share

Portland do-over?

Russell0Westbrook
Russell0Westbrook's picture
Registered User
Joined: 10/11/2009
Posts: 686
Points: 339
Offline
Portland do-over?

Why is it all the gm's said they would take oden over durant? Yes oden was decent in college but he never dominated how he was suppose to. He didn't even average 10 reb a game! Durant totally dominated everybody he faced and averaged more rebounds than oden the only thing oden did more than durant was block shots and that was close. Don't talk about oden taking ohio state to the championship. Durant had three 6 foot guards(abrams, augastin, and mason) with. Damion james as there lineup with a horrible bench. He didn't have half the team oden had he was willing that team to victories. That team was put together after hurricane katrina whereas the buckeyes conley, oden, and cook had been playing together since 8th grade (great chemistry). Oden is a decent player but is far from dominant and we don't know if he will ever be but durant on the other hand we knew he would dominate even with his frame. Just saying durant is a player that on a good team he can put them on his back and win a championship but oden will be a good player on a good team but he can't single handedly dominate a series like durant.put durant with roy and aldridge and they would be competing for a championship NOW! Prysbilla could be their starting center and it would be no problem. Just think about them changing teams and think of what people would say of portland. Prysbilla plays better d and rebounds better than oden he also plays under control. I know oden is young but my point is durant is flat out dominating NOW. Nobody would want to face that team in a series cuz durant is beating teams now without a lot of talent so imagine him on a team with talent that can compete. We have been watching this guy since college playing undermanned and he has been putting thede teams on his back. When will hw get his due respect. The bad part about it he may be the best pure shooter in the league on top of all his talents. Portland should have taken the SURE thing cuz he a top player now oden may be good later but he's nothing close to what durant is. As good as oden is getting durant is getting stronger and better also and he's only 2 inches shorter than oden


JJ7
JJ7's picture
Registered User
Joined: 06/11/2009
Posts: 27
Points: 13
Offline
Oden

I think you forget Oden led Ohio State to the championship game playing one handed and in that championship game he was awesome the rest of the team let him down. Remember he dominated Horford and Noah to other lottery picks as well. U mite have a valid point but give Oden one more year.

llperez
llperez's picture
Registered User
Joined: 04/13/2009
Posts: 12017
Points: 12121
Offline
I had the blazers taking

I had the blazers taking oden at that time, and I'm guessing most people would admit they did too. Durant is the way to go in hindsight, but a domminant big is far harder to find then a great scoring wing player. Oden might never be better then KD, but he is far from a bust at this point. If he can give 16pts, 11 rebs and 2-3 blcks, he will have a huge impact for that team.

NYK2010
Registered User
Joined: 05/09/2009
Posts: 2462
Points: 1498
Offline
most had Blazers taking Oden but

How does dominating Noah make you a # 1 pick. Its a lot easier for him to dominate the college game look at his competition. In the NBA how many Centers was he better than? The injury excuse won't hold after this year, taking the sure pick most of the time will help your team.

Another example Knicks past on Brook Lopez and Anthony Randolph for Danilo Galinari in 2008 draft, now we hear Walsh wanted Randolph but D'antoni pushed for Galinari. Either guy Randolph or Lopez could've been their big man for the next 10 years and both have All Star potential. Another case the Pistons pass on Carmello Anthony to draft Darko Milicic, yeah they won a title but that was despite Darko and in the long run Carmello's dominant offense was probably the missing piece to multiple titles. The Knicks took Fedric Weiss over Ron Artest obviously that hasn't worked out for them, again passing on a sure thing granted he was expected to be this good but he's from St. John's and a local kid they should've had enough info. on the guy.

Portland will probably be okay not drafting Durant becaz they have a superstar to be in Roy but they've made this mistake before. Drafting Sam Bowie over Michael Jordan, imagine Drexler & MJ on the same team and yeah they both were versatile enough to play SG & SF. If not imagine what they could've gotten back in a trade for either of them.

IndianaBasketball
IndianaBasketball's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/09/2009
Posts: 12826
Points: 24564
Offline
I had the opportunity to

I had the opportunity to watch Oden during his entire high school career at Lawrence North High School. Let me say this clearly... I've never EVER seen another player who's been as dominant as him. I've seen A LOT of players, big men especially (during high school, various tournaments, AAU, from Indiana and other states), but NONE like him.

