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The Big O

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The Big O

Is it just me or is Oscar Robertson the most underrated player ever? Jordan is the GOAT, Wilt was the most dominating, Magic was magic, and Bird was the best white guy not name Scalabrine ever, but Robertson was the only guy to average a triple double and while I'm not saying that makes him a contender with MJ, I do think he should get more attention than he does. The Robertson/Alcindor tandem was Magic/Abdul-Jabbar (literally in some sense) before
Magic/A-J.

If The Big O isn't the most Underrated who is?


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Allen Iverson is also under rated...

The Big O needs his love but a lot of people have been bringing up Oscar Robertson when talking about Lebron and Tyreke Evans...I feel like there may never be another Big O or AI or Penny Hardaway

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one knock on big o was that

one knock on big o was that he rarely won. In his 14 year career, he either missed the playoffs or lost in the first round 9 times. That changed when he had kareem on his team who i consider one of the 3 greatest players ever. I think oscar is top 10 all time for sure, but most people acknowledge that so i dont think he is underrated.

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as for who i consider

as for who i consider underrated, i have said this before on here, but to me, gary payton is the best pg i have seen play. I dont think he should ranked higher then guys magic, stockton or thomas becasue i dont think he had the overall career that they had. But in his prime, i would take GP over any of them. He was a lcokdown defender and was the teams number 1 scoring option many years.

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I don't think that there will

I don't think that there will ever be another human being that puts up those type of numbers ever again. Out of all of the G.O.A.T.'s, he gets talked about the least and put up some unbelievable numbers in the NBA (the scary thing is he was a 6'5 guard). Absolutely one of the most underrated players of all time. He wasn't even considered the greatest in his era.

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@llperez, I agree with you on

@llperez, I agree with you on Gary Payton being overlooked. Gary and J. Kidd are my all time favorite PGs... But truth be told, the only reason I would take them over an Isaiah Thomas and Magic IS because they are my favorites. The way Isaiah took over games were remarkable! And he commanded that Detroit team. Magic is Magic. There is nothing more to be said. While Gary Payton is by far in my top 3 for favorite players, even in his prime, he isnt better than Isaiah and Magic.

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Why do people think

Why do people think Scalabrine is so good? He is horrible, probably the worst player to ever play the game. If anything his "goodness" is a joke that gets very old very fast because it is used so many times.

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Perez.....did you really say

Perez.....did you really say that you would take GP over Magic?

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dwill

Nobody thinks Scalabrine is good. The fact that as a joke it gets used so much is what amuses me about it. It wasn't funny the first or second time, it actually didn't get funny until it was randomly thrown in there a bunch of times. I met him once, and he's a real nice guy, but compared to the rest of the NBA he's just not that talented...

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jesus...you had to bring up

jesus...you had to bring up Gary Payton in an Oscar Robertson thread? that's just wrong........

GO BUCKS!

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Ill get negatives for this

Ill get negatives for this for sure but i actually think O was overrated. of course a triple double is amazing but he never had a winning team until Alcindor and never did anything with Cincy. And alot of the games they didnt have statistics to so in a way theyre estimating that he averaged a trip double. He never had that killer instict that MJ, Larry, or Magic had. and for people saying there will never be another O..i disagree. I think LeBron may have a chance to average a trip double within the next 3 years and Grant Hill may have been able to if he didnt shatter his ankle. O is def a top 10 great because of stats...but hes not as far as killer instinct and being the leader of a winning team. that was Alcindor

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There'll never be another

There'll never be another player do what the Big O did. He didn't just average a triple double... He averaged a triple double over his first FIVE seasons in the league. That's not being done again.

And I don't know how you can knock him for not having the killer instinct of a MJ, Bird, etc. LeBron doesn't either. And when/if LeBron wins his first title, it'll come after he joined Dwayne Wade, who already has a ring and has proven that he has the killer instinct/clutch gene. LeBron has had his moments, but he hasn't really proven that he has that killer instinct/clutch gene. And it was just announced that Dwayne Wade will be the go-to player at the end of games for the Heat.

It's arguable and all about your opinion where the Big O is ranked, but he's definitely among the top five when it comes to guards. He was so far ahead of his time.

