This topic contains 24 replies, has 8 voices, and was last updated by 
Cynthia 10 years, 10 months ago.
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- Posted on: Sat, 08/22/2015 - 5:23am #61278
Pro-21ParticipantCould peak Kobe have led the Thunder to the WCP in this super competitive era? I’m saying, if he didn’t miss as many games as westbrook* because I’m sure westbrook could have.
05-06 Kobe averaged 35 5 and 5 on like 45% shooting.
On a secondary question, where does Kobe’s peak rank all time? Would it be fair to say that while Kobe was never the consensus best player like MJ or LeBron, he is an all time goat because hes had about 10 seasons as good or close to as good as curry, westbrook and harden?
0 - Posted on: Sat, 08/22/2015 - 6:15am #1009252
therealbballerParticipantHe also had seasons where he was alot better then any of those guys..
0 - Posted on: Sat, 08/22/2015 - 6:15am #1009114
therealbballerParticipantHe also had seasons where he was alot better then any of those guys..
0 - Posted on: Sat, 08/22/2015 - 7:03am #1009264
Stop_basketball_nonsenseParticipant"10 seasons as good as or (close to)" comment on nbadraft.net for the month! kobe black mamba who was clearly tbe best player in the league for atleast 3-5 years depending on the person compared to curry, whose borderline average on defense, harden who just popped up on the big time 2 years ago, & westbrook career 43% fg overall & 30% from 3 as a point guard.
That comment made me feel good, thank you pro-21.
0 - Posted on: Sat, 08/22/2015 - 7:03am #1009126
Stop_basketball_nonsenseParticipant"10 seasons as good as or (close to)" comment on nbadraft.net for the month! kobe black mamba who was clearly tbe best player in the league for atleast 3-5 years depending on the person compared to curry, whose borderline average on defense, harden who just popped up on the big time 2 years ago, & westbrook career 43% fg overall & 30% from 3 as a point guard.
That comment made me feel good, thank you pro-21.
0- Posted on: Sat, 08/22/2015 - 8:45am #1009286
Pro-21ParticipantAll three of those players had historic seasons in 2014-2015. Kobe is clearly a better player than they are, but can we honestly say that Kobe played as well as James Harden did this past season his entire career?, Harden led the rockets to the second seed in a western conference that is more competitive than ever, every year? Or did he easily play better than Westbrook who led the league in scoring and also finished in the top 4 or 5 in assists while also getting like 10 triple doubles? Or Curry, who had like a 28 PER (as good as Kobe’s best) and broke his own record for most three pointers in a season?
To say that Kobe always played better than that (which is ridiculous) is stupid. I’m sorry, Westbrook’s season this year is as impressive as any Kobe has ever had, actually, it might even be more so. What I’m saying is that Kobe had like 10 seasons at around that level — maybe as good, a bit better, a bit worse. That’s not so outlandish. Players like TMac, DWade or Grant Hill were all on Kobe’s level, the difference is that none of them had his longevity playing at an elite level. Kobe was a viable MVP candidate from ’01-’13. His calling card, I think, is playing about as well as the aforementioned MVP candidates did last year for a decade or more.
Also, I don’t remember Kobe ever being the consensus number one player. Ppl argued shaq, Tim Duncan, TMac, AI … etc. It was never as clear cut as LeBron and MJ.
The fact Kobe has had several seasons like that proves that it isnt an outlier and only points toward his legacy of dominance.
0 - Posted on: Sat, 08/22/2015 - 8:45am #1009148
Pro-21ParticipantAll three of those players had historic seasons in 2014-2015. Kobe is clearly a better player than they are, but can we honestly say that Kobe played as well as James Harden did this past season his entire career?, Harden led the rockets to the second seed in a western conference that is more competitive than ever, every year? Or did he easily play better than Westbrook who led the league in scoring and also finished in the top 4 or 5 in assists while also getting like 10 triple doubles? Or Curry, who had like a 28 PER (as good as Kobe’s best) and broke his own record for most three pointers in a season?
To say that Kobe always played better than that (which is ridiculous) is stupid. I’m sorry, Westbrook’s season this year is as impressive as any Kobe has ever had, actually, it might even be more so. What I’m saying is that Kobe had like 10 seasons at around that level — maybe as good, a bit better, a bit worse. That’s not so outlandish. Players like TMac, DWade or Grant Hill were all on Kobe’s level, the difference is that none of them had his longevity playing at an elite level. Kobe was a viable MVP candidate from ’01-’13. His calling card, I think, is playing about as well as the aforementioned MVP candidates did last year for a decade or more.
