’s last month and a half were. 29.8 points, 7.3 rebounds, 3.6 assists, 1.4 steals. while shooting 50% from the field. If you compare career stats they are almost identical. I think Kevin Durant gets to much credit.

Career stats Carmelo 24.7 points, 6.3 rebounds, 3.1 assists on 46% shooting VS. Kevin Durant 26.3 points, 6.6 rebounds, 2.8 assists on 47% shooting.

 

People are seriously nitpicking on Carmelo for no reason. I’ll just wait until next year and we’ll see the argument again. Carmelo should be top 10.

[Tongue-Out-Like-23Participant]

I don’t see how Westbrook is better than Wade.  Dwyane Wade can do everything that Westbrook can do except he does it all under control, doesn’t force, is efficient, and doesn’t turn the ball over.

If you take away all of the negatives that Westbrook has and add better perimeter and post defense, you get Dwyane Wade.

[Pistol Pete. The PelicanParticipant]

 I ended D-Wades with it’s a young guard taking the old guard thing. Dwyane Wade gets injured too much now. He and Westbrook both do the same exact things. 

Russell Westbrook playoff averages 23.1 points, 5.5 rebounds, 5.8 assists, and 1.55 steals to Dwyane Wade’s 22.8 points, 5.2 rebounds, 4.3 assists, 1.7 steals, and 1.3 blocks, the only stats Dwyane Wade leads in are steals and blocks, and the steals are right there with each other. Also Dwyane Wade played more minutes a game. 

So if D-Wade wasn’t injuried every year he’d be higher than Westbrook and probably a few other players. But his injuries have hindered his game and halted his production. Westbrook is better right now. Maybe this year will be different. So there isn’t anything wrong with putting Westbrook over Wade right now. 

[F_S]

 i am surprise to not see him on anyone’s top 10.

i am definitely not a melo fan, and I had him number 11 on my last top 20 like 4 days ago.

.

also, next year, everyone will have bynum in their list if he doesn’t get injured

[HaleParticipant]

1. LeBron James

2. Kevin Durant

3. Dwight Howard

4. Derrick Rose (healthy)

5. Chris Paul

6. Dwyane Wade

7. Kobe Bryant

8. Kevin Love

9. Russell Westbrook

10. Deron Williams

[PROBALLWAParticipant]

I like the picks

[chrsw003Participant]

 1. lebron james

2. durant

3. kobe

4. d rose

5. dwight howard

6. CP3

7. D wade

8. Westbrook

9. Deron Williams

10. Love

[RUDEBOY_Participant]

Y2G, I Know that must’ve Been a Misprint when you said Kobe wasn’t a top 15 player in 2010-11?

[HaleParticipant]

I meant top 10, but regardless he wasn’t very good that season at all. He bounced back this year a bit, but he’s no longer a top 5 player. I know this site has an abundance of Laker fans but Kobe just simply isn’t at the top anymore and it’s pretty obvious when you watch him play. He’s still great, but he’s not top 5.

[NbanflguyParticipant]

Rudeboy, I Know that must’ve Been a Misprint when you said 34 year old Kobe is better than Durant

[WolfRobParticipant]

 People forget… CP3 is one of those few players that you can put on a team and they instantly become a playoff threat. Put Chris, KD, or Lebron on the Bobkittens and they go to the playoffs. 

 

1. Lebron

2. KD

3. Cp3

4. Dwight

5. Drose (I think he’s 3rd when healthy)

6. Deron

7. Kobe

8. Dwade

9. Russ

10. KLove

 

[FastAndFuriousParticipant]

 Don’t really have a ranking just know that Lebron is #1 and glad to finally see Russell Westbrook getting the respect he deserves as a top 10 player in this league, because he is top 10! 

[ProudGrandpaParticipant]

1. Lebron

2. Durant

3. Howard

4. Rose

5. Wade

6. Paul

7. Williams

8. Bryant, Kobe

9. Bryant, John

10. Love

[NYK2010Participant]

 Kobe not a top 15 player in 2010-11 thats a joke.

