more melo and lebron debate
not saying hes better but lebrons not on another level the east doesnt have the players or teams like the west. its easy to make it through the playoffs people say lebrons teammates suck they won the most games last year they would look alot better if lebron quit trying to play everybodys position hes doing too much. and yeah lebron will shoot a high % that doesnt mean he can shoot derrick rose shoot 49% and we know he cant shoot. like i said if you watch the olympics lebron struggled to score cuz u can sit big men in the paint thats why wade and melo killed people even in the world championship melo killed everybody. and neither is a great defender they are willing defenders cuz they will guard good players. people say lebron is a great defender cuz he blocks shots from behind that doesnt make you a great defender he doesnt shut people down that why delonte had to guard turk in the playoffs last year and he didnt guard rashard either he guarded the point guard and got lit up by skip. nike is making him into a basketball god hes a good play with great strength and athletics. i think in the long run melo will be better cuz he can do so much more on offense and he plays hard on defense may not shut you down but he competes he score way easier than lebron and passes just as well but he lets his point guard do the passing unlike lebron. mo williams assist go down every year playing with lebron ot hes not a great passer he just has the ball all the time. everytime lebron has played a great team in the playoffs he gets beat and storm off the court. all im saying is melo does his job and does it as good as any player in the league he scores and rebounds he doesnt try to play everybodys position and get 8 assist a night and make his point guard a spot up shooter. yeah lebron has all around stats but none of his teammates have great numbers cuz lebron wants to do everything and hes not effective without the ball in his hands. keep taking my points im telling it how i see it if you watch the games hes either scoring on a big man or a small guard off the pick and roll. i bet lebron wont come play in the west teams in the west have great young talent and cap space but hes not thinking about that cuz he would not be able to compete.
world championship stats
I seriously can't read that wall of text. No caps, no commas, no paragraphs, just... I'm sorry.
As for the debate, it isn't really a debate yet. Carmelo has no doubt elevated his game, but I feel the fact that Lebron is so much more versatile. He's a better defender (sorry, based on last year, Lebron's team defense was as good as its ever been.) He's a better passer, (while I agree that Carmelo's court vision is underrated, Lebron is a top 5 passer in the league. He just needs to score more for his Cavs than Melo does for his Nuggets. By the end of the year this may have changed.) And he has an inferior cast. Billups > Williams, JR Smith > West, Martin>Varejao, Nene=Shaq. Lebron is the reigning MVP and I believe Carmelo will make a run at it, but there are four other players that are trying to do the same thing with better resumes. He still has to pass Wade, Howard, Paul, and possibly Kobe (short and long term) to get to that status. But if Melo continues to round out his game, we could have a fun rivalry for a decade with Wade, Lebron, and Carmelo all taken in the same draft, all emerging as superstars.
but who cares if your sf doesnt get alot of assist melo is not a ball stopper and he plays just as good defense as lebron. lebrons teamates arent that bad they just dont get a chance to do much because lebron does so much if he toned it down some they would be alot better team. melo changed his game alot for the team people like lebron so much they feel nobody is close to him. i think wade is the second best player in the league behind kobe. melo and lebron have diff games tho
I seem to remember six weeks ago I said Melo would lead the NBA in scoring and that he was the best pure scorer in the NBA!!! Where are those people who disagreed with me. I know it's only 4 games in, but that's all I have to go by!
Here's Melo....30, 41, 42 and 25 (he didn't play the fourth quarter of this game.) I'm back.
Dhamp2...the greatest basketball mind in the world. Next to Hubie Brown anyway.
First off, both Melo and 'bron are great players with completely different skill sets. Melo is a PURE scorer absolutely deadly from all ranges and able to score with strengh and finesse. Slightly deficient defensively but improving, he will never be an elite level defender. His passing and overall vision of the way the game develops is strong and he knows how to make the correct basketball play at the correct time. A good teammate who generally plays with a positive upbeat attitude but has demonstrated some notable maturity issues off the court which ultimately led to some unsavory situations. Melo has played with a far superior set of teammates and this fact is undeniable, led by Chauncey Billups (Nuggets true court leader) the cast surrounding Melo is as talented and deep as any unit in either conference, the full complement of scorers role players defenders and coaching has allowed Melo to use his skill set to flourish in a system tailor made for his offensive talents (George Karl: Reliance on pg dominance, and forward scoring).