Also, I don’t remember Kobe ever being the consensus number one player. Ppl argued shaq, Tim Duncan, TMac, AI … etc. It was never as clear cut as LeBron and MJ.
The fact Kobe has had several seasons like that proves that it isnt an outlier and only points toward his legacy of dominance.
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- Posted on: Sat, 08/22/2015 - 9:55am #1009171
Stop_basketball_nonsenseParticipantLol….you put that much thought into it and that’s the best you can come up with! I’m not going to argue with you since most of the new stars of today’s game are not complete players. Curry no defense, weztbrook horrible decision maker, & i would think he would lead tbe league inscoring shooting as much as he does, sad he shot the ball so mediocre, if he shot the ball well he should have scored over 30pts and got the thunder in the plYoffs.Harden ill give you had a historic season, true but kobe has harden beat on defense is where he succeeds harden many time all-nba defense., plus kobe got 5,rings yo. Plus plenty of people said kobe was the best in the game for years, many in the public eye actually, lebron who humbled himself and told the truth & stephen a smith.
okay hill, t-mac& wade all are not on Kobe’s level, chill bruh. Wade you can go back and forth on whose better on defense with the 2. Also I think passing their equal, wade is just a more willing passer. Kobe exceeds wade in all areas scoring the ball. wade losts 2 finals with the best player on the planet & a top 5-10 power forward.Plus kobe got 5 rings! T-mac is one of the best scorers of all time but kobe has t-mac beat on defense, post season success, although I will give t-mac this his magic teams weren’t the best. Plus kobe got 5 rings! Grant hill. This one is easy hill got hurt so no one knows what he could have become, I know one thing kobe got hill beat on outside shooting regardless of injury or pre-injury version of grant hill, plus you guessed it kobe got 5 rings. How dare you make such blasphemous statements.
Oh yea and the west has always been super competitive for the past 2 decades and beyond. It’s not like the competition is something never before seen! How young are you, you just sound young.
0- Posted on: Sat, 08/22/2015 - 1:48pm #1009204
Pro-21Participant48-50 win teams don’t make the playoffs in the west anymore. I’ve watched enough basketball to know that the west wasn’t as competitive as it is now.
Stephen A. Smith doesn’t count. Plenty of people said Kobe was the best player, true, but it was never ever unanimous. Shaq, Duncan, KG all had cases over Kobe.
I’m talking about Kobe at his peak, not overall career. At their peak, Tmac was every bit as good an offensive player as kobe was, and he was still a good defender when he wanted to be. Grant Hill was also a superstar. In terms of impact on the game, those players weren’t far off from Kobe, who never led his team past the first round of the playoffs by himself (like LeBron and pre-pippen prime Jordan). Kobe ranks ahead of them for his career because he sustained it better. And yes, I give kobe the slight edge because of defense, but its pretty close.
Dwade at his peak led miami to a championship and had one of the greatest finals performances ever. He averaged like 30 points, 7.5 assists and 5 rebounds on 50% shooting in 2009. That version of wade was not worse than kobe. Wade died down fast though.
LMAOO you’re really saying Westbrook was a worse decision maker than Kobe? That’s hilarious.
0- Posted on: Sat, 08/22/2015 - 2:56pm #1009208
Stop_basketball_nonsenseParticipantKobe 5 rings, weztbrook 0. Westbrook only had to push tthe thunder to 1 more win but turnovers, over 4 a game, lack of getting teammates involved , & less than 30% 3pt shooting led to that result.
Also didnt the pelicans just make the playoffs witb 45 wins &,also the rockets in 2012-2013? Give kobe ibaka, adams,lanter,augustine,waitors, & morrow, & they got a shot at tbe 2nd round of the playofgs atleast, let alpme just making the playoffs. The fact that westbrook constantly takes more shots than durant, who is best scorer in the game, tells me all i need to know about westbrook’s decision making, & can please shoot the ball well if he gonna b taking so msny shots!
0 - Posted on: Sat, 08/22/2015 - 2:56pm #1009347
Stop_basketball_nonsenseParticipantKobe 5 rings, weztbrook 0. Westbrook only had to push tthe thunder to 1 more win but turnovers, over 4 a game, lack of getting teammates involved , & less than 30% 3pt shooting led to that result.