Also Dwight Howard is not a top 3 player.

Can hit a jumper and up till the last year or 2 his post up game wasn’t that great either.

He is the best Center but Bynum isn’t top 10 or close there is no way Howard is that much better than Bynum, Love, Aldridge or any other top big man.

1. Lebron he’s been the top player for a while now and now the ring shuts up the haters.

2. Durant is a great scorer and is improving his all around game.

3. Chris Paul will need to produce more in the playoffs to earn this high a ranking.

4. Kobe he’s lost a step but still clutch and a lethal scorer when he gets hot.

5. Rose seems injury prone who knows if he’ll be the same when he comes back and he needs to improve his mid range game.

6. Wade dropped because of the playoffs last year but that could’ve been the injury taking a toll on him.

7. Howard the best big man, rebounding and shot blocking numbers are great.  Obviously needs to hit his free throws and stay out of foul trouble.

8. Westbrook his jumper and decision making are improving.

9. Rondo is no longer just a passer on offense and he was the best PG in the playoffs.

10. Love scoring is up needs to make the playoffs now with the supporting cast getting much better.

[HaleParticipant]

Like I said I meant top 10. Now explain to me how great he was that year genius.

[aamir543Participant]

In my opintion, Westbrook is easily better than D-Will. D-Will is still a top 10 player, but Westbrook is just so much more explosive, and he can score almost at will, his defense is better than D-Will’s also. I know we don’t like his decision making, but that will come with time. This is the year my boy Westbrook cements himself as a top 5 player in the league.

[FastAndFuriousParticipant]

Your not the only one hoping Westbrook jumps into the top 5! Hoping this is the year he shuts the rest of his haters up. 

[iguapops420Participant]

1.LBJ

2.Dwight

3.Durant

4.Kobe

5.CP3

6.Deron

7.Love

8.Westbrook

9.Wade

10.Bynum/Rondo

[RUDEBOY_Participant]

@Y2G, In 2010-11 Kobe was

1st Team All NBA

1st Team All Defense

3rd in Scoring and 3rd in Field Goals Made…

And he Finished 4th in MVP Voting..(4TH in MVP in Voting) in 2010-11..That Means a Panel of Experts Thought He had the 4th best year out of all the Players…So Why wasnt he a Top 5 player in 2010-11? That was just last year? So why are you saying Kobe was NO GOOD in 2010-11?  Sure,I ‘ll agree he had lost a step and rarely shows the hops that he once had…But he wasn’t as Bad as you’re saying….

[HaleParticipant]

Do you honestly believe that he earned any of those? He got them all due to name value. Hell almost all of his 1st team defenses are completely undeserved. Not to mention being 4th in MVP doesn’t mean they thought he was the 4th best player, they just gave him his annual MVP votes because of his name. 2010-2011 was the worst season Kobe had since he got significant playing time, which is why people made such a big deal about his knee surgery thing this season. He was clearly better this past year even though he got a little shot happy because of it, but make no mistake Kobe Bryant was not THAT good in 2010-2011.

 

[RUDEBOY_Participant]

@NBAnflguy…Ask any NBA Coach or GM who they hate seeing with the ball in their hands in the final seconds of a game,they’ll say the 34 year old Kobe Bryant….And even at 34 he’s still a top defender,1 of the most clutch players and maybe the best 1 on 1 player in the league…

I Love Durant,he’s 1 of the top 3 players in the nba right now..But until he starts playing both sides of the ball and start making his teammates better..20 years from now,he’s going to be in the same Category as players like Dominique Wilkens & George Gervin…Durant isnt a bad defender,but he isnt a presence on the defensive end,like a Lebron,Kobe or Wade….

