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mikeyvthedon 11 years, 5 months ago.
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- Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 11:05am #59113
AstroParticipantI know that everyone and their grandma were saying that about the 2014 draft, but I really think this draft is better.
Let’s go player by player at the top of the lottery.
1) Jahlil Okafor – he’s simply the best low-post college center in my lifetime. Better than Shaq (look at their FG% stats), better as a freshman than any of the big centers from the 80s (Ewing, Hakeem, DRob) – simply unstoppable one-on-one on the college level and probably on any level. That package of back-to-basket moves, power and passing from the low post is devastating. He’s simply a baby elephant.
So the issue is how will he develop defensively, will he add a face-up game to his arsenal, will he improve his free throw shooting? If he becomes a pretty good if not outstanding defender at the next level, he’ll be a perennial all-star and someone to build a franchise around. Here’s betting he will.
2) D’Angelo Russell – he’s mini-Magic. OK, maybe not as Showtime as Magic, more smooth than with flair, but holy crap his vision and feel for the game is beyond most players on any level. Those perfect passes he delivers cannot be taught. Add handles, size, offensive savvy, outside shot and you have another franchise player in the NBA. He has that confidence, you can tell he’s not afraid to put a team on his back.
3) Emmanuel Mudiay – guys his type (fast, explosive PGs with size) have gone #1 in recent drafts and have done well in the league; if he’s available at #3 that’s a steal.
4) Karl-Anthony Towns – excellent size and length, can post up and face up (and will get better at both), blocks shots, what else do you need? Great value at #4.
I’m excited about this lottery, can you tell?
0 - Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 11:46am #966476
Taylor Gang MikeParticipantOubre has potential to be a top 5 SF in the league in 5 years as well
0 - Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 11:46am #966624
Taylor Gang MikeParticipantOubre has potential to be a top 5 SF in the league in 5 years as well
0 - Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 12:10pm #966484
properbreaksParticipantBetter than Shaq? Are you saying just his freshmen year because I HOPE you aren’t comparing him to Shaq’s second and third years.
0- Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 12:51pm #966492
For_Never_EverParticipantSkill wise, yes Okaford is way better.
0- Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 3:09pm #966665
ipowersParticipantOkafor is more polished but he is nowhere near the athlete or physical specimen Shaq was. Plus Shaq is almost 3 inches taller. Okafor isn’t quite 6’11" he’s closer to 6’10.5 or 6’10.75 in shoes and Shaq was a legit 7’1"
0 - Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 3:09pm #966517
ipowersParticipantOkafor is more polished but he is nowhere near the athlete or physical specimen Shaq was. Plus Shaq is almost 3 inches taller. Okafor isn’t quite 6’11" he’s closer to 6’10.5 or 6’10.75 in shoes and Shaq was a legit 7’1"
0- Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 4:00pm #966675
For_Never_EverParticipantI didn’t mention anything about athleticism or physique. But I didn’t know about them having a two years age gap as a freshmen.
0 - Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 4:00pm #966527
For_Never_EverParticipantI didn’t mention anything about athleticism or physique. But I didn’t know about them having a two years age gap as a freshmen.
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- Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 12:51pm #966639
For_Never_EverParticipantSkill wise, yes Okaford is way better.
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- Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 12:10pm #966631
properbreaksParticipantBetter than Shaq? Are you saying just his freshmen year because I HOPE you aren’t comparing him to Shaq’s second and third years.
0 - Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 1:12pm #966496
negguaryParticipantThat’s really tough to say until we see Embid wear a uniform period!!!
0- Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 2:41pm #966659
AstroParticipantI certainly hope he can overcome his injuries, it always makes me nervous when big guys go down for long stretches.
0 - Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 2:41pm #966511
AstroParticipantI certainly hope he can overcome his injuries, it always makes me nervous when big guys go down for long stretches.
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- Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 1:12pm #966643
negguaryParticipantThat’s really tough to say until we see Embid wear a uniform period!!!
