Doug McDermott Comparison
DougieMac is being compared to Kyle Korver.
I have never seen Korver do anything other than shoot an open Jimmy.
Dougie Fresh, runs the floor like a mad man, plays in the post, puts the ball on the floor and takes it to the bucket strong.
That's a pretty lazy comparison. White, went to Creighton and can shoot so he must be similar to Korver right? Nah. He reminds me more of a combination of Wally Szczerbiak and Antawn Jamison. He's a good shooter, but not the the type of shooter who will run around singles/doubles, curls all day and shoot on the move with a quick release from the arc like Korver. He's more of a spot up shooter from beyond the arc with a slippery game below it and some post game. He has the knack like Jamison of finding openings in the defense, catching the ball in creases or from quick post ups and quickly getting shots up with accuracy. He's the master of getting into a shot motion without even looking at the rim. He makes up for his athleticism to a degree with his quick, awkward releases from mid-range and below as well as his movement off the ball. He also battles hard to get positioning for the ball. I'm not sure how much of his post game will translate, but he obviously knows what he's doing down there, so he'll be able to have his number called for post ups vs some NBA SFs. He knows how to get defenders off balance in the post, has economic footwork and can open up for the face up jumper a la Wally.
Here's a scouting report on Wally coming out of college, and the similarities are pretty significant. High efficiency scorers from small conferences with inside out ability.\
Agree, Korver is a lazy comparison and also a predictable and false one. McDermott doesn't run around screens in college so maybe he's capable of it but he lumbers and doesn't show the quickness and speed to have element in his game. As for Jamison and Wally, I'd say the former is apt for the college level. McDermott has a quick release around the rim like Jamison does but without as much unorthodoxy or really unorthodoxy. At the NBA level, I don't think McDermott can finish around the rim like Jamison did and Jamison wasn't even all that great at finishing in the NBA either. I actually don't think McDermott will post up too much in the NBA. A lot of his post game consist of running from baseline to baseline as hard as he can and then sealing his defender at the rim. He'll do some drop-steps and hooks but most of his post scoring is simple bank shots from up close. At his size, strength, athleticism and likely NBA-role, I don't think he's going to be doing much of that.
I think Wally was a better ballhandler and created better off the dribble. McDermott barely handles the ball for his team.
McDermott is a much better college player than Novak was but that said, I think McDermott's going to be limited to picking and popping and spotting up from three like Novak. I don't think McDermott's dribble drive game (which he doesn't even do a lot in college) and post up game translate to the NBA.
I'm pretty sure McDermott's going to carve out a fairly long NBA career because not only can he shoot with crazy accuracy but his release is super quick. He should have no problems being a deadly three-point specialist.
Yeah, the Korver comparison is not great, since, while McDermott will have to adjust his game significantly in the NBA, his strength is his scoring in the paint, and he has yet to show quite the perimeter skills of Korver. McDermott just is an old-school player who doesn't readily compare to many modern NBA players.
I do have high hopes for McDermott, but his lack of an obvious NBA comparison worries me. His motor, touch around the basket, post footwork, and spot-up shooting ability are all elite for an NBA prospect, though, so I think he will be fine. He may not have the prototypical size and athleticism of an NBA post player, but his touch around the basket in incredible and he has a super-quick release on shots down low. He is also a master of positioning, consistently getting a foot lower than his defender, giving him the advantage on almost every post-up. The consistency of his footwork in the post is reminiscent of Tim Duncan . As long as he proves a competent defender, I expect him to have an excellent NBA career.
He hasn't shown perimeter skills????
He hasn't shown the perimeter skills of Kyle Korver. McDermott is an elite shooter out of the pick-and-pop and is an elite spot-up shooter, but has very rudimentary ball-hnadling skills and limited ability to shoot off the dribble and, while Creighton does run him off screens sometimes, he isn't as experienced shooting over screens as Korver is. In fact, Creighton primarily screens to free McDermott up in the post, not to free him up for a jump shot.