[NbanflguyParticipant]

I would, but I dont have any coach or gm’s phone number. If you make statement like that, I assume that you talk to coaches or Gm’s to get that information. Who have you asked about it? Are they nice in person?

The clutch stat is bs to. There have been tons of information lately that shows that Kobe really is not all that clutch. Yeah he has made some awesome clutch shots in his career, but when you take every single clutch shot for the past 15 years you have to make a few. I have seen tons of times where Kobe will take and miss a contested fade away jumper while being triple teamed instead of hitting an open man.

Im not even a huge Durant fan. I think he is getting a little bit overrarted lately with people thinking he is better than Lebron, but he is still better than Kobe right now.

It is also laughable that you think Kobe makes his teammates better and Durant doesnt

[NbanflguyParticipant]

Here is a note I found interesting:

Bryant’s annual All-Defense selections make a mockery of the idea that head coaches are actually doing the voting. He picks his spots and rarely has to guard good wings. Nobody would place him among the league’s elite stoppers.

Thats from espn insider scouting report on Bryant.

[IndianaBasketballParticipant]

Now, hold on… I’ll say that Kobe hasn’t deserved some of his late career all defensive selections, BUT to say ALL of his NBA All-Defensive First Team selections are "completely undeserved" is pure ignorance.

During the prime of Kobe’s career and even slightly after it, he was one of the best perimeter defenders in the NBA… An absolute lockdown defender who could defend three positions. There’s a reason these voters are still giving these to him… It’s because they’re living too far back in the past and not right at this moment.

 

 

 

[RUDEBOY_Participant]

I Cant Believe you said Kobe wasnt a Top 10 player in 2010-11…..

[IndianaBasketballParticipant]

Yea, even with a bum knee that season, Kobe put up 25, 5 and 5… AND played all 82 games.

There were not 10 players better than Kobe that season.

[HaleParticipant]

Lebron James, Dwyane Wade, Dirk Nowitzki, Kevin Durant, Derrick Rose, Dwight Howard, and Chris Paul were all clearly better. You could also make a case for Zach Randolph, Russell Westbrook, Tony Parker, Amare before Melo showed up, and Kevin Love. I hate how everyone has a selective memory and forgets how Kobe wasn’t nearly as good in 10-11 as he was in 11-12 and it was so obvious in the way he played.

[BELLY333333Participant]

Lebron James

[NooMMMAParticipant]

kobe

[NbanflguyParticipant]

Now, hold on… I’ll say that Kobe hasn’t deserved some of his late career all defensive selections, BUT to say ALL of his NBA All-Defensive First Team selections are "completely undeserved" is pure ignorance.

Who said that?

[IndianaBasketballParticipant]

Y2G

[NbanflguyParticipant]

I think he was refering to all the awards that Kobe got in 2010-2011, not all the awards he has won in his career.

[IndianaBasketballParticipant]

"Hell almost all of his 1st team defenses are completely undeserved."

That doesn’t sound like he was just talking the about the 2010-2011 season.

[NbanflguyParticipant]

Your right. I didnt read that part I guess. Lets go beat him up!!

[HaleParticipant]

I meant exactly what you said. His later awards were not deserved, I worded it poorly.

[IndianaBasketballParticipant]

Even at this point of Kobe’s career, he’s a more complete player than Kevin Durant, BUT Durant’s *youth*, athleticism and height/length with so much offensive skill is enough to overcome his lack of a complete game and put him over Kobe in my opinion.

I think Durant is figuring out how to make his teammates better… It’s not always about assists. It’s about being aggressive… It’s about closing up the holes in your game and putting yourself in positions where you can make the game easier for your teammates. It’s about demanding nothing but the best from your teammates and understanding that leading doesn’t always mean being everybody’s best friend. Like I said, I think Durant has made strides… I liked seeing him get on Russell Westbrook.

At this point, it’s time to let go of Kobe being the best in the league, etc. I have no problem with considering him top five even, but he’s clearly on the decline and only has about two or three years left. He admitted that himself.

