You guys buying the John Henson top 10 buzz?
A lot of top 10 teams are working out John Henson and I have a hard time believing he's really being considered that high. This draft has some nice PF prospects and IMO Henson ranks pretty much in the middle. A guy you could reach for at 14 or pick up as a great value pick at 18 or 19.
In the NBA altering shots and discouraging guards to penetrate is a valuable commodity, and Henson can provide a team with a top notch shot blocker who's not completely inept on offense. That being said, Top 10?
I just don't buy it. His thin frame, leads me to believe he won't be nearly as effective on the glass as an NBA player and a lane enforcer usually works out better if he can't be pushed out of the way very easily.
I don't doubt Henson will have an NBA career. I think he will find a nitch, but I just feel there are a lot more talented guys out there to consider him in the top 10. I've read Golden State, Detroit and Sacramento all have interest in him. Maybe if they plan on trading down I could see how he could fit in all of those rosters, but not at 5, 7 or 9.
What do you guys think about John Henson and do you really think he's going top 10?
You never know whats in the minds of gms..It wouldnt surprise me at all if someone is fooled into taking him in the top 10..Coming from a highly regarded school like UNC helps him.He's a good kid,thats willing to get better and listen..But I'm not so sure people would be so high on him if he played at lets say Hartford or Jackson State...To me,He plays alot like John Salley of the old Bad Boys Piston teams...
I see him being a specialist in the pros,coming off the bench to block shots and defend....At the combine he had a lower vert than Jimmer had last season....
Couldn't agree with you more. I think he is way to thin to be effective immediately. I know alot of mock's had him going to Detroit and thought it would be a good fit next to Monroe but I think thats a huge mistake. Henson might be decent down the road, but I think that by the time he adds the weight he might not be playing for the team that drafted him.
Not buying it, but he'll be a solid NBA player.
I'll be upset if he goes Top 5-6 because that will mess everyone's mock up.
He needs to add 20-25 pounds but athletic 6'10 players go in the top 10 because of potential alone. Regardless if it's viewed as smart in retrospect, it's just what happens. Favors, Hill, Biyombo, Vesely, Udoh, Wright. All those players had different strengths and weaknesses but they all had enough potential to be drafted top 10, even when better players were still on the board. And all because of size.
That said, Henson is intriguing because he has enough skill to believe he's a bit less ricky then some raw, athletic big men, but still has so much potential because with a bit of weight he could be a great PF. On a team like Detroit and Sac he would fit in perfectly with the teams existing frontcourt, and maybe those teams are trying to fill out their team, instead of just drafting best player available. Maybe a bit of a reach at 5-9, but out of all the players left on the board he's the one that can improve your team the most, then why not?
Yeah, I'll give him a pass on the poor athletic tests because of his bum ankle, although I don't think he would have wowed anyone either if he were healthy.
I do see the John "Spider" Salley similarites (great reference by the way). I could see him being a specialist like he was, providing shot blocking and defense for 20-25 minutes for a playoff team. I think even more than gaining weight in college, he helped himself out a lot by learning to hit that 10 foot jumper consistantly.
Shouldn't go in the lottery. Not strong enough and will not be an immediate contributor and will struggle to adjust to the physicality of the NBA.
Sounds like a poor man's version of Anthony Davis. Not sure how you can be extremely high on Davis and extremely low on Henson.
That being said, I can kind of see John Henson as a good fit for Sacto. He would be a good rim protector for Cousins inside. Especially if Drummond is off the table as is Thomas Robinson (not a rim protector but should be a solid power forward). I think Henson would be a better fit in Sacto than Jeremy Lamb or Brad Beal.
Detroit sounds pretty good. But I think Sullinger is a better power forward. A better scorer and rebounder, even if he isn't athletic.
I think Sully should be in consideration with both the Sacto pick and the Detroit pick.
I am like you Joe, I can see John Henson being a very good value pick late. In the top 5-10 he might be a reach but most every guy in the top 5-10 has flaws. T Rob is a good one but is he tall enough and is his offensive game refined enough? Then you have Sully who I like a lot, but is he athletic enough? Meyers Leonard is supposed to go a little bit higher now but there are also some question marks with him.
