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shaq trade do over

llperez
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shaq trade do over

With all things considered, would the Miami Heat still make the trade for Shaq if they had to do it over again. They traded Brian Grant, Lamar Odom, Caron Butler, and a first round pick that was used on Jordan Famar. Obviously they won the title with Shaq, but do you think they would still do the trade if given a second chance.


QHaynes20
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Most likely, Yea. It got you

Most likely, Yea. It got you a championship. That team with Odom and Butler and wade were good not great.

The trade LA should not have done is the Butler-Brown trade

Champzilla21
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yes becuz they wouldnt have

yes becuz they wouldnt have won a champion ship with those ppl at all, and winning a champioship puts the team in the spotlight and what owner wouldnt want that

gatorheels
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Nope

Nope

Chalmers/Farmar
Wade/Cook/QRich
Butler/Beasley/QRich
Odom/Haslem/Beasley
J Oneal/Magloire

Miami would love to have that squad right now.

I think the Heat would be title contenders with this team this season & for the next couple years to come.

Would they still have Jermaine Oneal?

McWinning
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yep big men win titles and a

yep big men win titles and a Odom, Wade, BUtler combo would be neice but they wouldnt have size and that would hurt them.

QHaynes20
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Yea but if you... dont do

Yea but if you...

dont do the Shaq trade

you dont add Marion

you dont add O'Neal

and if you kept that team, you prob wouldn't have Beasley

gatorheels
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Good point QHaynes......yeah

Good point QHaynes......yeah I was thinking Marion was involved in that trade.....True about Beasley too I didn't think about that.

Alright I change my mind ha....the Heat would do that trade again.

llperez
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I don't think they would do

I don't think they would do it again. I know you can't really meassure against winning a title, but Shaq only gave them 2 good years. And who knows, with the way Wade played in the playoffs, maybe an Odom/Butler/Grant frontcourt could have still resulted in a title. They would still be competing for titles to this day as that group grew together instead of trying to rebuild around a prime Wade.

QHaynes20
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I disagree because Wade got

I disagree because

Wade got all the calls in that Dallas series....

And The Pistons would have beat them if they did not pull off the shaq trade.

McWinning
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they woudnt have gotten

they woudnt have gotten Chalmers probaly too so they wouldnt have a good point guard.

QHaynes20
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.....Chalmers really isint

.....Chalmers really isint that good and they probably still got the deal for him.

McWinning
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QHaynes20

yeah but hes better tan Quinn and they wouldnt get him because they would be later in the draft.

llperez
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The pistons choked for like

The pistons choked for like 3 or 4 straight years under Flip Saunders. Also, in the Finals that year, Shaq only averaged like 13 points a game. That series had as much to do with Dallas choking and Wade getting all the calls as anything else. But Odom and Butler would'nt exactly hurt Wades performance in that series.

Plus, those guys got to the second round together when Wade was a rookie and they were still young. If they had been given time to grow together, they could have been competing for titles year in and year out. So do you take the one title and immediate rebuilding stage that followed with zero playoff series victories since, or do you keep a young core together that could have grown and competed every year?

llperez
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chalmers

was a second rounder. The Heat could have probably still gotten him. And I know you think really high of Mario, but reality is that they could have found someone else just as good if not better. The Heat's future does not hinge on Chalmers.

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The main goal was the

The main goal was the championship and they got it........It all worked out and i don't think they should re-do. Who would have know all this players would transform in too pretty good players. They got what they wanted.