[F_S]

 i don’t think its fair to say durant is lacking a complete game

[IndianaBasketballParticipant]

It’s a fair statement. Kevin Durant isn’t a complete player, which is why he’s so scary.

He’s not a great post player just yet because he lacks strength.

He’s not a great defender just yet, but he can make an impact with his length alone. He’s improving, but can still get so much better.

He’s a great offensive player, but couldn’t he be more aggressive? Wouldn’t you like to see him demand the ball more?

And leadership wise… He’s still growing as a well. He’s not a natural leader, but he’s shown improvement the last two seasons.

 

[F_S]

 i think you’re mixing up his CURRENT abilities with his POTENTIAL to grow skill-wise. and that’s what makes him scary. he’s above average at everything.

he improved his post game this year, with that over-the-top nowitzki-ish one-legged turnaround. (that we’ll see him use more and more as he gets older), i also saw improvements at being a bit more aggressive against smaller defenders.

he’s already an above average defender. and he’ll FOR SURE improve in this area

be more aggressive? he drew as many fouls as D.wade who is considered a top ‘slasher’ in the game. only one less than lebron who is considered a freight train. he shot 50 from the floor, it doesn’t get much more efficient than that for a wing player.

and leadership wise? kevin durant is never gonna be that vocal leader like lebron. just doesn’t strike me as that person. but he doesn’t take bad shot, wants to win, is a good teammate and most importantly, he’s clutch as F

 

 

 

[IndianaBasketballParticipant]

So you think Kevin Durant’s game is *complete* at 23 years old?

Complete means total… Absolute. Complete means perfected… To make whole.

Can Durant get in the post and shoot a turnaround "one legged" fadeaway? Yea, sure… But he’s not a complete post player. It’s not a strength in his game. That’s what complete means. Kobe Bryant’s post game is complete. Paul Pierce’s post game is complete. Dirk Nowitzki’s post game is complete. During the NBA Finals, LeBron James dominated in the post and looked complete. There were no answers for him in the post and he either exploited his defender or got doubled and made them pay by making passes to wide open teammates/making it easier for them.

Durant can do a lot of things, but  he’s not a complete basketball player. There are a lot of players in the NBA who can do things… That doesn’t mean those areas of their games are complete. There’s a difference and it’s pretty huge.

[F_S]

to me he is a complete player… like, overall. 

not complete in the sense he has peeked.

but whatever, if you think kevin durant is not a complete player because his post game is not as polished as kobe’s, carmelo’s, or lebron’s post game, who are the best post wing-players. then that’s your opinion.

fact is, durant has no weakness.

[Tongue-Out-Like-23Participant]

He can’t exactly defend in the post.  That’s a weakness.

He’s not a natural leader.  That’s a weakness.

Improving his passing but not all there yet.  That’s a weakness.

Cannot control tempo of a game.  That’s a weakness.

Not as aggresive as he should be on both ends.  That’s a weakness.

[F_S]

BS.

he can defend in the post. when was the last SF that started exploiting durant in the post?… not a weakness

he;s not a natural leader? i went over this… he is a leader by example!!! he’s insanely clutch and will come thru when his team needs him. doesnt jack shots. he took his team to the finals as a 24 year old outplaying the hottest teams in the mavs, lal, and spurs….. clearly not a weakness

his passing is well above average….. clearly not a weakness. 

control the tempo of a game? he’s 7 feet tall, do you want him playing point forward?…that’s not his game. he controls the game by scoring whenever a bucket is needed.

…PLEASE…

[Tongue-Out-Like-23Participant]

"When was the last SF that started exploiting durant in the post?"
LeBron in the Finals.

Leading by example and leading by words are two completely different things.  It’s obvious Westbrook is the vocal leader on that team.

His passing is nowhere near above average, just stop it.