Though there are MANY, there's this one play that stands out in my mind about Oden. They were playing North Central High School (Eric Gordon was a sophomore at the time). Conley got a steal and was leading the fastbreak for LN. I think it was a four on three fastbreak. Oden was the last player trailing behind Conley. Conley passed the ball to Oden, who was running FULL speed, slightly behind the free-throw line. Oden, running full speed, caught the ball (It wasn't a very good pass, so the ball bobbled at first, but then he grabbed it like he had sticky paper on his hands), took the perfect steps in stride, took off from behind the dotted line and dunked it two handed with power. I promise... It was the most amazing play I'd ever seen. I could NOT believe my eyes. The whole crowd just dropped their mouths. I said right at that moment that he had to be a NBA player/first pick. First off, you just don't see young players his size.... Second off, you just don't see young players his size that can do that... Run, jump or have feet and hands like that. Have that kind of coordination. It was amazing. I could go on and on about this dude. I wanted to hate him, but I couldn't lol. He was simply just too good. I remember saying, "If he ever learns real post moves or how to face up, God help his opponents." I haven't even talked about his defensive abilitiy and IQ. I haven't even talked about how he's always been a winner and will do WHATEVER it takes. I haven't talked about how unselfish he is. It wasn't a coincidence Ohio State went to the title game during his freshman year. Dude is the real deal.

It's just too early. It's too early to say that Portland should've taken Durant. He'll never be a scorer like Durant, because that's just not his game. Both players play two different positions and have two completely different mentalities.

NYK2010
Registered User
Joined: 05/09/2009
Posts: 2462
Points: 1498
Offline
Good story

Thats high school and this is the pros now night and day difference. All that greatness you described about Oden we haven't seen much of in the NBA. If he dominates on Defense with Rebs and shotblocking anywhere near Mutumbo ppl will say it was worth the pick. However if he stays the course and only improves slightly it'll be known as a missed chance at a star player. I agree he has great potential with his speed and size. A lot of ppl say he tried to bulk up and be like Shaq if so that was a big mistake.

Dtay2152
Dtay2152's picture
Registered User
Joined: 08/14/2009
Posts: 218
Points: 62
Offline
he was picked ahead of

he was picked ahead of durrant because he has a chance to be a dominant center. he has dropped 15 pounds and has spent alot of time on conditioning all summer. he has been working on a left and right hook shot and already has a surprisingly soft face up jumper. i dont know if youv watched oden, but even last year with him being top heavy and in poor shap he was phisically imposing and mixed it up in the paint. he is a really good rebounder! this is year number 2 after micro surgery and everyone says it takes 2 years to get it back. look at amare he came back and is one of the most bouncy bigs in the league. non of portlands pre season games have been telivised (laaaaaame)but i was listening to the denver game on the radio the other night and i was going nuts listening to the 5 minute stretch before he fouled out(i know) where he grabbed like 5 boards scored 12 points and 2 blocks. it was crazy listening to it on the radio where it seemed like he just took over and put it to the birdman, nene and kmart. and all 3 of those guys are pretty intimidating and intense. and erlier in the preseason he blocked a shot a shot against jason thompson odens wrist was at the top of the square. he sent the thing flying. he will never be the scorer that durrant is already but he is quick and is getting athleticism back and has a chance to still be one of the dominant young centers in the west along with bynum. most of his baskets this season will come off of putbacks because he is probably going to be the 3rd or 4th option behind roy aldridge maybe miller and even fernandez if mcmillan has lost his damn mind and brings oden off the bench. even with very few plays being run for him i think oden can average 14 points just on putbacks and freethrows. he went 6 for 6 in the denver game. and he gets fouled ALOT. to be safe ill say 10 boards a game but he could also go nuts and rip down even 13. swats i think he could knock down 2 or 3 a game. i just hope he can stay healthy i want to see what he can do when he has a chance to focus on his game without the stress and worry of thinking about if his body can take it. per

Diggler
Registered User
Joined: 07/07/2009
Posts: 22
Points: 16
Offline
If I have this right, you're

If I have this right, you're saying that Durant dominates games and can win without much assistance, but...

Seattle posted it's worst record in franchise history in Durant's first year. Just to be clear, that means the worst in more than 40 years. Last year, OKC had a 23 win season. That's still 8 wins worse than before Durant came to town.
If Durant is so dominant, why has his team lost 75% of their games since he joined?