Champzilla21
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u have to do that trade

u have to do that trade seriously odom is overrated and never put it together, butler is nice but u can assume theyd have beasley and chalmers right now becuz their draft standing would be different, also the heat have a pile of cap space in 2010, theirs only on the hook for 17 mil, they can bring in multiple good free agents in a sexy free agent class, or they could sign 1 max contract guy to play along side wade, wade, beasley and one or 2 sexy more players of ur choice and their right back i it

QHaynes20
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yea but then you dont add

yea but then you dont add Walker, Williams in a deal

i dont think they would have contended because they had no real big men

McWinning
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llperez22

sure hes only decent but he wouls be a good fit because of his good defense and he wouldnt take shots away from them lus yes they could sign a free agent point guard but that would mean they wouldnt have as much money to spend on Wade, Odom, and Butler while Chalmers has a great deal with less than 1 million a year.

llperez
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why

could'nt they have added a walker or a williams? They could have found some key pieces through trades and free agency. Again, guys like Walker and williams are solid role players. But you can get guys like that pretty easily. Wade is the superstar and Caron and Odom would have made one of the better front court tandems in the league. When Brian Grants deal ran out, they had that much more money to spend on free agents. And it's not like getting Marion or Jermaine O'neal is exactly something to brag about. Marion was in and out without making any serious difference and O'neal is pulling like 20 mill right now for being a shell of his former self.

llperez
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birdzilla

but like I said, chalmers was a second round pick, so it's entirely possible the Heat could have gotten him regardless of their record.

McWinning
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llperez22

its possible but if they were in the 40is i doubt they would get him. he was a potential first rounder coming in to the draft and slipped a little and i dont think would go much farther down.

ckowalski
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But if the Heat were going

But if the Heat were going to be that good if they didn't get Shaq and be competing for championships they would have fallen into the 20-30 range anyways in the draft. Chalmers was picked at what 31? 20-30 would have been a good place for them to draft him anyways. I agree with llperez I really think that getting Chalmers would have been pretty easy.

McWinning
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ckowalski

wel first of all they couldnt have known he would be that good and second if you take him there he would get more money.

gatorheels
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The Heat didn't even draft

The Heat didn't even draft Chalmers. The TWolves drafted him then traded/sold him to Miami.

llperez
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actually birdilla

Chalmers going 20-30 was highly realistic, and the Heat would'nt have been making a real stretch by taking him there. Also, the money issue is pretty minimal. Late first rounders usually make just over 1 mill per year while second rounders make like 600k. However, second rounders also usually only sign 2 year deals wich means Chalmers will be up for free agency sooner and thus get paid more in the long haul while a first rounder can't go into free agency until after their 4th year assuming the team exercises their 4th year option. So really, it could cost the heat more money taking chalmers in the second round.

ckowalski
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Taking him 20th and taking

Taking him 20th and taking him 31st is not a significant difference. I think it is around 500k more if you are the 20th pick. I don't get the part about them not knowing he would be that good. It's not like they looked at him at 31 and said he will for sure play like the 25th pick, but if they look at him at 20 they are saying well we're not sure how he will turn out. I don't get the statement. I think after you get past the lottery and closer to the second round most of the draft seems to be irrelevant. Not saying second rounders don't produce but it is more common for a team to reach with a late first round pick or second round pick than a lottery pick IMO.

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llperez

Beat me to it man

BasketballGuru24
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lool What a coincidence you

lool What a coincidence you wrote the exact same thing

McWinning
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if were tlking about going

if were tlking about going back in time and redoing it yes that would work.
take Chalmers in 2008.
and Mark Gasol, and Aaron Brooks or Rudy Fernandez in 2007 i mean are we dorectly talking about them going back and making the right choice or what would happen if they chose not to do the trade instead?

llperez
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great minds think alike

great minds think alike

llperez
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well birdzilla

the point was to just basically ask if they could redo the trade today, would they. Obviously, that would impact how their picks occured or what free agents they signed, but the core idea remains the same. True, they might not have Chalmers, but who knows, maybe they end up with someone else who is just as good or even better.

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yes

Anytime u win a championship it was a good trade. Sure Shaq wasnt as dominant in the Finals that year, but it was is presence that helped Wade get open a lot. Giving all the credit to Wade for that is pretty dumb

gatorheels
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All the Heat had to do was

All the Heat had to do was buy Chalmers from the TWolves.