Also didnt the pelicans just make the playoffs witb 45 wins &,also the rockets in 2012-2013? Give kobe ibaka, adams,lanter,augustine,waitors, & morrow, & they got a shot at tbe 2nd round of the playofgs atleast, let alpme just making the playoffs. The fact that westbrook constantly takes more shots than durant, who is best scorer in the game, tells me all i need to know about westbrook’s decision making, & can please shoot the ball well if he gonna b taking so msny shots!
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- Posted on: Sat, 08/22/2015 - 1:48pm #1009343
Pro-21Participant48-50 win teams don’t make the playoffs in the west anymore. I’ve watched enough basketball to know that the west wasn’t as competitive as it is now.
Stephen A. Smith doesn’t count. Plenty of people said Kobe was the best player, true, but it was never ever unanimous. Shaq, Duncan, KG all had cases over Kobe.
I’m talking about Kobe at his peak, not overall career. At their peak, Tmac was every bit as good an offensive player as kobe was, and he was still a good defender when he wanted to be. Grant Hill was also a superstar. In terms of impact on the game, those players weren’t far off from Kobe, who never led his team past the first round of the playoffs by himself (like LeBron and pre-pippen prime Jordan). Kobe ranks ahead of them for his career because he sustained it better. And yes, I give kobe the slight edge because of defense, but its pretty close.
Dwade at his peak led miami to a championship and had one of the greatest finals performances ever. He averaged like 30 points, 7.5 assists and 5 rebounds on 50% shooting in 2009. That version of wade was not worse than kobe. Wade died down fast though.
LMAOO you’re really saying Westbrook was a worse decision maker than Kobe? That’s hilarious.
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- Posted on: Sat, 08/22/2015 - 9:55am #1009308
Stop_basketball_nonsenseParticipantLol….you put that much thought into it and that’s the best you can come up with! I’m not going to argue with you since most of the new stars of today’s game are not complete players. Curry no defense, weztbrook horrible decision maker, & i would think he would lead tbe league inscoring shooting as much as he does, sad he shot the ball so mediocre, if he shot the ball well he should have scored over 30pts and got the thunder in the plYoffs.Harden ill give you had a historic season, true but kobe has harden beat on defense is where he succeeds harden many time all-nba defense., plus kobe got 5,rings yo. Plus plenty of people said kobe was the best in the game for years, many in the public eye actually, lebron who humbled himself and told the truth & stephen a smith.
okay hill, t-mac& wade all are not on Kobe’s level, chill bruh. Wade you can go back and forth on whose better on defense with the 2. Also I think passing their equal, wade is just a more willing passer. Kobe exceeds wade in all areas scoring the ball. wade losts 2 finals with the best player on the planet & a top 5-10 power forward.Plus kobe got 5 rings! T-mac is one of the best scorers of all time but kobe has t-mac beat on defense, post season success, although I will give t-mac this his magic teams weren’t the best. Plus kobe got 5 rings! Grant hill. This one is easy hill got hurt so no one knows what he could have become, I know one thing kobe got hill beat on outside shooting regardless of injury or pre-injury version of grant hill, plus you guessed it kobe got 5 rings. How dare you make such blasphemous statements.
Oh yea and the west has always been super competitive for the past 2 decades and beyond. It’s not like the competition is something never before seen! How young are you, you just sound young.
0 - Posted on: Sat, 08/22/2015 - 10:56am #1009181
Dazzling Dunks and Basketball BloopersParticipantConsidering the fact that peak Kobe was able to lead a Lakers team that started smush Parker, Luke walton and kwame brown and had no virtually no bench to the playoffs in the west, I feel pretty safe saying he would’ve been able to get this year’s thunder team into the playoffs.
As far as his place in history, I don’t think there is any doubt he is the second best sg of all-time. Where he would rank on the all-time list is open for debate, but if he isn’t in your top 15 than you are probably just a hater. One of the most amazing things about Kobe is his longevity. Guys like t-mac, Iverson, wade, and even Vince Carter were all close to being on the same level as Kobe for periods of time but Kobe was able to stay at that level for such a long period of time, much longer than any of those other guys. That’s why you can’t even really put guys like curry, harden and Westbrook in the same sentence as Kobe right now. If those guys are still putting up the same kind of numbers 10 years from now and still playing at a similar level than maybe.
0- Posted on: Sat, 08/22/2015 - 11:36am #1009192
SubZeroParticipantIMO, I don’t see how you could even list him out of the top 10, and he might even be in my top 5, although I could definitely see him not being in other peoples’. Magic, Bird, MJ, Wilt, Russell, Hakeem, Oscar, Kareem, Duncan, and Kobe are my top 10. Not in that order, because I have no idea how anyone could rank big men and wings, along with being from different eras
0- Posted on: Sat, 08/22/2015 - 2:52pm #1009206
daggers818ParticipantThat’s a good list. Splitting hairs at this level, but I would probably have Shaq and Lebron over Hakeem and Oscar mostly based on better post season success. The rest I completely agree with.