0 - Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 1:37pm #966498
For_Never_EverParticipantYou guys really don’t believe Okaford is more skilled then Shaq freashmen year ?
0- Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 2:38pm #966508
AstroParticipantShaq 14 ppg 57% fg freshman year.
Okafor 18 ppg 66% fg freshman year.
Shaq never shot 66% from the field in his college or NBA career.
Okafor has about as complete a low-post game as I’ve seen in a long time.
If you take Shaq’s superior size out of the equation and judge strictly on low-post moves, Okafor is better.
0 - Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 2:38pm #966655
AstroParticipantShaq 14 ppg 57% fg freshman year.
Okafor 18 ppg 66% fg freshman year.
Shaq never shot 66% from the field in his college or NBA career.
Okafor has about as complete a low-post game as I’ve seen in a long time.
If you take Shaq’s superior size out of the equation and judge strictly on low-post moves, Okafor is better.
0 - Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 2:57pm #966661
hbomb3300ParticipantI would agree in terms of skills, but not even close physically.
0 - Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 2:57pm #966513
hbomb3300ParticipantI would agree in terms of skills, but not even close physically.
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- Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 1:37pm #966645
For_Never_EverParticipantYou guys really don’t believe Okaford is more skilled then Shaq freashmen year ?
0 - Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 2:18pm #966500
The Scare Crow RisesParticipantI believe that K.A.T and W.C.S will both be better players in the NBA then Okafor
I said it before everyone else jumped on the bandwagon, but I’ll say it again, Russell to the 76ers seems like a perfect fit if he can play SG next to MCW
I’m not sold on Oubre but I love his potential
Stannis the Mannis Johnson looks like a stud SF, Caron meets Jimmy Butler???
I think Mario Hezonja and Kristaps Porzingas will go in the Top 10(Porzingas will be a better version of Bargnani, Mario may be a Hayward type at SG/SF)
Looks like a solid draft
BTW…I love Jerian Grant and wouldn’t mind taking him in the late lottery as MCW insurance…
0 - Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 2:18pm #966647
The Scare Crow RisesParticipantI believe that K.A.T and W.C.S will both be better players in the NBA then Okafor
I said it before everyone else jumped on the bandwagon, but I’ll say it again, Russell to the 76ers seems like a perfect fit if he can play SG next to MCW
I’m not sold on Oubre but I love his potential
Stannis the Mannis Johnson looks like a stud SF, Caron meets Jimmy Butler???
I think Mario Hezonja and Kristaps Porzingas will go in the Top 10(Porzingas will be a better version of Bargnani, Mario may be a Hayward type at SG/SF)
Looks like a solid draft
BTW…I love Jerian Grant and wouldn’t mind taking him in the late lottery as MCW insurance…
0 - Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 3:06pm #966663
ipowersParticipantI don’t see Okafor ever being a top 3 or 4 player in the league. You’re talking Lebron James, Kevin Durant, Anthony Davis, Steph Curry, James Harden level and he’ll never be that. He will be a very good pro but top 3-4 in the leage are great players not very good ones.
0 - Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 3:06pm #966515
ipowersParticipantI don’t see Okafor ever being a top 3 or 4 player in the league. You’re talking Lebron James, Kevin Durant, Anthony Davis, Steph Curry, James Harden level and he’ll never be that. He will be a very good pro but top 3-4 in the leage are great players not very good ones.
0 - Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 3:21pm #966667
mikeyvthedonParticipant[Player: Jahlil Okafor] is incredibly skilled and is having a fantastic freshman season, but I think you are taking it WAY out of context. First of all, Shaq was only 17 until March 6 of his freshman year. 17! Tim Duncan was 17 for his entire freshman year. Notice that both of their freshman seasons were not necessarily "outstanding", though still pretty epic for a 17-year old. Jahlil turned 19 in December, which is still really young, but is he doing what Shaq did as a 17-year old? Considering the massive changes that he has undertaken with his body since last April, I would say it is doubtful.