With respect to LeBron, the athleticism is off the charts. 'Bron has proven to be an effective scorer inside, off the dribble and from the deep perimeter. He has worked to assimilate mid range abilities into his game as evidenced by the variety of back down jump hooks he has thrown up in this short season. He has grown from being right hand dominant into a far more ambidextrous skill set. often finishing at the rim with a soft touch off glass with the left hand. Though he possesses the ability to finesse plays he usually displays aggression when attacking the rim, and plays with a noticable reliance on athleticism often taking players best 'shot' and finishing through severe contact. 'Bron has demonstrated a willingness to work on his defense, he is not yet the NBA's elite defender due to his amiable nature. He has all of the tools to surpass his peers in this area, yet he lacks a level of nastiness and malicious intent required of the great defenders. Still due to his sheer physical dominance and uncanny timing he proves to be a superior defender, more so than Melo. As a teammate Lebron may be on a level of his own, his teamates seem to take great pleasure in playing with him, on the bench he cheers his mates on and off the court he displays the tact and empathy required of a team captain and with a level of maturity that belies his youth. Intangibles is where LeBron really displays an advantage, he displays that rare quality to actually see plays developing before they occur, his intuition is almost unmatched, especially for a player his size. The fact that there is a debate as to whether or not he should get minutes at pg is incredible. His teammates while improving are still learning to win as is their leader. The east is drastically underrated and this will be evident from the rapidly improving teams on the horizon. This will be Bron's first year playing with an all star (late stage) and Shaq is one of the more difficult game styles and personalities to assimilate in a team concept. Finally with regard to coaching and style of play, Lebron has a skill set that is obviously suited to a more uptempo approach, his coach is offensively deficient and the front office displayed a complete lack of ability to acquire a wing finisher/scorer who can play off the ball and allow Bron to do his Big O thing and distribute to an athletic finisher.
In essence LeBron is the superior player at this point in my opinion with Melo making a significant surge, with consistent development both players should be at the forefront of the NBA for years, as their height may offer a degree of longevity which may be elusive for DWADE (my 2nd favorite player), we as hoop fans should continue the friendly debate, and enjoy the show.
It's Not Even Close, Melo Only Scores...If Melo Gets 37 Points, The Rest Of His Stats Most Times Are 4 Rebs And 1 Assist, Where Lebron Scores 50 And Can Still Get 11 Assist 10 Boards Dude's Just More Complete Than Melo
i agree thar melo is the best score in the league but uuuuummmm it's only been a week and J.R Smith is coming back soon so, maybe you should wait before you go bragging
how is there defense the same when bron is a first team all defense and melo isnt even on the all defensive team?....and lebron a ball stopper??..lol..no you getting him confused with melo..melo gets the ball and the ball is going towards the rim....lebron will kill you with a pass for a basket or a shot...so which sounds like a ball stopper..the definition is the ball stops moving meansing a shot happens after the person gets the ball
Melo is a better scorer and shooter than Lebron but he will need to add much more to his game to be on the same level as Lebron but I will say that they are probably a lot closer now than most people think and also Melo is doing it in the West.
