Cavs moving up to #13?

JCliff24
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Cavs moving up to #13?

http://www.fearthesword.com/2013/6/20/4449154/nba-draft-2013-nerlens-noe...

"Dallas pick is available and Cavs appear to have parameters of a deal in place to move up from 19 for it. Target is Sergey Karasev"

If Shabazz is available at #13 and you're looking for a SF do you take Bazz or Karasev?


FutureNBAGM
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Maybe they can swap the

Maybe they can swap the future 1st rd pick they got from Sacramento to Dallas for #13

NickWayne87
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You take

Bazz. 13 times out of 10. I think he's a steal at that point in the draft to be honest.

WolfRob
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I'm taking Karasev to knock

I'm taking Karasev to knock down shots and space the floor. Let Kyrie and Dion have the ball in their hands (mainly Kyrie). Shabazz needs to ball to be effective, I don't see it being a great fit.

Mopgrass
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This is a great question.

This is a great question. These are the two SF's I really like.

Every team could use Karasev. He's a great team player and, I think, one off the top 3 passers in the whole draft. He's great at 3's, can make it off the glass from any angle, and he's a lot quicker laterally than people say. He will get pushed around until he gains weight.

Shabazz? I can't see Cleveland passing on him if he's there. Kyrie should shoot as much as he wants, but while Waiters did a great job, he has a low % and needs to shoot less. Shabazz is a good volume guy and too good of an opportunity here.

TheArtistPaysth...
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Is Shabazz a small forward?

The saying is, you are who you can guard. Is he quick enough to guard 2's or big enough to guard 3's? I haven't seen Karasev play outside of clips but he has legit small forward size. Bazz could post up shooting guards though.

Cleveland would definitely have to take Noel first if they plan on taking Bazz or even Karasev. KI, DW and either of those guys will create a 24 hour drive through window, even with Mike Brown's defense. Len/Noel and one of them has better overall upside but Porter and Deng/Plumlee has a better chance to be solid on both ends. Plus Deng or Plumlee would be there at 19 and you could deal the 2nd rounders for a late first.

The Cavs also have a headcaseless team and if they go Len over Noel then they are trying to keep it that way. Adding Bazz would certainly screw that up.

On the Karasev rumor, the Cavs usually do a good job of keeping their thoughts to themselves ala TT, DW, TZ and even KI was a decision that they left in the air publicly. Why if they are hot on his trail would it be so obvious. This may be a play to either leap over Atlanta or a smokescreen for another target. I'm thinking it could be Steve Adams or Nogueira. I'm sure Kyries tries to Australia had him well aware of Adams for a while and Nogueira is almost a Varejao clone.

Velvet Hoop
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Karasev

I think with Kyrie and Waiters on board, they already have enough "volume" guys. They need someone that can space the floor and not have to play with the ball in his hands. Look at the nbadraft.net list of strengths for each player. First Karasev and then Bazz.

Strong basketball IQ for a player who is yet to turn 20 ... Has solid court vision/imagination and is a willing passer ... Some ability to put the ball on the floor in the half court set ... Shows toughness, fighting for rebounds, even with a lack of strength ... Has spent the past year as a main scorer on a professional team with solid efficiency ... Definitely seems to have a willingness to come over and play in the NBA, not much worry about a hold out ... Will compete defensively and has nice size for either wing position ...

Can use his body to create space and get shots off near the basket ... Length (6-11 + wingspan) helps him get his shot off and create post-up opportunities against smaller wings ... Not afraid of contact and has the ability to get to the line at a high rate ... Was very proficient as an offensive rebounder, has a nose for the ball ... Developed a runner that looks very promising and was quite difficult to stop ... Noted for a strong work ethic, plays with a chip on his shoulder ... Wants the ball in the clutch and not shaken in end of game situations ... Length gives him potential as a defender ... Athleticism is quite solid and has an ability to play major minutes at optimum conditioning level ... Makes his move very quickly, does not stop the ball or take a lot of time off of the clock ... Shows a strong passion for the game and a will to improve ...

So with Karasev you get shooting, IQ, toughness, rebounding,efficiency, pro experience and size.

With Bazz you get offense, wingspan, work ethic. Seriously though, just about everything in his summary talks about his offense. How is he going to like being the third option? I actually like Bazz the most to the team talking about trading the pick. Dallas could use a scorer and he would come in and immediately be their second option. I don't know, maybe Cubes isn't that high on him. But I bet it is either a smokescreen or they are targeting MCW instead (if still available). I just don't see why they would trade the pick if they can get a guy like Bazz, unless it is more about packaging the pick with Shaw Marion to create more cap space for them for free agency.

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Karasev. He is simply a

Karasev. He is simply a better scorer than Shabazz. Better shooter, ball handler, and passer. Probably less of a liability on defense. Bazz is the better post scorer and offensive rebounder, and he may be a better finisher at the rim if he gets his conditioning up, but otherwise it is all Karasev.

Karasev needs to work a little on protecting the ball on his finishing attempts, but he draws tons of fouls, can hit floaters with either hand, and has an outstanding first step going into the lane. Karasev may not be an explosive leaper, but I think he does a nice job attacking closeouts and getting past people with his long strides. I think Karasev has a lower floor than Shabazz and a higher ceiling.

Karasev is only 19, but was an efficient leading scorer for a professional team going against tough competition. I think if he played in the NCAA, he may have scored even more than he did in the United League, and would probably be getting more hype than he does.

Andrew1984
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Really good material on this

Really good material on this thread, an enjoyable read.

I think Shabazz will be gone at No. 7 to Sacramento.

The question of the importance of shooters is an interesting one. Catch-and-shoot stiffs are a dime-a-dozen. The Tim Leglers and Steve Kerrs of the world are buried on every bench. Guys who don't put pressure on defenses, don't create, lack defensive prowess, and can't attack the basket are cheap and abundant. They're "specialists," and every team has one.

That being said, if you look at the way the Heat roster is constructed and the way they played in the playoffs, they absolutely needed perimeter shooting. If Battier, Mike Miller, and and Mario Chalmers weren't knocking down threes, life was miserable for LeBron and Wade.

So the fact is, reliable perimeter shooters are necessary, but they have to have some versatility too. Is Karasev a spot-up guy who gives you nothing other than catch-and-shoot? If so, you might as well sign some reincarnation of Craig Hodeges for chump change. But if Karasev is more well-rounded of a player in addition to spacing the floor, then he's worth moving up to No. 13.

My problem with both Karasev and Shabazz is that I'm just not sure they're a whole lot better than C.J. Miles. We know C.J. can explode offensively once every 10 games or so, but that's not good enough. He's also a walking turnover. But all three of those guys are lefties who can provide firepower, IF they're hot.

'Bazz can create but his perimeter shooting may be suspect.

Karasev can shoot consistently but his ability to create may be suspect.

That's why I personally would prefer Giannis. As much as I hate to use this name, he could be an impoverished, homeless man's Kevin Durant. And even if he never approaches that skill level, he still has guaranteed versatility, size, athleticism, and impact on a game. But I doubt he'll be available at No. 19.

cavaliersfan
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31 & 33 and sac pick for #13

31 & 33 and sac pick for Dallas #13

1-- otto pottor
13 -- CJ McCollum (kyrie backup, if kyrie gets hurt), Kentavious Caldwell-Pope, Gorgui Dieng(Center, great wing span )

19 -- Gorgui Dieng(Center, great wing span ) , jamal franklin (kawhi lenord ... )

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