The other thing you are leaving out with all of your Hall-of-Fame level big men Okafor apparently outshines is that they were all CRAZY athletes. They were pretty much unstoppable, even against each other for the most part (particualarly Shaq and Hakeem in their prime, though Robinson and Ewing were not slouches). Jahlil’s post game and footwork is amazing, but how often is he going up against people close to his size? It will happen more in the NBA. Plus, he will need to be able to defend position, which all of the players you mentioned did better thanks to the lateral quickness and athleticism they were blessed with at their size.
Shaq may have "only" averaged 13.9 ppg on 57.3% FG as a freshman, but he also averaged 12 rpg and 3.6 bpg (in 28.2 mpg). Plus, this was a time where early entry was not close to as common. It happened, but look at Shaq’s freshman year! How would a freshman stay in college if they did what he did? It was due to the lack of set rookie contracts, players used to negotiate deals much like they did in the NFL until a short while ago. So, one-and-done’s were not happening. Two-and-through also rare. There were freshmen that did amazing things, though for the most part, you kind of paid your dues a bit more than you do now.
Shaq also played with two future NBA players who were older. Chris Jackson, who later became Mahmoud Abdul-Rauf, was a scoring PG. An amazing one, at that. He had averaged 30.2 ppg the year before, than 27.8 ppg during the once again, 17-year old, Shaquille O’Neal’s freshman year. Plus, Shaq had another center who was two years older, just as big as he was and definitely more skilled at the time (at least offensively) in Stanley Roberts. These guys went #3 and #23 in the 1991 NBA Draft. The next year, a now 18-year old Shaquille O’Neal averaged 27.8 ppg and 14.7 rpg, with 5 bpg as a sophomore. He "only" shot 62.8% FG (more surprising, 63.8% FT. What happened?), but took home a couple POY trophies as consolation.
I get that you are excited about these four guys, they all are very nice prospects. Just wanted to add some context with Jahlil. Skill wise, he has been a phenomenal college player and he will be a bear to stop in the NBA as well. Even so, there is more to dominating in the NBA than just dominating college. Jahlil will need to keep up with his conditioning, though his lack of athleticism and lateral quickness could be somewhat of a hinderance to his being amongst the all-time greats. He still looks like a center most teams would love to have. Comparing him to those all-timers based on what he is averaging in college seems to not necessarily mean he will become better than them in the long run. Or, that a 19-year old Shaquille O’Neal was not a force much better equipped to dominate the next level as compared to a 19-year old Jahlil Okafor.
0 - Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 3:21pm #966519
mikeyvthedonParticipant[Player: Jahlil Okafor] is incredibly skilled and is having a fantastic freshman season, but I think you are taking it WAY out of context. First of all, Shaq was only 17 until March 6 of his freshman year. 17! Tim Duncan was 17 for his entire freshman year. Notice that both of their freshman seasons were not necessarily "outstanding", though still pretty epic for a 17-year old. Jahlil turned 19 in December, which is still really young, but is he doing what Shaq did as a 17-year old? Considering the massive changes that he has undertaken with his body since last April, I would say it is doubtful.
The other thing you are leaving out with all of your Hall-of-Fame level big men Okafor apparently outshines is that they were all CRAZY athletes. They were pretty much unstoppable, even against each other for the most part (particualarly Shaq and Hakeem in their prime, though Robinson and Ewing were not slouches). Jahlil’s post game and footwork is amazing, but how often is he going up against people close to his size? It will happen more in the NBA. Plus, he will need to be able to defend position, which all of the players you mentioned did better thanks to the lateral quickness and athleticism they were blessed with at their size.
Shaq may have "only" averaged 13.9 ppg on 57.3% FG as a freshman, but he also averaged 12 rpg and 3.6 bpg (in 28.2 mpg). Plus, this was a time where early entry was not close to as common. It happened, but look at Shaq’s freshman year! How would a freshman stay in college if they did what he did? It was due to the lack of set rookie contracts, players used to negotiate deals much like they did in the NFL until a short while ago. So, one-and-done’s were not happening. Two-and-through also rare. There were freshmen that did amazing things, though for the most part, you kind of paid your dues a bit more than you do now.
