wall isnt a sure fire lock for number one
from what ive been reading there is a chance he could drop to number 2 if turner has a very very good tournament just like beasley was knocked from the top spot because of roses tournament. i doubt this happens because i dont see wall having a very bad tournament. but it seems to be agreed that hes not a lock along the lines of shaq,bron or duncan where each of those players could have had bad tournaments (lebron bad hs tournament) and still were locks for number one. another factor ive read is that if wall has a regular to good tournament and turner has a very good tournament turner could either go number one to a team that doesnt need a pg or the team would draft wall and then trade him to another team to get there pick and another player
because you can't be locked when there is the guy with 19/9/6 we should realize that Turner's season is the one in many years..but i'm still think Wall is #1 for sure.
yeah i still sya he goes number one but hes not a locklock the guys i named. one of those guys who are number one picks in almost any draft year
No way Wall isnt number 1!!! Unless he's injured and cant play for a few years..Turner is an allstar..But Wall is a future Hall of Famer..I heard a local radio sports jockey say some people in the Lakers organization were thinking of drafting Sidney Moncrief in 1979 ahead of Magic..Because they thought he would be more NBA ready than Magic..Moncrief was a great player and became an allstar..But who remembers him now?
yeah but wall is'nt a 6'9 pg. and isnt as sure of a thing as magic was. it can happen just like it did last year when beasley was the sure bet as the number one pick till later int he season and tournament time when rose helped lead his team to the title game. id still go with wall but hes not magic,duncan,shaq as far as would go number one no matter what happened
At the beginning of that season, Beasley or" Beastly" was tearing up the big 12. He was head and shoulders beyond the competition. You can make an arguement that Rose wasnt even the most important player on his team. At the end of games the ball went to CDR. But now he is looking more like B-easy than Beastly.
I posted a few weeks ago that a buddy of mine that plays for IU said he thought Turner would be the #1 pick. He said Wall was super fast and athletic, but that Turner had a complete all around game. He said a lot of people on the college scene thought Turner was the best player in college and would have a shot to go #1. I thought he was crazy, but recently I've been seeing more and more articles that are saying Wall isn't a lock and that Turner could be picked by some teams.
people are amazed with wall athlecism and speed..... he isnt even close to be complete pg and somebody was caling him a HOF..... WTF ?!?!?.... on the other side turner is having great season, on of the most versatile college players in last 20 years and he is truely a leader... kentucky can win without wall( they have 4 first rounders) while turner has impact on his team similar to impact that lebron or wade have in their teams.... I tryin to say that Turner can play right now in nba for any team, wall is project.... And i wouldnt call him a lock cause if turner lets say carry ohio to elite 8 its a 50/50....
i really cant see Wall slipping from the top...his ceiling is so much higher than Turner's, that any team taking Turner #1 would be making a huge gamble...the type of gamble that can get a lot of people fired...i think whoever picks first has to take Wall...Turner is a better player today no doubt, but Wall's potential trumps Turner's production i would think...btw, in the real world Magic was/is 6'6-6'7...dont know why NBA listings always bother me lol
i dont agree with the past 20years thing.there have been other guys putting up his season averages before so lets not get carried away. he is a very good player though. as far as the teams are concerned yea kentucky would win games without wall but that doesnt have anythign to do with turner being better that just shows how good his team is. ohio won some games without turner and if turner was on uk they could win some games if he got hurt
I could see teams picking Turner over Wall, but I could also see those same teams being mad at themselves if they do. That's not a knock on Turner, but I seriously think Wall has the upside to be one of the top 10 or so players in the NBA. Turner will be an All-Star player it seems, but Wall seems like a future Superstar. There is a difference, one that is relatively big.
And for as publicized as Wall's TO's are, Turner averages the same amount but with LESS assists while playing PG this year.
Can we stop the Wall is a Hall Of Famer talk?
Last time we compared a player to a hall of famer was uh....Greg Oden and DeShawn Stevenson
Let Wall get into the NBA first before we say he's a HOF.
Lol... Turner does average less assists, but not by THAT much of a difference. I mean, it's 6.2 to 5.8. That's not significant enough to make a legit point out of it.
You also have to add in the fact that Turner has to do more for his team to win, unlike Wall who has a better supporting cast. It's arguable that Cousins is more valuable to Kentucky than Wall.
