[Celtics3178Participant]

 1-11 shooting from 3 and just 2 for 14 on the game with no free throws. Everyone has a bad game but how do you put up 11 threes and only hit one? His passing and rebounding are good but his shot style is so unorthodox does he have NBA 3 range. 

[cohenbc1Participant]

 It was funny when Kendall Marshall started trending on Twitter. I thought, "oh, someone must have signed him to a ridiculous contract." 

No, he was just eating Lonzo Ball for lunch.

 

 

[Miko4rm206Participant]

Ball is a SCRUB! No where as Polished Offensively as a Tatum/Fultz or an Athlete as Fox/Jackson. His Passing ability and Court vision is above average but The way Fox ran through him in College should have raised red flags. Even when he matched up with Fultz who didn’t have no where near the same talent around him was able to get his. 

Ball is a System player. He’s Rubio w/ a Kevin Martin shooting form. He doesn’t even seem like he has the Drive to really improve. The Lakers will regret this pick. 

What makes it worst is that Fox is Right up  i-5 in Sac-town so the Lakers will get to see how much they F’d up by Picking Ball lol

[MopgrassParticipant]

 One game isn’t indicative of anyone’s shooting. He’s more like Ricky Rubio with a jump shot. And Ricky Rubio with a jump shot is an all-star. 

[Miko4rm206Participant]

He Has Nothing Whatsoever he Can hang his hat on Offensively! He has no Mid range game whatsoever and probably won’t develop 1 at all b/c of how F’d up his shooting form is.

 

Proof is in the Pudding. He is not the most gifted athlete. He is rather slow. He has a little bounce. He has size. But he dosen’t/can’t get to the hoop consistently. He played exactly like he did at Ucla. Pass and Hoist up 3s. With the 3 being a little further back then college, as well as. Better competition and worst talent around him this is the lonzo ball you could be seeing alot.

Lonzo is not an Elite scorer. Those who think he is gonna put up 20+ a game and be the next Stephen Curry it’s not gonna happen. Even LeBron was clowning his shooting form! And again I don’t see any signs of this dude improving his game or his work ethic. Markelle, Bam, Fox, Tatum all of these guys want to get better and you can tell. While Lonzo is sitting in a chair smiling at his Daddy witg his shirt off in a WWE ring.

He might be a decent player. But there is definitely no allstar appearances in his future that I can see. OK started if he has a solid team around him.

 

 

 

[ChammesParticipant]

 Jesus Christ it’s his first NBA game and he didn’t shoot well, people overreacting to this are honestly kissing me off. There is multiple stars/superstars that haven’t played well in Summer League, in Australia last year with UCLA he didn’t play well either. STOP OVERREACTING 

[Miko4rm206Participant]

That sounds Like something Lavar Ball would say. While I’m gonna tell you the truth! You guys were better off Keeping Russell and Drafting whoever you guys had 2nd on your bigboard.

 You say 1 game?? Hop off his nuts I hear ya. But you can’t even tell me what’s Ball does well other than Passing.. His NBA 3 pt shot isn’t where it’s suppose to be obviously.

Guys like Markelle we knew what his game was Pullups, SpotUps, Ability to make tough layups, Fades, Ability to Create Offense period any way possible… He show cased that

Jayson Tatum again we Knew he was Polished offensivey. You seen Dirk fades in post, up and unders, Melo type midrange game, ability to be a triple threat as soon as touch the rock anywhere inside the arc and Range extends past the Arc.

Luke Kennard- Knew he was a Deadeye from 3. Showed us he was a Deadeye from 3 as well as find ways to get buckets inside the Arc.

Bam Abedayo- Knew he was Physical/ raw coming into the League. Has a NBA Body and really Athletic. Has a Nice Motor. Has a better Post game and Jumper than expected. Can handle the rock a little bit like Blake Griffin can rebound and Go coast to coast someplays. They said he is working on having a Consistent 3 pointer. That’s SOMETHING You Can Respect and see with his work ethic. 

