The more footage I see of jordan, the more I believe no player will ever achieve the greatness and playing level of his airness. When I see jordan dunk on people, it's with the intention that he knew he could do it and nothing would stop him...absolutely nothing. Jordan's post skills...defensively or offensively...and never took a break on either side and was good from year 1 to the end..... his athletic ability to overpower and outrun other players or get around them.....his ability to get inside your mind and pretty much tell you...oh yes...it's happening, this shot will go through and you can't do $hit about it. Jordan's leadership, his clutch, his great team chemistry and drive to always get better.....his inspiring of teamates to never take a play off and to always get better....truly...mj will be the best and on his own level for a long time.
By fan favorite of course, the next best SG is kobe. Although kobe has outstanding talent, drive to get better and a hatred of losing....he lacks many skills jordan used since year one. Many will hate this paragraph in particular due to the fact of love for the man, but kobe can not amount to jordan's level of play. Kobe can get all the rings he wants, get 30,000+ points and still never reach jordan's level. It's debatable that kobe NEEDED shaq for the rings, but the truth is great players do need great teamates to win rings. Kobe did not lead the lakers during 99-02...shaq did. The game was changed for shaq....the rules were differen't for him.... he dominated EVERYBODY...and he reminded us that fact almost everyday that he was the man of steel and unstoppable. I also have watched every finals kobe has played in, and I was very disappointed about 07-08. Injured lakers team? yes. Tough defense from boston? yes. Poor execution from the lakers? absolutely. Kobe should not have let the lakers give up that 24 point lead in a finals...and then lose by 38 as the stay alive or go home game. Jordan never allowed that to happen no matter what happend...when he got to the finals, business was business...and he prevailed.
The next best SG is wade. Wade's game is almost a mold of jordan's. Thing is, wade's body can't handle it and it has shown signs for the last 4 years. He played through muscle pain and strains in 08-09 and deserved mvp for taking a mere 3 games off...and put up shy jordan numbers while leading his previous year 15 win team back to the playoffs, game 7, against a very talented hawks team. Wade's major success was in 2006, when he himself lead the heat to beat the mavericks 4 straight...when they were down 0-2. That is a man and a leader right there...a man who looks at struggle and being in a bad position as an opportunity to show how great he is. I can't say that Wade is better than kobe, both have had amazing careers.... but by popularity of kobe, I would be ran out of this site if I said I liked Wade more and that he was a better player. What he has over kobe is defense....in the post, on the fast break for a block, 1 on 1,....even though kobe got that lucky shot off on him.... Wade also has the better leadership skills with the right players. Right now, he's looked lazy because all year long he has been unhappy with a young team that's struggled, he wants better players around him so he can put his serious game back on.
I'm going out with a limb right here, you give Wade one of the best powerfowards in the game, a young talented center, and a defensive sf, and then a player like odom off the best...and he would beat the lakers in 7. Uh oh...I went there.
I first thought to myself this topic was going to be like wow obviously no need to argue this, but you backed this up with some great points about each player. I would love to see Wade in a Knicks uni, I think the Knicks could draft a young center, possibly do a sign and trade for Chris Bosh with David Lee and have Wilson Chandler as that defensive SF with Gallo playing the two. I am being extremely bias, but I am allowed to dream, right??
thank you knicksfan.
I started a thread about a proposition for the Knicks and someone mentioned the Knicks going after Rudy Gay, I know you have been outspoken about the Grizzlies keeping Gay. Though, say the grizz don't wan tot give the money Gay wants. How would you feel if a sign and trade was done Gay for Chandler, straight up?? Maybe some1 else, but no draft picks.
if i don't see rudy gay in a grizzlies uniform next year, I may very well give up my love for the grizzlies and go where ever wade goes. Wade has been my favorite player since 03, and the grizzlies have been my favorite team since vancouver days.
I don't think I'd be happy with that trade lol.
With the amazing talented core...if i just see heisly let that go, it's going to be too damaging and disrespectful to fans.
D-Grizzly, well said. I don't think Heisly is in any position to try something new what he has going is great. He should continue to have his personnel expand in the draft. And his main focus should be Rudy Gay then a PG, sorry I am not a huge Mike Conley fan.
where is everybody? I want a lot of feedback on this one.....
Well there is a great bracket buster game on espn2. As well as plenty of nba games, but that is no excuse for lack of feedback.
I think Jordan is the goat, no question. KObe is trying to catch up, and that will probably never happen regardless of what he does. But i do think it is quite close in terms of how good they both were.
As for playing with shaq, yes that was shaq's team. But Jordan would have been option number 2 alongside a prime Shaq. Even Tex Winter who coached both jordan and kobe and is conseiderd the guy to invent the triangle said that jordan would have never put up 30 a game or been the main man if he played with a prime shaq. Nobody was stopping shaq and it makes no sense to run an offense through any wing guy who has ever played this game when you could just dump it down low and get easy buckets.
Also, having watched much of Jordan's career and the league throughout the 90's, i truly believe the game has evolved quite a bit. Jordan would still be every bit as good in todays game, but his competiiton would be much closer today. Think about wing players like kobe, wade, and lebron. All of those guys can do a lot of things jordan did. But who were the best wings jordan played against in his career? Dumars, Richmond, Starks, Majerle, Mullin. Drexler was probably the best wing not named jordan. I think the competition is tougher and more creative and more athletic today, a lot of which was inspired by jordan and his complete all aorund game inspiring the younger generation.