After the top 5 or 6 then there are about 10 or so guys who can fit in anywhere. Just depends on who fits where, and how the workouts/interviews went.
I have Anthony Davis first like everyone else. Then the next tier of Drummond, T Rob, MKG, and Barnes next. But after that, there seems to be not much difference between the next 10-15 picks. So I basically think that there are 3 tiers of players in the top 20-25 picks. Then some solid late first-early secound round types. From mid-to-late second round you have more question marks with more guys who fizzle out than contribute.
Henson's thin and weak. What's worse is that he has a frame that likely won't allow too much improvement on that front. He has great intuitive athleticism, but I can see him getting bullied and being permantly limited by his lack of strength. He's a player I'd hope my team didn't pick if I were anywhere in the lotto.
If anthony davis can make it so can henson.
Make it...yes....good as Davis....doubt it very seriously
not many lotto picks produce in year one so that excuse goes out the window. There are no locks in the lotto spots either so Henson could go lotto without much of a fuss. As far as being big enough, this isn't the NFL, he will have challenges just like other rookie bigs and he will get stronger just like every first year big has gotten. He will put on weight like other bigs as well. There are plenty of bigs who have came in skinny and did pretty well for themselves. He has a specific skill set that many teams could use and thats defense. He has also gotten much better with his jump shots and post moves.
For those who are quick to forget the pass here are some fact for you
Theo Ratliff came in at 214
Warrick (who isn't as good as Henson) 215
Taj Gibson 214
tobias harris 210
Anthony Randolph 197
Some of these guys have played well some not so well but none of them didn't play well because of their weight or strength and none were as good of shot blockers or as long as Henson. Its not like he would be going ahead of a sure thing if he goes top 10 and top 10 draft picks have known to be average NBA players and Henson can be that
No I'm not buying it at all. I think he'll be a good player and have a nice career but there are at least 10 and maybe 15 players/prospects I'd take before him. He'll be a nice defender when he adds weight and he has a decent jumper despite his horrible FT% but he won't be more then a spot starter/key reserve on a good team.
Based on what compared to Perry Jones (if you think he should go top 10), waiters,Drummond..because all of those guys have potential but also have the celining to just be spot starters, key role players off the bench
If that's directed at me:
Henson doesn't have the potential to be a star imo. He's going to be solid, but he still needs to put on weight and work on his FT's to really be a rotation guy. With Jones (although I do have doubts about him), and Drummond they both have the potential to be much better then Henson, so I would take them higher even if they need more grooming so to speak. They could end up being about as good or worse then Henson, but there is a chance they are both immensely better as well. Not really sure how I feel about Waiters yet, I haven't watched much of him.
I think Henson would be a good complementary big or an IDEAL third big. A great 8 man rotation guy who can come in off the bench, play inside, block shots, and finish around the basket. You could probably say the same thing about Zeller and Leonard, too. Sully is more of an ideal third big, or a complement to an all-star big man.
Is there a big man in this draft that you can get 20-25 points a night, and build a team around as your go-to scorer? Doubt it. Anthony Davis, if he does turn into a legit force, will be known more for defense than offense.
Mostly complementary bigs in this draft, outside of Anthony Davis who is projected to be a legit defensive force down the line and a very good core player. I would even put T Rob in the category of complementary bigs, even though he may have more upside. Andre Drummond could be a core guy or a flameout.
John Henson has some question marks, but so does everyone else. Can Henson be the third best big man out of this draft? Possibly.
How many guys turned out to be stars that people didn't think had the potential? No one knows what a player will turn into, if they did Kobe and K.G would have gone much higher than they did. Same with Parker,Ginobli, etc. Both might end up better but i wouldn't hold my breath for the simple fact that neither have high motors and you don't just automatically get that. Basically it's a crap shoot with them. They can make you look like Smart men or they can end up getting you fired if you take them too high. With Henson you know (as much as you could possibly know with seeing into the future) that he is going at least be a decent starter that ends up being a good defender.