Shaq also played with two future NBA players who were older. Chris Jackson, who later became Mahmoud Abdul-Rauf, was a scoring PG. An amazing one, at that. He had averaged 30.2 ppg the year before, than 27.8 ppg during the once again, 17-year old, Shaquille O’Neal’s freshman year. Plus, Shaq had another center who was two years older, just as big as he was and definitely more skilled at the time (at least offensively) in Stanley Roberts. These guys went #3 and #23 in the 1991 NBA Draft. The next year, a now 18-year old Shaquille O’Neal averaged 27.8 ppg and 14.7 rpg, with 5 bpg as a sophomore. He "only" shot 62.8% FG (more surprising, 63.8% FT. What happened?), but took home a couple POY trophies as consolation.
I get that you are excited about these four guys, they all are very nice prospects. Just wanted to add some context with Jahlil. Skill wise, he has been a phenomenal college player and he will be a bear to stop in the NBA as well. Even so, there is more to dominating in the NBA than just dominating college. Jahlil will need to keep up with his conditioning, though his lack of athleticism and lateral quickness could be somewhat of a hinderance to his being amongst the all-time greats. He still looks like a center most teams would love to have. Comparing him to those all-timers based on what he is averaging in college seems to not necessarily mean he will become better than them in the long run. Or, that a 19-year old Shaquille O’Neal was not a force much better equipped to dominate the next level as compared to a 19-year old Jahlil Okafor.
0- Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 4:05pm #966677
ConsiderableUpsideParticipantOriginal Poster…this man just ripped your argument to shreds^^^^^
Shaq’s freshman year is more impressive, and it’s not even close. Okafor having the edge in fg % is really the only arguement you can make in his favor. Shaq was a year younger, and played on a stacked team that featured one of the best scorers in NCAA history, so of course his PPG is lower. Not to mention the fact that he was a much better rebounder and defensive player than Okafor.
It’s also important to note that in the early 90’s underclassmen did not play heavy minutes in comparison how it is today. Many great talents were staying in school 3 or 4 years, nowadays all the best players are freshmen….things have flip flopped. A guy still being in school as an upperclassmen is seen as a failure almost nowadays from an NBA perspective at least.
0 - Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 4:05pm #966529
ConsiderableUpsideParticipantOriginal Poster…this man just ripped your argument to shreds^^^^^
Shaq’s freshman year is more impressive, and it’s not even close. Okafor having the edge in fg % is really the only arguement you can make in his favor. Shaq was a year younger, and played on a stacked team that featured one of the best scorers in NCAA history, so of course his PPG is lower. Not to mention the fact that he was a much better rebounder and defensive player than Okafor.
It’s also important to note that in the early 90’s underclassmen did not play heavy minutes in comparison how it is today. Many great talents were staying in school 3 or 4 years, nowadays all the best players are freshmen….things have flip flopped. A guy still being in school as an upperclassmen is seen as a failure almost nowadays from an NBA perspective at least.
0- Posted on: Sat, 02/14/2015 - 7:01am #966729
AstroParticipantGiven the disparity in size (advantage to Shaq), it’s the only argument I need to back up what I was saying, which is that Okafor has superior low post game – not that he is the better shotblocker or rebounder or overall center.
Again, Shaq never shot 66% in his college career, so the age argument is kinda moot.
Don’t you think if his low post game was better than Okafor’s at 7-1, 290 he would have shot better? It’s not like he was taking a bunch of 3 pointers in college.
Let’s think about this rationally.
Okafor is 6-10 3/4 277, and is making 2 out of 3 fg attempts. Doesn’t that require a better low post game, with smoother footwork, advanced counters and ability to shoot from various angles in comparison to a 7-1, 290 lb. guy playing primarily in the low post?
Yeah, of course Shaq was putting up huge PPG in his last 2 college seasons, but given his size and athletic ability – which is clearly superior to Okafor’s – wouldn’t you expect him to? And still, never shot .665.