i do agree with that...i dont think he will ever be the all aroun dplayer that lebron is though( the rebounding and the passing because passers like that have had it for awhile..its liek that it factor..you either have it or you dont..jason kidd and magic johson also have it)
melo lets his point guard get assist and he scores and rebounds lebron wants to do everything mo williams isnt a great passer but he is alot better than 4 assist a game especially playing with lebron. he is just as good a player as lebron they are just different i would take melo cuz he does what a sf is suppose to do and thats it whereas lebron wants to do everything when you tone it down you become a better teammate and win more lebron just needs to let his teammates play their position and he plays his. lebron was only on first team defense because of the chase down blocks he doesnt shut people down he doesnt even gaud the good wings in the magic series he guarded alston instead of either of the two 6'10 players that killed his team. melo can play with good wing players cuz he is great with or without the ball lebron could never play with good wing players cuz he dominates the ball he can only play with shooters thats why he won win a ring until he tones his game down basketball is a team game and when your teammates are watching what you're doing you will never win a championship. does anybody realize how much better chauncy is playing with melo? and jr smith was having a great year b4 they got iverson him and melo were killing people he just got back to his old ways when he got anther true point(had andre miller). melo doesnt get credit for making players around him better
meloe lets point guard do it because its not in his game to get assist..never has been..was at townson hs in baltimore..wasnt at oakhill wasnt at syracuse and hasnt been since hes been in the nba....not sure if you knwo but what a player is suppossed to do at a certain position isnt defined in a lil box..no coach says" hey sf youre not suppossed to get assists and find players under the basket and put them in a great position to score or tell pg..you arent suppossed to block shots cuz youre a pg)...if they went by youre logic..point guards are just suppossed to pass and not score..sg are suppossed to just shoot big men rebound and block. magic johnson wasnt suppossed to get assists because he was so tall..oscar robinson wasnt suppossed to rebound or get assists either..jason kidd isnt suppossed to do that stuff and lamar odem shouldnt be bringing the ball down court...how is melo great without the ball?..what does he do great when he doesnt have the ball to score??..inorder to be great without the ball dont you have to do other things?...chauncy was great before he played with melo..the man won a title and was a allstar and all nba player before comming to denver..where have you been..did you even watch the playoffs..lebron guarded lewis and hedo ...go watch the game you just making up stuff now..everything you keep saying about teammates watching what you doing goes more towards melo..what do players do when a player is a scorer but not that great of a passer?..watch what the player is doing.....no one EVER says lebron is a ball stopper or that players just sit and watch ..STOP MAKING UP STUFF if lebron was that type of player why is he constantly compared to magic and oscar 2 players known for being unselfish. he also being talked about as being unselfish..even his own peers( nba players) say hes so unselfish....man can you come up with just a lil rpoof instead of just tryna pass off youre opinion as fact
i watched them get killed by the magic west guarded turk, mo williams guarded pietrus or lee, lebron guarded alston yeah he guarded them sometimes but not most of the game u must didnt watch that series yeah chauncy was good but hes playing alot better now than b4. yeah lebron gets assist but his point guards dont thats a problem his wing players dont get a chance to create anything they just sit around and wait to shoot 3s. melo not know as a great passer but averages 3 a game for his career and thats great because his point guards always run the offense and averge 8 assist nobody will ever average 8 assist playing with lebron. they are different players but melo has always been a good passer just a better scorer. hes good without the ball because he can shoot and post up
so one series defines lebron to you?...wow..what about tevor arza giving buckets to melo? because he was getting buckets and kobe giving buckets to him
Trust me, I understand how good Carmelo is. I would love for him to become a free agent in 2011 and join the Knicks if they do or don't sign Lebron. I have been calling him for years the best pure scorer in the league. Five years ago I called him a future 30 point scorer. His defense on Kobe during the playoffs was exemplary, and always thought his rebounding, especially offensive, passing, and ball handling were underrated. He has a rediculously high basketball IQ and a nearly unmatched repertoire of moves. TRUST ME. I understand how good Carmelo is, from one Cuse alum to another.
However, Lebron James is arguably the best basketball player in the game. His midrange jump shot is underrated, as is his overall skill level. With his strength and the elevation he gets on his jump shot, he actually has 30+ feet range. The consistency isn't there, but he can make threes from ten feet behind the arc look effortless. If he ever gains thats consistency, he will be literally unguardable. No-one holds Wade's athleticism against him, or Kobe, or any other player but Shaq, but he's so good because he combines his ridiculous size and speed with an excellent feel for the game. Lebron will make at least 4 passes a game that make me feel like he can lead the league in assists, but only 1 or 2 will actually be made by his teammates. To carry the team he had to the number of wins they did last year was extremely impressive. And while Lebron loves to play matador defense, you have to admit he's one of the most effective in breaking up plays, where they be an attempted shot or lazy pass, he will make you pay with a fast break or block. Not to mention he's already unstopable on the break, he's dominant in so many scenarios that Lebron, for now, is the better player.
Edit: What really seals the deal for me is seeing how much worse the Cavs are on both ends of the court when Lebron is off the court. They take forever to get a contested shot and get their bodies in front of opponents, but rarely stop them. Lebron, again plays good team defense, roaming and looking to jump the passing lanes or help on blocks. You rarely see him seal off on man, with or without the ball, like say Battier or Bowen, but theres no denying how effective he can be.
