I know John Wall is amazing don't get me wrong. But there are some teams that need more than a PG. Here are the teams I feel could should not take John Wall if they get the 1st overall pick
New Jersey, Minnesota, Golden State, Utah, L.A. Clippers, New Orleans ( some close to the lotto) Milwaukee, Chicago.
New Jersey- Devin Harris isn't a terrible PG. He isn't that master passer teams need but NJ doesn't need that. People forget he was a all star.
Golden State: Monta Ellis is dropping a 24-4-5 at age 24 and Stephen Curry
Utah- Deron Williams
LA Clippers- Unless Baron Davis is moveable ( most likely not)
New Orleans- Chris Paul and Darren Collinson
Milaukee and Chicago- Jennings and Rose
I'm not saying these teams won't take John Wall but I'm saying if they have that number one pick- there are other options including trading that pick.
unless he gets hurt or something like that their is no reason Wall shouldn't get taken first overall. You can go ahead and trade him if you like your point guard better but, even though he has had a bad month and a half, nobody should go over him.
i see youre point..i think some of those teams will look to trade the pick if they get it and try to find more players plus another draft pick. if the players isnt a shaq,lebron,duncan,durant then he is tradeable. players liek that are hard to come by. its alot easier to get a player like john wall then those guys so he is tradeable for the right price
I don't know.
I'll use Golden State as a example.
You draft John Wall number 1. Wouldn't that diminish the value of Stephen Curry and Monta Ellis is you try to trade them? Like, last year. Minnesota took Rubio was drafted after Flynn. Rubio's people wanted to be traded and made it public. Flynn's people also said Flynn wanted to be traded but not to the tone of Rubio.
If say Wall, Ellis and Curry are on the same team- who's sitting on the bench? who's playing the 2? who's getting traded?
Wolves can trade Sessions, Rubio or Flynn easily, they are far from being indispensable.
Clippers can trade Davis too
Ellis or Curry can play as 2-guards.
For the others you mentioned it will be a tough choice indeed.
My thing about trading him:
What's the value for someone who is believed to changed a franchise?
2 1st round picks?
Flynn is fitting into the offense well and Rubio is being called the best PG not in the NBA ( I seen the guy play- he's improving)
Who's taking Baron Davis' contract during a time where teams are looking to shed salary?
I think that if the following teams get Wall he would be traded:
Chicago- Derrick Rose
Milwaukee- Brandon Jennings
Utah- Deron Williams
New Orleans- Chris Paul
New Jersey- Devin Harris
I think if Golden State grabbed Wall you trade Monta Ellis that's a tough one but Monta is a head case(Hung Over at pre-draft workouts, riding on a mo-ped, saying he couldn't play with Steph Curry publicly etc.)
The reason why I would keep Devin Harris if I was running the Nets, he has already proven he can be an all-star if he puts his mind to it, Wall is good and has potential to be better than Harris, but Harris has already PROVED his worth in the NBA.
i agree qhaynes... yeah they could trade those other guys but they will not get equal value for them because you pretty much never get equal value and teams know you want to get rid of them so they know youre desperate. why go through all that when you can pick a guy who is very good and fits a need. unless that draft pick is a shaq,bron,duncan type
Can't you play both Wall and Harris at the same time? Cause I may be wrong but didn't Harris play off the ball sometimes while in Dallas? They are both tall enough and quick enough to guard a 1 and 2 so I don't see any reason on why not to play them at the same time.
But if you decide to keep only one, since Harris is already a proven All-Star PG wouldn't his trade value be pretty solid? then a team would know what their getting in return instead of a hit or miss prospect in Wall(not saying hes gonna be a bust but theres always that small chance) and may get better in return for Harris?
I think if Wall proves his worth early on in his NBA career, they can trade Harris for a solid big man to back up Yi and/or Brook.
prettyt much you can put anyone int he back court. the question is can they beat a top team int he plaoffs with the backcourt. can they guard a top 2guard in the playoffs where its alot more half court then full court which doesnt play to there strong points
I'm not saying wall is not going to be a good pro or even an all star level player at some point in his career, but lets not just start trading and getting rid of accomplished players before he has even logged 1 NBA minute. Honestly, I really feel at this point Evan Turner gives you as much value at that #1 pick as John Wall. This guy just continues to show me things with each game since his soph year began that he has what it takes to be an elite, go-to wing at the next level. And he still has a considerable amount of potential left, just like Wall, he may be only "scratching the surface" of what he may become. If I'm one of those teams that Qhaynes mentions such as a Utah or a New Orleans (especially New Orleans) I take Turner to fill that wing position. The only thing Turner will have to adjust to at the next level is playing without the ball, something I think he'll become accustomed to has he grows. This is no fault of his own as he's asked to be the everything in the Ohio State offense. But either way, my point is, Wall and Turner are the top two picks that go in the draft. It will be interesting to see what Sacto does if they get the #1 pick. Do they show faith in Tyreke to be their lead guard, and take Turner to fill the void on the wing left by the trading of K-Mart. Or do they go with Wall, on try to move Tyreke to his more natural 2 position, even though he showed since he was at Memphis he's not too good w/o the ball in his hands. This will be a good draft!