So, again, take the size and athleticism out of the equation – who has the better low post game?
0 - Posted on: Sat, 02/14/2015 - 7:01am #966582
AstroParticipantGiven the disparity in size (advantage to Shaq), it’s the only argument I need to back up what I was saying, which is that Okafor has superior low post game – not that he is the better shotblocker or rebounder or overall center.
Again, Shaq never shot 66% in his college career, so the age argument is kinda moot.
Don’t you think if his low post game was better than Okafor’s at 7-1, 290 he would have shot better? It’s not like he was taking a bunch of 3 pointers in college.
Let’s think about this rationally.
Okafor is 6-10 3/4 277, and is making 2 out of 3 fg attempts. Doesn’t that require a better low post game, with smoother footwork, advanced counters and ability to shoot from various angles in comparison to a 7-1, 290 lb. guy playing primarily in the low post?
Yeah, of course Shaq was putting up huge PPG in his last 2 college seasons, but given his size and athletic ability – which is clearly superior to Okafor’s – wouldn’t you expect him to? And still, never shot .665.
So, again, take the size and athleticism out of the equation – who has the better low post game?
0- Posted on: Tue, 02/17/2015 - 3:20pm #967264
mikeyvthedonParticipantYou do realize there is both offense and defense played there? Does he score in a more vast variety of ways and have better footwork? Probably. I for one was 7-years old during Shaq’s last season in college, though I will say, he sure as heck managed to score pretty damn well in the NBA immediately. Plus, you do not just say as a freshman, until you mention three Hall-of-Fame centers I am guessing you and I both were not old enough to see in college. What I was doing was pointing out that two of the preeminent centers of my lifetime were 17-years old when they were freshmen. Yes, Tim Duncan was indeed, a center.
One other thing I will mention is that while Jahlil’s FG% is impressive, I do not get why that ultimately wins an argument. It is not necessarily more "rational" to think that a guy making 66.5% of 11.2 field goals per game is a better low post scorer than a guy who was shooting 62.8% on 17.8 field goals per game. Which means that Shaq, as a sophomore, when he was still younger than Jahlil Okafor is now, was averaging 11.1 MADE field goals per game. Which is why I fail to see why the FG% discussion necessarily tilts the boat towards Okafor.
Of course Shaq was bigger. He also was an absolute low post monster who could get A LOT of shots up during a game. So his shooting 66.5% vs. 62.8% seems to be more of a moot point than mentioning Shaq’s age. To put it in perspective, had Shaq entered college this year, he would have been born March 6, 1997. A player who will indeed become a stud, Sviatoslav Mykhailiuk, is playing spot minutes on a good team. Shaq had a really solid season with two eventual first round picks. Than, he became an absolute force beyond a force. Again, just giving some perspective.
If you want to say Okafor has been the best college center since Tim Duncan, definitely possible. The best low post scoring freshman since you were born? Probably. Again, do not know how old you are. But, you did kind of bring all of these other beastly players who were in a different era and I do not see why there can’t at least be a debate. Plus, I do not know why other factors that will indeed make a difference towards what he does once he gets to the NBA are thrown out the window. Does that not seem to be totally going against what you are stating in your original post?
What made Shaq amazing was not just that he was so big and athletic, but that he could use that to get a lot of shots up. Think of how much more physically and athletically dominant Dwight Howard was compared to the next best center during his prime? 13.4 FGA (field goal attempts) per game is the most he has averaged with a season. Yes, he gets to the line a lot. So did Shaq, while he averaged over 13.6 FGA per game for each of his first 14 seasons. Over those first 14 seasons, he averaged 18 FGA and 10.4 FTA.
Right now, you have DeMarcus Cousins at 18 FGA on 46.5% FG and 8.8 FTA at 80.1%. He is averaging 23.8 ppg. The 2nd highest scoring true center is Nikola Vucevic, who is shooting 15.9 FGA at 53.6% FG and 3.2 FTA at 77.6%. My question is, where does Jahlil fit in? He seems to have a much better shot selection as Boogie, though is he going to be able to get those same shots once he gets to the league? Like Al Jefferson, for instance, has been able to get a high number of FGA’s, but has never averaged more than 5 FTA’s in a single season. Plus, Al is a 71.2% FT shooter, which is something Jahlil needs to work on.
