The Wildcard to the 2010 NBA Draft
As we get closer and closer to May 8th, we'll see people post there mock drafts and have players go to teams they feel fit best. Cole Aldich, Xavier Henry, Greg Monroe, Patrick Patterson might have to wait to allow the biggest Draft piece to move.
The name? Darren Collinson? 21st overall pick last season.
As we slot people in draft positions- We might have to wait. With Chris Paul coming back for next season and the David West/ Emaka Okafor combo not really working out- The Hornets could look to move thier biggest piece.
As it stands right now- There are 3 teams in the top 12 (Indiana, Detroit and Memphis) and 4 in the top 13 (maybe Toronto) who could look to Darren Collinson as a PG fix for the next decade. The biggest question: What's Collinson's value? I would say 1st round pick. Is the 9th overall pick too much for a 2nd year PG? I don't think so.
What would be interesting is New Orleans if they land another lottery pick to the 11th projected pick they currently own. With 2 top 12 picks- The Hornets could go from the middle of the pack to a team who could contend for a top 4 seed.
What are your thoughts?
i doubt collison pulls a top 4-5 pick, but i think he could get a 5-8 pick to be honest. If im a team in need of a pg selecting in that range, i migh tbe on the phone with New Orleans right now.
Indiana should pull up with NO and make a move. I would offer
Indiana gets: Emaka Okafor and Darren Collinson
New Orleans gets: 1st round pick, A,J Price, Tyler Hansbrough and Troy Murphy
im a hornets fan and i can't wait to see what gets done now that G shinn is sellin his share of the team. As long as they quit giving out terrible contracts to past their prime vets, and don't draft cole aldrich ill be fine
Hassan Whiteside Or Monroe should be some great picks. Anything else they should trade down and grab a small forward and a solid vet big for a team. I would love for them to move up to top 3 though I dont want them to get the first overall because that could cause confusion but getting 2 or 3 and they could go for Turner, Johnson or Cousins. Cousins would be a good fit if New Orleans gets top 3.
If I were the Clippers I'd trade the 8th pick for Collison and pair him with Eric Gordon for the next 10 years, With Collison, Gordon, Griffin, and Kaman the Clippers would have a bright future.
i think the clippers have the most to offer. 8th pick. they would do that in a second. gives them a good young pg to get rid of disgruntled baron davis. also, he is a local star from ucla. i think if he goes anywhere he goes to LAC because he probably wouldn't go for a first half of the lottery pick. 8-14 is the more likely scenario and the clippers hold the 1st pick of the second half of the lottery. Trade baron to the knicks for eddy curry.
pg: darren collison, bobby brown
sg: eric gordon, 2nd round pick
sf: free agent pickup (maybe rudy gay or joe johnson), rasual butler
pf: blake griffin, craig smith, eddy curry
c: chris kaman, deandre jordan, BIG SOFO
I could see NO looking at LAC with some cap space and say: " Hey, Indy is offering the 9th pick. We could give you Collison but you have to take some players for cap relief.
Plus Detroit has the 6th pick...wouldn't they have the upper hand over LAC?
actually the pistons have the 7th pick. i doubt they offer #7 for a pg when they have rodney stuckey. and why would the hornets not prefer #8 (LAC) over #10 (Indy)?
I doubt the Pistons would trade the 7th pick for Darren Collison. If Dumars wanted a PG he would have drafted one last year with the 15th pick. There were plenty on the board then, including Collison. He has played really well, but we need help in the front court a lot more than we need a PG at the moment.
All those players were available when we picked Daye. I don't think there is anyway that Dumars trades a chance at a quality big man at number 7 for Collison.
New Orleans is not getting a lottery pick for Collison. They should be shooting for cap relief.
Memphis will definitely not give the 12 for him.
Collison was one of the top 5 rookies in the league this year and you say no chance he is worth a lottery pick?
He's a Memphis fan- He doesn't know what it's like to have a good GM.
Clippers- The Pistons would love to have Collison. Yes, the 7th pick is alot but they could move Stuckey back to the SG spot. I could see this team move Prince next season and add a strong, tough defensive big man.
I could see Detroit do
7th pick and Richard Hamilton and DeJuan Summers
Darren Collinson and Emaka Okafor
If Dumars wanted a PG why did he not draft one of the 5 available in the draft last year? So instead of getting Collison for the 15th pick in the 2009 draft he is going to get Collison for:
7th+Richard Hamilton+DeJuan Summers
Utterly ridiculous. Let me restate what he could have done if he wanted Collison. DRAFTED HIM WITH THE 15TH PICK LAST YEAR.
no one knew he was gonna be that good last year though. That likes saying no way would cleavland take marcus thorton for their 1st round pick because otherwise they would have just done it last year.
also, the emka for rip makes sense for the pistons too since they both have similar bad contracts and the pistons need a big way more then they need a sg since getting collison would just allow stuckey to play sg.