The clippers might be the best team as far as players go for Wall. He could play next to a very good young SG in Gordon and an intriguing young frontcourt with Griffin and Jordan. I also think a veteran like tayshaun Prince would fit perfect in the middle of that lineup.
i don't think evan turner gives you near as much value as wall. wall is far more explosive and plays a position where there is not much depth in this and next year's draft. i think evan turner's game doesn't translate as well to the nba as wall's at his natural position. turner practically plays everything for osu, making himself a stat collector. i don't see that happening in the nba. i don't think he will be handling the ball as much in the nba so he'll have to improve on his 24% 3 point shooting. he won't be driving past everyone in the nba without a consistent jumper.
wall is a can't miss. i think any team that passes on him would be crazy, especially when you are talking about adding depth to one of the most important positions in basketball.
Everyone ask a similar question in 1984 when the Rockets got the 1st pick and chosed Olajuwon..People were wondering would they trade the pick or trade Sampson? Who they had just drafted the year before..Several teams made some outstanding offers..The Lakers offered Worthy.The Pacers offered Stipanovich,draft picks and another player..New Jersey offered anyone on their roster except Buck Williams..Portland offered its number 2 pick and Drexler..lol..But The Rockets keep both players and 2 years later they were in the Finals..If your an organization is lucky enuff to get the 1st overall pick..You select the best player regardless of position..then later see if trades are needed
Both Wall and Harris should be able to defend the 1 and 2 positions so to me they can play together and also Harris has played without the ball sometimes in Dallas so it should not be that big of a deal considering he is not getting paid the max and he is not a big ego guy. If New Orleans got number one they would trade Collison and keep Wall. You can play Wall sometimes together with Paul and maybe if Wall improves trade Paul. I am a New Orleans Hornets fan and knows Paul will never ask to be traded but it may have to happen because i want Paul to win a ring and it may be hard for him to do it in New Orleans.
i would not wish that curse on wall( going to the clippers)
the value of a franchise changing player
wall- 2 first rounds 3 second rounds && a decent veteran
lebron- nothing but if push comes to shove. . . . all your picks for he next 7 years plus a good player (ex: amare stoudemire) && a veteran (jerry stackhouse) && rookie (taj gibson)
kobe- nothing but if push comes to shove. . . . 4 first round picks 2 second rounders veteran && a young talent (andre iguodala)
i agree with him. everything he said is right. draft wall and plan on playing him and if a team offers you something you are comfortable with you take the deal and if not you have a stud pg and a young athlete that can play the 1 or 2. the first pick this year is win win. wall has so much hype and can be so good.
I agree with scoutguru for the most part (if Sac gets the #1 pick, its Wall). If a team with a legit point guard has the number #1 pick Evan Turner is a great pick. He's a winner, a complete player and his jumpshot is at least as good as Wall's. I see Turner as more can't miss, as he's already extremely polished, has maybe the top IQ in college, a great ball handler, he's just got everything you look for in a 2 guard, a position that has less depth in terms of top flight pure 2 guards. Theres a lot of undersized 2's in the NBA that Turner can take advantage off.
Lol, shows what you think of Tyreke as a playmaking pg. And yes I agree with the point you make about their shots being comparable. And as everyone says in the nba, "shooting is the easiest thing to teach" once someone gets to the next level. Heck, if Richard Jefferson could learn to knock down shots perimeter shots with some sort of regularity, anyone can.
Both Turner and Wall would not fit well with Tyreke Evans. They need somebody who can use Reke's skill to help them become a better player. Despite the attitude question marks, DeMarcus Cousins would be fit nicely. Wesley Johnson is a player that would make Reke better, as well.
If they end up with a top 2 pick, they should trade down. Add some more depth.
The worst team NEVER gets the 1st pick. lol look it up. I would pick Wall No Matter What. Even if you dont plan on keeping him, he is an asset.
Cleveland got it in 2003. I think they were the worst team in the NBA.
Lately teams who had the 3-6th best chance to get number 1 got it.
