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Great Debaters...lol

JNixon
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Great Debaters...lol

I'm going to bite off of FutureoftheGame's idea, and debate different topics....except I'll debate with... another person.lol. So what will the first topic be about....?

Edit: And the person that comes up with the topic is the person I'll debate with, to eliminate confusion. And keep it basketball related...


MagikKnick
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lol@"..except i'll debate

lol@"..except i'll debate with another person"

Toronto16
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I'll debate with you Your

I'll debate with you

Your debating why the Lakers won't win the title this year, I'll debate why they will.

You go first.

JNixon
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Alright, The Lakers wont

Alright,

The Lakers wont make the playoffs because the Portland TrailBlazers have become a must stronger team with all of their young guys a year older and Brandon Roy being a top 15 player in basketball. Also the addition of Andre Miller gives them the true PG they've lacked to make the next steps forward. They could have the depth team in basketball, with offensive explosiveness and defensive presence all spread out evenly. The Spurs, the have the exact same squad (in terms of contributors) and added a great piece in Jefferson. Makes them the prime competition for the Lakers... And the Denver Nuggets have virtually the same back from last year, minus Jones (who was replaced easily with a similar player in Afflalo) and Kleiza (a streak shooter who drifted to the perimeter more and more as his career progressed, despite his size and girth). Their losses were replaceable. And with the addition of Lawson, Anthony Carter can be a mentor to groom Lawson as a backup NBA player and not on the floor, where he can be steady, but also baffling. The have a stronger team than last year as well..thats why I see them overtaking the Lakers out West.

butidonthavemoney
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?

I know this isn't my debate but that was a very weak argument as to why the Lakers won't make the playoffs.

I'm such an ass...

JNixon
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Probably because I dont

Probably because I dont agree with any of that.at all..I see LA winning.

JNixon
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Your's was better..I haven't

Your's was better..I haven't gotten any challenges really lol

JNixon
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Yea thanks man..I did it

Yea thanks man..I did it because the topics have been dead lately. Just trying to spark a conversation lol

SpencerIsHawesome2
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damn stop blowin eachother

damn stop blowin eachother

JNixon
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Hahahaha....you like startin

Hahahaha....you like startin stuff dont you?

Michael.S.
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Tracy McGrady was better in

Tracy McGrady was better in his prime than Kobe was in his prime.

you got Kobe

JNixon
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Kobe is better because he

Kobe is better because he has the credentials. He also advanced past the 1st round of the playoffs, which is something T-Mac cant say he has done. At any point of his career. Kobe is the winning player that McGrady is not. He also is the more prolific scorer. Kobe is a very overrated defender, but T-Mac makes him look like Shane Battier on D. He is willing to play through all kinds of injuries and still be very effective, while McGrady is constantly injured and will not tough out an injury if its real painful. I think Kobe was better overall at every aspect than TMac.

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LOL@blowing each other.

LOL@blowing each other. that was funny not saying you should not give props but I have to admit that was funny.

Also to argue why they will win. They have gotten better. They have at least 3 guys on the floor at all time they may have to be double team on the offense.

They added a physical player and intense mindset to Kobe who is intense himself but more controlled. Artest will push Kobe a lot in practices because Kobe will be more able to deal with players that get physical with him. Also I think Kobe will be better this year than last year considering he actually is getting rest. People forget that Bynum will only get better and hopefully will stay injury free now. Gasol is actually getting better at his age. He has shown a toughness that he did not have in Memphis.

Spurs are over hyped and I think they will do well in the regular season but they are too old to mess with the younger elite teams in the playoffs. Jefferson does not make them that more special. It will be more about health and the thing is Duncan may be too old to stay healthy playing the West. Denver and Portland look to be the biggest problems to the Lakers. Denver lost firepower though. Portland is still young and may match up poorly with the Spurs and the Spurs could possibly take advantage of their young age and win that series only to lose the next one to the Lakers who if they are healthy should have a easy time getting to the Finals.