I think these players are all very nice prospects, I just question as to whether your original post does not overstate their potential once they get to the NBA. One obviously hopes the top 3-4 players become All-Star caliber players, I think they certainly all have a chance. It is just hard for me to see them as the top players in the league. That is usually reserved for guys with those same freakish qualities you have asked for me to take away from Shaquille O’Neal. My problem with when people compare Jahlil to Tim Duncan is that it takes his versatility and dominance as a post defensive anchor. The ability to play both ends has been really important for centers, even Shaq.
Okafor, Russell, Mudiay and Towns have been great in college (or their limited time overseas), though I felt last years class had a lot more long term star power. I think a bevy of unfortunate circumstances is covering that up right now, though I think they have some guys with even more potential to be among the leagues best. Andrew Wiggins and Jabari Parker may not have been all that was expected, though I think expectations were ridiculous and that they both looked like guys with a lot of potential down the line. Joel Embiid still has a way to go, though it is difficult to deny that he has athleticism and agility you cannot teach at his size, along with a soft shot that could make him absolutely dangerous.
If you want to keep the FG% as the biggest part of your argument, I could go further, though I was just trying to give some context as to what made Shaq such an enormous NBA prospect out of college. Plus made him amazing in college. Jahlil is a monster and a very skilled post player. He is a good NBA prospect, though I am not sure he is the caliber of those players you mentioned due to his lack of athleticism and lateral quickness. His FG% is incredible and quite impressive, especially for a freshman. However, there are definitely other factors into ones low post dominance. Bringing it up to state otherwise is not necessarily as rational as it may seem.
0 - Posted on: Tue, 02/17/2015 - 3:20pm #967118
mikeyvthedonParticipantYou do realize there is both offense and defense played there? Does he score in a more vast variety of ways and have better footwork? Probably. I for one was 7-years old during Shaq’s last season in college, though I will say, he sure as heck managed to score pretty damn well in the NBA immediately. Plus, you do not just say as a freshman, until you mention three Hall-of-Fame centers I am guessing you and I both were not old enough to see in college. What I was doing was pointing out that two of the preeminent centers of my lifetime were 17-years old when they were freshmen. Yes, Tim Duncan was indeed, a center.
One other thing I will mention is that while Jahlil’s FG% is impressive, I do not get why that ultimately wins an argument. It is not necessarily more "rational" to think that a guy making 66.5% of 11.2 field goals per game is a better low post scorer than a guy who was shooting 62.8% on 17.8 field goals per game. Which means that Shaq, as a sophomore, when he was still younger than Jahlil Okafor is now, was averaging 11.1 MADE field goals per game. Which is why I fail to see why the FG% discussion necessarily tilts the boat towards Okafor.
Of course Shaq was bigger. He also was an absolute low post monster who could get A LOT of shots up during a game. So his shooting 66.5% vs. 62.8% seems to be more of a moot point than mentioning Shaq’s age. To put it in perspective, had Shaq entered college this year, he would have been born March 6, 1997. A player who will indeed become a stud, Sviatoslav Mykhailiuk, is playing spot minutes on a good team. Shaq had a really solid season with two eventual first round picks. Than, he became an absolute force beyond a force. Again, just giving some perspective.
If you want to say Okafor has been the best college center since Tim Duncan, definitely possible. The best low post scoring freshman since you were born? Probably. Again, do not know how old you are. But, you did kind of bring all of these other beastly players who were in a different era and I do not see why there can’t at least be a debate. Plus, I do not know why other factors that will indeed make a difference towards what he does once he gets to the NBA are thrown out the window. Does that not seem to be totally going against what you are stating in your original post?
