Bobcats shopping #2 pick; targeting James Harden
Via Jeff Goodman of CBSSports.com:
"The Charlotte Bobcats are eyeing the possibility of dealing the No. 2 overall pick in a trade that would bring a more established player, multiple sources told CBSSports.com.
Rod Higgins and Rich Cho understand that the Bobcats need more than just a talented rookie, whether it be Bradley Beal, Michael Kidd-Gilchrist, Harrison Barnes, Thomas Robinson or even Andre Drummond — to make the Bobcats competitive from their laughingstock of a season.
One source said that Oklahoma City’s James Harden could be in play due to the Thunder’s salary situation following next season. GM Sam Presti already has Kevin Durant and Russell Westbrook on the books for more than $29 million next season — and both Harden and Serge Ibaka will command huge contracts after the 2012-13 campaign."
Seems silly to me. I seem them getting rid of Ibaka and/or Perkins before they lose Harden. I just mostly thought it was interesting that Charlotte was looking to trade the pick.
They're not getting rid of Harden or Ibaka, but they're in a sticky situation, because their best bet to keep those two is to amnesty Perk after next season when Harden and Ibaka's contract starts, hopefully Aldrich is ready to fill the void, but Harden will be a top 15 player in the game, they're not letting him go.
And people are always talking about how it's harder to generate revenue because they're a small market team and don't have a huge TV deal, but with Durant and Westbrook and all, isn't it feasable that they could net a big market like TV deal?
Harden isn't going anywhere. If the Thunder win the title they would be silly not to go a little into the luxory tax.
James Harden looks untouchable at this point. Although Ibaka is an excellent shot-blocker, I just feel that he's a little bit overrated defensively. I mean, you see all the highlight blocks such as this one:
And you think, "Wow, that guy is good." But tbh, the guy is only an average Pick-n-Roll defender, and doesn't like to chase stretch 3s and 4s outside of the paint, as evidence by Shane Battier dropping several treys in game 1. Harden is the more irreplaceable player right now, and I don't think they'll be keeping Perkins with his lack of offense. So for Harden, this deal is a no-go.
I don't think they will make this kind of deal this summer... next summer maybe.
I don't see Harden leaving OKC any time soon, but why am I not suprised Jordan would be trying to shop the second pick for a try fast soulution player? That never works out. At best it would just put their team back at mediocore if they're lucky.
I dont agree that Jordan should do it but fast solutions do work, just ask Boston
Ibaka is a very good 1 on 1 defender though, always does a good job against good offensive PF like Nowitzki. He also hs the potentail to be a 14+ ppg scorer with his midrange game, offensive rebounds and an improving face up game
I wonder if Harden and Ibaka will be willing to take on smaller contracts for the sake of the team.
They wouldnt have a problem resigning harden and ibaka if they amnesty Perkins who is grossly overpaid, Cole Aldrich and nick Collison could man the center position for them.
If they want to keep all four of their great young talent I can see them trying to trade Kendrick Perkins. I would try to package him with their draft pick for cash, a 2nd rounder, and an expiring contract. I wonder if the Celtics would want Perkins back? He liked playing there and they need a center, if they are going to make one more run or if they plan to rebuild for the future. The Thunder's 1st rounder would give them 3 first round picks to go along with a good defensive backcourt in Rajon Rondo and Avery Bradley with Perkins protecting the middle. Even if they lose Ray Allen I think they can still contend if they resign KG to go along with Paul Pierce.
The Thunder would have a hole in the middle but they would have their Big Four locked in along with a couple of bigs in Nick Collison and
Cole Aldrich. They could go after a cheap center like Stiemsma who will get solid money but not a ton, or Ryan Hollins. Or they could buy a 2nd round pick where there are a few servicable bigs.
if i'm the Sixers i also will go after Harden and ofer Even Turner and #15 pick.
I'm not saying this will happen but it'd be a great move for Charlotte. They'd get a guy who might be a legit franchise player and a guy who can score with the best of them. I like Beal, Barnes, Drummond but I doubt any will be better then Harden.
I think the one thing we can take away from this is that Charlotte is very likely to unload that pick.....for something. It is doubtful that #2 pick will be playing in Charlotte.