Maybe because he liked Austin Daye?
Let's stop acting like Collison was being called a smart pick at 15. He would have gotten crap for that for the whole summer. Daye was a good pick who didn't have a spot last season.
Plus, your telling me if you guys get the 7-9th pick: You rather risk the chance of drafting a bust then taking the sure thing in Darren Collison? Come on now....be real
Nobody knew he was going to be this good I suppose, but last year's class was completely PG dominated. The Pistons had 3 picks and took a total of 0 PGs. We will resign Will Bynum this summer and play a combination of Bynum and Stuckey at the point. It is insanity to say that we would make that trade even disregarding the Okafer involvement.
Insanity? Collison played as well as any rookie for about 2 monthas as a starter. I like stuckey, but he still might be better suited to play sg. Rip needs to go regardless and getting emeka solves their biggest weakness while also making them younger and freeing up even more playing time for gordon. picks outside the top 5 are always gonna be risks, why not play it safe with a guy who already proved he is a legit nba starter?
They didn't take a PG last year because Stuckey had a good season. He shot like 29% from 3 but he improved.
You wanna run with a combo guard as a PG- Fine but don't expect 35 or more wins.
You do that trade and get back Collison and Okafor? I could Detroit winning 40-50 games.
Collison is far from being a "sure thing", the guy had a solid rookie season. Our best big this year was Ben Wallace. He is 35+ and plays zero offense. We have Stuckey and Bynum at the point. Raymond Felton is a FA and could be had for a reasonable price. We could deal with Minnesota for Sessions w/o giving up the 7th pick. Why are we suddenly desperate for a PG? Is that what made us a 26 win team this year our PG play?
Ramon Sessions or Darren Collison?
Are we arguing that now?
lots of things made them a 26 win team. I think no question emeka is a step up for the pistons over rip. That is a major improvement for their team and getting younger. Adding colison for the 7th pick would be solid as well. He played like arguably a top 3 rookie last year in my book behind only reke and curry.
There is a reason that NO is looking to deal Okafer, and its not because he is a "young and talented" player. It is because he has a terrible contract and is at best a solid player. We could easily draft a Okafer-caliber player without paying him 10+mill a year.
Rip has to be moved regardless I agree, but I do not agree with trading Rip to bring in another guard. It does not make any sense unless we want to move Bynum too.
I would rather move Rip for a big, draft another big at 7 and resign Bynum. We come out of this with:
Bynum at ~3 mill/year
Depending on the big we trade for, I would prefer this to having another terrible contract on our roster with Okafer. We have enough iffy contracts as it is.
I am not saying Sessions is better than Collison. Im saying Sessions can be had for less than our 7th pick and is a good player than can develop into a very good player.
Collison is a very promising rookie, but I'm not ready to give the keys to the franchise over to rookie who has had one good season. The last time our rookie PG had a good season, we traded Chauncey for Iverson and got ourselves into this bad situation that we are in.
collison...not close (although no one would have said that last year preseason)
so you think rip and his 33 year old self is better then having okafor who has the same type of contract and answers the teams biggest need?
No read what I wrote.
I am saying I would rather have Bynum, 7th pick, big that is obtained via Rip trade then Collison Okafer.
i did read what you wrote, and the okafor aspect of the trade is what gives the edge over rip. They make the same contract but emeka would be better then rip. That helps the whole trade out for detroit so you pointing out how emeka is over paid and not that great, well what do you think they are gonna get for rip? Certainly less then emeka if it was straight up. Not sure why you are calling out emekas contract while ignoring the fact they would unloading rips terrible contract.
This is pointless.
The thing is: Detroit needs a major shakeup. They won 26 games and looked like a finesse team. They need a tough big man who could bang around and get 8-10 boards a night. They also need a REAL point guard. A pass first point guard. Someone who can get 8-10 assist a night.
Sounds like Collison and Okafor to me...
Rip can play, it is clear if you watch any Pistons games the guy can score consistently just like he has for the past however many seasons. Rip has a terrible contract, but a trade involving him and Prince could easily get a player better and with a better option then Okafer.
We need a low-post scorer AND a defensive presence. We can get half of that puzzle with Okafer, but we can get the whole puzzle with the 7th pick and trading Rip. I would rather get a reliable low post scorer then Collison. Obviously these are not just sitting out on the curb waiting to be picked up, but this summer a lot of players are going to be moving around and teams that are patient will be rewarded.
We were completely killed this year by injuries. We were never going to be contenders or anywhere close but we could easily be in the playoff hunt without the injuries. OK I was trying to find the exact numbers but I can't remember where I read them at Pistons players missed an absurd amount of games compared to the league average. This team is not a 26 win team if it is healthy for 82 games.