When you’re the star player on the team, you need to be able to control the tempo of the game, doesn’t matter if you’re 7’6" (Like Yao did for the Rockets when healthy) or 5’11 (Like Allen Iverson did for the 76ers and Denver)

Another thing, he turns the ball over way too much for somebody that isn’t the primary or secondary ball-handler on the team.

 

[F_S]

 lebron did not exploit durant in the post. nor did he do more damage in the post than usual.

leading by example is being a leader.

4th best passing SF.

how did yao control the tempo of the rockets? (serious question)

allen iverson is not 5’11

he held the ball at a 31 usage% compared to westbrook’s 32%. which would make him the secondary ball-handler.

 

 

 

[NooMMMAParticipant]

There were not 10 players better than Kobe that season.

[UUMUYYOSAParticipant]

haha

[IndianaBasketballParticipant]

I think we have different definitions of "complete player" and just what being a complete player requires. We’ll have to agree to disagree on this.

[F_S]

 no prob. agreed to disagree.

if you had to make a list, what does durant require to be a complete player? post game?

cuss the way i look at it, if he’s not a complete player. THEN WHO IS????? aside from lebron. 

[HaleParticipant]

 Paul Pierce, Chris Paul, Kobe, Steve Nash offensively.

[F_S]

 paul pierce: lacks a first step. post game is not as strong as some think. he’s complete though

chris paul: should attack the basket more. has lost that super quickness. gets taken to the post by bigger PGs. disappears for short periods of time and then waits till the last second to explode.

kobe: bad shooting selection, ball stopper, needs to be more efficient from the floor.

steve nash: loosing quickness, hole on defense.

 

[HaleParticipant]

 Complete means they can do everything. It has nothing to do with being athletic. Kobe, Pierce and Paul can also score in every way imaginable, pass if needed, rebound and defend, therefore they are complete.

[F_S]

 "Complete means they can do everything. Kobe, Pierce and Paul can also score in every way imaginable, pass if needed, rebound and defend, therefore they are complete."

SO DOES DURANT!!!!!! i think kobe, pierce, and paul ARE complete players!!!!! im just trying to prove that you can nit-pick on any1!

durant can do everything in the court, as well as them. score from anywhere, pass, rebound, defend. he is the undisputable 2nd best player in the world.

[HaleParticipant]

Durant doesn’t defend nearly as well as those three and isn’t much of a passer at this point, even though he’s improving. He’s the 2nd best player in the world, but he isn’t complete yet. He could be in 12-13, but he hasn’t shown to be it at this point.

[F_S]

 by saying "as well as them"

i meant "and they can too"

NOT, ‘he can do those things as well as them

[F_S]

 BTW durant posted better ‘defensive rating’ than kobe. and better steal and block numbers than both,  pierce and kobe.

[NYK2010Participant]

A lock down defender at 3 positions really meanwhile Fisher, Fox were guarding the other teams top offensive player a lot of the time.

[IndianaBasketballParticipant]

You mean just like Pippen used to guard the other team’s best player from time to time and Jordan sometimes wouldn’t lock up the best offensive player until the 4th quarter? Or how LeBron didn’t always defend the best player so he could roam defensively? I remember LeBron defending Alston instead of Lewis and Turk. Do you remember him covering Dirk at all during the Finals? Just because a great defensive player doesn’t defend the best offensive player every second of the game doesn’t mean he’s not a great defensive player.

 

There is no doubt that Kobe was a *lockdown* defender during his prime who could defend point guard, shooting guard or small forward.

[Malik-UniversalParticipant]

1. Lebron

2. Kevin D. 

3. Kobe

4. Rose 

5. Paul

6. Howard

7. Wade 

8. Deron Williams

9. Westbrook

10. Love

 

[MUbballfanParticipant]

1) LeBron

2) Durant

3) D12

4) Paul

5) Wade

6) Rose

7) Kobe

8) Love

9) DWill

10) Westbrook

[Pistol Pete. The PelicanParticipant]

 I think people put extremely too much stock into the art of scoring, there is much more to the game than putting the ball in the net. 