I don't think Durant is bad, but his high scoring has alot to do with being on a bad team. If he played in Portland, his numbers would be lower. Oden, on the other hand, hasn't really shown what he can do yet. Maybe he does turn into a bust. Or maybe his talent starts to show now. This year we should finally see what he's capable of. My prediction is that after this season, no one in Portland's front office is going to be losing any sleep over picking Oden.

Russell0Westbrook
Russell0Westbrook's picture
Registered User
Joined: 10/11/2009
Posts: 686
Points: 339
Offline
Durant will be a HALL OF

Durant will be a HALL OF FAME player while were hoping oden can average 16/10. Why wait for somebody to develop when you could have somebody step in now and produce with the best at his position. People kill me talking about how oden will become dominant he was never dominant he has good size and athletism thats it! Low bball IQ (fouls 2 much) and horrible offensive hame and dont ell me he is you cuz bynum was 17 when he put a move on shaq and dunked on him, of course it was 1 play but we saw he had low post game and a bright future! I don't see oden going toe to toe with any of the good centers for a whole game cuz he has NO low post and he fouls 2 much he's been doin it since college. While durant can go toe to toe shot for shot with ANY wing player in the league now he may not stop to many people but he wont get stopped either. He is a BETTER player now and he will continue to get better like oden. Some you guys still think darko will be good cuz of his measurements. Oden looks like every other young center in the league that doesn't mean they will all dominate. We know durant can dominate game what we are still wondering about oden. Durant is losing cuz they r rebuilding but that doesnt mean he isn't talented the bulls were also losers when jordan first got there and we know how that turned out he dominated in losses been when the talent around him came together he was unbeatable in a series! Another plus about durant is is almost at the top of the league as hitting game winner or game tying shots and he's only 21. If you can imagine oden getting better just imagine durant with strength he will be the toughest player to guard with his skill set and athletism.

IndianaBasketball
IndianaBasketball's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/09/2009
Posts: 12826
Points: 24564
Offline
NYK2010... I don't care if

NYK2010... I don't care if it's high school, college, the NBA or the moon... You just don't see players who can do that. We haven't seen a lot of it in the NBA yet, but he's been dominant at times. I watched almost every Portland game last season and Oden showed dominance at times. He really hasn't had the opportunity to show what he can do on a consistent basis because of the freak injuries (He was NEVER injured in high school). Last year was basically his rookie season and he was trying to come back from microfracture surgery. That's not easy, not to mention he had to work himself back into game shape, etc. He also went through the regular growing pains of a rookie and confidence issues. I think this season, he'll start to put some of people's doubts to rest. He's 100% healthy and confident. Oden is a different kind of player. He has a different kind of mentality and a different kind of game. He really is almost Bill Russell like, because you just can't judge him by his statistics alone. You have to judge him by his overall impact. He's going to have some HUGE games, but you can't always judge him based on his statistics. He just wins though. A lot of people just don't understand his game. Watch him closely this season.

Diggler... Perfect post.

Beanz816... In only 16 posts, you've proven to be the biggest player hater on this site. Durant is a special scorer, but ask yourself this... What has he EVER won other than individual awards? Read what Diggler said. Since Durant was drafted to Seattle/Oklahoma City, the team hasn't won anything. They may be more exciting, but they're no better now than they were (wins/loss wise) before he got there. Other than scoring, tell me how else he dominates a game? Tell me how else Durant even impacts a game other than his scoring.

"The Bulls were also losers when Jordan first got there..." Let me educate your little ass on something. The Bulls were 27-55 before Jordan was drafted. When the Bulls drafted Jordan, he led them to a 38-44 record and to the PLAYOFFS his rookie season. Jordan led the Bulls to the playoffs every year he played. So I don't want to hear all those excuses you're making for Durant. If he was as dominant as you say, his team would be a lot better. You sound real hypocritical. Making excuses for Durant being a loser, but not giving Oden ANY credit for the fact he's won his whole entire career.

Like I said... It's too early. This is only year three for the 2007 draft class. Oden missed year one and was working himself back during year two. Let's have this conversation again at the conclusion of year three.

