John Wall and Reggie Bush
GOING OUT ON A LIMB. PLEASE RESPECT MY POST
John Wall reminds me a lot of Reggie Bush. They get by in college by extreme speed and athleticism but when they reach the pros, everyone is as fast as you and everyone is stronger than you.
Football----Basketball..............and the same was said when Lebron went into the league he came straight from high school
Wall is too thin, next Derrick Rose? Please, Derrick Rose has a filthy nasty crossover. John Wall relies on speed. Derrick Rose can take contact because of his thicker body while John Wall's skinny body will get tossed around in the NBA.
Comparison: Devin Harris with no J
John Wall is a lot faster than most of the players in the NBA right now. He has great size and athleticsm for his position as well.
DanEboy.. If you match up Derrick with Wall, Derrick would punish him.. So would players like Nelson and Fisher
Wall is nice in the open court, hes got crazy handle and plays solid D (especially on the weak side), but in the half court he can be contained....
I actually kinda see the point of this argument. by all means, i would draft wall first, ut reality is just becase you dominate athleticly in college doesnt mean everything in th epros. Is wall that much better a athlete then pros like Shannon brown, russell westbrook, or ronnie price
Great comparison....i was thinking the same thing....John Wall is like Devin Harris. Rose is much faster,stronger and a better athlete imo. Wall looks really weak and Im thinking he might be a little bit overhyped.
Just a point of reference...
Rose at Memphis:
Wall at Kentucky:
Wall is just a teenager, with a few million dollars, an NBA workout regiment, and the need to bulk up after getting banged around some, he'll have the same body as Rose in a couple years.
Having a fearless point guard isn't always the greatest characteristic... I love Derrick Rose, but he needs to get smarter going to the hoop (just ask Dwight Howard), otherwise he's going to see his career shortened... being physical goes both ways, and a point guard needs to stay on the floor.
Bush is not as bad as people think and also Bush is quicker than most in the NFL still but in the NFL it is more about finding holes to run when Bush find the hole now he is getting yards. The adjustment from college football to NFL is not the same as college b ball to NBA. Wall will do fine. It is funny how everyone is knocking on Wall but when he starts playing good then the same people will be on his nuts. People spoke bad about Curry but now everyone is praising him like they were not the same ones hating.
has anyone one noticed tht about 80 percent of walls points come either on the fastbreak off a to, or off wat i call a cheapy which is where he will leak out.... u rarely see it in the nba and also he needs to imporve his J big time... i still think ET is the best player in this draft
Sheltwon.. There's a BIG difference between John Wall and Stephen Curry. Stephen Curry has a NICE jumpshot and Wall doesn't so you can't even compare the 2.
rose wasn't always this filled out. . .
&& you same people said the same things about jennings, evans, blair, && curry . but now you're
praising them . let's just wait til next year to continue this
it would do him some good to learn a few new moves. . euro-step , hesitation moves , && just to be a little patient .
Big difference between players you're naming.
Blair is a post player.
Evans has a strong build.
Jennings and Curry have good jump shots.
Don't compare them to Wall.
i'm not comparing them. .
i'm just letting you all know that you doubted more people than wall. . && those are just a few that had similar doubts && "problems" with their game. . (with the exception of blair)
I've said it before and I'll say it again... Wall is a little overrated. I think he's going to be a great point guard, but I'm not so sure he's going to be a superstar... Especially in one or two seasons. I'm not sold on him being a go-to offensive player in the NBA, or him carrying a team for 82 games.
I think he'll be more of a Rajon Rondo type of player... Somewhere in between a Rondo and Russell Westbrook. Great point guard, but not a superstar a la LeBron, Kobe, Wade, Paul, Howard, Durant, etc.
He lacks a mid-range game and isn't as great of a ball handler as people think. He doesn't really have any advanced ball handling skills, especially in crowded situations. His three-point shot is suspect. He's fast, but lacks a change of speed/pace and/or hesitation moves to get to the basket like a Rondo/Rose. He's also only fast with a running start. He's not as fast from a standstill position. He struggles shooting off of the dribble just like Rondo and he can only drive left. Force him right and he struggles.