With Henson i have no issue picking him top 10 if i'm the Kings because he brings something no one else on the team brings. You have scorers in Cousins and Evans and if you don't like Evans you can trade him for other scorers. Henson is good at what Cousins has issues with. Det is another team who i would pick Henson over PJ3 because he Monroe is the scorer and Henson fits in well with him. Basically those are the only teams i can understand Henson goin gto in the top 10 because they already have Centers who can score but no PF who can do the dirty work on defense
Both Sacramento and Detroit can use him, effectively.
The Kings are picking 5th but i can see them trading Tyreke and the pick for a lower one and then grabbing him as he will be invaluable next to DeMarcus...
The Pistons are picking ninth and its just about the right spot for him, plus that he will be the ideal fit next to Greg Monroe.
I think he is top 10 cuz if you see the Kings workouts he can hit an NBA 3. I dont think he is a true PF and I see him more as a SF in a Charles Smith or Derrick McKey (Horry) type
He's been told every year at UNC to gain weight. Still, no weight. This leads me to believe that he'll never be able to gain the weight needed, and he will be a bust, or a decent role player. But i have heard that he's slipping
You must not have watched Henson for his college career because he has definatly gained weight since he got there
He came into UNC as a freshmen at 183 and now is 216 , that is 33 lbs that is a significant weight jump. Mosdef he is not a SF , but he is a face up 4 man that can hit the 15ft jumper better than many give him credit for. Marcus Camby after his Jr year was a high pick and played Center despite being 6'11 220. This weight crap is overblown , a guy like Serge Ibaka is only 6'10 235 I can see Henson being 230 or so by the time he is 24-25. He is a lottery pick talent just not sure above 9 is where I would feel comfortable taking him. He doesn't bite on ball fakes at all and while not as explosive as Davis he does many of the same things. I see him as a career 10ppg 8reb 2blk guy over 10-12 years.
IMO he's in the mold of Gibson-Udoh, great defensive benchers, great plus minus guys too, that wouldn't be enough and that won't be necessarily the case as starters, henson won't transfigure the losing team selecting him in the top 10, think pistons.
Gibson was a great late first, udoh a reach and an atrocious 6th(monroe was obvious), henson's more of a bubble guy, rockets pick, trade bait, packaged, bought.
Leonard will grab his landing spots, anyway...
"Sounds like a poor man's version of Anthony Davis. Not sure how you can be extremely high on Davis and extremely low on Henson."
that is going to be an unpopular statement....but I have to agree with you on it....absolutely. Henson is not going to do big things early in his career, but the scouts are looking at his upside. He has tremendous upside if you consider the fact that has developed greatly each of his years at UNC.
there is too much bias and double standard when it comes to Davis. Davis is the more talented and dominant player sure...but the same things that people make such a big deal about with Davis....Henson has done, even if but to a lesser degree.
As a junior in HS, John Henson was a 6'4" guard. Between his junior and senior season he grew to 6'10" (7'6" wingspan). He is athletic, he has high motor, and his offensive game has improved by leaps and bounds. The only reason UNC tried him at SF that first year was because he had been a guard for all his life until his senior year in HS where he became the #1 ranked PF by most experts. His jumpshot has vastly improved as his range, as when he was a freshman he shot a lot of airballs. His footwork in the post has improved as well.
Roy tried to make Henson into a perimeter player because basically, UNC had so much depth up front and Henson was too talented not to give minutes to. Although highly recruited, he didnt come in under a blaze of glory like Davis because he had much more competition to compete with in the front court. UK's only choice at center was Davis or Vargas. Easy choice. Meanwhile, Henson was like 180lbs, when they already had Ed Davis, Dion Thompson, Tyler Zeller, and the Wear Twins!!! Not to mention Will Graves was getting the bulk of the minutes as SF.
I read here the other day where someone said Henson had a bad freshman year. That person probably didnt watch closely. All things considered and the playing time he got, Henson was one of the most important players that year. If it were not for him they wouldnt have won as many games as they did....I remember the State game in particular in Raleigh. Henson was the heart and hustle of the team...his hustle plays were just incredible. He was an animal on defense when he got in the game and his defense, hustle, and shotblocking turned that game around as well as several others.
So again, I am just looking from a GM perspective. He is not Anthony Davis and he doesnt have the frame that he has, but there are plenty of parallels between them and with Henson's work ethic, I can see why they value him as a potential top 10 pick.