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The Big O

I do not think anyone who studies basketball's history cannot give Oscar Robertson an amazing amount of respect. He was, as Indiana Basketball said, a player who will never be seen again. Truthfully, he was LeBron James before LeBron James, more so than any other player who has ever played. I mean, 6'4 and built like a tank with athletic ability that dwarfed his competition, back than, that made Oscar the best all-around basketball talent to have ever played. The only thing that keeps Oscar at 4th on my list of guards is the fact that llperez brought up, which is his lack of rings and big winning seasons. Clearly it was circumstance, but as we all know, circumstance matters. But, to average a triple double in a single season, much less your first five years in the league, Oscar will have that distinction above anyone else to play in the NBA. If he had won by doing this, than I think he would definitely have been considered in a class above even Magic or Kobe, if not Michael. But, in his triple double season, I still think Wilt Chamberlain had the better year, I mean, I would take 50.4 and 27.2 over the triple double, and Bill Russell won the MVP that year as well! But I say Oscar is a top 10 player of All-Time, and a top 5 guard, and I do not think that makes him underrated. When listing the all-time best players, everyone has their own seperate criteria, and if the criteria was the best overall offensive presence (basically, the triple double), than Oscar is in a class by himself, but their is more to basketball than just that, and I think circumstance plays a part. But, I think Oscar's triple double season might be the second best season ever had by a player after Wilt's ridiculous 1961-62, and that his first 5 years in the league are more impressive than any one player in history. So, I do not think I underrate Oscar Robertson, and if people do, than that is usually just due to a lack of knowledge of the game's history. But all I know is that this board gives Oscar Robertson a lot of credit as a player, enough for me to believe that people who post on here know just how great Oscar Robertson was.

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in 1968

Wilt averaged 24PPG 24RPG 8.6APG >>>> over the triple double season IMO.

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Also, I dont think he's

Also, I dont think he's underrated, I think that as generations go by you tend to overlook older players. Like Bob Cousy, a Hall of Famer but if you watch tape of him you probably say he's no better than Derek Fisher. Players evolve, grow to be bigger and faster so older generations dont get the respect they deserve because of how good players are today.

There weren't players with Oscar's size,strength and athleticism doing the things he was doing. He is one of the all-time greats. And if LeBron only wins one chip in 40 years, he will be in the same boat when this discussion is brought up again

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The Big O was a great player

The Big O was a great player but people have to remember the leaugue was much faster paced back then and you had players like wilt and russell averaging over 20 rpg and cousy averaging over 20 assists per game, it was easier to do back then

Oh yeah can we stop with Lebron not having a killer instinct, stats say otherwise and I guess ppl forgot about his duel with Pierce 2 years ago in gm 7 and his great performance against the magic last year and he had a triple double against the celtics this year, but couldn't win because of his teammates.

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cousy never got over 20 apg

cousy never got over 20 apg lol, not even 10

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Andxxx has no idea what he is

Andxxx has no idea what he is talking about. If averaging in 26 9 and 7 against a Celtics defense completely geared to stop you isn't chocking, I don't know what is. Not to mention his complete lack of killer instinct against Orlando the year before where he averaged 39 8 and 7.

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You make averaging 26 9 7

You make averaging 26 9 7 sound like it's bad

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Haha sarcasm there man. Sorry

Haha sarcasm there man. Sorry that didn't come across. I completely agree with you, Lebron absolutely has a killer instinct and I made a long post about it last night.

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I think the Big O was regard

I think the Big O was regard as the best swingman before MJ took over all the hype.

We are probably too young to really realize about it. Big O was like the MJ of his time and until MJ showed up, he was the best swingman in NBA history.

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Im Your Father

my bad man I forgot, sarcasm can be hard to read over the internet

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indianabasketball

Where did i ever say that LeBron had a killer instinct?? I just said he has the chance to average a trip double.

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You were critical of

You were critical of Robertson because he didn't have the killer instinct of a MJ or Bird (two of the biggest killers in NBA history) and because he didn't win a championship until he teamed up with another superstar...

My reply was that LeBron doesn't have the killer instinct of a MJ or Bird either. Are you going to criticize him for that too? And IF LeBron wins a ring, it'll be after he teamed up with another superstar as well. Are you going to criticize LeBron for that too?

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Tim Duncan will be like Oscar

Tim Duncan will be like Oscar Robinson 20 years from now..becuz he's not flashy on the court.....

i was at the park the other day..and saw 2 of my 8 year old neighbors playing basketball..I asked them is their favorite player?

1 kid said i'm Shaq becuz i can dunk and dominate...he then pointed at his friend and said ''he plays like Duncan, becuz he be trying to shoot from outside like a Big Sissy...lmao!!!

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Duncan is a top 10 player at the end of his career

he was the key factor in all those Championship runs...sure he had the Admiral,Avery,Elliot and Mario Elie then he had Parker,Manu,Finley and Bowen but he was always the Main Guy in SA...I think he'll have to be respected as one of the 3 best PF's of all time....he's got the stats and hardware to back up that statement

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duncan is defenitely top 10.

duncan is defenitely top 10. My top 10 in no particular order would be: robertson, jordan, kareem, magic, bird, kobe, wilt, russell, shaq, duncan, malone, olajuwon...wait, damn thats 12. This list is tougher then i thought.