Russell0Westbrook
Russell0Westbrook's picture
Registered User
Joined: 10/11/2009
Posts: 686
Points: 339
Offline
oden is not some great

oden is not some great winner everybody wins in highschool and he didnt win anything in college. and for sure aint the reason portland is winning and people are talking about them prizbilla helps that team more than oden if you acually watch the games. they would be the same with or without oden! and the celtics were losers with pierce b4 garnett and allen so is he not good and a loser also

The lake show2
The lake show2's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/26/2009
Posts: 6717
Points: 1248
Offline
tezo83...i dont doubt that

tezo83...i dont doubt that you have never ever seen a player dominate as much as oden but that has more to do with you seeing most of his games and none of the games of some other former allamerican centers...alonzo morning was a straight monster as well as othello harrington( 30 plus points and 25 reb a game) even though he never panned out...as far as other players that dominate you must not have seen alot of guys play because there are a couple who just destroyed people when they were matched up against them..i watched stephon marbury,chris jackson,glendon alexander,jerry stackhous,kenny anderson,felepi lopez and of course lebron just dominated any and everyone who was put in front of them as well as played against some who dominated ( luke recker from youre state gave my team the busniess at all american camps and aau. another one from youre state damon baily also dominated in hs. i would have picked durant first but some of that might be because im a lil biased that hes from my hoem state but mostly because i think hes gonna have the betyter career...now thats no slight on oden because i think he will be a allstar player in his own right

Russell0Westbrook
Russell0Westbrook's picture
Registered User
Joined: 10/11/2009
Posts: 686
Points: 339
Offline
im not saying oden is a bad

im not saying oden is a bad player but look at both players now they a the same age except on is way more advanced oden isn.t the 1 either sorry. durant is a top play at his position and he and oden are the same age. the excuses people make for oden are being made for DARKO he never dominated anywhere except those 9 foot goals at 24hr fitness! we dont know what oden will be but if neither player gets any better anybody would take durant. also who has durant played with to win? dont label him a loser cuz who he plays with and his coaches. dont forget kg was in the lottery b4 boston and so was ray allen and rashard lewis coming from durants same team b4 him and look at them im just saying put him on the blazers and alot of gms might argue they are the best in the league. what is oden's unique talent somebody please tell me cuz thabeet is tall and can block shots and hack too also no offensive game except hustle point and people are saying he's a bust in which he just picked the game up?

Russell0Westbrook
Russell0Westbrook's picture
Registered User
Joined: 10/11/2009
Posts: 686
Points: 339
Offline
oden is not some great

oden is not some great winner everybody wins in highschool and he didnt win anything in college. and for sure aint the reason portland is winning and people are talking about them prizbilla helps that team more than oden if you acually watch the games. they would be the same with or without oden!

Briguy
Registered User
Joined: 05/13/2009
Posts: 66
Points: 44
Offline
sheesh

Ok first off,

Portland did not NEED Durant they had Brandon Roy who may not have come to this level being along side KDurant, they needed a Center to stand next to LAldridge. Myself I think KD is the better scoring option but Defense wins titles AKA Oden and let BRoy score. I would have agreed with you more on the (do over) till others here in Portland made me think that through.

Oden so far is starting to show he can play at the Pro level. Also remind everyone only 1 or 2 players came back from Micro fracture surgery after the first year and played at a high level (Amare) everyone else it took 2 years to be truly comfortable with the knee.

IndianaBasketball
IndianaBasketball's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/09/2009
Posts: 12826
Points: 24564
Offline
I see you didn't answer my

I see you didn't answer my questions. What has Durant won besides individual awards? If he's so dominant, then why is his team basically the same (wins/losses wise) as they were before he was drafted? Other than scoring, how else does he dominate the game? How does he even impact the game besides scoring?

You're putting Thabeet and Oden in the same category, so that proves to me you don't know Oden's game. They're too completely different players with different abilities and mentalities. You need to stop hating and watch Oden play this season. He's 100% healthy, so now you can judge him.

Oden isn't some great winner? Huh? He lost less than TEN games his entire high school, AAU and college career. That's not a coincidence.