John Wall doesn't lack a mid-range game at all. He actually is very solid from the mid-range and shows a nice shot with better mechanics than he does shooting spot-up shots. He needs more range and a better spot-up 3 point shot, but he's got a good mid-range game. He doesn't have a tight handle but he can get by because of his quickness and athleticism, similar to D.Wade. He'll be one of the fastest players in the NBA immediately and he'll be a good scorer. I think at best he's like D.Wade, but at worst he's like a taller Tony Parker. He's the best prospect in this draft.
Disagree with just about everything you said Tezo. he is right handed but he can absolutely drive right..he has a pull up jumper that he even goes to on the fast break or full speed stop and shoot on a dime(as seen in his first game where he hit a game winner). he is only fast with a running start? No way, he gets to the basket whenver he wants. Ebanks couldn't stay infront of him in the elite 8, Who actually stood in front of him this season? i just disagree with you, which I dont often
He improved his mid-range jumper as the season went along, but it's still not that effective to me. He can drive right, but when he does... He's not nearly as effective as he is going left. There's no way I can look it up, but I'd be willing to bet that he drives to his left 80% of the time. He's not nearly as comfortable driving right.
He's definitely not as fast/explosive from a standstill position. We saw him score most of his points last night just being a one man fast break.
I think it's safe to that I coined the phrase "John Wall is a little overrated." So shame on tezo and the rest of you clowns who slurped Wall until he took his first tournament loss.
P.S. John Wall needs another year of college.
thats god if hes between rondo and westbrook because both are stars and future stars. devin harris is another one that isnt bad. being compared to them is far froma insult. pg's dont tend to get awhole lot bigger so i dont agree with him eventually filling out like rose. and if he does dont you think that will effect his speeed?..rose has always been bigger then wall at the same stages of there basketball careerfrom jr year on from what ive seen. also cant agree with som who think wall is more explosive or a higher jumper
He beat Devin Ebanks off the dribble repeatedly, and even got by a tough defender in Mazulla alot in half-court. He is faster with a head-start, but who isn't? He has a great 1st step, no doubt about it. Bobody this year has been able to keep him from getting to the rim. His speed is not going to be questioned when projecting him for the NBA.
And he's had a solid mid-range game since High School. I was watching the Jordan Brand game and PJ Carlisemo said that his mid-range game was NBA caliber, and that was his senior year of high school.
Your nit picking...he will get past everyone in the NBA or at any level...Halfcourt, fastbreak,left, right it doesn't matter...Nobody can stay in front of him...His jumper is better than Rondo, Evans and Westbrook NOW and he has a better form than all of them including Rose....
at the same stage i think his jumoer is better then rose when rose was in college. i cant say its better then those in the nba because theres one big difference. wqll is shooting against college players and defenders while rosewestbrook, rondo is shooting against nba defenders. another thing is the games are longer and much more physical with the bumps and elbows which will take effect on a players jumper during the game. walls jump shot percentage seems to drop dramatically when he has a defender contesting it compared to being wide open on a pass or in a zone(most players jumper do)
im curious to see how he does..with jennings he has a quicker release and can get hot from three, rose and westbrook body can take more contact with there drives to the hole,rondo is preobably the one whos game he will resemble the most early in his career minues the good on ball defense
When John Hollinger debuted his new college PER this week, he revealed something statistical analysts who follow both the NCAA and the NBA have noticed for a while now: John Wall's statistics aren't all that great.
Looking at his stat line, there are a few obvious explanations for why Wall looks relatively weak by the numbers. Foremost among these is turnovers. While the proneness to miscues of Ohio State's superstar Evan Turner has drawn attention because of his tendency to pile them up in individual games (10 apiece in a loss to North Carolina at Madison Square Garden in the 2K Sports Classic and Saturday's overtime win over Illinois in the semifinals of the Big Ten Tournament), Wall has turned the ball over more frequently as a percentage of the possessions he has used--23.6 percent to Turner's 21.1 percent.