I think Kobes attitude kinda hurt his legacy....what happened when they played Boston was totally unexcusable...and i think you can honestly have a arguement and say Kobe is better then Jordan if Kobe had better leadership skills and he didnt give up on his players the way he did when they played Boston...and it hurts for me to say this stuff cuz he is my fav player and he is more dear to me then Jordan...but i think talents wise they are not far off...one thing about Kobe is you have to admit is that if you take one part of his game away he will come back with another...if you break his right hand he will shoot with his left....and he is always adding things to his game...
and about the shaq comment wat do you think would happen if jordan had shaq they would win more titles of course bout i bet shaq would have the same amount of final mvp awards as shaq and jordans touches would be alot fewer..
I agree about Kobe's attitude because Jordan never had a bad attitude towards the game. Though, what you're saying about Kobe changing his game no matter what if he were to break his right hand and would shoot with his left, I don't see that much than if the same happened to Jordan. I think what amazes me most about Jordan is how well of a defender he was it doesn't get mentioned b/c he was such a great offensive player.
jordan came to unc running a 4.6 in the 40 yard dash && when he left he was running a 4.3 . . . . . .
NOBODY works AS hard AS JORDAN !!!!
all of what you said is true. But the thing is, jordan dominated opposing defenders at each position.... countless times. He's dunked on the big's back in the 90's...he dominated the wings, and hardly anyone could really defend him period.
Mr. Jordan could post up 7 foot men and still find a way to get it in.
I do agree about the evolution of the game, that is spot on.
I have a hard time agreeing with anyone that jordan wouldn't be able to put up 30ppg even with a prime shaq.
I would take a prime jordan over prime shaq anyday.....anyday....
I am from Chicago and grew up watching Jordan and later Wade at Marquette. I don't think that you are going to get an arguement about Jordan being the best and never duplicated.
For me, Wade is my favorite player to watch. He plays such a physical game, more so than LeBron or Kobe. He lacks their size but goes non-stop on both ends of the floor every game, he has paid for it though with his injuries. And when Wade takes over
a game, it's usually done in unbelievable fashion. Hopefully he is doing this ^ for the Bulls next year!
i absolutely love wade's game....... it's fearless and krazy.... my fav player too man...
if you guys get a chance, type up wade vs 5.....or wade dominates chicago.
Wade may very be the best penetrating player in the league when it comes to double or triple teams....
jordan will go down as the best ever and i would not put shaq next to jordan on the career level. But did you watch SHaq between 1999 and 2002? Dude was not only big, but he was quick. You had to double him and flop and foul and beg for help. The last minutes of a close game, jordan would have had the ball and took the last shots just like kobe did when he played with shaq, but for the first 44 minutes, you would go to shaq and run your offense through him i don't care who was on his team. That's why i argue with people when they hold it over kobe that he was option number 2 on those teams. I seriously can't think of one player to ever play this game that would have been option number 1 over shaq during that brief period of time.
perez i understand where you are coming from, and unfortunately we could never see it to be proven.
But with jordan's style and leadership...i find it hard to think he would be a 2nd option....see kobe wasd held back early in his career...jordan had no leash and never needed one.
Has never even been as good as Allen Iverson when iverson was in is prime. Kobe was better and still is beeter then iverson
oh no...you didn't go there...
I BELIEVE MICHAEL JORDAN IS BETTER THEN KOBE BUT NOT BY FAR. BUT YOU CAN'T EVEN SAY SOMEBODY IS BETTER THEN JORDAN UNTIL THEY HAVE WON AT LEAST 6 RINGS. MICHAEL JORDAN WON 3 CHAMPIONSHIPS LEFT THE GAME AND THEN CAME BACK AND WON 3 MORE. KOBE BRYANT WAS MORE SKILLED THEN JORDAN. I BELIEVE KOBE HAD MORE OF A SKILL SET BUT JORDAN WAS MORE ATHLETIC AND HAD MORE OF A WILL TO WIN.
Wade needs more rings to prove it, but I feel every much as good as KB. Neither is better than Jordan. Sometimes I actually forget KB is in the game, and that never happened when I watched mike.
I stand by wat i said...the only thing that stands in kobes way from being the best player nba in history is leadership and a strong will and to not give up.....his skill set in jordan skill set is almost same..jordan is better defensively ill give you that but kobe can also play defense...offensely there the same so plz dont say jordan is better...both have devasting post game...both are clutch...both have devasting mid range...
kobe has shown he can win a title with out shaq and shaq showed he can win without kobe. as far as there titles. they needed each other. it wasnt shaq who won the title for the team and it wasnt kobe it was both of them. as far as wade, at his best i believe he is up there. he has that fire and can dominate. i wouldnt put him up there with kobe because he lacks the post game kobe has and the consistant jumper. as far as kobe and jordan i believe kobe can get to his level with winning a couple of titles although some people will never admit it. its clear they are set in there mind when they have there mind made up even though kobe still has 4-6 very very good years left. thats why i agree with some of the guys who played against jordan and who played in the nba who say if kobe continues to win and dominate then he will be up there with mj. most fans will never put him up there no matter what he does because of there love for jordan. jordan is still my fav player but i can always have a unbiased opinion and know kobe can get to that level