How can you say that Portland would be the same team with or without Oden? You don't know that. This is the first season he's been 100% healthy. We'll see this season.

quincey hodges... I'm not going to type a list, but I've seen A LOT of players. I've probably seen every great player come through Indiana since the early 90's. My father played overseas and was a big time basketball fan, so he'd always take me to high school games and AAU tournaments in the mid-west. I saw A LOT of great players. I've never seen a player dominate the paint so naturally at both ends like Oden. I've seen great scorers, centers/power forwards and super talented/explosive athletic guards and wings, but I've still never seen a player change the game like Oden. I mean, he just shut down the paint. He didn't have goals to score 30 points or grab 20 rebounds. He just did what he had to, to win the game. If he had to score 37, he would. If he had to grab 26 rebounds, he would. If he had to block 10 shots, he would. I'd never seen a player with his size, hands, feet, strength, power, agility, lateral quickness, leaping ability, recovery speed, timing and defensive IQ. I've seen Kevin Garnett, Amare Stoudemire and Dwight Howard, and not one of them was as physically imposing and dominate in the paint like Oden. I mean, I've seen more offensively skilled big men, but not one who could get position underneath the rim and dunk it with authority and power like Oden. Once he got the ball down there, it was all over.

It's just too early to say that Portland should've drafted Durant.

The lake show2
The lake show2's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/26/2009
Posts: 6717
Points: 1248
Offline
ive seen all them too and

ive seen all them too and amare was physcially dominate in the paint as well as garnett..you forget that you dont have to be real big to be physcially dominate in highschool..and im not sure if you have seen them if you said you never seen any of them get under the rim and and dunk it with athourity..because thats whats amare d howard and garnett did anytime they were under the basket so what are you talkign about?...ive been to a coupel fo dwights games in hs and he domintaed any big man he played against..with oden he actually got dominated and went even with the kid that went to louiville and got punished by hansboro in the game on national tv( i didnt know who he was at the time but i watched that game and tyler ate him alive) and you obviously never say othella and alonzo in hs..those 2 staright destroyed everyone and you could never say a big man got the best of them

The lake show2
The lake show2's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/26/2009
Posts: 6717
Points: 1248
Offline
alonzo actually blocked more

alonzo actually blocked more shots scored more points and grabbed mor boards then oden when he was in hs and thats when there were better big men...i like oden as much as the next man but that doesnt mean imma have a bias towards him liek you obviously do if you say dhoward amare and garnett werent as dominate in highschool....even my uncle says kareem was far and away better then oden when he was in hs( he watched alot of kareems games and watched some of odens)..you also not taking into accoutn that most of the guys oden faced in hs were alot smaller( i checked the rosters of the games he played in hs of the oppossing team)...im not really sure you keep bringing up hs anyway because hs and college doesnt matter once you get to the nba where there are men..in hs he didnt face one other nba center...in college he faced one who is also young so you cant really judge off of that when the competetion was horrible...you cant judge a trrue center till they get to the nba because they never get to face another tru big man untill then

The lake show2
The lake show2's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/26/2009
Posts: 6717
Points: 1248
Offline
as far as saying oden is

as far as saying oden is darko or thabeet..thats wayyyyyyyyyyyyyy off..oden is better now then both even when injured..i also agree with what someone said about portland not needing durant...another point is that it wasnt just oden on that ohio state team..they were actually one of the best teams in the country while oden was out with that injury..they had 2 other nba players on that team who are playing very well in the nba

IndianaBasketball
IndianaBasketball's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/09/2009
Posts: 12826
Points: 24564
Offline
quincey hodges

Wow... You must not be reading what I'm writing or understanding me clearly or something. I didn't say Garnett, Stoudemire and Howard didn't get under the rim and dunk it with authority. I never said they weren't dominant either. They were extremely dominant lol. Garnett was dominant offensively and very good defensively, but I saw him get pushed around. He was a light weight. He didn't dominate the paint defensively like Oden. Stoudemire was EXTREMELY dominant offensively and explosive athletically, but not as dominant defensively. Howard was dominant at both ends, but I saw him get pushed around. I've never seen Oden get pushed around. Teams couldn't keep him from getting position in the paint whether they double or even triple teamed him. I've never seen a player dominate the paint at both ends like Oden. Once Oden got the ball deep in the paint, there was literally nothing you could do, even when he was double/triple teamed. None of those players were as big as Oden either, yet he ran the floor and had hands, feet, athleticism, quickness, timing, etc just like them, if not better. You're judging "domination" solely by statistics only and statistics are misleading. Zach Randolph, Jared Jeffries and Sean May all averaged more points and rebounds than Oden, but NOT ONE of them dominated the paint at both ends and impacted the game like Oden.