McDermott has excellent perimeter skills for a big man, but his lack of ball-handling ability limits him as a wing prospect. If he had even average athleticism for an NBA wing, that wouldn't be as much of a problem, but he needs to improve his handle, his ability to finish on face-up drives, and he needs to develop a superior pull-up jump shot to make the transition to wing fully.
To add to my previous post, while one of the reasons I love McDermott's game in college is his efficiency and his ability to create high-percentage shots, he does need to add more to his game to keep NBA defenders honest. But while one of his biggest strengths as a player is ability to create easy finishing opportunities and catch-and-shoot threes, he will need to improve his face-up game so NBA teams an't just run him off the three point line every chance they get. McDermott also won't be able to establish impeccable post position on seemingly every offensive possession the way he does in college, so he will have to improve his ability to face-up out of the post and take his man off-the-dribble.
Now, McDermott won't have to deal with teams completely abandoning the weak side to double him when he posts up in the NBA, so it isn't going to be all bad in the NBA, but there is still going to be a big adjustment period for him as a rookie in the NBA. I do see McDermott as a lottery talent, but I do try to be realistic about his limitations as an NBA prospect. He isn't going to be able to maintain the efficiency and productivity he had in college once he gets to the NBA. Creighton's jump to the Big East should help give a better indication of his NBA potential, as he will match up against superior talent and may have to adjust his game a little to maintain his productivity.
Shooting the 3 is just one perimeter skill. Can he shoot on the move? Can he create from out there? What happens when he's chased off the line, can he make a play with the ball going towards the hoop? Does he have the ball skills to handle ball screen action?
Korver's perimeter skills aren't that great either but I know from watching him with the Bulls that an entire group of offensive sets can be designed around his ability to run off of multiple screens and shoot from the perimeter. I can't see that happening with Doug.
I think he's more of an Ersan Ilyasova-type player. Big-bodied guy who can knock down the three and be an all-around high-efficiency offensive player
That's probably the best comparison I've heard. McDermott is probably the better shooter and post scorer, while Ilyasova is the better rebounder, but they both have a great feel for the game and are extremely unselfish players who screen well and do a lot of the little things needed to win.
Ilyasova is taller and much longer than Doug. Ilyasova is only 1 inch taller in shoes but has nearly a five inch advantage in wingspan. I don't know Doug's standing reach but there's no way it measures up to power forwards. Ilyasova has the requisite 9'1.5 standing reach for the PF position.
Ilyasova is an above average rebounder in the NBA. His total rebounding percentage has been anywhere from 13.9 (average) to a very good 17.6. His has his deficiencies at PF but he's a stretch four who can also rebound for the position. When he's at PF, it's not termed small ball. Doug at PF is small ball.
He has a lot of Keith Van Horn/Rashard Lewis in him
Korver has nearly zero near the basket scoring skills and not a great rebounder.
Mcdermotts best comparison is Matt Harpring. Almost like twins if you ask me
the wally szczerbiak comparison is a great 1 because both guys look like they absolutely suck and thier bodies look stiff as hell, but then they go out there and just kick butt. and are both really good shooters...right on the money with that comparison.. the fact that they both go to smaller schools is another factor as well
...And all of the comparisons are white too... Give me Boris Diaw...
So you make it a race thing and then give a very mediocre comparison between two guys of different ethnicities.
Sorry, I really am. Just was getting a tired of this, whether you want to believe it or not almost all of the comparisons on this site is people of the same race. That said I shouldn't have brought anything up.
Which is partly because white people are less athletic in general, so unathletic players like McDermott will get compared to similar unathletic players, who most of the time are white.
I'm french and I can tell you one thing : diaw was a very athletic player when he was young... a way better athlete than McDermott will never be.
He was also weaker and didn't possess McDermott shooting ability.
They are two very different players
Ok, just because they're both big-bodied wing players who can shoot does not mean that Wally Szczerbiak is a decent comparison. McDermott doesn't nearly have the ballhandling and penetration skills that Wally has and he is not nearly as good of an athlete.