Now Lonzo what is he Known for other then passing???? I’ll wait….. what does the great Lonzo ball have from his Repitoire at Ucla that translate over???

 

 

 

 

 

[Ahkasi ClayParticipant]

 Ball pulled a kobe. But c’mon it is a single summer league game.  If he really work hard. He might one day be as good as D’Angelo Russell. 

[Miko4rm206Participant]

Ball Pulled a Kobe??? I’m not even gonna go that route…

All I’m saying it’s 1 thing to have an off night. It’s another to your game just not being able to translate to the nba. 

 

 

 

[ChammesParticipant]

not kissing 

[mowestenParticipant]

Did it to yourself 

 

[The GoatParticipant]

 I don’t get the hype. He can’t defend at all. He couldn’t keep Kendall Marshall in front of him. His shooting form will cause issues cos he can’t go right to pull up when people go under screens. Lakers are a lock for the lottery. I just wanna see Magic’s reaction to Lavar when he inevitably takes a pot shot at the way the team is run for why Lonzo isn’t playing well. 

[Andv1 WaitingParticipant]

 3 of the shots should not have been held against him:

2 last deep in the shot clock had to hoist it and 1 x half court heave at end of the half

So it makes him 2 of 12 which still isn’t good.

But what I can take away from his first game is this:

 He was slightly nervous-you could tell he wasn’t as relaxed as college

His passing is as advertised the first play to Ingram was the most relaxed play of the whole game that I saw.

His defense(man to man defense needs work)

His shooting just wasn’t falling today-They were good looks but just didn’t fall,some just hit back iron unfortunately.

He needs to be more agressive and drive to the rack a little more-He only did that once the whole game.

He makes others get good looks/helps the ball move like promised.

He looked to cut a couple of times like college but stopped when the player was clearly going tunnel vision and wasn’t going to pass it-I think it was vander blue driving twice at least.(Guys trying to prove the can make a team) 

As most will say though it was 1 game and summer league isn’t the best indicator as two things come into play: 1) There are players trying to make the team which can sabotage overall good team play/freeze players out so they can get theirs to help themselves rather than the team and 2) The young players have to find out what peoples tendincies are,adjust to the different pace of the game/24 shot clock and how to run the system properly..

The other key point is you can be Vegas MVP and struggle to even keep in the league see Jarryd Bayless as a key example..

Wait until at least the end of next season, before the bust talk starts as people were saying the exact same thing about ingram early on but as he got more comfortable  he got better and he is now see as untouchable.. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[TarHeelRavenParticipant]

 Not a good look for Lonzo at all.  Of course it’s a summer league game, but I believe Magic Johnson expected a lot more from Ball as you could tell he was very frustrated watching Lonzo brick shot after shot.  Kendall Marshall, who as we all know is far from an elite athlete was having his way with Lonzo.  Like it or not, Lonzo has a huge target on his back all thanks to his loud-mouthed dad and it will only get worse.  

[Miko4rm206Participant]

 His dad played a part in hyping him up and putting him in the spotlight. But at the same time it’s On Lonzo to get better (which he hasnt) also Magic and the scouting dept. need 2 scout talent better. It’s ashame. Mj didn’t make the greatest of Picks (Kwame Brown, Adam morrinson) falling all into hype picks instead of actually scouting. Thought Magic would be different.

[Ahkasi ClayParticipant]

 It Was The Shoes!!!

[Jr. ROXASParticipant]

His ball-handling as I’ve always said is garbaaaaaggeee. He gets flustered on traps and when he gets pressured and has no smoothness whatsoever when he has the ball. That weakness ultimately affects his ability to run the PnR.

A lot of his assists ever since UCLA came from him making a forward pass to another player on the break or him skip passing to Alford or Hamilton who will then hoist up a slight contested three. He has no creativity at all with the ball and in the pick and roll and that really bothers me as way more skilled guys like Evans and Mason are going under the radar.