I won't explain all the things Lebron is better at than Melo, but I will say that he's a better defender than Melo. Melo defended better than he ever had in the past last year, but he's not the defender Lebron is, even off the ball. I can't remember a weakside block or a trailing block that Melo has made, while Lebron does that all the time. So he's a better off-ball defender, and even though Lebron is an overrated defender to me (him being a runner-up for the Defensive Player of the Year was a joke to me...like comedy) he's a better than decent on ball defender and is better than Melo is to me.
Lebron can't shoot.
He's a athlete.
Lebron can't shoot.
He's a athlete.
bigbusiness got them negatives for telling em like it is. Lebron does have a great B ball IQ. When I saw him play in highschool it stood out before his athleticsm. Dude is a sometime type shooter who shoots the 3 too much. He should work on his mid range jumper til he can't take it anymore. Shoot the three on occasion. I want Melo shooting at the end of the Game. Lebron is a beast though.
I was honestly surprised by LeBron's lacking 2006 stats, but I than I realized that 2007 was the stat line I remembered. Check out LeBron's percentages and all-around game. Melo still scores, but LeBron is just a beast. To me their is no doubt who is a better player, regardless of how many points per game Melo averaged on a 2006 World Championship team that cracked bronze.
The Olympic team stats were also in favor of LeBron, although I think Dwyane Wade was just ridiculous, and I am not saying that just because he led the team in scoring. Whoever watched that Olympics just saw Dwyane Wade be amazing. Kobe was the best player on the team in general, but Dwyane Wade was the MVP of that 2008 US Olympic team. LeBron and Melo both killed it, but to me LeBron was much better at this point in time. Melo has a great game for international ball, but LeBron is just a better player.
I Get Negatives Because They Won't Hop Off His Nuts.
Yes Lebron Is Very Good.
I'm Just Saying It's Mostly Because He's A Freak Athlete Rather Than His Skills Unlike Kobe, Jordan, Wade, etc.
Lebron is a better overall player on defense, passing, rebounding.
Carmello is a better shooter and scorer.
Lebron hasn't had a decent pg maybe ever on the Cavs he's played with Delonte West, Gibson, Jones, Snow, McInnis, Ollie, Mo Williams none are close to top 10 in the league or were ever.
Carmello has played with Andre Miller, Iverson and now Billups all guys who were talents and their numbers proved it asts wise at least. So he's ask less to do running the offense.
Carmello has improved his defense, seems more focused seems like he matured but he's not on Lebron's level yet. Just look at the resume of work MVP and took his team to a Finals, Conf. Finals and Game 7 of 2 East Conf. Semis. Carmello helped his team to the WCF last year now has to at least get his team back there.
Btw running down plays and blocking them isn't only using your freakish athletic abilityits not giving up on plays too. Your saying it like Lebron uses his athletic ability mainly he has a decent jumper, he can pass and do everything else almost as well as anyone else too.
I don't see how guys like Wade and Kobe don't use their athleticism to cross over guys esp. Wade.
If the Cavs ever got a legit pg, you'd see Lebron goin back door and coming off screen and in the post a lot. He's score a lot easier than always driving into the lane against the other teams big men.
Cavs just make the game too hard and its not like they have great shooters or great big men either.
Shaq clearly isn't the same Center he was a few years ago when he helped the Heat win a title.
As a Knicks fan I wish they'd land either of these guys but if you had to choose you pick Lebron thats not a knock on Carmello is the best SF in the West & might be the best player in the West once Kobe drops off.
this isnt a chat about kobe and lebron its about melo and lebron..just because you state the obviou doesnt mean someone is on a players nuts...are you on kobes nuts since you said hes better then lebron?...starting to think you might swing the other way because thats the second time u bring up a gay reference...very interesting...people kill me when they say..well he only does this because of freak of nature or bigger then every one else...biggest cop out
But back to the point.
Lebron is the best athlete in the world..not the best player.
And ya'll need to get off the gas just a little.
two bmore guys went at it with melo giving gay a smooth 42pts and gay responding with 18...more good guys from my area repin maryland/dc