[UncledrewParticipant]

Zach lavine is still only 20 years old and won’t be 21 until march. He’s averaging 14 ppg and almost 4 apg in only 24 minutes. Tonight he had 28 points leading the wolves in scoring. It makes you curious how much he could provide if given 35 mpg. If he continues to improve his shot selection, shooting stroke, and play making abilities what is his ceiling considering he’s still 4 Or 5 years from entering his prime? I’m thinking 25 ppg 6 apg 6 rpg much like a biggrr more athletic Monte Ellis in Golden State. Alot of people thought he’d be Vince Carter to Wiggins McGrady but I think he’s like tmac was in Toronto, waiting to get out of Carters shadow and in this case Wiggins shadow. I also think his ball handling makes him a better playmaker than wiggins much like tmac was to Vince.

[he_gets_bucketsParticipant]

 He can’t touch Wiggins and the reason is defense- Lavine is one of the dumbest players in the league plain and simple, he’s hella exciting and has tantalizing potential, but just has rock bottom basketball IQ. Gets caught sleep so often on defense, and makes some absolute bonehead plays with the ball in his hands. Its not just a matter of improving his shot selection and play making abilities- he needs a complete overhaul of his understanding of the game. He plays way too out of control to be worth giving 35 minutes a game especialy with Wiggins, K-mart and Rubio ahead of him on the guard depth chart.

[he_gets_bucketsParticipant]

 He can’t touch Wiggins and the reason is defense- Lavine is one of the dumbest players in the league plain and simple, he’s hella exciting and has tantalizing potential, but just has rock bottom basketball IQ. Gets caught sleep so often on defense, and makes some absolute bonehead plays with the ball in his hands. Its not just a matter of improving his shot selection and play making abilities- he needs a complete overhaul of his understanding of the game. He plays way too out of control to be worth giving 35 minutes a game especialy with Wiggins, K-mart and Rubio ahead of him on the guard depth chart.

[UncledrewParticipant]

Never said he will be better than wiggins I still think wiggins is a superior overall player I was just referring to play style. Lavine makes bone head plays because he wants to make something happen on a team that lacks true scoring options outside of Wiggins and because he’s 20 playing against grown men. KAT has days he looks great then days he’s battling foul trouble. I’d rather give the guard minutes to Lavine and let him grow. Martin isn’t in the future plans and Rubio shouldn’t be either he’s inconsistent and does next to nothing aside from facilitating. His steal numbers doesn’t show how he gets abused by opposing point guards and he still cant hit the backside of a barn.

[UncledrewParticipant]

Never said he will be better than wiggins I still think wiggins is a superior overall player I was just referring to play style. Lavine makes bone head plays because he wants to make something happen on a team that lacks true scoring options outside of Wiggins and because he’s 20 playing against grown men. KAT has days he looks great then days he’s battling foul trouble. I’d rather give the guard minutes to Lavine and let him grow. Martin isn’t in the future plans and Rubio shouldn’t be either he’s inconsistent and does next to nothing aside from facilitating. His steal numbers doesn’t show how he gets abused by opposing point guards and he still cant hit the backside of a barn.

[OhCanada-Participant]

 Reminds me of Westbrook in so many ways. Everyone thinks he is a dumb player with low iq when in reality the "bad shots" he takes are really just shots his superior athleticism and skillsets makes capable for him to hit.

 He is one the most efficient youngscoring gaurds in the league yet always gets overcriticized for every turnover or forced shot.

He has true elite athleticism that few players posess.

When at his best he is super aggressive and confident. Never seems scared to shoot.

The biggest problem I have with his game is he has no in-between game. He needs to learn to stop for that 10-15 foot pull up jumper which is Westbrook’s bread and butter. Lavine will either be an all-star for years to come 6th man oty an are candidate or both.

 

 

 

 

 

[OhCanada-Participant]

 Reminds me of Westbrook in so many ways. Everyone thinks he is a dumb player with low iq when in reality the "bad shots" he takes are really just shots his superior athleticism and skillsets makes capable for him to hit.

 He is one the most efficient youngscoring gaurds in the league yet always gets overcriticized for every turnover or forced shot.

He has true elite athleticism that few players posess.

When at his best he is super aggressive and confident. Never seems scared to shoot.

The biggest problem I have with his game is he has no in-between game. He needs to learn to stop for that 10-15 foot pull up jumper which is Westbrook’s bread and butter. Lavine will either be an all-star for years to come 6th man oty an are candidate or both.

 

 

 

 

 

[he_gets_bucketsParticipant]

He’s in the bottom half of effective field goal percentage in the league and in the top 12% in turnovers per 36 minutes. Remind me again how he’s one of the most efficient guards in the league? 

Yeah he’s got a big ceiling but he’s not an efficient player right now. Yes he’s a great athlete, so is Gerald Green. 