Wally was not a ball-handler or penetrator and he was a poor athlete.
All correct or somewhat correct. I'd say McDermott is literally not a ballhandler because he rarely handles the ball. He plays like a power forward in the way he outlets every rebound and hardly handles the ball off screens. Wally wasn't so much not a ballhandler as a limited one. Still, he at least was on the receiving end of some outlet passes rather than always delivering them and he created jumpers off the dribble. Wally averaged over 10 shots per game WITHIN the arc and managed to score around 17-20 points off very good efficiency. There's no way Doug is going to be capable of that.
I don't see why some of Doug's post game wouldn't be able to translate,especially vs NBA SFs where he will see some time. He's hard nosed, plays strong (Wally was stronger though, which was his greatest athletic quality), understands positioning, has very good footwork, battles for position and works to maintain it. He's also a master at running the baseline so he could get some quick pin action for his jump hook (and other quick release shots), which he can get off quickly before even spotting the rim (something that Jamison did very well). Working the baseline will also allow for some mid post opps where he can inside pivot for a quick jumper a la Wally. Doug really has good touch and quick releases from inside the arc.
Wally wasn't a great ball-handler. You couldn't' really entrust him to do anything other than pump and go. Defenders had to play him close and if they bit on Wally's pump fake, he had the strength to maintain his advantage and carry his defenders closer to the paint.
Also, Doug plays PF bc he IS the PF for Creighton. He also has played with capable playmaking, ball-handling guards like Grant GIbbs and Austin Chatman. Being the best rebounder on his team of course he's going to throw more outlet passes than receive them. That was the same story for Wally in college as well.
I can't see Doug's post game succeeding because it's mostly predicated on establishing DEEP position a few feet from the basket and hitting simple bank shots. He's not going to be able to establish the same kind of positioning because nobody does in the NBA, not Lebron, not Carmelo, nobody. I haven't seen Doug consistently back his man down and do advanced post work. Of course at the college level defenses aren't going to let him do that too often but I can't see someone with his size, strength, athleticism and ball control pulling that off in the NBA. Further, I can't see a team vacating the post too often for a small forward role player whose best assets are his deep shooting and ability to create spacing for his teammates. Maybe he'll get some opportunities but not enough to be even a minor part of his game.
I know Doug IS the power forward for Creighton but he's actually a power forward who is lights out from deep rather than a small forward called a power forward in college because he's the fourth tallest player in the starting lineup. It's the difference between someone like Kyle Singler and him. Wally handled the ball in the college. He used dribbles. Doug's game is almost all off the ball.
Not necessarily. He does a lot from the midpost as well, which, if you're not sure what I'm talking about, is short corner closer to the baseline on either side of the hoop. He's not a back-em-down post or even a catch and hold player, he is a quick post player which happens off of movement. His post game is a decisive catch around the paint area and a quick counter. He obviously knows how to feel the defender before he makes a catch so all that is needed is a shoulder shake to get his man off balance, drop step, open up for a face up short jumper or an immediate turn into a jump hook/push shot before he even eyes the rim. That was pretty much Jamison's post game in a nutshell too. The good thing about that type of post game is that it doesn't have to happen by design. No "clearing out" needs to be done and it can be accomplished within the flow of the offense.
It really doesn't matter if Wally handled the ball more because that wasn't even a strength of his.
Well I don't think McDermott's capable of translating Jamison's post game to the NBA because he's much slower horizontally and vertically and isn't as long. You really think McDermott's going to effectively "outquick" defenders in the post just because he goes off the catch or has a great feel for his defender? Even if he does, I don't think he's going to fare too well against the bigs around the basket. Post scoring is one of the hardest things to do in the NBA. Someone like Doug being proficient at it would be a huge surprise.
I agree, Wally didn't handle the ball very much but he was still very good shooting off the dribble. Even if he only took a few dribbles on a possession, he could use it to create a jumper for himself. That was enough along with his post game and three point shooting to give him enough possessions to pump out pretty good scoring numbers. Shooting off the dribble is not something Doug has demonstrated too much. There's a difference between practically non-existent and somewhat usable.