PG- 48 minutes/game
SG- 48 minutes/game
That's 96 minutes. If you're telling me that 3 guys can't share 96 minutes... (32 minutes/gm) than maybe you have the wrong players.
as for golden state, don nelson wouldn't have any problem playing Wall, Curry, and Ellis at the same time.
im sure don nelson wouldnt mind it. but if you are looking to win a title you wont go with that line up. in the playoffs that line up gets ate up in the slow down half court playoffs
badger I was going to write something about your math but you were too quick. HA
Anyway, it really is moot. You know Ellis is going to miss more than half the season due to injuries and suspensions.
im an accounting TA and our first exam is tomorrow so my brain is moving a little slowly, butidont! even when i was doing it, 88 minutes seemed like too little!
i kind of disagree that wall, ellis and curry couldn't win a title. first of all, wall could still grow. I grew an inch or two at 21.
second, can you imagine trying to guard Curry, Ellis and Wall? i understand that they may have difficulty guarding, but i'm not convinced wall won;t be able to stick with many of the 3s in todays game.
lol....yeah he could still grow but the chances of that happening is slim and none. its alot easy guarding those guys in the playoffs and half court. i wonder how fast those guys would be running when banging with lebron or artest at the 3 the whole game?..im pretty sure theres a reason a lineup like that has never won a title or even gotten close to a title. none of them could check anythree even a back up one. you dont win titles but just outscoring teams ( ask phx) you need to be able to d up teams. id liek to see one of them trying to guard kobe,bron,melo,durant in the playoffs. alot harder for those small guys to have to drive past them then go through another big man at the rim even with a clear out compared to denver,lakers,atlanta,orlando clearing out for the post. the team would have to double team that which leaves billups,kobe,or a average gguard who can knock down the 3
that line up may work in nba live or 2k though
If you were referring to the height of an Ellis, Wall, Curry backcourt -- Detroit had a Thomas, Dumars, Vinnie Johnson backcourt and won two championships.
Of course the Warriors are too stupid to ever win a championship. The entire organization. Stupid.
i may be wrong but didnt vinny come off the bench?..and thomas was a good defender and one of the best pg ever and dumars was a strong guad who was a very good defender. ellis defense is kinda bad to say the least
I think he meant bringing one of the three off the bench. He said there are 96 minutes in the backcourt (with 32 minutes for each), so I believe it was implied that they would run a three man rotation in the backcourt.
a small line up could probably work with a rotation but it would have to be like that pistons team and all would probably have to be hall of famers or real close to it plus the other players on the team would have to be good and have a specific role liek rodman rick mahorn, lambeer. it would take alot of different specific type players. wouldnt be as easy as just throwing those 3 together. would also take unselfish ness and better defense so far all ellis pretty much does is score and shot. he doesnt seem or too interested n defense up to this point in his carer. ormaybe he just cant play it, i dont know for sure. but that line up is nice to fantasize about. not to mention plays are bigger stronger now adays and small fowards are bigger and stronger
If you do not want Wall on your team (which is reaaaly unlikely) you better draft him and then trade the pick down a bit + get some valuable pieces
quincey, do u have any basis for saying ellis is an awful defender? i remember reading an article earlier this year praising him for his defense. i think it might have been on truehoop...
I mean.... Roy is too tall for him to guard, right?
from watching people score on him alot.. thats what i base it on
read that article ^
dont need to read it i go by what i see. youre more then welcome to think hes a good defender. imma stick with what i see and what i see is a bad defender
lol..because i dont agree with you im a idiot...lol..thanks i appreciate the name calling if that makes u feel better
you can take my points to if you want..i dont mind.. heres 2 posts so you can take 2 of them
the idiot comment was in response to your refusing to look at evidence. i couldn't care less if you disagree, but at least have something to BASE your disagreement on... otherwise, u look dumb.
ahhaha i dont waste time with points.
which evidence should i go by...watching the game or what someone wrote?....ill stick to what i see. just like the stats someone put that a couple guys not named lebron or wade were better scores then kobe
you should probably just stick to watching the game, relying on your expert knowledge/perception. that's gotten you pretty far in life, huh? LOL. half-kidding. but seriously, whats the point of discussing if you're so set in your opinion and not willing to consider other opinions/evidence?
i consider other options if it doesnt deal with me actually seeing. anyone who has seen my post knows that withme seeing is believeing. numbers arent gonna chance what i see. you can give me articles about the sky being black but if i look out side and se its blue im going with blue. its different if we are talking about shooting. if i think one guy is a better shooter then another but stats show that they arent then ill take a look at that. but if watch a player play a bunch of times and see who ever hes guarding scores on him alot then im gonna say hes not a good defender
what if he was saving his energy because he had to use it all on offense? wouldn't evidence that he HAS been a good defender when he's put his mind to it indicate he CAN be a good defender? against BRoy, a bigger guard, no less?