I don't think people understand everything that Ron Artest brings because of his craziness. They will miss Ariza's 3 pointers but Artest defensively will be able to match the same effect but play in a more physical style than using length and speed like Ariza. Artest also is a Vet defender and that speak volumes in how he can help the team defense and just make highlight defensive plays. Also Shannon Brown may very well become this version of Ariza. He has all the physical tools and athleticism but was too raw. Morrison is also going to push for time and has the actually skill set to do that but I doubt he play much in games but his hard work is practice will push other guys and hopefully make him a attractive free agent to a Team where he can get minutes.

sheltwon3
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T Mac had the great

T Mac had the great potential from a raw standpoint but Kobe was a is a better player. If T Mac worked as hard as Kobe, he may have been able to eclipse Jordan. Before yall get mad. I want yall to look at T Mac work and his body and athleticism. I will this also Jordan is better than a lot of player this generation not because he was just gifted physically but emotional and mentally he was above everyone. He willed teams to win and the only person that can come close to this mindset is Kobe but Jordan was bless with some raw abilities Kobe does not possess and never will. T Mac has raw abilities that neither Jordan nor Kobe has but he does not have that same intensity. I am not saying that T Mac does not work hard but I do believe he has never really pushed himsef like Kobe and Jordan has but the thing is you have to have their personality to do it. Odom is gifted to be better than everyone I mentioned above including Jordan but his personality does not get him to be that player. He is not as intense and is more laid back but his is still a tough person and he works hard too.

Michael.S.
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My turn

Kobe wasn't better at every aspect, McGrady had more range and probably a better jumper, McGrady also was way better at creating for others although sometimes was a ball hog, but can you really blame him? His team always sucked, yes he had Yao, but 1of them were always injured, never really played a postseason togther at 100% and besides that their supporting cast was mediocre. Kobe's worst team was better than McGradys best team ever on Orlando, when he was undoubtedly the 1st scorer.

JNixon
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Having extra range is not

Having extra range is not all that important. I mean if you can shoot a 3 pointer, does it matter how deep you can shoot? 3 points is 3 points, even though he had more range Kobe was the more confident shooter (he makes wayyy more contested shots and takes more 3's than TMac). McGrady has more physical tools, but he isnt the player Kobe is. He is gifted, but too soft and unphysical to make the absolute best use of his tools. He is the better passer, but why pass when you have Luke Walton and Chris Mihm starting on your team like Kobe did? T Mac came to Houston with Yao on his team, so he had a star at the most valuable position in basketball. No way they should'nt of never been to the second round of the playoffs with 2 all-NBA caliber players...

Michael.S.
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TMac will get out the first

TMac will get out the first round this year! ...................................how bout them apples!

Michael.S.
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Oh and I always thought Kobe

Oh and I always thought Kobe was a little soft, but it seems im the only one.

How do you guys define soft?

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Someone who

Someone who dodges/constantly falls to the floor off of little to no contact, doesnt play through injuries, and always complains about everything..

Michael.S.
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You really blame McGrady fo

You really blame McGrady fo not playing through those injuries?!?!?!

Oh aslo Kobe, I feel he settles too much, and you can argue ......but his Ft's...........but half those are off his crazy head fake

JNixon
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T-Mac has had alot of

T-Mac has had alot of injuries, and some of his injuries are ridiculous. He missed a game once because he had a cold. A cold...and he was shooting around and laughing with his teammates. That's lame to me.

Kobe finishes through contact. I cant think of one time he's fallen on the floor through contact on a drive to the basket. And he plays through nagging injuries..he still hasnt had surgery on that finger yet, its been dislocated for almost 2 years now. He played with a slightly separated shoulder a few years backs. He's definitely a tough player, one of the toughest in basketball..

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Good topics

Odom since when is he a real threat on the perimeter and from behind the 3 pt line?
Tmac seemed to be a great scorer but not a great all around player like Jordan and Tmac.
Also Tmac obviously never stepped it up in the playoffs.
Kobe is a little soft thats why he rarely guards the other teams best perimeter player.

Argument against the Lakers winning it all is Artest has lost a step defensively if you heard what the Rockets players said about him. Basically he's a PF now, reminds me of Antoine Walker Artest plays more D but both like to throw up a lot of 3's. Bynum can't stay healthy or out of foul trouble just because he had a few 30 pt games in the regular season doesn't mean thats the player you'll see every night. The bench doesn't scare anyone besides Odom, the next best is Walton who gets abused on defense. Vujacic can't hit a shot, Farmar doesn't fit the system. Powell, Mbenga, Morrison make little to no impact. Shannon Brown is the wild card but besides a couple big plays against the Nuggets what did he really do. Don't forget Fisher is getting old, making it pretty difficult to repeat.

The Spurs, Blazers, Jazz, Hornets, Nuggets are all improved and the road to win it all will be much tougher.
Especially the Spurs who have a stacked front court with RJ, Duncan, Blair, McDyess, Bonner and Ratliff. Also who's stopping Tony Parker from getting to the rim Derek Fisher I doubt that.