He needs a lot of seasoning before you can start saying he’s efficient, let alone one of the most

 

[he_gets_bucketsParticipant]

He’s in the bottom half of effective field goal percentage in the league and in the top 12% in turnovers per 36 minutes. Remind me again how he’s one of the most efficient guards in the league? 

Yeah he’s got a big ceiling but he’s not an efficient player right now. Yes he’s a great athlete, so is Gerald Green. 

He needs a lot of seasoning before you can start saying he’s efficient, let alone one of the most

 

[IlladelphParticipant]

So many people post on this site saying things like, "one of the most efficient guards in the league", but actually have no data to back it up.  I am not an analytics guy per se, but I’m not a fan of just making stuff up either.

The guy has a plus/minus of -3.2 this season, with a career plus/minu of -8.5.  Zach Lavine may be exciting to watch for Minny fans, but comparing him to Russell Westbrook, and calling him "efficient" is ridiculous.

[IlladelphParticipant]

So many people post on this site saying things like, "one of the most efficient guards in the league", but actually have no data to back it up.  I am not an analytics guy per se, but I’m not a fan of just making stuff up either.

The guy has a plus/minus of -3.2 this season, with a career plus/minu of -8.5.  Zach Lavine may be exciting to watch for Minny fans, but comparing him to Russell Westbrook, and calling him "efficient" is ridiculous.

[tuck243Participant]

For a good portion of the season he WAS efficient.   I’m thinking he had some bad games because he was shooting over 45% from the field for at least 15 games into the season.   

Just checked…. According to his game log, he was in a shooting slump the previous 6 games before last night…  That’s why he slipped to 43% (for the record, he’s still shooting better than Lillard)…  He’s shooting well from 3 (36%) and his turnovers are less than Curry, Wall, Lillard, and Westbrook PER 36…  Nice job using stats to paint the picture a certain way…  

[tuck243Participant]

For a good portion of the season he WAS efficient.   I’m thinking he had some bad games because he was shooting over 45% from the field for at least 15 games into the season.   

Just checked…. According to his game log, he was in a shooting slump the previous 6 games before last night…  That’s why he slipped to 43% (for the record, he’s still shooting better than Lillard)…  He’s shooting well from 3 (36%) and his turnovers are less than Curry, Wall, Lillard, and Westbrook PER 36…  Nice job using stats to paint the picture a certain way…  

[Parker2016Participant]

 Lavine will follow westbrooks and vince carters footsteps and make the game 10x harder for himself. Don’t get me wrong I love Westbrook and his ability. But the inability to play through a system leaves the rest of his teamates wondering what is going on. 

[Parker2016Participant]

 Lavine will follow westbrooks and vince carters footsteps and make the game 10x harder for himself. Don’t get me wrong I love Westbrook and his ability. But the inability to play through a system leaves the rest of his teamates wondering what is going on. 

[Parker2016Participant]

 Lavine will follow westbrooks and vince carters footsteps and make the game 10x harder for himself. Don’t get me wrong I love Westbrook and his ability. But the inability to play through a system leaves the rest of his teamates wondering what is going on. 

[Parker2016Participant]

 Lavine will follow westbrooks and vince carters footsteps and make the game 10x harder for himself. Don’t get me wrong I love Westbrook and his ability. But the inability to play through a system leaves the rest of his teamates wondering what is going on. 

[nath09Participant]

I’m not sure if it’s true but it seems to be that Wiggins scores alot more when Lavine has started as opposed to when Rubio has been starting.

[nath09Participant]

I’m not sure if it’s true but it seems to be that Wiggins scores alot more when Lavine has started as opposed to when Rubio has been starting.

[r377Participant]

T-Mac, Westbrook, 25-6-6. Really ?

This thread is hilariously ambitious. If T-Ross drops 30 tomorrow will someone start a new all-star thread about him ?

[r377Participant]

T-Mac, Westbrook, 25-6-6. Really ?

This thread is hilariously ambitious. If T-Ross drops 30 tomorrow will someone start a new all-star thread about him ?

[UncledrewParticipant]

Hilariously ambitious?…Lavine per 36 numbers are 21 points per 6 rebounds and 6 assist now at 20. He could still be at ucla right now getting ready to enter the league this year it’s way to early to say what he can’t do.

[UncledrewParticipant]

Hilariously ambitious?…Lavine per 36 numbers are 21 points per 6 rebounds and 6 assist now at 20. He could still be at ucla right now getting ready to enter the league this year it’s way to early to say what he can’t do.

[r377Participant]

Do you know how hard it is to average 25-6-6 and which players have done it ?

Oscar Robertson, Jordan, Jerry West, Lebron, Larry Bird. There may be more ? Statistically, to compare Zach LaVine to five of the top 10 all-time greats is ambitious don’t you think ?