What made Shaq amazing was not just that he was so big and athletic, but that he could use that to get a lot of shots up. Think of how much more physically and athletically dominant Dwight Howard was compared to the next best center during his prime? 13.4 FGA (field goal attempts) per game is the most he has averaged with a season. Yes, he gets to the line a lot. So did Shaq, while he averaged over 13.6 FGA per game for each of his first 14 seasons. Over those first 14 seasons, he averaged 18 FGA and 10.4 FTA.
Right now, you have DeMarcus Cousins at 18 FGA on 46.5% FG and 8.8 FTA at 80.1%. He is averaging 23.8 ppg. The 2nd highest scoring true center is Nikola Vucevic, who is shooting 15.9 FGA at 53.6% FG and 3.2 FTA at 77.6%. My question is, where does Jahlil fit in? He seems to have a much better shot selection as Boogie, though is he going to be able to get those same shots once he gets to the league? Like Al Jefferson, for instance, has been able to get a high number of FGA’s, but has never averaged more than 5 FTA’s in a single season. Plus, Al is a 71.2% FT shooter, which is something Jahlil needs to work on.
I think these players are all very nice prospects, I just question as to whether your original post does not overstate their potential once they get to the NBA. One obviously hopes the top 3-4 players become All-Star caliber players, I think they certainly all have a chance. It is just hard for me to see them as the top players in the league. That is usually reserved for guys with those same freakish qualities you have asked for me to take away from Shaquille O’Neal. My problem with when people compare Jahlil to Tim Duncan is that it takes his versatility and dominance as a post defensive anchor. The ability to play both ends has been really important for centers, even Shaq.
Okafor, Russell, Mudiay and Towns have been great in college (or their limited time overseas), though I felt last years class had a lot more long term star power. I think a bevy of unfortunate circumstances is covering that up right now, though I think they have some guys with even more potential to be among the leagues best. Andrew Wiggins and Jabari Parker may not have been all that was expected, though I think expectations were ridiculous and that they both looked like guys with a lot of potential down the line. Joel Embiid still has a way to go, though it is difficult to deny that he has athleticism and agility you cannot teach at his size, along with a soft shot that could make him absolutely dangerous.
If you want to keep the FG% as the biggest part of your argument, I could go further, though I was just trying to give some context as to what made Shaq such an enormous NBA prospect out of college. Plus made him amazing in college. Jahlil is a monster and a very skilled post player. He is a good NBA prospect, though I am not sure he is the caliber of those players you mentioned due to his lack of athleticism and lateral quickness. His FG% is incredible and quite impressive, especially for a freshman. However, there are definitely other factors into ones low post dominance. Bringing it up to state otherwise is not necessarily as rational as it may seem.
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- Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 3:56pm #966673
properbreaksParticipantOkafur has better skills as far as post moves, yeah I agree with that, but it doesn’t even matter when comparing him to Shaq. He didn’t need them and no one could do anything about it. Most people talk about Shaq and how huge he was and stood 7’1, but you have to remember most of Shaq’s career, he was jumping out of the gym too.
On another note, any GM who’d tell his owner that he thinks Cauley Stein is going to be better than Okafur, the owner would politely ask him to write a resignation letter. (lol) He wouldn’t even want anyone in the world to know that he hired a GM who even thought something like that (lol)0 - Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 3:56pm #966525
properbreaksParticipantOkafur has better skills as far as post moves, yeah I agree with that, but it doesn’t even matter when comparing him to Shaq. He didn’t need them and no one could do anything about it. Most people talk about Shaq and how huge he was and stood 7’1, but you have to remember most of Shaq’s career, he was jumping out of the gym too.
On another note, any GM who’d tell his owner that he thinks Cauley Stein is going to be better than Okafur, the owner would politely ask him to write a resignation letter. (lol) He wouldn’t even want anyone in the world to know that he hired a GM who even thought something like that (lol)0 - Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 4:47pm #966679
King CaluchaParticipantI like all these players but I still believe Wiggins, Jabari and Embiid (if healthy) have better shots at being franchise players than the guys from this draft.