You're pathetic for bringing up that game versus Hansbrough lol. Oden was 16 years old and a sophomore in high school! He was playing his first nationally televised game. You're searching real hard, huh lol? Hansbrough was a senior (a 19 year old senior at that) and getting ready to go to North Carolina. Hansbrough did not eat him alive either. I was at that game. Hansbrough had a great first half, while Oden struggled. They triple teamed him literally every play lol and Oden passed the ball. Oden OBLITERATED them in the second half in every way imaginable. He had Hansbrough shooting jumpshots and three-pointers. Hansbrough had fear in his eyes and didn't even take it to the rim. As far as the player that went to Louisville, who are you talking about? What... Was that Oden's freshman year lol?

I'm just going to let you keep hating and questioning whether or not he should've been the number one pick. Obviously, I'm talking about what Oden did in high school and college, because that's what led to him being the number one pick. Oden's first two years in the NBA have been well documented, so I don't need to go over. Now he's 100% healthy though. I'll just let his play do the talking. At the mid-point of the season, we'll see if you're still saying the same thing.

The lake show2
The lake show2's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/26/2009
Posts: 6717
Points: 1248
Offline
the louiville player was

the louiville player was derrick character..he actually dominated and pushed oden aroundat all american camp and in vegas....you didnt see oden get pushed around back in indiana because he want going against any other big man..can you name one big man he faced that did anything in college back in indiana?..like i said i watched howard and he dominated..who pushed him around?..you said you saw him get pushed around by some one so please name one player who did and ill go find the game and watch it as see...ive never seen othella or glendon alexander or alonzo get pushed around and alonzo dominated on both ends of the floor everytime...but like you said oden was the most dominate big man..YOU seen. (and i think i can believe it seeing as he was 6inches taller and 40 lbs heaveir then every guy he faced in his hs conference).which is different then actually being the most dominate big man to ever play hs...and why would i be pathetic for bringing that game up when you said he dominated every game?..and if you dont believe me about derrick caracter eating his lunch look it up...same age same class

The lake show2
The lake show2's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/26/2009
Posts: 6717
Points: 1248
Offline
By Eamonn Brennan Louisville

By Eamonn Brennan

Louisville fans and college hoops fail aficionados will remember Derrick Caracter, the former top recruit who derailed his own limitless potential by basically not being very motivated. Caracter was once the hottest recruit in the country. He was tall, athletic, and multi-talented. He possessed that fierce and rare inside-outside combo game that so many coaches and scouts fawn over. At ABCD camp in 2006, Caracter and some random named Greg Oden squared up for a battle of the top two recruits of that class; Caracter won handily, solidifying his reputation as a true basketball blue-chipper.

The fans attending the Reebok ABCD Camp in Hackensack NJ. last week had to wait until Saturday night in order to get their monies worth when 6’9 forward Derrick Caracter from St. Patrick’s High (N.J.) squared off against 7’0 center Greg Oden from Lawrence North High (Ind.). It was a match up of arguably the top two players of 2006. Even the hype of Oden being possibly the best of the best couldn’t keep Character from bringing it to the big man and slightly tarnishing the Superman cape that has been put on Odem since his performance at last year’s Nike camp vaulted him as the top prospect and according to some recruiters the No. 1 pick in the 2006 NBA draft.

Greg Oden- “Caracter is still the scariest player I've ever faced

GoJOSH HUESTIS
GoJOSH HUESTIS's picture
Registered User
Joined: 06/13/2008
Posts: 860
Points: 457
Offline
i was at that game in new

i was at that game in new jersey and when they played in vegas(was doing work for hoopscooponline.com)..that was the one big man who ued to give oden fits every time they played because he was stronger then oden and had very good footwork..that guy had so much potenial but just wasnt a real hard worker ..most of the time they played derrick would outplay oden and sometimes dominate him and other time derrick would barely outplay him. you do have to realize that hs is hs though and that centers dominate in highschool easily since they rarely have to face anyone nearly as tall or strong as them..i watched around 20 of odens hs games in hi career and he did dominate jut about every big man he faced esspecially in hi hs conference where there was basically mall fowards/hooting guard(college size) guys guarding him. he was one of the most dominate big men (defensively) i had seen..on offense though he wasnt that dominate he out muscled smaller players and would dunk because he was tall but he didnt dominate a game offensively all the time because he wasnt that skilled on offense and if you watched all hi games in hs then im sure you know that tezo . id have to say alonzo was more dominate as well as garnett..thought garnett was smaller he still dominated on defense even if he was pushed..i watched alot more of amare games and ill tell you this..he was a monster on offense and defense in hs he was easily one of the most aggressive big men i ever seen on the highschool level and i seen many in my 40 plus years..oden had/has the most potenial out of all of them though because of his hight defense of instincts and athletic ability.. to be honest he was one of the most dominate