Sam Presti probably never thought he'd be making tough decisions like this, a few years ago the Thunder were nothing, now that all the players have developed he has tough decisions to make,sad that OKC has worked so hard together and have gel'd to have them break up in the near future, they can't keep everyone.
And if anyone demands a bigger contract it will be Ibaka, you have to think his family are still in Congo, and after watching that short documentary on him and where they are from, you'd have to think Serge wants to take care of his family, which means he needs more money.
The problem with that proposed trade is that Drummond would be nice but he gives them what Ibaka brings to the table. T Rob is a hustling, high motor, athletic power forward, and Harrison Barnes is a jump shooting small forward. Not what the Thunder need. MKG would be interesting. He would give them another finisher and a wing defender. But without Harden they would be down to two legit scorers. I don't see MKG passing and shooting as well as Harden.
Although a Durant, Westbrook, Ibaka, and MKG core would be very intersting. If the Bobcats took Perkins contract and threw in one of their secound round picks that would be a better trade, especially if OKC liked Andre Drummond at 2. Drummond, Ibaka, and Durant would be a great frontline. With Westbrook at the point and Thabo and Cook at shooting guard. With that second round pick they could go after Doron Lamb if he falls or Darius Miller to give them a little of what Harden did.
Harden would be the ideal franchise player for Charlotte, he can make plays as well as score, so he can mesh well with a scoring point like Kemba, and he's young enough to be around for a while. Plus, he plays the shooting guard position, so Jordan can mentor him better than he could Kwame, Emeka or Adam Morrison.
That said, if they can't get Harden, just take Barnes and live with the consequences. The team was obviously trying to tank, hitting the panic-button after one bad season isn't the right thing to do, stick with the rebuild, take your lumps and build a legit core instead of taking shortcuts.
Players who win championships are more likely to take paycuts to stay together (See Spurs, San Antonio). If the Thunder win their first title when every member of their core four is 23 or younger, they will want to stay together. If they turn into a dynasty and win multiple championships, they'll more than make up for their lost salary in endorsements and other profit-generating endeavors.
As far as paycut, forgetabout it. Players who take paycuts are older players that have made thir money, rarely if ever do you see a young player taking a pay cut, this is Hardens first big pay day and who knows if he gets injured and never has a chance to get another. The agent will advise him to get as much money as possible.
Lmao...Jordan is so impatient it's ridiculous. I get the competitive nature in him but Jordan hates losing so much that he isn't willing to build from the ground up. You have to start somewhere. I don't get why he even traded away Stephen Jackson and Gerald Wallace if he wanted to at least be somehwat competitive. Surve is right. I will be shocked if the bobcats keep the player they draft or even keep their pick on draft night for that matter. Harden isn't going anywhere so he can keep dreaming.
If the Thunder did move Perkins then they could easy get a veteran C to come in for less money to chase a title to help fill the void and Perkins will have trade value as a guy who has a lot of NBA Finals experience and his contract isn't awful.
With the play off runs, I would feel that the Thunder can carry a bit of luxury tax, Sam Presti is very creative look at the Nick Collinson deal, he can maybe use his 5 year contract for someone coming off a rookie deal if he still has that available to give one guy a longer deal whilst the othr maybe gets more money for a shorter deal with Ibaka and Harden.
Why cant the Bobcats ever just truly re-build? come on, take the BPA and suck next year and do the same...Harden is not going to make that team a playoff contender so why not just RE-BUILD...get rid of the bad contracts and get picks...its not rocket science, look at OKC's rebuilding project...seemed to work pretty well for them.
On the Harden vs. Ibaka thing...Ibaka has to be the odd man out after Perk...I like Ibaka a lot but my only problem is, it seems like everytime he blocks a shot, it goes back to the other team...Its great to get a lot of blocks but you need to start fast breaks with them or at least block it to a teammate...keep Harden, shop/amnesty Perk, might have to trade Ibaka eventually
I think there gonna have to amnesty Perk because Russel Westbrook's new contract kicks in next year (around 15 mil a year) and there probably going to sign Harden to a big contract. But I think Ibaka is gonna get offered a ridiculous contract by a stupid GM and Presti won't be able to keep him. I forgot about Aldrich, they might have to roll the dice and see if he can play.