0 - Posted on: Fri, 02/13/2015 - 4:47pm #966531
King CaluchaParticipantI like all these players but I still believe Wiggins, Jabari and Embiid (if healthy) have better shots at being franchise players than the guys from this draft.
0 - Posted on: Sat, 02/14/2015 - 2:25am #966713
sitlbitoParticipantSaying he’s more skilled than Shaq is cool,but in the end you look at who makes the biggest impact on the game. The concern I have with Okafor is that he seems to very rarely play against a player his size,and when he does,that player is not that good. In the NBA he’ll play against a taller/bigger player almost every game.
0 - Posted on: Sat, 02/14/2015 - 2:25am #966565
sitlbitoParticipantSaying he’s more skilled than Shaq is cool,but in the end you look at who makes the biggest impact on the game. The concern I have with Okafor is that he seems to very rarely play against a player his size,and when he does,that player is not that good. In the NBA he’ll play against a taller/bigger player almost every game.
0- Posted on: Sat, 02/14/2015 - 7:08am #966731
AstroParticipant…that can be leveled at every center playing on the college level.
Yes, Frank Kaminiski isn’t DeAndre Jordan. Then again there aren’t that many guys who are both beefy and athletic that could pose a challenge.
Okafor is a combination of size and moves. He can bull a smaller guy over or spin on a bigger guy.
His game translates to next level offensively, that’s not a concern.
0 - Posted on: Sat, 02/14/2015 - 7:08am #966584
AstroParticipant…that can be leveled at every center playing on the college level.
Yes, Frank Kaminiski isn’t DeAndre Jordan. Then again there aren’t that many guys who are both beefy and athletic that could pose a challenge.
Okafor is a combination of size and moves. He can bull a smaller guy over or spin on a bigger guy.
His game translates to next level offensively, that’s not a concern.
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- Posted on: Sat, 02/14/2015 - 11:52am #966749
holefillersParticipantAt the NBA level Okafor is going to be somewhere between Enes Kanter and Al Jefferson. He will score in the post and grab boards but he will never have high block or steal totals. Cant shoot past eight feet. I take Russell and Towns over him.
0 - Posted on: Sat, 02/14/2015 - 11:52am #966602
holefillersParticipantAt the NBA level Okafor is going to be somewhere between Enes Kanter and Al Jefferson. He will score in the post and grab boards but he will never have high block or steal totals. Cant shoot past eight feet. I take Russell and Towns over him.
0 - Posted on: Sun, 02/15/2015 - 12:12pm #966722
BiggysmallsParticipantAmazing how good these drafts are perceived to be when the Lakers, Knicks, and Celtics are terrible. Not sure the original poster is a fan of those teams, but I don’t see this draft being THAT special. I like Okafor and think he could be a less crazy version of Cousins. I like Towns but he has some boom or bust to him. Mudiay played like 15 minutes in China and could be Tyreke Evans (nice player but not franchise level) or John Wall (franchise level), and Russell looks like he’ll be a stud but there have been a lot more crafty sneaky athletic guys like him that haven’t been great than ones who have.
I think this draft is fine, but people like Magic Johnson suggesting there are like 5 franchise players is just people reaching for something to be excited about.
0 - Posted on: Sun, 02/15/2015 - 12:12pm #966869
BiggysmallsParticipantAmazing how good these drafts are perceived to be when the Lakers, Knicks, and Celtics are terrible. Not sure the original poster is a fan of those teams, but I don’t see this draft being THAT special. I like Okafor and think he could be a less crazy version of Cousins. I like Towns but he has some boom or bust to him. Mudiay played like 15 minutes in China and could be Tyreke Evans (nice player but not franchise level) or John Wall (franchise level), and Russell looks like he’ll be a stud but there have been a lot more crafty sneaky athletic guys like him that haven’t been great than ones who have.
I think this draft is fine, but people like Magic Johnson suggesting there are like 5 franchise players is just people reaching for something to be excited about.
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