I personally don’t think LaVine will ever average more than about 18 or 19 points per game. No way he gets 6 assists, he is not a true point guard. He doesn’t have great bball IQ or passing ability. He might be getting an easy 14ppg at the moment with opposing teams concentrating on Towns and Wiggins but getting 20ppg is going to be much harder for him to get….

[r377Participant]

Do you know how hard it is to average 25-6-6 and which players have done it ?

Oscar Robertson, Jordan, Jerry West, Lebron, Larry Bird. There may be more ? Statistically, to compare Zach LaVine to five of the top 10 all-time greats is ambitious don’t you think ?

I personally don’t think LaVine will ever average more than about 18 or 19 points per game. No way he gets 6 assists, he is not a true point guard. He doesn’t have great bball IQ or passing ability. He might be getting an easy 14ppg at the moment with opposing teams concentrating on Towns and Wiggins but getting 20ppg is going to be much harder for him to get….

[MatosParticipant]

 Agree with r377. This is exactly why I was saying thr per/36 stats are misleading.

[MatosParticipant]

 Agree with r377. This is exactly why I was saying thr per/36 stats are misleading.

[TravelinTravParticipant]

 T-Mac year 2 9.3 ppg

Westbrok year 2 16 ppg 

It isn’t that crazy to compare LaVine to either of those players.  Not saying he will be as good but I personally have faith he will be. He is best in a catch and shoot or catch and drive scenario when he’s not playing PG. It’s a huge plus when there is someone better at ball handling then him on the court. His biggest weakness is not having the ability to react quick enough, he can’t make decisions quick enough, therefor he can be a half second behind on D and on Offense. he has no anticipation. If he can get to a point of seeing plays before they happen he will be a legit player in the league. 

[TravelinTravParticipant]

 T-Mac year 2 9.3 ppg

Westbrok year 2 16 ppg 

It isn’t that crazy to compare LaVine to either of those players.  Not saying he will be as good but I personally have faith he will be. He is best in a catch and shoot or catch and drive scenario when he’s not playing PG. It’s a huge plus when there is someone better at ball handling then him on the court. His biggest weakness is not having the ability to react quick enough, he can’t make decisions quick enough, therefor he can be a half second behind on D and on Offense. he has no anticipation. If he can get to a point of seeing plays before they happen he will be a legit player in the league. 

[markfitz14Participant]

 It is now accepted that he is a shooting guard. This is becuase he doesn’t have that nack of being a creater for others. He will prbly never average 6 assits a game. He can score in bunches and dunk like a beast. Wiggins and Lavine= Bounce Brothers

He is right where he needs to be behind Martin until they trade him. He has a lot to learn and adjust to. At his prime he prbly will avg around 19-20 pts a game. Wiggins and KAT are both going to want to score 25 a game too. They would get the ball and green light first.

 

[markfitz14Participant]

 It is now accepted that he is a shooting guard. This is becuase he doesn’t have that nack of being a creater for others. He will prbly never average 6 assits a game. He can score in bunches and dunk like a beast. Wiggins and Lavine= Bounce Brothers

He is right where he needs to be behind Martin until they trade him. He has a lot to learn and adjust to. At his prime he prbly will avg around 19-20 pts a game. Wiggins and KAT are both going to want to score 25 a game too. They would get the ball and green light first.

 

[Gold Chain]

 A lot of good point guards don’t have a knack for creating for others.

At the same age LaVine is now, Lillard was in his sophomore or junior year of college.

LaVine has great physical tools for defending point guards. He’s long and has elite athleticism.

Even if he remains a dumb azz, which is likely, he will still likely emerge as an average defender against point guards with a few more years of experience. Something Lillard can’t say, nor can a lot of starting and star level point guards.

Defending shooting guards is another story. LaVine not only lacks intelligence, but he’s 30-40 lbs lighter than a lot of shooting guards.

LaVine in his prime will probably be as good as Isaiah Thomas, putting up as much as 22-23 ppg but not making others much better, and requiring a decent secondary ball handler/point forward on the court with him to maximize his impact.

Basically borderline all star, but definitely could make a James Harden level impact at point guard. Just don’t expect him to be a real point guard.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Gold Chain]

 A lot of good point guards don’t have a knack for creating for others.

At the same age LaVine is now, Lillard was in his sophomore or junior year of college.

LaVine has great physical tools for defending point guards. He’s long and has elite athleticism.

Even if he remains a dumb azz, which is likely, he will still likely emerge as an average defender against point guards with a few more years of experience. Something Lillard can’t say, nor can a lot of starting and star level point guards.

Defending shooting guards is another story. LaVine not only lacks intelligence, but he’s 30-40 lbs lighter than a lot of shooting guards.

