Any Chance Wall and Turner are Busts?
When ever I evaluate prospects I always look at the worst, because the majority of the time prospects don't live up to the hype. My question is it posssible both Wall and Turner are busts. Both have flaws which I will state:
Wall: Very fast, but he turns the ball over a lot, he also isn't a good shooter, is very skinny, and doesn't seem to get enough lift on his jumper when he does shoot. It's hard to win titles in the NBA with up-tempo styles, and I don't see Wall succeeding in a half-court or slowed down style.
Turner: Turns it over alot, people say thats because he handles the ball alot, but the reason he is great is because he always has the ball in his hand, what will he do off the ball in the NBA? He also isn't the most athletic person, will he be able to score against athletic defenders in the NBA and beat the off the dribble? He also isn't a good 3 shooter, and people praise him for his mid-range game but the three in college is a mid-range shot in the NBA. I wonder how affect he will be off ball.
This are just assumptions, not predictions, but most seem like valid points that could see them not living up to their hype. Thoughts?
Always a chance, but I would very very seriously doubt either will be. Every prospect has weaknesses, and I think both have weaknesses that can be corrected pretty easily. It's not like they're tweeners, or lack size or something like that, we're talking about guys that are good and not as good as they will be in the future.
isnt Wall a combo guard, and ppl still havent figured out what position Turner will maximize his potential at
I dont think theyll be busts but I doubt how far they can elevate a franchise.
Wall plays much better with the ball in his hands and is a good passer and distributor, so he's a PG. Hasn't played anythinjg but PG since he was in HS so NO, he's not a true combo guard.
Turner's maximum potential is at SG. He's not a good enough ball-handler or quick enough to play PG alot, and even though he can play spot minutes at the SF he's not a good enough post up guy to play SF. He's easily more of a shooting guard IMO
Injuries are the only thing that can bust these two players.
injuries or the clippers.
i agree any one can become a bust but i doubt either will..wall because even if he isnt the great offensive force that some predict he does have high level passing ability and turner because he also has high level passing ability and high iq...
Im just not sure how well Turner is going to do playing off the ball, if he doesn't improve his shot people are going to give him space and he won't be able to drive by them.
Im also not sold on Wall's work ethic. He was in high school 5 years which isn't a good sign. He also never seems to take things serious and is always laughing, not sure if he was the will to practice and get better.
I'm not sure how laughing limits your upside...who gives a rats ass if he laughs, goodness sakes man, he's not in a prison camp, he's playing basketball. Its not like he's a goofball out on the court, or laughing at key moments in the game...every single basketball player smiles (except for this one JUCO player i played against).
I think you bring up some valid points about both guys weaknesses, but in the long run, every single prospect has some weaknesses. Wall does struggle in a half court setting and Turner might not have off the charts athleticism and who knows if either guy will win championships...that doesnt really determine weather or not they are busts...if that was the case...Adam Morrison has panned out nicely. I think both players will be day 1 starters in the NBA and both will be pretty good players.
Wall is an 18 year old kid who can do things in real life that most of us cant do in a video game (normal people with lives anyways). his athleticism is unbelievable, and he has an amazing court awareness that you just dont see in many point guards. He has the ability to score, but he also gets his teammates involved first. Very few point guards even in the NBA have the kind of court awareness John Wall displayed in just his Freshmen year in college. He does have his weaknesses, most of which are correctable or can be solved with more experience.
Turner is a big strong perimeter player who can get into the lane anytime he wants. His jumpshot has improved dramatically over the season. He turns the ball over alot, but I think that can be solved with experience as well. Most of his TO's are due to overpenetrating into a defense, that wont happen when he gets more comfortable with his outside shot and running offensive sets. He doenst have off the charts athleticism, but neither does Brandon Roy, or Paul Pierce, and they are doing just fine...its not like he is a slouch either...I've seen him go from the 3 point line to the rim in 1 or two dribbles leaving his defender watching, still standing at the 3 point line.
Are both guys going to be instant franchise saviors...no. Rookies arent instant franchise players, but both guys have the ability and potential to be cornerstone pieces for a good team.
I expect Wall to average 14-16 points and 5-8 assists his Rookie year and I think his career averages will be between 16-19 ppg and 8-11 apg.
Turner I could see being a 15-18 ppg and 5-7 rpg and 4-6 apg his rookie year and I think his career numbers will be around 18-22 ppg, 5-7 rpg and 5-7 apg.
Both guys are going to be good NBA players barring injury.
Your stat projections are right on imo. And to clear it up, Wall is NOT a combo guard. Dude was the best passer in the country even though he was limited by Bledsoe also being out there. He is also not very good wit out the ball in the half-court except on alley-oops.
"Wall is NOT a combo guard Dude was the best passer in the country even though he was limited by Bledsoe also being out there."
Combo Guard doesnt necessarily mean a bad thing, it means they're the only one stopping themselves and that they're not near their potential yet.
A combo guard is a mix of scoring and passing, I've seen recruiting sites where Rondo was listed as a combo guard coming out.
People still say Rondo can be unguardable once he develops a jumper off the dribble.
Chauncey Billups, Tony Parker, etc.
Hibachi is a scoring combo guard, he was an MVP candidate a few years back.
Being a combo guard means you have "potentially" have less limitations than a pure point (Jose Calderon).
Yo Biggy, u think Wall can average 8-11 asts a year for his career? Thats pretty crazy. Nash is only at like 8 apg for his career. J-Kidd is at 9.2
wall went to high school 5 years because he went to a prep school. . . .after his freshman year (i think after his freshman year) he went to Holy Cross , so they gave him an extra year of eligibily. . . . same thing as a 5th year senior
delfam, lebron laughs a lot to.
You dont think Wall can Average 8 assists per game?
Think about the league Jason Kidd played a better part of his career in...same with Steve Nash, and think about the NBA today...Its alot more PG oriented. John Wall is going to be running alot of sets, pick and roll, isolations. He'll have the ball in his hands, either penetrating and scoring or dishing to other guys. I imagine alot like Chris Paul and Deron Williams. Its lke 2 assists a quarter...you cant tell me that John Wall isnt going to be in position to get 2 assists a quarter.
wall repeated his 3rd year of hs... and he can be 8ass in career but his team will never won... thats my opinion,i just dont see him as a great passer in nba, he is more scorer ( i see him as a 20 ppg during career)... and to that guy who said nash is only 8 ass.... nash wasnt a household name when he first came in league... he worked hard and proved that he belong to nba....
I agree. I think is going to be a scoring PG. He seems like a 7 or more likely 8 assist guy though to me at his best.
There's a small chance that either Wall or Turner become busts. Of course that's excluding futuristic factors that we have no way of predicting like injuries, etc.
I do think there's a chance that Wall might not live up to the expectations though. A lot of people are expecting him to be an elite point guard OR even a superstar within a few seasons. The expectations are much higher for Wall than they are for Turner.