You just can't go on with your debate as if I didn't put in a picture of Chewbacca sexually harrassing Princess Leia...
Acknowledge the wookie....
i can see both points but i cant say hes degressed. when you are playing less minutes it can sometimes make it seem like you have degressed since if you dont play well it can make you look very bad but it can also make you look very good or even great if you play well. a player tends to look better when they play more minutes but worst when they play less mibnues. not in all cases but in most
Lucas has a better Ast/TO ratio than any guard on the team except for Balbay. Talk about crazy turnovers & not many assists...you got the wrong person...better look at J Brown.
Lucas has played more effeciently at Texas. All you have to do is look at the #'s. He is shooting better %'s from the field & 3 point line at Texas than he did at Florida, his Ast/TO ratio is better at Texas than it was at Florida, he is scoring more points per minute at Texas than he did at Florida..............Liking him at Florida but not at Texas makes absolutely zero sense.
Coach Rick Barnes isn't doing a very good job coaching this team at the moment.
to be honest i cant blame the coahc. i think hes doing a good job. i think its the players. too many times the coach gets all the blame but they arent the ones missing easy shots or letting a guy drive right pass tghem. some of the players just arent stepping up like they were earlier in the season and one of them is pittman. and although i like jordan and think he has worlds of potential i dont think ive ever seen a guy who looks to shoot every single time he touchs the ball
"Coach Rick Barnes isn't doing a very good job coaching this team at the moment."
-Yea....Jai Lucas is the game-breaker. Excuse me. No.
"Lucas has a better Ast/TO ratio than any guard on the team except for Balbay. "
-Whoopdy-doo, there are only 3 PG's on the team since Mason has played the wing this whole season except for the 4 games Varez Ward was playing in before his injury.
Lucas' stats are better than when he played at Florida because he plays such a limited amount of minutes compared to then. I could find plenty of examples besides the Gray Johnson one I used a minute ago as to why you can have skewed stats when you have a small sample of something.
if we are gonna go by what he does at limited minutes at the point then shoulsdnt bledsoe fall under the same standards?..as well as dexter strickland and peyton silvia?...i mention those because they also dont play alot of minutes at the pg position
All 3 of them are more productive than Jai Lucas has been this season
i agree some have been but if we use the stats with jai we have to do it with both and bledsoes stats say he's not close to being a good pg( his ast to turnover ratio is horrible) as well as dexter and his below average numbers. to be honest none are worth talking about as far as being point guards
Your right, I don't think any of them are polish enough or productive enough to be anything more than a college player right now. All of them need to work on their games before being pro players. Bledsoe and Avery Bradley are in about the same boat to me. Neither is ready for the NBA, and they need to show the ability to play PG. Bledsoe would probably declare for the draft (for better or worse) if Brandon Knight signed with Kentucky though, whereas Bradley comes off as someone that knows he needs to return. But who knows for sure?
i agree although to me bradley is better then bledsoe. some say well its because he has wall and thats why he doesnt play better but that same arguement could be made for why he does play as well as he does since teams are too worried about stopping the other 3. i think most would have bradley over bledsoe also by looking at a coupel of mock drafts. i do think both need to come back to college. bradley has shown hes a better sg then bledsoe but both need to prove they can be a nba pg. both have the potential to do so though
It's a draw for me between who's better to me. Bradley is more efficient, but Bledsoe is more explosive and he seems to have more upside to me. But it's really about prefernce to me, they both bring the same exact things to the table.
Nothing to support your opinion.....pretty bad
I give facts
People give excuses
I'm not hearing it
Never said Lucas was a game breaker. Do I think he deserves more minutes? Yes. I've already given the reasons why. Just my opinion, its cool if people disagree.
Do I think Coach Barnes is doing a poor job? Yes. No chemistry. He has too many players playing the wrong amount of minutes. Just my opinion, its cool if other people think he is doing a good job. I would like to hear the reason why you think that though.
Out of all the Texas guards do I think Lucas is the best shooter on the team? Yes (the #'s support that). That is a fact.
Iggy don't back peddle.... You said Lucas shoots better than all the other Texas guards because he takes less shots. That simply isn't true. He shot higher %'s than all of them throughout his entire college career. There is no denying that. IT is a fact. Look at the #'s thoughout all the players' careers. We are talking about 100's of shots. The small sample size argument doesn't come into play here.
On to the next point Iggy you said he was effective at Florida but terrible at Texas. That makes absolutely 0 sense. I'm sorry but you are way off base. I've already given you the #'s. It is a fact..there is no way you can say Lucas was effective at Florida but terrible at Texas hahahahha what a joke. Go Look at the #'s...it is pretty obvious.
The reason he played more at Florida is because Florida wasn't a top 25 team. Texas is a top 15 team with tons of depth. That Florida team wasn't nearly as good as this Texas team. That Florida team went to the NIT.
bradley brings better defense while being taller and being the higher leaper. he's shown hes a better scorer against better comp( compare each player in big games)
Tons of depth?? Texas has Balbay and J'Covan Brown.....Florida had Nick Calathes and Walter Hodge. Florida backcourt> Texas' backcourt. So all that "Texas is number 15 and Florida went to the NIT" crap is irrrelevant.