[Miko4rm206Participant]

100 % agreed and Vice versa. His ability to create for himself or even get into the lane consistently is not there. He was able to hit 3s in college.. Have guys look out for him on backdoor cuts or get a offensive rebound and easy put back cause of the spacing at ucla. None of that translates to the nba his shooting form is way past wack. He tried moving w/o the basketball and they just didn’t find him for easy baskets cause nobody was looking for him! If he’s not running a fast break or open for 3 he is not a threat to score himself

[SeattleSuperChronicsParticipant]

 He missed wide open three’s I have seen him make on several occasions. He makes half those we are talking about how good he played. Not worried. The Lonzo haters will be out in full force after every bad game. Expect a big bounce back game tonight.

[Miko4rm206Participant]

Exactly wide open 3s. He made 1 three and had a offensive putback. He can shoot complete opposite and go 10-11 from 3 next game. That wouldn’t change the fact hid offensive skill set is Completely lacking not to mention his defense. His best bet is a 3 no D-playmaker. That’s not gonna cut it

[Arc12345Participant]

Let’s see how he plays today, everyone can have a bad game. And it’s not like he played awful, if his shot is dropping then we’re talking about what a great game he had.

I actually thought he did a decent job on Marshall, but was going for the block or pick pocket a little too often instead of focusing of staying between him and the basket. His length definitely helps him on the defensive end and he has very active hands.

Again, I have to see more, and I’m in no way writing him off this early, but it’s a little alarming that everyone else in the top 5 had very very nice debuts (Fultz, Tatum, Jackson, and Fox). I’m excited to review everyone’s numbers and summer league experience once it concludes. 

Lakers vs Celtics today should be good. Two of the better summer league squads.

 

 

 

[SubZeroParticipant]

It amazed me how the PJ Carlesimo and the other commentator (can’t remember who it was) kept talking about his shot and being like “it’s compared to Jim Furyk’s golf swing but that’s a good thing because it works!” No, it doesn’t really work. He can only shoot if he’s wide open and if last night is any indication, he can’t shoot at all. Can’t shoot moving right because of the form, no midrange at all to speak of. I can’t see him ever looking good when he has to score. Plus, his body language looked awful. We all know he’s a quiet kid but everyone wanted to talk about how good of a leader he’s gonna be, and he didn’t do much besides slouch around. He doesn’t seem like a leader at all, whereas you can tell with Fox that he can be the leader in the floor with how vocal and competitive he is, while also trying to build his teammates up.

Yeah obviously it’s just the first summer league game and usually doesn’t mean much, but the truth is that if this were any other lottery pick besides Lonzo, he’d be getting killed for it by everyone

[mgreener_34Participant]

 Can’t wait to watch Lakers/Celtics tonight. I hope Ball and Tatum come out looking to prove something. 

Likewise, for all the hate Lavar gets, the man is a genius. How is the hell do the Lakers first two SL games, on a Friday and Saturday, get prime time showings from ESPN? For real, kid wasn’t even the #1 pick, and is already getting LeBron treatment in terms of exposure. 

Because of this, he HAS to start playing well. Ball can’t just be ok, he needs to be good or else the media’s going to turn on him real quick. People will start to turn on him even quicker…

 

 

[nill650Participant]

 maybe it was first game jitters,maybe the apologists think he will bounce back blah blah blah…he was exposed in summer league of all places. Even Anthony Bennett played good in summerleague. not a good sign at all for the hype eaters. I was hoping he proved me wrong, but despite it being a given he would go in the top 5 this year…he is not capable of playing the same game he always has at this level without significant improvements. gatorade league will never see him because the kid has too many high expectations strapped on his back.