I think Wall probably has more "upside" because of his size, speed and athleticism at the point guard position, but other than that... Turner is better at almost everything else it seems and he's NBA ready physically/mentally wise. John Wall is probably 6' 3" with shoes and less than 185 lbs. Turner really does remind me of Roy in the fact many people thought Roy had limited upside because he didn't play with extreme speed, athleticism, etc. Obviously they were wrong.
It's not that much of a difference in their turnovers, but Wall gets criticized alot for his TO's, so much so that people don't think he's a real PG. Turner has a worse assist-turnover ratio than Wall, but Wall is much more often criticized for being out of control.
John Wall is NBA ready physically and mentally as well. Turner is more NBA ready right now, but Wall will have the better career probably.
It's not arguable at all to anyone that watches a Kentucky game that John Wall is more valuable that DeMarcus Cousins. That's only arguable to those that read box scores instead of watching games.
i feel you ont he turnover thing. peopel get on wall's turnovers but turner's is worst. he damn near averages as many turnovers as he does assist which is one reason why i say he isnt a nba pg. at leats not a fully time one. as far as who has more value on the team. i think that depends on there match ups. wall has shown early in the season that when hes out of the games uk get worst. when cousins is out i havnt seen them look as bad so i guess id have to go with wall
6.2 assists to 4 turnovers
5.8 assists to 4 turnovers
That's not THAT big of a difference... If you say Turner averages damn near as many turnovers as he does assists, then you have to say that same thing about Wall... And he's actually a point guard. I'm not on Turner as much about his turnovers because I feel like his team relies on him more than any other player in college basketball. It's not like he's a lose cannon throwing bad or questionable passes. Everybody knows Turner won't be a point guard in the NBA, nor will he be relied upon to do as much.
i do say the same thing about wall. my point was no one ever brings that up with turner. they say how he racks up assist and triple double and one guy even said there hasnt been a guy like him in the past 20 years. but no one ever brings up his turnovers
I think Turner has the ball in his hands WAY more than Wall. He has to be more aggressive than Wall, which means he has to take more risks. That leads to turnovers, but if he's not aggressive... Then his team loses. He doesn't have the luxury of playing with a Cousins, etc. He's the most heavily relied upon player in college basketball.
I feel like Wall shouldn't be averaging that many turnovers when he has the supporting cast that he has. He actually projects to be a point guard in the NBA, so I think that's why he gets criticized more for his turnovers. Turner will play off the ball in the NBA.
I don't see Turner being a high turnover player at the next level. Especially when he has more talent surrounding him.
It's not that big a difference, but he does average more turnovers yet and still. That has to be recognized more than it is. John Wall hasn't been quite as turnover prone as Turner has but Wall is more criticized in this area. Plain and simple. And how can you say he's not a loose cannon or not throwing questionable passes? How can you average 4 TO's a game without doing any of that? He does all of that if you watch OSU play.
Turner does get criticized for his turnovers. That's listed as one of his weaknesses on most scouting websites. He doesn't get criticized as much as Wall because scouts realize he's the most heavily relied upon player in all of college baskeball. Everybody knows that. Kentucky doesn't rely on Wall as much as Ohio State does Turner, nor does Wall have the ball in his hands as much as Turner. Considering how often he has the ball in his hands, four turnovers isn't that bad lol. Wall on the other hand has no business averaging that many turnovers... It's because of poor decision making in the half court, hence the criticism. As a point guard, you have to be able to run an offense in the half court. It's not just about fastbreaking.
I don't think Turner will be a turnover prone player in the NBA. He'll play off the ball more and won't have to do as much.
The majority of Wall's turnovers come from flying down the court trying to force something in transition and over-penetrating, usually not from bad passes. Take it from a guy that has watched every minute of every UK game this season and has been taking notes on Wall all year.
i see u guys haven't been watching basketball that long...
also need to factor in the talent surrounded Wall compared to the talent to Turner's team.
turners turnovers arent just from his teammates. alot of them are from people taking it from him and alot of bad passes. and people keep talking about talentaround them and yes uk has more talent but ohio st is close to getting a number one seed so its not as far as some of ya'll try to make it seen. turner isnt the only pro potenial talent on his team