Henson is a former perimeter player who is just now learning to play as a big. Maybe thats a good thing....or then again, listening to you guys....it could be another overused cliche that is only biased when applicable.
I usually go potential star over sure solid player, but I see where you're coming from.
he's a role player... you don't draft role players that high.
Now out side of the two teams i named i might have to agtree with you as far as not picking him top ten.. Henson is definatly not a bubble guy (if you mean bubble first round) and yeah go ahead and pick Lenord now if you want just because of his combine stuff. As far as Gibson he can start for a good NBA team and he's shorter, not as long and not as good as Henson at the same stage.
And Henson is a pf not a sf, hitting threes in workouts vs no one isn't that hard for just about any big. Shaq used to hit threes in workouts like that as well. Big difference between that and doing it in games. Just because you do it alone does not mean you can do it in games. I think we pretty much know what Henson range is at this point and its not NBA three or even college three point line
Can somebody please tell me the last guy like John Henson who was successful? Taj Gibson comparisons are laughable... Henson is nowhere near the defender Gibson was coming out of USC... The Theo Ratliff comparison is ridiculous too - Ratliff's 215 coming in is different because he actually had shoulders on which he could add muscle... Henson's too slight...
Henson is going to be like other lanky UNC PFs to come out - taken way too high, with very little to show for it. I don't see the same "potential" that others see in guys like this who don't have the frame to truly get to enforcer NBA big, but who already have decent skills. I see potential in someone like Drummond, who has the frame, but not yet the skills, but I feel like with Henson, we've seen the majority of what he can get to as far as skills, and the physical side of things isn't ever going to be a strength for him...
The only guy who I think is more overrated than Henson is his teammmate, Kendall Marshall.
I like Henson, but I don't buy him going top 10. Unless someone really takes a liking to him and sees something more than I do.
I know Jerry West is a big decision maker in the Warriors war room and he's a guy who makes unbelievable decisions, at the time, that turn out awesome. I'm sure a lot of people doubted him trading Vlade Divac a solid all star level center for a guard out of high school in Kobe Bryant, but it worked out beautifully for the Lakers.
Gibson was the same age as a freshman at USC that Henson is now! This has got to be some kind of a joke. Henson 2x DPOY in the ACC. Did Gibson win DPOY in college? To say that Henson is no where near the defender is ridiculous garbage. Gibson has peaked but Henson is still improving...and I did say he was a guard his junior year in HS didnt I?
Again, Henson's top 10 projection is not based on him as being a finished product.
I've got him going 9th to Detroit, so yeah I buy the hype. Check out this thread I created a few months ago.
Who cares how much bigger Henson gets. You don't have to be Dwight howard to play pf in the NBA or to even be sucessful. K.G was never big yet he still played top notch defense. Dennis Rodman same thing. The point is you are making weight wayyyy more important than it really is. Marshall is very overrated i mean its not like no one else put up assist numbers like he did in two years and look how great Barens and the rest of the Tarheels looked once he got hurt, oh wait................
I agree Stanford, too much emphasis is placed on weight as if a player cant be successful. That was the two biggest negatives against Taj Gibson, that he was old for his class and he needed to add weight...way too skinny. Gibson was a very good player though so I wasnt surprised by his success in the least.
To another degree....that was all you heard about Kevin Durant. He was too skinny and he needed more strength. I am not saying he wouldve went before Oden, but the way Oden was built and the way Durant was built were definitely deciding factors....and why most GM's wouldve taken Oden regardless. When KD got in the league, people found out two things....one, he didnt need to add a lot more weight or get that much stronger. Two....he was a lot stronger than people realized in the first place.
I know KD is not a PF, but my point is, too much of a big deal is made out of weight and strength when you are talking about a guy who is 18-21 years old.
Yeah the teams that have offensive big men w/ limited athleticism (SAC, DET) could use a shot-blocking big.
Henson's athletic testing is almost identical to Taj Gibson's, even in the weight department, but Henson is taller and longer and I think Henson has more upside. I like Henson to Detroit at #9. Nice shot blocking complement to Greg Monroe.
PF: John Henson 6'10"
C: Greg Monroe 6'11"