If he doesn’t bust I would be shocked

[jaysmith1987Participant]

 I am sure some watched the game and didn’t like his shooting or offensive game but that guy was pushing th e ball getting people inlvolved like a point guard should.  The shot will fall there was a lot of in and outs.  His first game wasn’t bad but this guy clearly knows how to run an offense.

[Miko4rm206Participant]

 Everybody knew he could/can run a team when comes to being a PG. But what else does he have to score when the game slows down to a half Cort game and his ugly looking 3pt shot ain’t falling? * hint u seen it last nighp

[vulture711Participant]

However, Magic could have helped his transition by keeping Russell and letting Lonzo spend some time off the ball.  He’s been thrown into the – it’s your team – sink or swim, as a kid.  I’m not a Laker fan but I hate seeing young guys moved because you need to offload a contract that should never have been given out.   Fultz is lucky to have Embiid and Simmons so the lights won’t be so bright on him and he can go out and play and have fun.  Nobody is saying it’s your team …. it belongs to Embiiiiiddddd

 

 

[Memphis MadnessParticipant]

 Lonzo needs some pet, go-to moves in the mid-range/post.  

Magic needs to work with him on that post game.  Magic had a good one…

Lonzo needs to get his runner/floater game going.  That is where MOST point guards get their points… even a guy like Fox will score mostly from runners/floaters/mid-range.  Fox is a heck of a speedster and will probably lead rookies in layups, but he still isn’t going to get more than a few layups (his length is mediocre).  

Lonzo needs the keys but he can’t crash the car into a mountain.  Would be a bad look.

I think his MAXIMUM number of 3 point attempts per game should be 4.  Unless he is 3/4 then keep going.  

Needs to get to the line 5 or 6 times a game.

Solid passer, but not off the charts.

Looks like a triangle point guard with a super-streaky jumper.

Hopefully, he has GREAT chemistry with the rest of the team…

Probably the same as the other top guys.

Looks like Fox has better chemistry with his guys.  Fox has a motor.  Leadership.  Reminds me of Isiah Thomas.  

Tatum and Brown looks like a good combo in Boston.  Liked Tatum’s body language but the guy was hitting… 

Fultz needs to show more leadership as does Ball.  Even if you aren’t vocal…

Fultz did what you expected him to do.  I would imagine he gets MOST of his points on mid-range stuff, floaters, runners, drives to the bucket resulting in a layup or foul…  

Fox: Same thing… probably more SPEED than even Futlz so he might get more blow-by layups.  But, I am not sure either of those guys gets tons of throwdown dunks going down the lane a la Russell Westbrook.  I don’t expect either guy to be a money 3 point shooter.  Lonzo might be a volume 3 point threat, but I still don’t think he should take more than 3 or 4 a night.  

Other than that, Ingram looked great.  Thomas Bryant looked good.  A lot of the other guys didn’t look so good, and were mostly trying to get theirs…

They need to run a SYSTEM that utilizes Ball’s skills (and Ingram’s).  Then let Randle and the rest of the guys adjust…

You need space/pace mixed in there with some Showtime as well as some Triangle.

I saw a good triangle on the wing with a guy getting an open shot.  

Yeah, like someone else said, I think you go with Jordan Clarkson as the other perimeter guy then each of those 3 takes turns handling the ball and initiating the offense.  

Finally, I wonder what Jason Kidd did in summer league… did he play in summer league?  

The guy that Lonzo probably needs to pattern his game after is Shaun Livingston.  A bigger, longer, pass-first point guard who makes a living on a steady diet of pull-up mid-range jumpers, and abusing smaller point guards in the post.

But, hey, if Lonzo can get Ingram going, get Randle going, get Brook Lopez the ball in his favorite spots, then I don’t care if Lonzo goes 3 for 12 every game as the long as they pile up wins.

You can compare Ball to Fultz, but it won’t get a GM fired.  Fultz went 1.  It was between Ball and the other guys… And, they have Ingram so you can’t fault them for not taking Tatum, with Josh Jackson being a player with similar size, even if he might project more as a 2 guard.  