Second, Wall isn't yet an effective outside shooter. He's made just 31.3 percent of his three-point attempts and could stand to improve from the free throw line, where he attempts nearly seven shots a night but makes them at a 76.9 percent clip.
More surprising are a couple of areas where Wall's athleticism hasn't yet translated into results. Despite the ability to finish off the glass from a variety of improbable angles, Wall isn't yet great around the rim. That and poor shooting on long twos explains why Wall's two-point percentage of 50.5 percent is nothing spectacular. Wall also isn't the kind of presence on the glass you'd expect from a player with his size and explosiveness. He's grabbed 6.3 percent of all available rebounds, which is below average for a point guard.
Of course, Wall has his strengths by the numbers as well. His 33.9 assist rate is outstanding and ranks him 33rd in the nation, and Wall's ability to get to the free throw line on a regular basis has boosted his True Shooting Percentage. Naturally, the success enjoyed by the youthful Wildcats also speaks well to Wall's leadership from the point.
To better gauge Wall's NBA potential, let's compare him to a pair of obvious peers--his predecessors playing point guard for John Calipari, Derrick Rose and Tyreke Evans. The No. 1 overall pick, Rose won Rookie of the Year in 2008-09, and Evans seems well on his way to joining him. Here's how their NBA translations (which account for strength of schedule) looked compared to Wall entering the NCAA Tournament in a variety of key metrics.
Player Usg TS% Reb% Ast% TO% FTA% Win%
Wall .189 .472 .053 .075 .217 .111 .393
Rose .192 .476 .073 .067 .168 .112 .426
Evans .240 .446 .093 .056 .187 .091 .405
The similarity between the numbers posted by Wall and Rose is pretty remarkable. Rose was a better rebounder in college and turned the ball over less frequently, but Wall has demonstrated superior ability to set up his teammates, both in terms of assist numbers and the court vision he's flashed this season. Evans was a slightly different player--more of a go-to player on offense but less of a passer, befitting the debate over whether he is really a point guard or a shooting guard--but his overall performance was relatively similar to Wall's.
If there's one downside to Wall's statistics, I think it's that they fail to provide justification for the notion that he is a once-in-a-generation prospect. To rise to that level, he'd have had to significantly outplay Rose and Evans. But if those two players provide a template for Wall's future, it is a bright one indeed.
Way to copy and paste that article into that post. Mad props.
Quincey...this is hard for me to say but, I agree with you 100%
much easier to copy and paste the post then retype all of that
he won't be stopped 1 on 1. . . he has great court vision. . . some people look. . . well john wall sees it all. . . && you can't teach that. . . && yesterday (even in a loss) showed me that he's the best player in college basketball && the unanimous #1 pick. . . he will be special. . .
he's a gamer man. . big games are what he lives for . . he showed that in his 1st game against miami-ohio. . . he's done more in the clutch than rose,jennings,rondo,westbrook, or harris at any stage of their careers. . he will be better than jennings. . . he's a great point now. . but he could be an even better 0 guard (ala dwyane wade). . he can do anything on the court , as evidenced by his 19,9,5,4,1 stat line yesterday. . .
he's not afraid of anything. . . at the end of a big game rose seems too timid. . . wall's fearless. . . last year rose deferred to ben gordon. . . this year he hasn't been aggressive && shouldn't have made the all star team. . . .
rondo's good but won't ever be great in my opinion. . .
westbrook is a steve francis clone. . .
harris , to me , is only good. . .
wall has already mastered the knowing of when to take over. . . && he's only 19. . .
he WILL be GREAT!!!
P.S. am i the only one who (even yesterday when there was just 2 minutes left) always expects john wall to lead his team to victory. . .
&& now wall. . . thats the list of the guys whom I trust with two minutes left in a game (also down by double digits) to will their team to victory. . .
yeah you might be because i dont see it. and there have been other 19 year olds who lead there team to victory. some havent lead them to s many because there teams werent in the position where they have topull out a victory at the last minute. i like wall and hes gonna be good but i look at past guys who are gonna be great of have been great like a durant,shaq,duncan and he hasnt dominated in the manner they have
Everything you guys are listing as bad qualites about wall are fixable qualities. No jumpshot? He can fix that through pracice. He can practice a midrange game as well.