He doesn't need to out quick per se, he just needs to out-position them, which will be aided by his constant movement. His defender can't always stay with him, especially those players who aren't used to defending players who move as much as he does. The thing about quick releases is that there's an element of surprise. Jamison isn't the quickest, longest or most athletic guy. That's not why he was a relatively effective scorer from the FT line on down. He scored because he could shoot the ball quickly from awkward positions that defenders were not accustomed to defending, getting shots off before they could react.
Wally didn't create space with his handle. He didn't have the handle nor the quickness to do so. He was actually pretty notorious for getting his jump shot blocked, which is not that common. He create space with strength and up fakes. Him shooting off the dribble was just up fakes and an escape dribble. Any good shooter with decent balance can do that if they have a good up fake and they're a good enough shooter to sell a fake.
I don't think he's going to be constantly moving once he gets into the NBA. In college, when he's the power forward and the area around the basketball is his to post up on both ends of the block, that's fine but as a stretch four or a small forward, no team is going to let him try to post up constantly when his main asset is shooting.
I don't see anything special or unorthodox about his release either. He mostly shoots very basic two-handed shots off the glass at regular speed. There is huge difference in their release speeds. Jamison not only had the funky releases but he was also extremely quick off his feet. McDermott isn't close to that. I don't see the similarity in their games as you do and even if there was some stylistically, McDermott's inferior athleticism will hamper him more. They're comparable to me in the sense that McDermott does at the college level what Jamison has done in the NBA in terms of scoring around the basket and shooting from deep on catch and shoot and pick and pop opportunities but McDermott isn't likely to translate his post game like Jamison. He is and should be a much better outside shooter and as a 6'8 guy with short arms and bad hops, that's where he'll be parked in the NBA.
He doesn't have to constantly move just trying to post he just has move, period. Run the baseline from corner to corner, flex cuts, short curls, slip picks, flashes into open spaces, etc.
He's one of the best quick release players below the FT line I've seen since Jamison. The way he can get off shots before even locating the hoop is uncanny. You don't have to be quick off your feet to get off shots like that. It's not about getting off the floor at all, it's about releasing the ball quickly, with accuracy before the defender can react.
Spot up shooter or put him on the move, he can do either. There's no sense in using someone who knows how to move without the ball just parked in the corner. NBA defenders are equipped to defend the ball, but they still can be lost off the ball especially because there's so much emphasis on providing support in help situations. He's not just running around with his head cut off, he KNOWS how to move. He sees when a player is relaxed or has his head turned and takes advantage. All he needs is a sliver of daylight to get position and/or get a shot off. That type of player is a luxury to have because he doesn't need the ball to be effective or have to have plays run for him. He's a safety valve from multiple spots of the floor, not just by standing in one spot llike most players, but by moving to spots on the floor where he presents a target.
He plays in the post, but flashes out and plays off screens to hit deep jumpers on the perimeter. He doesn't have good ball handling ability nor great lateral quickness, and doesn't run off screens at nearly the rate of Korver. Doug also has a great one on one post game, which isn't goting to be featured at an NBA level, but it's a skill. That old man game that can get you a bucket or a great pass out when you get stuck or are in trouble. What gets forgotten in the comparisons is how hard nosed he is, you don't expect a guy dropping 23 ppg while shooting such good percentages to be blue-collar, but he plays that way.
There isn't a player I can think of that's a lot like McDermott, but Harpring is the closest IMO. He's not the physical specimen Harpring was, but he's tough like he is, he's wing-ish for a forward, but can't really handle the rock and has the ability to stretch the floor like him too. Doug's got a great court IQ, and if he has been working on his ball handling ability then I think he has more value to an NBA team, but as much as I like him as a player, I suspect his NBA role will be very specific. I don't think he's going to be a top 20 pick, but he'd be a great pickup 20-30.