I think your confusing Kobe with Iverson in terms of playing with injuries.
If his finger needed surgery he would've had it this offseason, no need for him to postpone it what has he been doing the last 3 months.

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i will debate against DHamp

i will debate against DHamp (DChump) if he dares to face me. I'll eat his lunch.

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Why the Lakers Won't Win

1. No team has repeated since the Lakers did it back in the day... there's a reason for that. With film and everything teams WILL figure out how to beat the lakers... whether it's doing things like Rick Adelman~ and charting every shot the Lakers take and then forcing them to take shots in areas where they hit a low%, or just seeing where the Lakers are weak on defense, there's a good reason that teams don't repeat in this league anymore. The rockets almost did it with their scrubs, what about a team like the celtics?

2. Age. I hate to say this, but Kobe has definitely lost a step. I mean, the guy got blocked by Hedo Turkoglu at the end of one of those finals games... I would never have thought that I'd see that. EVER. He has played 948 regular season games... since 1996! That's a long time to go through the grind of an 82-game season + playoffs + olympics. The guy is not the same athletically.

3. Artest is one star too many... Egos are a real thing. you can say what you want, but I think egos will affect the chemistry of that team. (and I don't want to hear someone say, oh, artest has his buddy Odom on his team, he'll calm him down. No, we're talking about grown men) When you look at Bynum, Gasol, Odom, Bryant, Artest all those guys want to be a big-time player, but there are a limited number of shots every game. It's the same thing as when the Lakers tried assembling all the stars before~ result? they lost.

4. Injuries are imminent~ Ron Artest hasn't played a full season- probably ever. Bynum will not last an entire season. Gasol and Odom played almost all of last season, but do you really think that will be the case again? They had all their pieces together for the stretch run last year, and that's why they won. (That's why Boston won the year before). And this goes back to why no team repeats. It's really hard to have your guys all be healthy for the playoffs. The team that wins is usually the team with all their guys healthy (would it have been a different story for Orlando if Jameer would've been healthy? who knows...) the point is, what are the chances it happens for the lakers two years in a row? not likely.

5. Talent in the league is really starting to gravitate to abotu 10-15 teams. The disparity between the top tier of teams and the bottom tier of teams is kind of astonishing to be honest. There are a couple teams kind of stuck in the middle ~ Jazz, Hawks, Hornets, for example, where they just haven't really been able to add pieces, although the hawks did add crawford this year~ but otherwise, the tops teams are going out and increasing their talent levels... Boston- Sheed. Cleveland- Shaq. Trail Blazers- Miller. Magic- VC. Spurs- Jefferson. Mavs- Marion. And I'm sure this trend will continue at the trading deadline. It's not to say that all those teams are so much more talented than the lakers, but it's just a fact that the more talented teams there are, the less likely it is that ANY one team will win the championship...

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why the Lakers will win the

why the Lakers will win the title:

1-size. Pau, Bynum, Odom, and Artest equal one of the longest, toughest and most talented frontcourts in the league. Bynum was no where near 100% last playoffs, and if he returns to how he played before injuries the last 2 seasons, then he is an all star caliber player being added to a team that already won a title. Odom off the bench is a luxury few teams have.

2-Artest. He is hungry for a title. He adds a more physical defensive option to gaurd physical sf's like Lebron and Paul Pirece. He has a long term deal which means he isn't playing with his next destination on his head like he has been doing throughout his career. He respects Kobe and Phil, and he knows they won without him, so he will get in line. So far, he is saying alll the right things this off season like how he just wants to lock people up like he used to and forget about his shots.

3-bench improvement. Farmar, SBrown, Vujacic, Morrison, and Powell are all young players who should only improve from last season. Farmar and Brown will take more of Fisher's minutes and Morrison and Vujacic will battle it out for the role of designated shooter.

4-legacy. Kobe knows he needs to seal up his legacy while he is in his prime and has this much talent. Phil has never won one title in a row before. He wins them in 3's.

5-Kobe has not slowed down as much as people think. He played the fewest minutes per game last year since he was 19 years old. He knows he has more talent around him, and he is picking and choosing his moments. His play in games 5 and 6 against Denver when the Lakers were facing their toughest spot in the playoffs, he had two of his best games of the entire year. When he wants to, he is still the best player in the game today.

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