The real comparison now is to De’Aaron Fox as others have said.

Should be an AWESOME matchup.

When do they play each other in summer league.

Well, at least THAT rivalry is back…

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[ndbigdaveParticipant]

 Ive read a few different defenses for Ball in this (and another thread) and I thought it would be a good exercise to go through…

#1 – It was just (one) summer league game.
100% correct. You cant put too much stock in this, there have been players who have underwhelmed in summer league and went on to play well and vice-versa. That being said, this is at least a small step in competition and it would be preferable to see the rookies also take a step up, these top picks are supposed to be elite level talents, athletes with massive potential the last point is the one I will give Ball, he is young, this is his first quasi-NBA game and he will develop physically and with skills. 

That being said, the issues that were noted by myself and others were very prevelent on night one – the problem with issues on defense (lateral speed) and ability off the bounce (again athleticism + go-to moves) arent things I ever see changing and will only be exposed further at the NBA level.

#2 – If a few of the 3’s had gone in we would have said he played well
We would have?
His defense was bad. He failed to break guys down off the dribble and though some of his better passes werent credited with assists some of his other less thrilling passing (simply roating the ball around the 3-point line where Ingram hits a contested 3 isnt my idea of creating offense). This "defense" is where I can tell the difference between "boxscore fans" and actual basketball fans who realize that games are beyond points/rebounds/assists.

Ball is a unique player, a lot of his benefits to the Lakers this year wont always show up on the box score, the way he pushes the ball and sets the tempo will lead to easier shots for his teammates – that is truly valuable. I also think Ball will have games where he hits 3s because he does have NBA range and he will help spacing for Luke Walton’s system (also very valuable). That all being said, he isnt an elite shooter (good not great) his defense is a liability and his ability to push the ball only works on missed shots, almost half the game (at least) will not allow this benefit to work and his inability to break guys down off the bounce will lead to defenses harassing his shot even more not worrying about him getting to the lane.

I am not a "hater" I just call it how I see it as a long time fan and coach.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[whiteflashParticipant]

 My problem with Ball (as I wrote in the ZO2 thread) is that his only definable NBA skill is passing on the break. He can’t create his own shot, can’t finish through contact, can’t defend, isn’t especially quick/fast, etc… That’s just not a guy you hang your franchise on. Add all of that to the fact that EVERYONE is going to go after him ’cause of his dad’s mouth and you have a recipe for disaster. His dad and the media have led the masses to believe that he’s something he’s not. The J. Kidd comparisons are silly ’cause not only could Kidd control every facet of the game, he was built like a tank. I expect Ball to have a better game tonight (it’d be hard to have a worse one) but think he’s going to really struggle this year. 

[ndbigdaveParticipant]

Ball has some skills, I always feel like I have to defend him in part before I criticize.

I like how he looks ahead and has a knack for "creating a break" even when one really isnt there by simply passing fast (I mean that in a good way here) and by getting the ball to the open man – that type of play will inspire guys to run and know that they will get the ball if they do the work to get open – there is tremendous value in that for team and can lead to easy buckets and will pad Ball’s assist numbers.

I also think that Ball can be a competent shooter, he has a weird shot, but he can hit open shots and is confident in his step-back.

He will serve a purpose and will have some games (when his shot is on) where he could get over 20 and get 10 assists, but on many nights and especially against teams that play defense he simply is not a threat outside of spoting up for shots as he cant break a defense down with his dribble/athetlicism and then he is a liability on defense. What is scary is a guy like Marshall last night just killed Ball off the bounce and if Ball gets shifted to guard SGs his length/height advantage goes away and his lack of physicality will be exposed further.

 

 

  

[Ahkasi ClayParticipant]

 Last year when Ingram had some off days I defended him by using "its only Summer League" excuse.   I will not be doing that this year for Ball.   I think he is a walking joke.  

[Author]

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