McWinning
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yeh they could have gotten

yeh they could have gotten Lee, Batum, Moute, Hill, or Deandre Jordan i guess that clas was filled with steals.

QHaynes20
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Wasnt D-Wade playing PG in

Wasnt D-Wade playing PG in Miami before Shaq?

I remember it was

Wade, Butler, Odom, Haslem and Grant?

or

Wade, Jones, Butler, Odom and Haslem?

Chicago1980
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Yes Yes Yes

I think that they would do it again because you never know when you are gonna have a chance to win a championship I think that I would mortgage the future to win a championship right now which is basically what they did when they made that trade.

tuck243
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yes

They would do it again... A ring for one year is much better than NO ring at all... Without Shaq they don't add certain peices to win a Championship... And the Lakers would trade Brown for Butler again... Because Kwame's contract got them Pau Gasol...

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Yea i think they would do it

Yea i think they would do it all over its guys right now who would love to have that ring....

Elgin Baylor (Help led the Lakers to 8 finals appearances but never won)

Karl Malone (One of the 50 Greatest Players)2 time MVP

Charles Barkley (One of the 50 Greatest Players) MVP

John Stockton ( All time steals and assist leader)

Pete Maravich (Average 24 points per game in his ten-year NBA career)

Reggie Miller (One of the deadliest three-point shooters in NBA history)

Dominique Wilkins
George Gervin
Patrick Ewing
Bernard King
Chris Webber
Etc.

mikeyvthedon
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Absolutely

Simply put, the Heat would not have won a ring without Shaq. Kobe won a ring with the help of Pau Gasol, Bynum and other role guys, similar to how Wade had help from Shaq (The Big Decoy in the Dallas series), James Posey, Antoine Walker and Jasoin Williams. I mean, not saying that Wade is Gilbert Arenas, because he surely is a far superior athlete, but how dop the Heat look much better than the current Wizards if they do not do that trade. Not to mention, no Beasley, Jermaine O'Neal was traded for Shawn Marion (who was of course traded for Shaq), so, while the Heat might be better as of right now, I am assuming Odom would have been gone and they would have had a nice scoring duo with Wade and Butler, but it is hard to see them competing with presumably 0 inside presence. If the Heat had not won a ring, than I would say no to the deal, but after what happened in 2006, Miami is pretty happy with the outcome, as they would still be ringless if the trade had not gone down.

llperez
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well

it seems most people think the trade was the right thing to do since it lead to a title, which is understandable. But I think the heat might have been able to win that year anyways without the trade honestly. The east was way down that year and detroit was the only other good team, and they choked. Dallas was not a tough team either and they choked as well. They held a 10 point lead in the 4th quarter of game 3 while leading the series 2-0. If they hold that lead, it's gonna be 3-0 and in all likely hood a title for dallas. but Wade went off and carried the team to the title. And I think he might have done it even without Shaq. Odom is a very good player who had his best season as a pro playing in miami with wade. Butler has turned into a legit all-star who would have been one of the top number 2 options alongside Wade.

Add in that the team did not win a single playoff game the next year while Shaq's game decresed severly, and I think the team would have preffered not making the trade. Keep in mind Farmar could have also been there to help, and once Eddie Jones and Brian Grant's big salaries came off the books, the Heat could have added some key pieces around wade, butler and odom.

As of now, the heat have'nt been competitive since the title, wade is playing his prime years with very little help and everything rests on whether or not they can draw free agents in to miami.

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WITHOUT

WITHOUT THE BROWN-BUTLER TRADE, THERE WOULD BE NO GASOL!!!

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i think they would want that

i think they would want that team now, but the trade brought a title. and wasn't that miami's first title? if they kept that team together and still ended up with beasley, they'd be pretty good off, but i don't think they'd redo it. it got the first title, and they're only one or two key pieces away from contending again. if they can resign wade, and use the rest of the money on a joe johnson type player, and very good player, but not a superstar, to pair with wade, they'll be good, so a title then, and possibly another in a few years, beats no title, and just a better overall team. they'd redo it.

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