If he could get as much PT as he did with an NBA draft pick in Calathes and an above average college guard like Hodge, why hasn't he gotten any other the time with a weaker backcourt at Texas? He's regressed in some way, because there is no way that if he was as solid a player as he was with Florida, he'd be struggling to even see 10 mpg playing in the weaker backcourt at Texas.
I stated that he's a better shooter than Texas' guards, which I know he is (even though I think Brown is at least just as good, but not statistically, so I included him too). I just think that his 3 point percentages are skewed because he has a small sample size. Not that I think he's a worse shooter than Balbay or Mason or Brown. I have a hard time believing that he's a 50% shooter if he took the same amount of shots or even close to the amount he did at Florida.
I mean, it's fairly obvious that Lucas is ineffective in game situations for the most part, if you watch Texas play. I don't think you would say he deserves PT if you've watched him play this season as much as I have. He has played at least decent in only 1 game I've seen this season, and that was against UConn. The rest have been terrible. I've seen Texas play about 10 times this year too, at least. I think you should watch him play more and look past reading his stats to see if he is really a better player than his other backcourt mates.
I've watched Texas a ton this year. I also watched nearly every Florida game (I'm a Florida fan) the year Lucas played for them as well as watching him in person. Overall he is basically the same player as he was at Florida (even though the stats support he is more effecient now).
Lucas played off the ball some at Florida. He transfered because. Calathes was the PG & Lucas wanted to be the main PG. Walter Hodge isn't a PG.
If you are going to count Walter Hodge than you have to count Mason & Bradley.
Texas has a better team than Florida did...that is a fact. Texas had more depth...that is a fact.
I'm done with this nonsense.
Now if you are a 5-11 guard...what team are you going to have a harder time finding playing time for?....
Team A- top 15 team, with 4 guards....Bradley, Brown, Balbay, Mason
Team B- not even a top 35 team, with 2 guards...Calathes, Hodge
Pretty obvious why Lucas played more at Florida.
its clear that this texas team is better more talented then that florida team
If you thought he is terrilbe now at Texas than you have to say he was terrible at Florida as well.
His stats at Florida:
30 minutes, 8.5 points, 1.7 rebounds, 2.3 assists, 1.6 TO, 1.4 A/T ratio, .5 steal, 0 blocks, 46% FG, 71% FT, 43% 3 point
His stats at Texas:
10.8 minutes, 3.6 points, .5 rebound, 1.7 assists, .9 TO, 1.92 A/T ratio, .1 steal, .1 block, 47.5% FG, 71% FT, 50% 3 point
Easy, he's worse now because he plays about 3 times less minutes, and averages less ppg, assists, rebs, stls. None of Texas' guards are anywhere near as good as Walter Hodge or Nick Calathes, and Lucas played more with them. Quality over quantity. If your really that good and haven't taken some sort of step back, I would think that he would be able to play alot of minutes for Texas at the PG spot, when it's their weakest spot on the team by far. Especially playing guard for a team with an NBA player at the same spot.
It doesn't matter if Texas has more PG if all of them aren't real good, or if Texas had a better team than Florida. Yes, Texas' team is better but there backcourt isn't. So the fact that he is playing far less is troubling in some way or another.
We are talking about that 2007-2008 Florida team.
Walter Hodge was a Junior. Nick Calathes was a Freshman. Hodge never got drafted. Calathes was a mid 2nd round pick after his Soph. year.
Look at the Texas backcourt now... Avery Bradley is a Freshman. J'Covan Brown is a Freshman. Dogus Balbay is a Jr. Justin Mason is a Senior.
Bradley will get drafted higher than Calathes did & it probably isn't close.
Texas backcourt > Florida backcourt
Once again it is easy to see why Lucas played more at Florida.
Iggy- you are clueless about PER... You really don't know how to look at #'s. Your logic explaining how Lucas was effective at Florida but terrible at Texas is extremely flawed & quite frankly humorous.
You honestly think Texas would be a better team IF you replaced Balbay, Mason, Bradley, & Brown with a Freshman Nick Calathes & a Junior Walter Hodge? No Way
he has worst stats but you cant say hes a worst player. if wall went to kansas instead of kentucky im sure ghis stats would go down right now but that wouldnt mean he is a worst player. i think youre looking at texas pg position more as who scores then anything else. balby plays the minutes he plays because he is a very very good defender. i can tell you are just looking at how he is on offense. then you have jacovn brown who is bigger and a better offensive player then lucas is. nick is better but you have to remeber they also played him together with jai alot. you cant play balbay and jai together
i forgot that nick was a freshman..
If his stats went down dramatically...am I missing something. PER is something I really don't care to learn anyway. I'd much rather watch a game than look at stats of what a player can do if he played 48 minutes and all that kind of unreal stuff. Maybe if I wanted to be a Fantasy Basketball guru or something I'd try to figure that out.