If I'm Charlotte, I keep the pick and draft either Drummond or MKG
One simple trade they could do would be to trade Kendrick Perkins straight up for Darko Millicic. Getting Darko would save them a little over $2 million. Also, Perkins deal is for 4 more years, while Darko's deal is only for 3 more years.
They will still be paying Darko solid money, but to get any half way decent center will cost at least $3 million or $4 million a year. Plus, Darko is fairly young and he does have a ring -- even if he didn't play much in 2004.
Perkins doesn't make a heck of a lot, even though he is overpaid a bit. Not sure they need to move him though. Quality centers are hard to find. Two guys they can move are Collison and Cook. Both guys make over $3 million a year and are more replacable. Collison has 4 years left on his deal. They could also move down a bit in the draft and trade their first rounder for cash and a mid to late second round pick and maybe an expiring contract too. ... they could end up with some cash and Quincy Acy if they play their cards right.
Collison and Cook make about the same amount of money combined as Perkins does (but Cook only has a 2 year deal), so it might be better to move those two than to trade their starting center. They could probably get cash and picks for those two. Their six man core is set with KD, Westbrook, Harden, Ibaka, Thabo, and Perkins and if they can keep Fisher then all they need are some servicable filler types. Paying Collison and Cook $3 million each and trading Perkins doesn't make sense. If I were them I would trade Cook and Collison for cash and second rounders, and maybe even move their first round pick for cash, a second rounder, and a future pick with an eye on getting Quincy Acy and/or Miles Plumlee to replace Collison and go after Darius Miller or a shooter (Kim English?) to replace Cook.
There is a lot they can do without blowing up their core. They just have to trim around the edges and be smart. Fortunately, there are some solid talents in the second round this year that could fill out the end of an NBA roster and perhaps even contribute a bit in a deep rotation.
If you are Jordan and your mentality is to trade the pick, would you target Tyreke?
I really like Harden, but I like him in the role he is in. IDK that he is a player I would build around. IDK that Evans is that player either, but he would be easier to pry away from Sac and to me he has the higher ceiling between he and Harden.
Harden is def in the spotlight right now, but to me that's because all of his bad games get swept under the rug. There isn't as much pressure on him as the number 3 option, so if he has a bad game it's not as noticeable. Evans jump shot hasn't progressed as much as people want, but it has improved. He also doesn't benefit from having the talent around him that Harden does.
As for Sac with the 2 and 5 you could get 2 of Drummond/Trob and Barnes/MKG. It could work out ideally where you get a big and a SF, you just have to hope if you draft Drummond 2, Trob gets taken 3 or 4.
I actually like that trade for both teams Ninja...
Tyreke still has potential to get better and Sac gains two more high draft picks to support there backcourt and Cousins.
I'm sorry Memphis Madness, but I can't believe that Darko is or ever will be the answer to anyone's prayers!
The Spurs take a paycut? Their big 3 makes more than Miami's.
Harden is going nowhere. Presti isn't a moron.
And finally, the best idea I've heard has been to Minn for D-Will and next year's Wolves first rounder or 18 this year. Williams still has franchise changer potential and would fit really well as a high usage guy next to Biyombo.
When Pulse Glazer said D-Will, I thought for a moment he meant Deron Williams!
I don't see what all the panic about the Thunder's cap is, Harden and Ibaka still have a year left on their rookie deals and if Jeff Green had stayed, he'd have likely been on a Perkins like contract. The Thunder sold out every home game this year, they have a superstar in KD who will likely rival LeBron in the soring stakes over the next few years and don't forget that KD's standing will actually rise when older superstars retire in the next few years and thus the team becomes even more marketable.
The Thunder have a good naming deal for their arena also and whilst they will never pay luxury tax like the Lakers, Mavericks etc do, the team can carry some tax maybe similar to what say the Spurs do from time to time. Teams need to speculate to accumulate, maybe pay more but then get greater success and have runs to the Conference and NBA Finals to thus help pay for it.
I'm sure that the Thunder may well have a business plan which could help them balance the books, it could be something like Conference Semi Finals and so anything beyond there means they make money.