Wall is a great prospect and can tailor his game to the pros, the same way every single other point has to when coming to the league. He has a great combo of size and speed, something that can't be taught. I disagree that wall is slower than rose. Rose just changes speeds better.
While he relies alot on athleticism and speed now, you still see moments in every game where wall flashes a brilliant move like a nice eurostep to a finish through contact.
Bottom line: wall is very successful now in college. I believe that he will adapt to the league and use more moves from his arsenal to score out of necessity. He doesn't have to now though, so he doesn't in college
youre right he can correct all those things.. but it wont be corrected overnight for those who think hes gonna come in and take the leauge by storm. its gonna take him a minute to correct those things like it took jkidd,toney parker time
name some 19 year olds then. . . .
durant hasn't won anything. . .&& hasn't really proved himself in the clutch. . .
shaq's dominant but he can't play in a close game because he can't hit free throws && your offense has to be geared around him for him to be dominant.
duncan's the only one i agree with you on. . .
key words( some guys who are gonna be great) durant...and wall has won nothing either.. ..highschool he didnt, college he didnt. durant has proven clutch in the nba. wall..in college..very very very big difference. and its much easier to be clutch in college when youre team is in those situations alot. it doesnt mean a player who isnt in those situation as much isnt clutch. the uconn women have blwon out every team they face but that doesnt mean there all americans arent clutch. rather have a player whos so good that his team never has to be in clutch sitation because the player dominates so much
^ Melo won a title as a freshman..that guy is pretty clutch
kenny anderson lead his team to some victories
beasley lead his team to many victories
the list goes on and on.. there have been freshmen who have went to teams who weent that good and was the main reason those teams won games
And Tony...Rose has been extremely aggresive this year...have you actually watched him?
I noticing everyone is saying he can't shoot, didn't everyone say that about jennings?
Quincey...Kenny Anderson is my all-time favorite college basketball player ever. Augmon would be next.
what clutch thing has durant proved????? getting swatted by lebron???
big difference ! durant is 21 wall is 19. . . .
&& yes melo is clutch. . . . so clutch that last year was the first time that his team went beyong the first round of the plaay-offs during his career. . . . .
durant isn't that good. . . his teams have been in alot of situations like that but they couldn't win && he couldn't step up. . . he's a great player in the first three quarters , but he's just good in the fourth. . . && it'll be a minute before he's great. . .
rose hasn't been as aggressive as a superstar should be. . . .
&& i never said that a freshman ha never done it. . . i said that its impressive at how he did it so fast. . .
&& out of those freshman you named. . . durant , kidd , melo are the only ones that have come to the league && have made a significant impact. . .
youre comparing what durant has done int he nba to what wall has done in college?..makes no sense toney.. if anything you would have to compare what they did in college since wall is still in college. durant had lead texas to many wins and melop lead his team to a title.wall hasnt played a minute in the nba so how can you compare what hes done in college to what they have done in the nba?...and melo lead his team to the playoffs in year 1...that isnt clutch for a rookie picked int he top 3?...durant is second in scoring and is leading is team to the playoffs in year 2?...yeah none of those things are clutch at all or are as impressive as leading youre college team to a elite 8
Tony...you can only compare Wall with what players did their freshman year because he hasn't played in an NBA game so no one knows if he will be 'clutch'. Melo won a title and was as clutch as it gets at Syracuse.
Durant isn't that good?!
durant won player of the year in college. melo won a title.. i dont think wall is getting either
i may be wrong but isnt leading youre team to a title as a fresman more clutch then leading youre team to a elite 8?...same with being a consensus. player of the year ala durant
wall's also about to be the #1 pick. . . melo && durant have done neither .
durant's a t-mac clone. . . melo's a benard king clone. . . .
they're both great. . . i just don't see them winning a ring as a lead guy .