The laughable thing is that you keep bringing up stats and not bringing up that when Lucas steps on the floor in real life, he is not an effective player for Texas. I really am convinced you haven't watched Lucas play much if at all for Texas, because he's done nothing at all for him to justify him playing more than any of the Texas guards he's currently behind. And that's what it all comes down to....PER or not to PER.
but if youre minutes go down dramatically then doesnt it make sense for youre stats to go down dramatically? i dont think anyone can put up the same stats when they go from 30min a game to 10 min a game. come on now. lucas isnt a great or very good player so of course he's not gonna be able to put up great numbers in limited minutes. most players cant but the ones who are real good or great can still put up solid numbers with limited time. i agree i dont see any reason to play him more. that doesnt mean hes gotten worst or is a bad player. are you sure you never go by per? it seems we have had discussion where you have said a player or 2 would do better if they were given more time. i do think one was dexter strickland
Saying that Strickland needed more time had nothing to do with PER, it had to do with me thinking Larry Drew wasn't a very good starting PG. I said Strickland was a better natural scorer than Larry Drew, but you and Gatorheels said that Drew's stats said otherwise. I said what I said without looking at stats, that was you 2 saying that his stats didn't go with what I was saying.
i remeber you mentioning per though when talking about strickland. think you said if he had more minute sor campared it to larry or something like that. at any rate i put stricklnad in the same boat with lucas and that boats name is "irrelavent " because thats what both players are in the grad scheme of things right now. lucas being even less since hes older. i dont even know why ya'll are even arguing about a 3rd string pg. i could see if he was a freshman or had nba talent
I have literally NEVER even typed the word "PER" until this topic for as long as I've had an account on here. I don't even know how it works. I did say that if given Drew's minutes, Strickland would average more points. But I didn't say he has a higher PER or whatever.
thats all per is... what a player might average if they play more minutes. you didnt have to say per its the same thing
Looks like it involves other things besides just points.
yeaqh it involves other stats but its still per when you mention some ones points if they got more time. its pretty simple
Going from effective to terrible is a really dumb thing to say. I have a hard time believing Lucas is terrible now after working on his game a year & a half since his days at Florida. Players don't just all of a sudden go from effective to terrible at this age.
I've already said why he plays less now than he did at Florida...everybody can see that. So obviously his stats will be down.
So with your logic since Lucas scores 3.9 less points, 1.2 less rebounds, .6 less assist, .4 less steal while playing 20 less minutes he is no longer an effective player but he is terrible. Think about that.
Plus if you are going to use that logic than you forgot to mention that Lucas is shooting a higher FG% now, higher 3 point % now, less turnovers, more blocks, & a higher A/TO ratio than he did at Florida...Hello
His stats show that he is more EFFECTIVE/EFFICIENT now at TEXAS than at FLORIDA...that is a FACT. Get over it
Lucas plays for a MUCH BETTER team now, that has MUCH MORE DEPTH in the backcourt, & overall is a more TALENTED backcourt.
Who cares if he only plays 10 minutes a game as long as he is effective. He has been effective. I think a lot of teams would like a guard to come in the game & have a really high A/TO ratio & shoot great %'s. Out of the 5 guards Texas plays (Lucas, Balbay, Brown, Bradley, Mason)...Lucas has the 2nd highest A/TO ratio, the highest FG%, the highest 3 point %, 2nd highest free throw %.
One of the reasons Texas is struggling is because J'Covan Brown has a terrible A/TO ratio for a small guard. And he is shooting terrible. Shooting 38% FG & 28% 3 point while shooting as many shots as he is, is Not helping the team.
Another reason Texas is struggling is because BOGUS..I mean Dogus Balbay is not a threat to shoot at all. Teams can just sag off of him on defense because he can't shoot. It is basically like Texas is playing 4 on 5 when he is in the game. He can't score. Lucas can & would score more than Balbay (Lucas proved at Florida he could score more than 4 points a game like Balbay is scoring now) . Lucas would make the defense play honest.
You win games by being effecient.
Iggy- Don't take this personal man. It really isn't that serious. You know I respect your opinion. I give you credit when credit is due. I'm just trying to get you to look at things from a different angle...maybe you will learn something. That is what we are all here for.
You are probably the best person on this site as far as predicting the winner of games. You also talked about Wesley Witherspoon before anybody else. He is starting to climb up draft boards. Memphis is going to be scary good next season ha. You've been right about a lot of prospects.
I'm not taking it personal at all lol. I'm just going by what I see when Lucas plays for Texas as opposed to how he plays now. I haven't seen anything about him at all this season where he deserves an increase in PT. I'm not big on looking up stats unless a player is really playing outstanding and I want to see how he's doing. He is a better shooter than Texas' other guards for sure, no doubt, but I don't think he's been a better player than any of those guys this season. That's just me. But I don't really care that much either. I like Lucas, but he's not doing very well to me this season. I didn't think anybody did lol, but hey, to each its own I guess.