LaVine in his prime will probably be as good as Isaiah Thomas, putting up as much as 22-23 ppg but not making others much better, and requiring a decent secondary ball handler/point forward on the court with him to maximize his impact.

Basically borderline all star, but definitely could make a James Harden level impact at point guard. Just don’t expect him to be a real point guard.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[MatosParticipant]

 Westbrook is a freak though. Lavine is not nearly as agressive as Westbrook is or was on D.

Nonetheless, ceiling? Yes its high, but you cant be sold on a player with a lot of questions marks. Only T-Wolves fans think hes not expendable for the right price.

 

 

[UncledrewParticipant]

He is expendable at this point in his development but everyone has a price there’s just a short list of names you can offer for him at the same time. Most of the guys you’d trade for you can’t aquire because there already on max level deals and or their franchise cornerstone player. But you can’t name 5 guards worth trading for that’s under 25 and still on a rookie level deal that you’d rather have than lavine.

[UncledrewParticipant]

He is expendable at this point in his development but everyone has a price there’s just a short list of names you can offer for him at the same time. Most of the guys you’d trade for you can’t aquire because there already on max level deals and or their franchise cornerstone player. But you can’t name 5 guards worth trading for that’s under 25 and still on a rookie level deal that you’d rather have than lavine.

[MatosParticipant]

 Westbrook is a freak though. Lavine is not nearly as agressive as Westbrook is or was on D.

Nonetheless, ceiling? Yes its high, but you cant be sold on a player with a lot of questions marks. Only T-Wolves fans think hes not expendable for the right price.

 

 

[ExumInfernoParticipant]

 He was a good pick by Minnesota, who have made some bad choices before when picking guards.

On a bad team with little help he could be Ricky Davis with 20, 4, 4 stats very easily.  Right now as a good contributor off the bench for a talented, but building, team he is around 15, 3.5, 3.5 which is very good.

He could quickly improve his efficiency, he hits free throws so he needs to draw more fould so he can shoot more.  From outside, he needs to practice a lot more and develop his 3point range.

He has improved in every stat this year, nearly every stat, so he should keep getting better for a few more years.

With the size, forget about Carter and McGrady.  With Rubio there, forget about him starting for a while.  But next year he could be the NBA 6th Man award winner.

 

 

[ExumInfernoParticipant]

 He was a good pick by Minnesota, who have made some bad choices before when picking guards.

On a bad team with little help he could be Ricky Davis with 20, 4, 4 stats very easily.  Right now as a good contributor off the bench for a talented, but building, team he is around 15, 3.5, 3.5 which is very good.

He could quickly improve his efficiency, he hits free throws so he needs to draw more fould so he can shoot more.  From outside, he needs to practice a lot more and develop his 3point range.

He has improved in every stat this year, nearly every stat, so he should keep getting better for a few more years.

With the size, forget about Carter and McGrady.  With Rubio there, forget about him starting for a while.  But next year he could be the NBA 6th Man award winner.

 

 

[Taylor Gang MikeParticipant]

 Lavine has the most potential in the NBA.. Hope he pans out because he has al the tools to be great

[Taylor Gang MikeParticipant]

 Lavine has the most potential in the NBA.. Hope he pans out because he has al the tools to be great

[Meditated StatesParticipant]

 People saying he can’t touch Wiggins will eat their words. If he keeps working  and getting minutes I see him playing pg very well and sg well. Great potential at only 20. Man in 4 years think how much his skills will grow. He will be 24. Sky is the limit.

[Meditated StatesParticipant]

 People saying he can’t touch Wiggins will eat their words. If he keeps working  and getting minutes I see him playing pg very well and sg well. Great potential at only 20. Man in 4 years think how much his skills will grow. He will be 24. Sky is the limit.

[BogDon_KryptParticipant]

Please complete the following:

Zack Lavine is to Marcus Fizer as Tim Thomas is to ____________

 

 

 

[BogDon_KryptParticipant]

Please complete the following:

Zack Lavine is to Marcus Fizer as Tim Thomas is to ____________

 

 

 

[MopgrassParticipant]

 I’m just impressed that Minnesota went from winning 20% of their games last year to 40% this year (so far). They’re not quite a playoff team and they’re real up and down, but I’m super impressed. While I hate to see them holding back minutes on some of the young guys, the pairing of veterans was great. They’re doing the best rebuild job. 

I can only assume the increase in wins is due to young player improvement and Towns (an under talked about, though drafted 1st, rookie). 

[MopgrassParticipant]

 I’m just impressed that Minnesota went from winning 20% of their games last year to 40% this year (so far). They’re not quite a playoff team and they’re real up and down, but I’m super impressed. While I hate to see them holding back minutes on some of the young guys, the pairing of veterans was great. They’re doing the best rebuild job. 

I can only assume the increase in wins is due to young player improvement and Towns (an under talked about, though drafted 1st, rookie). 

[Author]

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