0- Posted on: Sat, 08/22/2015 - 3:26pm #1009212
SubZeroParticipantI actually thought the same thing, but Hakeem’s my favorite Center ever because I love low post moves, and Oscar in all actuality should probably rank below Lebron, but the triple-double season is just insane. If Lebron retired today I’d put him up there, but the fact that he’s still going made me want to give Oscar some love until Lebron’s close to being done
0 - Posted on: Sat, 08/22/2015 - 3:26pm #1009351
SubZeroParticipantI actually thought the same thing, but Hakeem’s my favorite Center ever because I love low post moves, and Oscar in all actuality should probably rank below Lebron, but the triple-double season is just insane. If Lebron retired today I’d put him up there, but the fact that he’s still going made me want to give Oscar some love until Lebron’s close to being done
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- Posted on: Sat, 08/22/2015 - 2:52pm #1009345
daggers818ParticipantThat’s a good list. Splitting hairs at this level, but I would probably have Shaq and Lebron over Hakeem and Oscar mostly based on better post season success. The rest I completely agree with.
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- Posted on: Sat, 08/22/2015 - 11:36am #1009331
SubZeroParticipantIMO, I don’t see how you could even list him out of the top 10, and he might even be in my top 5, although I could definitely see him not being in other peoples’. Magic, Bird, MJ, Wilt, Russell, Hakeem, Oscar, Kareem, Duncan, and Kobe are my top 10. Not in that order, because I have no idea how anyone could rank big men and wings, along with being from different eras
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- Posted on: Sat, 08/22/2015 - 10:56am #1009318
Dazzling Dunks and Basketball BloopersParticipantConsidering the fact that peak Kobe was able to lead a Lakers team that started smush Parker, Luke walton and kwame brown and had no virtually no bench to the playoffs in the west, I feel pretty safe saying he would’ve been able to get this year’s thunder team into the playoffs.
As far as his place in history, I don’t think there is any doubt he is the second best sg of all-time. Where he would rank on the all-time list is open for debate, but if he isn’t in your top 15 than you are probably just a hater. One of the most amazing things about Kobe is his longevity. Guys like t-mac, Iverson, wade, and even Vince Carter were all close to being on the same level as Kobe for periods of time but Kobe was able to stay at that level for such a long period of time, much longer than any of those other guys. That’s why you can’t even really put guys like curry, harden and Westbrook in the same sentence as Kobe right now. If those guys are still putting up the same kind of numbers 10 years from now and still playing at a similar level than maybe.
0 - Posted on: Sun, 08/23/2015 - 1:40pm #1009454
EspressoprodigyParticipantThis is one of the best Kobe threads ever in .net
Everyone is correct, +1
0 - Posted on: Sun, 08/23/2015 - 1:40pm #1009317
EspressoprodigyParticipantThis is one of the best Kobe threads ever in .net
Everyone is correct, +1
0 - Posted on: Mon, 08/24/2015 - 1:05am #1009520
CynthiaParticipantKobe is considered one of the GOAT. There is no one in todays game except for Lebron who is even close to being considered in the GOAT discussion, and that comes from a die hard Thunder fan. Kevin Durant is awesome, and he will be a first ballot Hall of Famer, but he’s not GOAT material. Either is Curry, Harden, or Westbrook.
It’s a shame that some of the newer fans will never know Kobes true greatness, or much of the NBA in the 80’s or 90’s in general. It’s a different game now days, there’s a lot of decent players but there’s very few true franchise players or potential legends. I feel like the overall talent of the NBA is starting to slowly slip.
0 - Posted on: Mon, 08/24/2015 - 1:05am #1009382
CynthiaParticipantKobe is considered one of the GOAT. There is no one in todays game except for Lebron who is even close to being considered in the GOAT discussion, and that comes from a die hard Thunder fan. Kevin Durant is awesome, and he will be a first ballot Hall of Famer, but he’s not GOAT material. Either is Curry, Harden, or Westbrook.
It’s a shame that some of the newer fans will never know Kobes true greatness, or much of the NBA in the 80’s or 90’s in general. It’s a different game now days, there’s a lot of decent players but there’s very few true franchise players or potential legends. I feel like the overall talent of the NBA is starting to slowly slip.
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