GoJOSH HUESTIS
GoJOSH HUESTIS's picture
Registered User
Joined: 06/13/2008
Posts: 860
Points: 457
Offline
i am actually curious of

i am actually curious of what games u saw of amare,garnett,and howard in which they were pushed around...i wasnt at all the games but our publication and peers were at every game each of those guys played ...not sure where u are getting ur info about garnett not dominating the paint on defense because he truley dominated. it wa extremley rare that a big man ever got anywhere neat double figures on him..and im not just talking about blks..his foot work and defensive IQ was some of the best i have ever seen

IndianaBasketball
IndianaBasketball's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/09/2009
Posts: 12826
Points: 24564
Offline
Derrick Character didn't

Derrick Character didn't push Oden around, nor did he "eat Oden's lunch". He just held his own against Oden during ONE summer tournament in high school. He played really well against Oden in Vegas. Once upon a time Character was considered a can't miss prospect. He was like 6' 9" 300 something pounds. Oden dominated high school and AAU basketball for four years and all you can bring up is one game during one tournament? It really sounds like you're just trying to find anything you can lol. I mean, the game you brought up versus Hansbrough was pathetic. Oden dominated that game the second half and made Hansbrough look irrellivant. I didn't say Oden dominated every game. I also never said that Oden was the most dominate player to ever play high school basketball (I haven't seen every player that's played high school basketball), but it's arguable that he's at least one of the most dominant ever when you consider his overall impact and how much he won. You can't always judge domination and overall impact by statistics.

Do you really think I'd say Oden is the most dominant player I've seen based on only his competition in high school lol? I watched Oden during AAU also. The facts are that he wasn't going to run into a ton of players his size in high school or not even in college, however he dominated games versus great players and great teams. He didn't play in a cup cake conference during high school. He didn't face anybody 7' 0" 250 pounds, but he faced great players with very good size, athleticism and strength. Josh McRoberts, Luke Zeller and Luke Harangody were a few players with "size" he faced and dominated during high school. Most of Oden's size competition came during AAU, etc. He faced off against Al Jefferson, Robert Swift and a few other bigs at Nike Camp. He faced off against the Lopez brothers, Character, Spencer Hawes and a few other bigs during AAU.

I saw Dwight Howard get pushed around by Al Jefferson. I also saw him get stiff competition from Robert Swift. I saw him get pushed around by his own teammates during a practice/scrimmage during AAU. Randolph Morris and Josh Smith. I saw him physically struggle to keep Darnell Jackson out of the paint. Another player who was able to get physical with Howard was Joseph Jones. Howard was only 6' 10" 220 in high school. Oden was 7' 0" 250. Like I said... I've never saw Oden get pushed around or physically dominated.

Like I said... It's too early to say Portland should've taken Durant over Oden. In my opinion, if Oden had never gotten injured, this wouldn't even be a topic of conversation. However, he's 100% healthy now... Get at me at the mid-point of the season and let's continue this conversation.

IndianaBasketball
IndianaBasketball's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/09/2009
Posts: 12826
Points: 24564
Offline
jakarii33

I'm not saying Garnett didn't dominate defensively. I saw Garnett about 15 times during high school and he was dominate at both ends. I agree with everything you said. He was a light weight though. Garnett dominated with his length and athleticism, not necesarily his strength. He was a great defender, but he didn't shut down the paint. Garnett was a GREAT high school player, but he didn't impact the game like Oden did.