[aamir543Participant]

If you don’t think Kobe has been top 10 at the very least in every season for the past decade, you are definatly smoking somthing.

Would I have put Kobe in the top 5 this season or last? Not at alll, but to say he hasn’t been even at 9 or 10 is ignorant. The guy scored 25 a game in only 33 minutes per, that too at a respectable 45%(In 10-11) I know his FG% dipped considerably this past season, but to say guys like Rondo, Bynum, and Dirk are better than Kobe? It might be close but you still have to give Kobe the nod…..for now that is. If his efficiency continues to dip ranking him lower can definatly be justified, but I have him in the top 10 right now.

[HaleParticipant]

 I swear you never read what I actually say, but whatever.

[aamir543Participant]

I do read your posts, and that was not aimed at you, or anyone in particular. The reason I sort of assumed that you meant Kobe wasn’t in the top 10 last year was because you said Kobe is in the back end of the top 10 this year, but he was worse last year. My bad. 

[HaleParticipant]

 Double post

[bangbangwayne3000]

Y2g is a clown.saying kobe isnt atop10 player.most of the posters on here no nothing and are bandwagoners. And durant does need to get better on both sides of the ball. Rudeboy was right on the money.if d

[NbanflguyParticipant]

Y2g is a clown.saying kobe isnt atop10 player.most of the posters on here no nothing and are bandwagoners. And durant does need to get better on both sides of the ball. Rudeboy was right on the money.if d

Wow…. Just wow. Take a English class ASAP

[GrandmamaParticipant]

 Lol, "an" English class, you need one too…

[IndianaBasketballParticipant]

Lmfao

[bangbangwayne3000]

Y2g is a clown.saying kobe isnt atop10 player.most of the posters on here no nothing and are bandwagoners. And durant does need to get better on both sides of the ball. Rudeboy was right on the money.if d

[bangbangwayne3000]

And u ugly to. And dum

[NbanflguyParticipant]

nbanflguy u r a below average poor poster

And u ugly to. And dum

Nbanflguy *you *are a below average *and poor poster. *You *are ugly and *dumb as well.

[bangbangwayne3000]

Po poster

[NbanflguyParticipant]

so nbanflguy yo name should be dleague arena leagueguy

Po poster

*So *Nbanflguy, *your name should be *dleaguearenaleagueguy.

*Your a *poor poster.

 

[NbanflguyParticipant]

*You’re

[ZOOKINGSAWAParticipant]

“There are a lot of new faces, lot of new players, it does take time to jell,” newcomer Elton Brand said as the team kicked off camp. “I think starting training camp early and going to Europe will give us a chance to jell and mesh and be beneficial for us. There are a lot of guys on one-year deals.

[RockGAGAEWAWWParticipant]

1) Lebron

2) Durant

3) Kobe

4) Wade

5) Chris Paul

6) Rose

7) Dwight Howard

8) Love

9) Williams

10) Westbrook

[TWTWWAParticipant]

The only reason i would rate Durant ahead of Kobe, is because Durant is a decade younger…

[BringWinBingoParticipant]

1. LeBron

2. KD

3. Rose

4. Kobe

5. Paul

6. Howard

7. Wade

8. Love

9. Westbrook

10. Williams

[Lakers_own_uParticipant]

Rookie point guard Damien Lillard scored 20 points for Portland (1-2). LaMarcus Aldridge had 16 points and seven rebounds, Nicolas Batum scored 14, and Wesley Matthews and J.J. Hickson had 11 each.

[dg34232323Participant]

The Jazz showed all the teamwork Los Angeles still lacks in their second big win over the Lakers in four days. Utah led by 20 points at halftime while holding the Lakers to 10-for-34 shooting, going ahead 35 in the third quarter and by 41 in the fourth while easily slicing through the Lakers’ makeshift lineups.

[Author]

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