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Yeah any list is tough to make and then stick to it

I just look at a Who's better approach...

Like I'd pick Duncan over Malone, so I'd probally have leave Karl off a top ten list( very hard to do)

But has far has Best Centers all of them can't make a top ten list...Wilt,Karrem,Hakeem,Russell or Shaq would take up half a top ten and I don't think it's fair...Centers back then could post ridiculous numbers...But Wilt was a freak of nature back,Shaq was and is still a Monster,Hakeem had the most refined offensive game ever for a C...Kareem was Kareem and still holds the scoring record if I'm not mistaken...and Russell had those winning intangables that will never be matched again...how many rings does Bill have...??? probally more than the other Centers combined I bet...

I gotta make another thread about Top 5 By posistions...

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yeah,it's going to get

yeah,it's going to get tougher in years to come..when guys like Lebron,Garnett & Wade retire

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Lebron may need a few rings to be in the top Ten

who do bump out the Top Ten...even top 20...

Wilt...

Jordan...

Magic...

Kareem...

Bird...

Russell...

Shaq...

Duncan...

Malone...

Kobe...

Hakeem...

Kidd...

Iverson...

Oscar...

Walton...

Barkley...

Stockton...

Isiah...

Rodman...

Pippen...

The Scare Crow ...
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Lebron may need a few rings to be in the top Ten

who do you kick out the top ten for Lebron...

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WOW!! Scarecrow you would put

WOW!! Scarecrow you would put Rodman as a top 20 player of all time? I won't have Pippen in the alltime top 20!!!

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Russell

Had 11 rings in 13 years Scarec's (pronounced skairks). I made a list of top 100 players a while back, it has to be updated, but it is very difficult to do. I am sure if you look through the archives of this site you will see it somewhere. But, it is super difficult to leave some players who were top 10 staples out, and now once you get to the 20's, it is ridiculous. But, bare in mind that this is out of thousands who have played in the NBA, and these are really the best of the best. Nonetheless, my top 10 includes:

1. Michael Jordan

2. Kobe Bryant

3. Shaquille O'Neal

4. Bill Russell

5. Wilt Chamberlain

6. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar

7. Larry Bird

8. Magic Johnson

9. Oscar Robertson

10. Tim Duncan

I am guessing this is probably slightly changed from the one I did before, usually because you realize something these players have done or see it in some different way, but I am quite confident those were my 10 players. Incredibly difficult to distinguish between some of these players and over eras, but I like my list of 10 guys, and my top 20 would feature, Hakeem, Moses, Karl Malone, Jerry West, Julius Erving, Elgin Baylor and Rick Barry among others. Years ago, you would never see a top 10 list without Jerry West, but now it has gotten to the point where some players have indeed passed the Logo. I think LeBron James will more than likely become a top 10 player of All-Time, and when the Big O is shouting you out, you know you must be pretty good. It would be so difficult to put Oscar out of the top 10, but that could be what it is coming too, and that is just what happens as new players come in and establish great careers. I tend to look at things from the stand point of a career, which to me usually incorporates about 10 years (with Bill Walton, he only played 482 games, but it is still enough for him to be in line with some of the greats), so LeBron and Dwyane Wade still have something left to prove, but I fully expect that they will be included in the top 20 or so players on my list down the line.

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Good list.. I would bump

Good list.. I would bump Oscar and put in Hakeem Olajawon..

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i agree with mikeyvethedons

i agree with mikeyvethedons group of top 10 although i would rearrange them a little. Man its crazy leaving out hakeem and malone though. But here is mine:

1-michael jordan

2-kobe bryant

3-kareem abdul jabbar

4-magic johnson

5-larry bird

6-shaquille oneal

7-bill russell

8-wilt chamberlain

9-oscar robertson

10-tim duncan

if shaq had done a better job taking care of his body, he could be the closest to challenging jordan for number 1. But as it stands, i give kareem the edge over him based on kareems brilliance over a 20 year career that saw him win titles with 2 different teams. Chamberlain and robertson are both held back a little by the fact they have less titles then those ahead of them. A few other names that should be included in a top 20 list are jerry west, bob petit, julius erving. Lebron will probably enter the top 10 as well.

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I would say he is rated

I would say he is rated correctly. I think people overrate the value of him getting a triple double even though it is a good feat back in his time. I'm 100% sure that LeBron and Magic would average a triple double in Oscar's time, and Oscar would be a 20-5-5 guy during this time. The game is so much different than it was back then. There are less possessions now, overall slower pace, and much better athletes, generally speaking. To say he is better than players of this era mainly because he is the only one to average a triple double is failiable. Just because of the game being so different now, I tend to keep players who played ages ago within their own category.

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