The lake show2
The lake show2's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/26/2009
Posts: 6717
Points: 1248
Offline
oden didnt dominate all four

oden didnt dominate all four years in aau so please go ahead wit the lies..yea he faced off against guys in camp but didnt dominate every big man he faced all four years..he dominated most during his sr year but got out played and dominated by caracter...im pretty sure id take jakariis word on that then youres since he was actually at the games and you werent. ive seen oden get pushed around before just like every big man has been pushed around before...it happens to every big man so i dont see youre point when it comes to that...and dwight howard punished randolph morris like he was a step child when they eplayed as well as dunking on him constantly. matter of fact dont even mention garnett amare and howard in the same breath as oden since hes not on there level..how much longer are you gonna dwell on what this guy did in hs?..i it because hes not dominating goo dbig men in the nba?..and oden dominated alot of big men in aau on defense not offense..there were games where he barley scored..offense i not liek defense where you can say..he didnt score much but he dominated on offense..sorry it doesnt work that way on offense it does on defense though . so i agree he dominated on defense he didnt on offense..name one guy in college or nba who people say..wow he didnt score much but he dominated on offense..other then a guy that rakes up alot of assist

The lake show2
The lake show2's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/26/2009
Posts: 6717
Points: 1248
Offline
all usa first team all time

deleted this since it was made before odens hs years

The lake show2
The lake show2's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/26/2009
Posts: 6717
Points: 1248
Offline
a more up to date

a more up to date one

http://sports.espn.go.com/highschool/rise/basketball/boys/news/story?id=...

garnett number 7 alonzo 16 oden 49 dwight howard 40..these are from guys who have watched all these guys play....THE EXPERTS HAVE SPOKEN

IndianaBasketball
IndianaBasketball's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/09/2009
Posts: 12826
Points: 24564
Offline
Oden was ranked number one

Oden was ranked number one in his class from the beginning of the rankings until the end. How is that not domination Quincey? I see now we have completely different definitions for domination. Domination in your book is solely based on statistics. Statistics are a good judge, but can also be very misleading. My idea of domination is based on statistics, but also on a player's overall impact on the game/both ends of the floor and also wins.

Even if Character dominated Oden, which he didn't, that's ONE player. Name another player who you saw push Oden around in high school and college. I named players that I've seen push Howard around. How was Oden not on Garnett's, Stoudemire's and Howard's level? Scouts and GM's said that Oden would've been selected over Howard in 2004. Oden lost less than TEN games his entire high school and AAU career. If that's not domination, then I don't know what is.

Who's dwelling on what he did in high school? Are you forgetting the whole point of this conversation? Beanz816 said that Oden has NEVER been dominant and that he was basically overrated and undeserving of the number one pick and being selected over Kevin Durant. That's the only reason I brought up what he did in high school and in college. How are you not understanding this? You have a little bit of basketball knowledge, but you don't read or understand very well. Once again... My whole point of talking about what he did in high school and college was to prove that he was dominant and that there was a reason he was selected over Kevin Durant.

As far as the NBA goes, the first two seasons of Oden's NBA career have been well documented, however that's the past... This is a new season and he's finally 100% healthy. Judge him by this season. Like I said, it's too early to say Portland should've drafted Durant over him. That's was the whole point of this conversation. Get at me during the mid-point of the season and let's see if you're still hating.

IndianaBasketball
IndianaBasketball's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/09/2009
Posts: 12826
Points: 24564
Offline
You lose points for even posting that list

Lol... That list was a joke! That list is tainted by their pro careers! Greg Oden won the National Player of the Year Award TWICE, but that wasn't good enough to get him past Kobe or Jordan lol. All Kobe won was one Class 4A state championship in high school. If this list is truly for the top preps, then Jordan shouldn't even be on this list.

Next time, you might actually want to read the article.

The lake show2
The lake show2's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/26/2009
Posts: 6717
Points: 1248
Offline
i made my point so im

i made my point so im done..i watched derrick out play oden and thats the only point i wanted to prove that oden didnt dominate ever big man..proved the other point that oden wasnt as dominate as amare,garnett on offense and definatly not on d with garnett

IndianaBasketball
IndianaBasketball's picture
Registered User
Joined: 05/09/2009
Posts: 12826
Points: 24564
Offline
You didn't prove any points.

You didn't prove any points. I never said Oden dominated every big man. I said he was the most dominant at both ends that I've seen. I also said I've never seen him get physically dominated or pushed around. Even if you did prove any points, you lost them by posting that bogus list and switching to your other nbadraft.net account (jakarii33) and trying to double team me lol. I've lost respect for you as a poster because you don't read and lack the ability to understand clearly. You were so busy hating and criticizing, that you forgot the whole point of this conversation. You're bogus bruh.

RSS: Syndicate content