So the proposed starting front court next year is Ben Wallace and Okafer. That definitely provides the low post scorer that is clearly the thing that this team is crying out for more than anything (internet sarcasm). Anybody who has watched a game this year knows that the Pistons need a low post scorer more than anything else. If we are moving the 7th pick towards something that is what it should be towards. We have 2 if nothing more "good-enough" PGs at the moment (and I think both are better than most people think) and zero low post scorers.
How do we get a low-post scorer after we trade our pick and rip for Okafer+Collison? Or do we just play without one again?
Whatever you say, Collison proved he belongs. He's worthy of a top 5-8 pick. He's safer than most draft picks except maybe for Wall and Turner. Look how raw Favors or Cousins are and tell me you would not take Collison if you needed a point. Teams like Washington, Detroit, Clippers or Indiana all need a Collison type of point guard, as unselfish as he can be a dangerous scorer.
Chabvis...Have you not seen Okafor play?
Also, DET has a early 2nd round pick. That could be a Kevin Seraphin, Soloman Alabi, Kieth Benson type player to come in and be a good defensive big off the bench.
BTW- Are we forgetting Jason Maxiell?
Cousins will immediately make an impact. So what you are saying is that the Pistons need a PG more than a low post scorer? Rodney Stuckey plays PG, as does Will Bynum. They have been our two best players this year (along with Ben Wallace and JJ).
a couple things, rip and price are both considered bad contracts. Not sure why you think the pistons are gonna use those guys to bring in new building pieces. To me, okafor is a bad contract as well, but at least he plays the one position the pistons need while rip plays the one position they have the most talent already.
And lets take them out of the trade completley, i would take colison over the 7th pick. Their all kinds of questions about who is gonna go number 7 and none of them are gaurantees. Did you see what collison did in the like 35 games he started, he was about 18ppg, 9apg and was shooting a high percentager and playing terrific defense. Are you so sure you can get that with the 7th pick, because im not. Plus he allows stuckey to move over to sg which i think he owuld be better at.
I think both apsects of the trade only improves detroit and summers is not much of a factor since he plays the same position as daye and jerebko.
But at this point, we just disagree on this trade i guess. Im just surprised you called it "insanity"
Okafer is not a scoring threat. Do you really think he is? Maxiell is an energy player. If he is starting for you then your team is very bad. He is a good player to have off the bench, but he is by no means a consistent threat in the post. Have you watched the Pistons before?
"To me, okafor is a bad contract as well, but at least he plays the one position the pistons need while rip plays the one position they have the most talent already." This is true, but Rip and Tay are both significantly better players than Okafer. Prince's contract also expires next season, a potential contender could pick him up for relatively low risk since his contract will expire regardless.
"And lets take them out of the trade completley, i would take colison over the 7th pick. Their all kinds of questions about who is gonna go number 7 and none of them are gaurantees. Did you see what collison did in the like 35 games he started, he was about 18ppg, 9apg and was shooting a high percentager and playing terrific defense. Are you so sure you can get that with the 7th pick, because im not. Plus he allows stuckey to move over to sg which i think he owuld be better at."
Hmmmmmm. You make a good point. I probably should not have used the word insanity. I like to use that word. I don't know what else to argue really. Is Collison worth the 7th pick? If he plays like he has played then yes. You are not guaranteed anything close to those numbers at number 7. He is a very good player, I have not debated that. What I am debating is whether or not it is worth trading this pick when we clearly need help in the front court much much more than we do at the point. It just does not fill a dire need at the moment. If we were in a situation where PG was a higher priority (I personally do not think it is a particularly high priority) than this trade would make perfect sense, but I dont see it that way.
I think the argument basically comes down to:
how good do you think Okafer is?
what do you think we can get for Rip and Tay?
how good can Stuckey be at the PG?
what kind of player can you get at 7?
My responses are:
younger version of 35 Y/O ben wallace (solid defender terrible offensively) with slightly better offense and a terrible contract.
they can both play and could be valuable to the right teams
in this draft, a very reliable big man at 1/10 the price of okafer
no, i think its a bad trade for NO. i think you can get a proven player for collison not just the seventh pick. the trade would be great for detroit though. no u wouldnt have a low post scorer but you would have a pg that could get easy buckets for the bigs. will bynum and rodney stuckey doesnt scare me if im an opposing team. but lets be real detroit even with collison and okafor are fighting for a low seed in the playoffs. they need to take back the contracts they gave to ben gordon and villanueva. even the people on this site all agreed that was dumb. maybe detroit can get gortat from orlando for tayshaun prince next year. orlando would have to find a backup big first.
trinajoe, i agree. I dont think it works for New Orleans. I just thought it would be good for detroit.
for new orleans, the 7th pick is no gaurantee. They dont have a big man to take emekas spot and marcus thornton might be as good as rip right now and is certainly the guy they want to invest more minutes in.